[damiensmunki]

After salivating over rumors of impending Blu-Ray support in the upcoming 10.5.2 update, I have become disheartened in reading more recent status reports on the developer seeds. No mention of BD support. What is the likelihood that we'll see Blu-Ray in 10.5.2? Do you think the support will come in a "dot update," or will it come in...I dunno...an update solely to DVD Player? Am I the only one obsessing over this?

[harbinger75]

I don't really have an answer for you, but I was really surprised to see absolutely NO support for Blu-Ray at Macworld. I understand that Apple was focused on the Air and ATV, but with the format war all but over, you'd think Steve would have been able to forecast that in his crystal ball...

Maybe we'll see some form of support and new drives, etc. later this year when the dust settles.

[damiensmunki]

Yeah...I was definitely floored that the only person involved in the keynote who even alluded to BD was the Fox guy.

[newtech]

A couple thoughts. First anyone who actually has the seed(s) is covered by the NDA and can not rightfully say anything yea or nay as to BD support. Second I doubt the majority of developers are even much interested in BD till it is released officially by Apple.

[voodoo]

I'm sure we'll see BD support this year in Mac Pro's as an option, but something tells me Steve is going to sit this one out like he did with CD-R on Macs and MMS on iPhones.

In other words, Apple will come to, but way later than one would expect by a company that is usually years *ahead* of the competition.

Sometimes Steve is just too obtuse to accept certain 'inferior' realities.

V

[damiensmunki]

Well, I hope I'm not alone in completely ignoring this iTunes movie rental bullsh*t. I don't rent movies. I buy them, and I buy them in the best quality available, which...I'm sorry...but iTunes will never be.

[analogue SPRINKLES]

I don't see the big deal. The BR drives for computers come with drivers for burning and watching movies. Apples support isn't needed.

[goMac]

Mac hardware doesn't support HDCP so far. Even if Apple introduces software support, you won't be able to play the discs unless your have an HDCP Mac.

[damiensmunki]

From what I understand, there is no app available on Mac for playing back BD movies.

[damiensmunki]

Yeah...I know, but I'm perfectly willing to upgrade my Mac Pro...once the nvidea releases the new card for the first gen MP's, and once Apple gets off its butt and updates the cinema displays. The thought of a 23" or 30" LED CD with iSight and a possible ir sensor makes me happy in the pants.

[voodoo]

Originally Posted by damiensmunki 

Well, I hope I'm not alone in completely ignoring this iTunes movie rental bullsh*t. I don't rent movies. I buy them, and I buy them in the best quality available, which...I'm sorry...but iTunes will never be.

I agree with this.. I will not rent movies online from iTunes or any other business in the foreseeable future.

That said, BD support will be introduced as an option on Mac Pros this year. Blue-Ray movie playback will not.

Maybe in 2009..

V

[damiensmunki]

Can you say a bit about your thoughts that go into this prediction, voodoo? Thanks!

[Eug]

Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES 

I don't see the big deal. The BR drives for computers come with drivers for burning and watching movies. Apples support isn't needed.

There is no way to watch a commercial Blu-ray movie on a Mac... unless you install Windows.

[voodoo]

Originally Posted by damiensmunki 

Can you say a bit about your thoughts that go into this prediction, voodoo? Thanks!

Steve Jobs is obsessed with on-line movie rentals and he's going to make a shot at making them the 'next big thing'.

There will still be need for larger optical backup drives on the professional machines so the only thing that fits the bill is a BD drive.

It won't be for video playback because - for one thing- not all Macs have the DRM hardware to play BlueRay movies yet. That feature will be seen on consumer machines before or at least at the same time as it will be on Mac Pros. Also the software is missing.

The on-line video thing will keep Jobs occupied the next 12 months at least, so we won't see BlueRay movies on Macs until his otherwise mercurial mind finds something else shiny and distracting

That's my prediction..

V

[PaperNotes]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Mac hardware doesn't support HDCP so far.

Where did you get that blinger from?

[AppleGirl1990]

Will those of us who purchased old macs or even the new MacPro's be able to install the blu-ray drives that apple offers? or will they only work on the computer which are released at the end of 2008 or 2009 when the blu-ray option becomes available?

Nobody wants to be left in the dusk, especially after spending a small fortune on these new machines.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by PaperNotes 

Where did you get that blinger from?

Check the interwebs. No Mac modal is HDCP compliant. A Mac has to be entirely HDCP, from the motherboard to the GPU. The Mac might include a HDCP GPU, but without the motherboard being HDCP compliant, it's pretty useless.

[PaperNotes]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Check the interwebs. No Mac modal is HDCP compliant. A Mac has to be entirely HDCP, from the motherboard to the GPU. The Mac might include a HDCP GPU, but without the motherboard being HDCP compliant, it's pretty useless.

Not entirely true at all (HDCP motherboard must be something only you and some batty boy could come up with). Even if the above was, apps like VLC would eventually bypass everything.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by PaperNotes 

Not entirely true at all (HDCP motherboard must be something only you and some batty boy could come up with). Even if the above was, apps like VLC would eventually bypass everything.

Completely true. HDCP requires every component in the computer that handles any data from the disc be HDCP compliant. This means the drive itself, the motherboard, and the GPU. Why do you think you can't just use some sort of USB CableCard device with any computer? Because CableCard requires HDCP compliance, and the entire computer would have to be HDCP compliant from the USB port, to the motherboard, to the video card, to the display.

A few computers do ship with CableCard, but it's internal, and the entire internal system is HDCP'd.

If you think about it, HDCP would be useless otherwise. You could catch all the data being sent to the graphics card and dump out a copy of the movie in 1080p.

[PaperNotes]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Completely true. HDCP requires every component in the computer that handles any data from the disc be HDCP compliant. This means the drive itself, the motherboard, and the GPU.

There are already Mac owners playing Blu-ray and HD-DVD movies with external drives and Power DVD running on Windows so please don't take us for idiot by telling us what we already know about HDCP and then bullshitting about how there are no Macs with HDCP hardware. Honestly, isn't it enough that you spent more than a whole year telling us all how HD-DVD was going to be the winning HD disc format and how Warner was going to go HD-DVD exclusive (this you said one week before Warner went the other way, something I told you would happen which you couldn't accept).

****ing techno bullshitter is what you are. Just a box spouting abbreviations and jargon that you can't add up.

[Cold Warrior]

PaperNotes,
Keep it civil. Don't get so emotionally involved.

[P]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Mac hardware doesn't support HDCP so far. Even if Apple introduces software support, you won't be able to play the discs unless your have an HDCP Mac.

Really? Stop by Sony's homepage, go to the Vaio laptops and find one that let's you configure a Bluray player. Now check the boxes and click compare - that seems to be the only way to get the techspecs. This is as close as I can link, because it's some weird server app, but it's close enough. Now, see the specs they have - don't they look a lot like what the Macbook Pro has? Same processor, same chipset, same family of GPU - you can get it with the exact same model if you like - and generally the same type of hardware. The iMac isn't too far off either. Which particular part of the hardware of current Mac models needs to be HDCP compliant yet isn't?

The OS needs some updates to make it work, but the hardware is there alright.

[P]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Completely true. HDCP requires every component in the computer that handles any data from the disc be HDCP compliant. This means the drive itself, the motherboard, and the GPU. Why do you think you can't just use some sort of USB CableCard device with any computer? Because CableCard requires HDCP compliance, and the entire computer would have to be HDCP compliant from the USB port, to the motherboard, to the video card, to the display.

No, actually. It's because CableLabs requires a complete box to certify as a host. If they had simply required HDCP compliance, it would be possible to make a device that they could certify - presumably by making the box check for other required HDCP compliant hardware and shutting down if it didn't find any.

[harbinger75]

A couple thoughts. First anyone who actually has the seed(s) is covered by the NDA and can not rightfully say anything yea or nay as to BD support. Second I doubt the majority of developers are even much interested in BD till it is released officially by Apple.

I guess I'm not sure where you were going with that. We were just surprised not to see any Blu-Ray devices or support offered at Macworld. Developer NDA's weren't the issue, actually.

But, I guess I can see it from another angle. Since Blu-Ray really didn't (essentially) win the HD war until a few days before Macworld, there's no way Apple would have thrown their weight that direction so quickly. Maybe next Macworld we'll have a plethora of BD stuff.

[analogue SPRINKLES]

I give it 6 months tops before Apple starts to include some sort of BR support. They can't ignore it forever even if they are trying to push Apple TV.

[AppleGirl1990]

but even if they offer blu-ray support, are we going to be forced to purchase the new apple computers they come on in 6 months, or can i replace my dvd burner and a blu-ray burner?

[krillbee]

isnt recent apple hardware going to be hdcp compliant? If I recall correctly the geforce 8800 and most ATI 2x00 series have HDCP capabilities. So what's to prevent Apple from just releasing an update that would give these users the ability to use Blu Ray? I mean anyone with a powermac can easily install a Blu Ray drive.

[Big Mac]

According to goMac the motherboard has to be HDCP compliant too. Sounds ridiculous and unfortunately very believable.

[AppleGirl1990]

You would think Apple would address this issue. Loyal customers of Apple really want to know what the scoop is.

Apple doesn't have to commit to Blu-ray or even suggest a release date of blu-ray hardware, but if it's not compatible with the current hardware, i for one would hold off on upgrading my computer.

Blu-ray is a MUST for me and i was planning on getting an internal/external drive when the time came.

[damiensmunki]

I don't understand, if the motherboard must be HDCP compliant, why can we use BD drives in our first gen Mac Pros when we boot into Windows?

[CaptainHaddock]

It's not just hardware. Vista is compromised at every level, locking down or degrading video and audio to comply with the requirements of Blu-Ray DRM and HDCP. If anything isn't right, hardware or software-wise, Vista downgrades your video to non-HD. I don't want that crap on my Mac, and I don't want to be a second-class Mac user because my 24" LCD doesn't have a DRM-compliant HDMI connector.

Long story short, Apple can't support Blu-Ray without either crippling OS X or waiting for a change in the legal climate.

In the meantime, if I need to see a video in high definition, there's always Bit-torrent. For Americans, there's also your Apple TV.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by damiensmunki 

I don't understand, if the motherboard must be HDCP compliant, why can we use BD drives in our first gen Mac Pros when we boot into Windows?

You can use a BD drive right now on OS X. You can't play back commercial Blu-ray movies however on OS X.

Originally Posted by PaperNotes 

There are already Mac owners playing Blu-ray and HD-DVD movies with external drives and Power DVD running on Windows so please don't take us for idiot by telling us what we already know about HDCP and then bullshitting about how there are no Macs with HDCP hardware.Honestly, isn't it enough that you spent more than a whole year telling us all how HD-DVD was going to be the winning HD disc format and how Warner was going to go HD-DVD exclusive (this you said one week before Warner went the other way, something I told you would happen which you couldn't accept).

****ing techno bullshitter is what you are. Just a box spouting abbreviations and jargon that you can't add up.

Last I checked, Mac owners playing commercial Blu-ray and HD DVD movies are using a hack that bypasses the HDCP requirement, and that is available in Windows. Without the hack, the movies don't play. It's possible things may have changed since I last checked a few months back, but my guess is no.

P.S. Since you are accusing people of techno bull, I'll remind the posters here that it was you that claimed that Apple's DVD Studio Pro doesn't support burning of HD DVD, despite your trying to pass yourself off as a DVD Studio Pro dude. You claimed that "HD DVD" was just a generic term, and had nothing to do with the HD DVD format promoted by the DVD Forum, which of course is completely false. Pot, kettle, black.

Originally Posted by CaptainHaddock 

It's not just hardware. Vista is compromised at every level, locking down or degrading video and audio to comply with the requirements of Blu-Ray DRM and HDCP. If anything isn't right, hardware or software-wise, Vista downgrades your video to non-HD. I don't want that crap on my Mac, and I don't want to be a second-class Mac user because my 24" LCD doesn't have a DRM-compliant HDMI connector.

Long story short, Apple can't support Blu-Ray without either crippling OS X or waiting for a change in the legal climate.

In the meantime, if I need to see a video in high definition, there's always Bit-torrent. For Americans, there's also your Apple TV.

This wouldn't be crippling OS X. It would be enabling OS X to use what the rest of the world already can use.

Long story short, Apple can support Blu-ray by enabling OS X and its hardware, but has chosen not to for whatever reason at this time.

[Big Mac]

No, what Captain Haddock suggests (and what we've all read if not seen personally in Vista) would be properly referred to as crippling. I don't want pervasive DRM throughout OS X just to play a movie format. I don't care to give Hollywood that much control over my computing experience.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Big Mac 

No, what Captain Haddock suggests (and what we've all read if not seen personally in Vista) would be properly referred to as crippling. I don't want pervasive DRM throughout OS X just to play a movie format. I don't care to give Hollywood that much control over my computing experience.

Not crippling at all. This is value-added functionality, despite some of the claims by some of the anti-DRM crowd.

The fact of the matter is, Vista can play Blu-ray and HD DVD, and OS X can't. Furthermore, the incorporation of this support in Vista doesn't degrade playback of other formats like DVD. DVD still functions as before. Non DRM'd movies for other formats also still function normally. The only "crippling" going on is with DRM'd material that requires that crippling. But on OS X, the OS can't play that DRM'd material at all.

If anything, OS X is far more crippled in this regard.

In fact, this was one of the main reasons I decided to hold off on buying a Mac mini for my home theatre.

[Big Mac]

I guess that's where we differ. I don't want any part of it if that's the cost involved, so I hope Apple stays away from commercial Blu-ray support for as long as possible.

[PaperNotes]

Originally Posted by Eug 

Last I checked, Mac owners playing commercial Blu-ray and HD DVD movies are using a hack that bypasses the HDCP requirement, and that is available in Windows. Without the hack, the movies don't play. It's possible things may have changed since I last checked a few months back, but my guess is no.

1. There is no such thing as an HDCP motherboard. The only compliant parts required in PCs to date have been the graphics card, optical drive, monitor, output and software. Every MacBook Pro and Mac Pro over a year has been HDCP compliant in every way except for the lack of a next gen optical drive and software. As has been pointed out and should be obvious to anyone with two or more braincells, there are many PCs playing Blu-ray and HD-DVD discs fine that only have two advantages over Macs and that is the optical drive and playback software.

2. The playback on Windows has been achieved without hacks. It's just plain Power DVD with HD support.

3. Even if Apple updates DVD Player.app they might choose, as they have done, to not support playback from external optical drives.

P.S. Since you are accusing people of techno bull, I'll remind the posters here that it was you that claimed that Apple's DVD Studio Pro doesn't support burning of HD DVD

This is bullshit and an outrageous lie. I challenge you to back it up immediately with a black and white quote and if you can't I will stop paying your female relatives the amount they usually charge

[Eug]

Originally Posted by PaperNotes 

1. There is no such thing as an HDCP motherboard. The only compliant parts required in PCs to date have been the graphics card, optical drive, monitor, output and software. Every MacBook Pro and Mac Pro over a year has been HDCP compliant in every way except for the lack of a next gen optical drive and software. As has been pointed out and should be obvious to anyone with two or more braincells, there are many PCs playing Blu-ray and HD-DVD discs fine that only have two advantages over Macs and that is the optical drive and playback software.

Dunno about the Mac Pro, but for the MacBook Pro, playback is on the internal screen, not out the DVI port.

If it works on the Mac Pro now as well, then that's good news. Didn't work before though, as Slysoft AnyDVD HD was needed.

P.S. I made no comments about an HDCP motherboard.

Originally Posted by PaperNotes 

This is bullshit and an outrageous lie. I challenge you to back it up immediately with a black and white quote and if you can't I will stop paying your female relatives the amount they usually charge

http://forums.macnn.com/89/macnn-lou...4/#post3464487

Originally Posted by PaperNotes 

I've already corrected you on Apple's use of the term HD DVD and you fled from the conversation when I showed HD DVD according to Apple's use of the term can be a h.264 hi res video in Quicktime .mov format recorded on a regular DVD-5. That's their use of the term and in that format won't play on any player that doesn't support mpeg4 with a Quicktime wrapper.

http://forums.macnn.com/89/macnn-lou...8/#post3451765

Originally Posted by PaperNotes 

They're using it as a generic term. Go say what you said on the dvxuser forums and many professionals will tell you what it means. By HD DVD Apple means high definition resolution of any of the codecs supported by Blu-ray and HD-DVD players and also can be recorded on DVD discs.

SD DVD and HD DVD resolutions

[PaperNotes]

What me and others told you is that Apple has used HD DVD as a generic term for high resolution DVD content even before DVD Studio Pro was updated with 4.1 to support burning to HD DVD discs.

Now show me where I said the app didn't burn to HD DVD discs as you outrageously lied.

And since you are such a genius please answer about this so called hack you mentioned that is required to play Blu-ray on Windows. You made that up too.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by PaperNotes 

What me and others told you is that Apple has used HD DVD as a generic term for high resolution DVD content even before DVD Studio Pro was updated with 4.1 to support burning to HD DVD discs.

Now show me where I said the app didn't burn to HD DVD discs as you outrageously lied.

We called you on your bull back then, and we're calling you on your bull now too.

The "HD DVD" support listed is specifically official DVD Forum-compliant HD DVD. You tried to deny it then, but were proven wrong.

Originally Posted by PaperNotes

I've already corrected you on Apple's use of the term HD DVD and you fled from the conversation when I showed HD DVD according to Apple's use of the term can be a h.264 hi res video in Quicktime .mov format recorded on a regular DVD-5. That's their use of the term and in that format won't play on any player that doesn't support mpeg4 with a Quicktime wrapper.

BTW, the only person I recall telling us what you claimed was you. Which "others" tried to claim the same thing?

Originally Posted by PaperNotes

And since you are such a genius please answer about this so called hack you mentioned that is required to play Blu-ray on Windows. You made that up too.

SlySoft AnyDVD HD

AnyDVD HD comes with same functionality as AnyDVD, but with additional features for full HD-DVD (High Definition DVD) and Blu-Ray support, including decryption of HD-DVD & Blu-Ray movie discs.

Allows you to watch movies over a digital display connection, without HDCP compliant graphics card and HDCP compliant display. No need to buy an expensive monitor. Sweet!

Playback your discs on your PC with PowerDVD Ultra, which otherwise do not run (titles released by Studio Canal, The Weinstein Company, Kinowelt, Optimum Releasing).

AnyDVD HD is the "must have" utility for the serious home theater enthusiast using a media center / home theater PC.

[OreoCookie]

Settle down, people and stay on topic, please.

[Eug]

Sweet.

Originally Posted by Big Mac 

I guess that's where we differ. I don't want any part of it if that's the cost involved, so I hope Apple stays away from commercial Blu-ray support for as long as possible.

Well, you can't have it both ways. Do you agree with Apple's AppleTV product? Do you use an iPod? Have you ever supported iTunes?

Heck, have you ever watched a DVD on a Mac?

Cuz to a certain extent all have the same "cost", in that they all require the OS/software to have some level of DRM support. DVD's region coding system is particularly annoying I'm sure you'll agree.

I agree that Blu-ray and HD DVD's DRM requirement is harsher overall, but the concept is the same. It's just another set of DRM... which OS X hasn't yet implemented.

Personally I find it annoying that el cheapo PCs can play DRM'd Blu-ray and HD DVD, but my dual 24" 1920x1200 (3840x1200) Mac OS X setup can't. It's doubly annoying because I already have an HD DVD USB drive that I could plug into it. Ironically, in Tiger I can plug in the HD DVD drive, put in an HD DVD, and navigate the directory tree. I just can't play the darn thing.

[P]

It's a question of a cost/benefit analysis, Eug. For DVDs, the limitations are that you can't take screenshots of a DVD and you can't open region coded DVDs in video mode if the OS and drive are in the wrong region. On some DVDs you can't even open them as data discs if the region is set wrongly, but that's in the drive firmware and not in the OS.

AACS support in Vista requires all sorts of checks in the system (various voltages, etc) that degrade performance all the time. It disables ports for no good reason - not just the digital ports like the S/PDIF port, but the analog ports such as S-video and composite as well. It made hardware acceleration like EAX impossible, because it was a mixer outside the control of the OS (EAX sucks, but that's not the point). It made echo cancellation in voice recording programs impossible, because you can't feed output back to input anymore. It makes writing drivers so much harder, because you can't debug in any meaningful way. There are millions of other media-related things that you can't do or that can only be done slower because of the control freaks in the MPAA.

Every single one of these things is a limitation all the time. Not just when playing AACS-encrypted HD video - all the time. In my opinion, that's too big a cost for the benefit of being able to play Bluray discs natively. I'll wait until VLC hacks in support.

Oh, and btw: The media protection scheme in Vista was broken inside a month. It doesn't even do what it's supposed to do.

[P]

Originally Posted by krillbee 

isnt recent apple hardware going to be hdcp compliant? If I recall correctly the geforce 8800 and most ATI 2x00 series have HDCP capabilities. So what's to prevent Apple from just releasing an update that would give these users the ability to use Blu Ray? I mean anyone with a powermac can easily install a Blu Ray drive.

The fact that they'd have to implement a fascist media protection scheme á la Vista to do it.

Also note that while the currently shipping graphics cards in Macs do support HDCP, the 7300 that was the standard in Mac Pros until quite recently may not have. The GPU itself did, but it required some more things on the card to fully support it. The newer GPUs bundle the whole shebang, but Mac Pros haven't had them for long, and it's not quite that easy to replace the optical drive in an iMac or MBP.

And I'll post the link to the source for that as soon as goMac posts the source to the statement that no current Mac is HDCP compliant because of something missing on the motherboard.

[exca1ibur]

The only thing that needs to be HDCP compliant is the video card and the monitor. The motherboard isn't a factor.

HDCP: The graphic card and monitor nightmare.

All that is needed for a third party video card (never happen) to be HDCP compliant and a monitor to support it as well, aka your HDTV if you are using a home theater and you are good to go. If the shipping video cards support HDCP at the hardware level all that is needed are drivers, that's about it.

[CaptainHaddock]

Originally Posted by Eug 

I agree that Blu-ray and HD DVD's DRM requirement is harsher overall, but the concept is the same. It's just another set of DRM... which OS X hasn't yet implemented.

It's not just another set of DRM. It required fundamental re-structuring of the Vista architecture so that every single multimedia data stream, regardless of the application, could be analyzed by the kernel for DRM compliance and downgraded or disabled if "necessary". Major compromises were made in Vista that sacrificed security, privacy, and performance to accommodate the Hollywood cartel. In fact, I heard you couldn't even play a WMA song in Media Player without the kernel having to throttle back network speed due to system resources required to simultaneously play audio and monitor DRM. (!)

Personally I find it annoying that el cheapo PCs can play DRM'd Blu-ray and HD DVD, but my dual 24" 1920x1200 (3840x1200) Mac OS X setup can't.

El cheapo PCs can't play DRMed Blu-ray and HD-DVD at HD quality without el-non-cheapo HDCP video cards, displays, and encrypted audio, and they are forced to run an el crappo OS.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by CaptainHaddock 

El cheapo PCs can't play DRMed Blu-ray and HD-DVD at HD quality without el-non-cheapo HDCP video cards, displays, and encrypted audio, and they are forced to run an el crappo OS.

HDCP-compliant GPUs are not expensive. Neither are HDCP-compliant displays. Welcome to 2008.

Even GMA X3100 supports HDCP, and I haven't bought a non-HDCP standalone LCD display in years. (Hint: I refuse to buy Apple displays, cuz they don't support HDCP, yet cost significantly more than HDCP-compliant displays.)

[Houston2007]

Originally Posted by damiensmunki 

After salivating over rumors of impending Blu-Ray support in the upcoming 10.5.2 update, I have become disheartened in reading more recent status reports on the developer seeds. No mention of BD support. What is the likelihood that we'll see Blu-Ray in 10.5.2? Do you think the support will come in a "dot update," or will it come in...I dunno...an update solely to DVD Player? Am I the only one obsessing over this?

The issue is Apple ALL the monitors are currently Non-HDCP meaning that even though you got a HDCP 8800 GT or ATI 2600 XT Video card you still need a HDCP monitor to view Blu-Ray. Apple can't introduce Blu-Ray without a New Cinema HD lineup. If you think people is pissed off when Apple dropped the price of the iPhone within 80 days of release imagine how many people will be pissed off if the brought the $1799 30" and can't watch Blu-Ray Movies. Ironically Blu-Ray is supported in Final Cut Pro as export option of video editing. Blu-Ray means more money on Audio/Video and PC options. I push Video downloads now to prolong the mess Blu-Ray is gonna create. 1080p trailer looks good on 30" but I feel the Blu-Ray would looked awesome. I like to see how this panout because currently the iMac, MacBook Pro is currently capable of Blu-Ray you may have to use the Win XP or Vista in Boot Camp to play Blu-Ray but you have to make a external drive.

[Houston2007]

Originally Posted by P 

It's a question of a cost/benefit analysis, Eug. For DVDs, the limitations are that you can't take screenshots of a DVD and you can't open region coded DVDs in video mode if the OS and drive are in the wrong region. On some DVDs you can't even open them as data discs if the region is set wrongly, but that's in the drive firmware and not in the OS.

AACS support in Vista requires all sorts of checks in the system (various voltages, etc) that degrade performance all the time. It disables ports for no good reason - not just the digital ports like the S/PDIF port, but the analog ports such as S-video and composite as well. It made hardware acceleration like EAX impossible, because it was a mixer outside the control of the OS (EAX sucks, but that's not the point). It made echo cancellation in voice recording programs impossible, because you can't feed output back to input anymore. It makes writing drivers so much harder, because you can't debug in any meaningful way. There are millions of other media-related things that you can't do or that can only be done slower because of the control freaks in the MPAA.

Every single one of these things is a limitation all the time. Not just when playing AACS-encrypted HD video - all the time. In my opinion, that's too big a cost for the benefit of being able to play Bluray discs natively. I'll wait until VLC hacks in support.

Oh, and btw: The media protection scheme in Vista was broken inside a month. It doesn't even do what it's supposed to do.

I think Steve Jobs know this and this is probably will never see Blu-Ray on a Mac no time soon.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Houston2007 

1080p trailer looks good on 30" but I feel the Blu-Ray would looked awesome.

While Apple's Quicktime HD 1080p trailers look reasonable, when compared against Blu-ray or HD DVD, they look pretty mediocre. It's a HUGE jump up in image quality, at least for a recent Blu-ray/HD DVD release. Totally different league.

[P]

Because they use a different H.264 profile - and probably bitrate as well. Jobs is being slightly coy when saying that everyone is using H.264 - they are, but most people are using the High Profile while Apple is using Mainline.

Still waiting for the source on why no current Mac is HDCP ready in the hardware. (Yes, I'm annoying, but this is exactly how FUD is started. I hate FUD.)