[hyteckit]

Well, the rising temperatures of the ocean had lead to a mile on algae in Alaska a few months back.

Now, another consequence of global warming and rising sea temeratures is 124 miles long Sea Mucus.

Giant, Mucus-Like Sea Blobs on the Rise, Pose Danger

Good bye fishes.

They are going get killed by algae and sea mucus.

E-coli sushi. Yummy.

[Chuckit]

Do you really think these blobs pose more of a danger to fish than, say, other fish — or fishermen?

[stupendousman]

My more concerned about what's going to happen with the effects of all the record cold right now:

Early snow records set to be broken – General News – Austrian Times

http://vortex.plymouth.edu/uschill.gif

No more summer. No more shorts weather.

[spacefreak]

Record low temperatures all over the globe along with lower ocean temperatures indicate we are in a cooling cycle now. The Obama Administration has even instructed staff and media to stop using the term "global warming" and instead say "climate change". I wonder why they would do that?

On a related note, the plethora of evidence supporting the observations that we are in a cooling cycle has Prius owners patting themselves on the back for their epic achievement of reducing global temperatures.

Of course, there is the downside to this. We're going to be needing a lot more fuel to heat homes. Once this reaches the tipping point, Prius owners will be asked to buy Hummers from China to help us re-warm the planet.

[olePigeon]

The median change over the last hundred years is a general warming. This includes averaging of cooling and warming trends. We may be in a cooling trend. On average, we're warming.

[Doofy]

Insert standard Doof climate change hysteria response:

It's all to do with our financial systems. Current financial systems are burning themselves out, so TPTB need to get on a new gold standard. Which will be carbon credits. Nowt to do with the environment.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by olePigeon 

The median change over the last hundred years is a general warming. This includes averaging of cooling and warming trends. We may be in a cooling trend. On average, we're warming.

I don't think this is debatable, unless somebody else can explain where the polar ice caps have gone.

[Uncle Skeleton]

They turned into mucus. Duh.

[SpaceMonkey]

Dump some Mucinex into the ocean. Problem solved.

[BadKosh]

Yeah, no matter what you MUST blame global warming.

[besson3c]

No matter what you must trust your gut feeling over anything scientists say.

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

No matter what you must trust your gut feeling over anything scientists say.

I take offense to this. Mucinex has been shown to be effective in placebo studies.

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey 

I take offense to this. Mucinex has been shown to be effective in placebo studies.

I hear your mom has been shown to be affective in placebo studies.*

* These claims have not been verified by the FDA.

[besson3c]

Why is it that conservatives are so chronically mistrusting? We've gone over distrust of government a gazillion times, but why so distrusting in science, academics, the intent of gay people, and whatever else should be added to this list? Why are you so simultaneously trusting of our military and naturally so trusting of the free market to seemingly no end given this propensity to mistrust?

You'd think that this mistrust would be consistent towards every group with an agenda.

[spacefreak]

Originally Posted by olePigeon 

The median change over the last hundred years is a general warming. This includes averaging of cooling and warming trends. We may be in a cooling trend. On average, we're warming.

But when the median is taken from time since the Middle Ages, it's obvious we've been on average cooling.

[ort888]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Why is it that conservatives are so chronically mistrusting? We've gone over distrust of government a gazillion times, but why so distrusting in science, academics, the intent of gay people, and whatever else should be added to this list? Why are you so simultaneously trusting of our military and naturally so trusting of the free market to seemingly no end given this propensity to mistrust?

You'd like that this mistrust would be consistent towards every group with an agenda.

In this case they are distrustful because huge corporations don't want the government to try and regulate them, so they pressure the Republican party to fight against climate change laws in any way possible. Sometimes the best way to do that is to simply discredit the entire notion.

I have no idea if climate change is real or not, but I do know that taking care of our environment is important and just about anything that moves us in that direction is probably a good thing. That said, I'm not naive enough to believe that either party really has our best interests in mind, so what you really just need to do is follow the money.

[Warren Pease]

Originally Posted by spacefreak 

Record low temperatures all over the globe along with lower ocean temperatures indicate we are in a cooling cycle now.

NOAA - National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration - NOAA: Warmest Global Sea-Surface Temperatures for August and Summer

[Warren Pease]

Originally Posted by olePigeon 

The median change over the last hundred years is a general warming. This includes averaging of cooling and warming trends. We may be in a cooling trend. On average, we're warming.

Not surprising since the sun (source of 98% of earth's energy) is stuck in an abnormally long trough of it's 11-year cycle for the past 2-3 years.

[Warren Pease]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

No more summer. No more shorts weather.

No summer for you? Guess you missed out...

NOAA - National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration - NOAA: Warmest Global Sea-Surface Temperatures for August and Summer

NCDC scientists also reported that the combined average global land and ocean surface temperature for August was second warmest on record, behind 1998.

You guys still get to chant 1998! 1998! 1998!*

*for land surface temps only.

[besson3c]

I like to chant 1998 anyway.

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by olePigeon 

I hear your mom has been shown to be affective in placebo studies.*

* These claims have not been verified by the FDA.

I see what you did there.

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

I like to chant 1998 anyway.

I'm gonna party like it's 1998.

[besson3c]

Don't forget to use a condom, and make sure your goats have been sterilized.

[hyteckit]

Originally Posted by olePigeon 

The median change over the last hundred years is a general warming. This includes averaging of cooling and warming trends. We may be in a cooling trend. On average, we're warming.

Here's your graph from NASA.

[stupendousman]

Originally Posted by Warren Pease 

No summer for you? Guess you missed out...

I guess you missed the irony of my post.

The fact that you quote something about just "sea-surface temperatures" and "August" shows me you really didn't get it.

The fact that other people decided that only the last 100 years should determine the overall spectrum of climate change for our planet also shows that someone else didn't get it either.

[Shaddim]

[Venkman] Some whale blew it's nose and they want to keep it? [/Venkman]

[hyteckit]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

I guess you missed the irony of my post.

The fact that you quote something about just "sea-surface temperatures" and "August" shows me you really didn't get it.

The fact that other people decided that only the last 100 years should determine the overall spectrum of climate change for our planet also shows that someone else didn't get it either.

I'm still trying to figure out if you live in Austria or the US.

Somehow Austria or US temperatures right now means global warming is false?

[imitchellg5]

Why do they call it global warming? It's been bloody cold here.

[Rumor]

Originally Posted by Shaddim 

[Venkman] Some whale blew it's nose and they want to keep it? [/Venkman]

[stupendousman]

Originally Posted by hyteckit 

I'm still trying to figure out if you live in Austria or the US.

Somehow Austria or US temperatures right now means global warming is false?

No more than mucuse-like sea blobs in selected areas means it's true, or that all the fish are going to die.

[hyteckit]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

No more than mucuse-like sea blobs in selected areas means it's true, or that all the fish are going to die.

Are you saying warmer ocean temperatures does not lead to the buildup of algae and sea mucus?

I'm pretty sure people who study marine life for over a decade would know more than you.

I'm pretty sure satellite data from NASA and NOAA that shows the 11 warmest years on record is in the last 13 years is more accurate than you pointing out that it is really cold in the past a few days of the of year in Austria.

[hyteckit]

New data:

The Associated Press: Explorers: North Pole summers ice free in 10 years

North Pole summers ice free in 10 years

The North Pole will turn into an open sea during summer within a decade, according to data released Wednesday by a team of explorers who trekked through the Arctic for three months
The Catlin Arctic Survey team, led by explorer Pen Hadow, measured the thickness of the ice as it sledged and hiked through the northern part of the Beaufort Sea in the north Pole earlier this year during a research project. Their findings show that most of the ice in the region is first-year ice that is only around 1.8 meters (six feet) deep and will melt next summer. The region has traditionally contained, thicker multiyear ice which does not melt as rapidly.

[Lint Police]

It is even possible that desirable redistribution is more likely to occur through climate change policy than otherwise.

-Regulatory Admin Cass Sunstein in '07 University of Chicago Law Paper

It's about power. Not about how damn warm or cold it is. Period.

Enjoy your former United States.

[hyteckit]

Originally Posted by spacefreak 

But when the median is taken from time since the Middle Ages, it's obvious we've been on average cooling.

You mean the medieval warm period? How do you think they got the temperature?



NOAA Paleoclimatology Global Warming - The Data

[macwall]

Global warming sucks.

[stupendousman]

Originally Posted by hyteckit 

Are you saying warmer ocean temperatures does not lead to the buildup of algae and sea mucus?

Are you saying that record cold weather doesn't mean I can't comfortably wear shorts? Are you saying that I'm not going to have to most likely turn up my thermostat and use more and more environment killing fossil fuels?

I'm pretty sure satellite data from NASA and NOAA that shows the 11 warmest years on record is in the last 13 years is more accurate than you pointing out that it is really cold in the past a few days of the of year in Austria.

"11 warmest years on record is in the last 13 years"

Yet, it's stopped getting warmer. I believe that's what data from NASA and NOAA show.

You are providing a tiny, tiny snapshot from limited set of data on a planet that's pretty old, of which we were all assured that the "scientific data" showed would be getting hotter and hotter, not cooling back down.

That's the problem with "science". It doesn't want to be reliable when you don't know ALL of the facts.

[Warren Pease]

Originally Posted by imitchellg5 

Why do they call it global warming? It's been bloody cold here.

The '-ing' is there for a reason.

[Warren Pease]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

"11 warmest years on record is in the last 13 years"

Yet, it's stopped getting warmer. I believe that's what data from NASA and NOAA show.

You are providing a tiny, tiny snapshot from limited set of data on a planet that's pretty old, of which we were all assured that the "scientific data" showed would be getting hotter and hotter, not cooling back down.

The stat that the 11 warmest years on record happened in the past 13 years is a limited snapshot of the data - over the past 150 years.

Your assertion that 'it's stopped getting warmer' is also from a limited set of data of 11 years ( or 5 years depending on which dataset you use ) which is a whole order of magnitude shorter.

The trend over the last 150 years is appreciable warming, the trend over the last 11 ( or 5 ) is barely perceptible cooling. Again, not surprising due to the diminished output of the sun over the past 2-3 years.

Using this dataset : http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/ta...LB.Ts+dSST.txt , the top 3 warmest years for the summer months are:

June: 2009, 1998, 2005
July: 1998, 2009, 2002
August: 1998 and 2002 (tied), 2006
September (just for fun): 2005, 2009, 2003

Decade by decade, the 2000's have still been warmer than the 1990's.

[spacefreak]

Originally Posted by hyteckit 

You mean the medieval warm period? How do you think they got the temperature?

Duh... Everyone and their mom knows that Merlin had the ability to measure the temperature of the globe.

Merlin was actually pushing the same crap as Al Gore, but his efforts failed once Lancelot returned from a long journey to announce to all of Camelot that, contrary to Merlin's theories, there were no fossil-fueled industries to take down, and there were no automobiles to buy back via King Arthur's Cash for Clunkers program.

So Camelot and the world was forced to kick back and enjoy the nice weather. Aside from the occasional dragon attack, it was quite the festive period of time.

[hyteckit]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

"11 warmest years on record is in the last 13 years"

Yet, it's stopped getting warmer. I believe that's what data from NASA and NOAA show.

You are providing a tiny, tiny snapshot from limited set of data on a planet that's pretty old, of which we were all assured that the "scientific data" showed would be getting hotter and hotter, not cooling back down.

That's the problem with "science". It doesn't want to be reliable when you don't know ALL of the facts.

WTF? Don't know all the facts? It's stop getting warmer?

Analyzing 2000 years of data. Not enough to determine if Global Warming is happening.

Record colds in Austria in the past few days. Global Cooling!

Not enough to know if World is getting warming by analyzing 2,000 years of data, but looking at 1 year is enough to determine that the world stop getting warmer?


Seriously, let me make the argument for you.

Here's what your argument is suppose to be:


Although data shows there is a gradual increase in global temperature in the past 100 years, the data alone is not enough to determine if Global Warming is man made or just a natural cycle.

Global Warming might be real, but it's not possible to determine if it's just a natural cycle without analyzing 1,000 10,000 100,00 1,000,000 years of data.

[stupendousman]

Originally Posted by hyteckit 

WTF? Don't know all the facts? It's stop getting warmer?

Analyzing 2000 years of data. Not enough to determine if Global Warming is happening.

It's still getting warmer? How much warmer is it now than say, 10 years ago? The planet is much older than 2000 years and people lived here for quite a long time before that data was taken. Has it been hotter here on Earth than just the last 100 years?

The 2000 years of data is NOT enough to determine anything at any level of precision. We were told years ago that the use of this "data" as part of models would cause warming to go up and up every year. Has that happened? Yes or no? 30 years ago, we were told that all the data showed that we were about to go into a man-made era of global cooling. Did that happen? Yes or no?

At some point, people are just going to have to admit that they really can't predict what's going to happen with the climate, and they can't always prove why what happens.

I never said that there wasn't any "warming". I'm just saying that your alarmist "evidence" isn't really likely to sway anyone. We've heard about one climate/environmental catastrophe after an another, with none really coming into fruition. It's the classic "boy who cried wolf."

You can take selected data sets. Extrapolate them, then apply "worse case scenarios" to all of them just as I did with the data showing record cold around the globe. It's a silly exercise to be sure.

So, my argument isn't that the climate hasn't changed in the last 100 years towards the warmer side. My argument is - so what...based on the history of the earth, it's just as likely to start trending the other way for reasons you don't have a clue about. For the most part, it's stopped trending upwards and has went back down. Is that a permanent thing? Who knows. The scientists who assured us that their data models where accurate the past 30 years or so sure don't seem to.

Al Gore assured us all kinds of increased weather catastrophes by now. None came to fruition.

WOLF! WOLF!

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Originally Posted by spacefreak 

Duh... Everyone and their mom knows that Merlin had the ability to measure the temperature of the globe.

Merlin was actually pushing the same crap as Al Gore, but his efforts failed once Lancelot returned from a long journey to announce to all of Camelot that, contrary to Merlin's theories, there were no fossil-fueled industries to take down, and there were no automobiles to buy back via King Arthur's Cash for Clunkers program.

So Camelot and the world was forced to kick back and enjoy the nice weather. Aside from the occasional dragon attack, it was quite the festive period of time.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by hyteckit 

I'm still trying to figure out if you live in Austria or the US.

I have a sneaking suspicion that he lives in Aberdeen.

[Warren Pease]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

The 2000 years of data is NOT enough to determine anything at any level of precision. We were told years ago that the use of this "data" as part of models would cause warming to go up and up every year.

Well, you were told wrong. It's as simple as that. Hansen's model clearly shows variation and *gasp* years of cooling.

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

At some point, people are just going to have to admit that they really can't predict what's going to happen with the climate, and they can't always prove why what happens.

Well that's a defeatist attitude and an odd debating tactic to take. Point: We see global warming happening and here are the factors that may influence that. Counterpoint: Well sometimes you just don't know!

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

You can take selected data sets. Extrapolate them, then apply "worse case scenarios" to all of them just as I did with the data showing record cold around the globe. It's a silly exercise to be sure.

Extrapolation of very short time spans is silly. Today was cooler than yesterday, let's call it global cool... er, winter!

Also, kudos to you for being the first person to bring wind-chill into the climate debate!

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

The 2000 years of data is NOT enough to determine anything at any level of precision.

Yes it is. Just because you don't understand the chemistry behind it doesn't make it any less valid.

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

We were told years ago that the use of this "data" as part of models would cause warming to go up and up every year.

On average.

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

Has that happened? Yes or no?

Yes.

Originally Posted by stupendousman 

30 years ago, we were told that all the data showed that we were about to go into a man-made era of global cooling. Did that happen? Yes or no?

No, that hypothesis never had significant scientific support. It gained popularity because the press inaccurately represented the data due to their lack of understanding of ice age cycles.

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by Warren Pease 

Wait, isn't this a lot like hitting the broad side of a barn? The lower echelon of those projections is pre 1998 levels right?

[Warren Pease]

Originally Posted by ebuddy 

Wait, isn't this a lot like hitting the broad side of a barn? The lower echelon of those projections is pre 1998 levels right?

The projections are from top to bottom A) increased B) (then) present and C) reduced anthropogenic CO2 production.

Broad side of a barn? Perhaps... but most of the criticism leveled against this computer model is that it's nowhere near accurate.

[ebuddy]

I'm curious about a couple of other things here. The focus of this study is the Mediterranean Sea and its warming, but they didn't cite the actual temperature increase that led to this increase in mucus. They refer to "sea temperature increases over decades, but nothing specifically related to the focus of the article. Studies suggest the Mediterranean Sea is not warming. How can this mucus be related to the warming of a sea that is not warming?

What am I missing here?

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by Warren Pease 

The projections are from top to bottom A) increased B) (then) present and C) reduced anthropogenic CO2 production.

I appreciate the response. Do you have a link to this graph? It seems the "observed" stops at 1988. I could look for it if you wish, but I'm assuming you've got it handy. Thanks Warren Pease.

[Warren Pease]

Originally Posted by ebuddy 

I appreciate the response. Do you have a link to this graph? It seems the "observed" stops at 1988. I could look for it if you wish, but I'm assuming you've got it handy. Thanks Warren Pease.

Right clicking on the image > open in new tab should allow you to see the link... um. What are you asking? The graph is from Hansen's 1988 paper and so the observed is limited up to 1988.

[Added]

Here is an image comparing recent temps with the 1988 model :

I chose it because it is one of the few that preserves the average annual temps (how the original data is displayed) and not the monthly data, which introduces a tremendous amount of noise, like here and here.