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Big Mac · Nov 5, 2011, 09:41 AM

This type of thread is destined for the PWL and should have been placed there by the third post.

Spheric Harlot · Nov 5, 2011, 09:51 AM

Let me repost this link, since it's obvious that nobody's reading it:

The amount of tissue loss estimated in the present study is more than most parents envisage from pre-operative counselling. Circumcision also ablates junctional mucosa that appears to be an important component of the overall sensory mechanism of the human penis.

Erogenous Tissue Loss after Circumcision
(warning: It's a scientific paper with some photographs—not of the procedure itself. NSFW)

Doing that to a child is physical mutilation.

Spheric Harlot · Nov 5, 2011, 09:57 AM

Originally Posted by Big Mac

This type of thread is destined for the PWL and should have been placed there by the third post.

There is absolutely nothing political about this subject.

The whole soap boxing on the risks of gay sex is a completely pointless tangent, and ebuddy's totally idiotic stamping it as a leftie/rightie issue just put the final nail in the thread.

This thread is a perfect example of why this forum is dying.

It's not the mods, it's nothing that can be saved be reintegrating the Poli lounge into the regular lounge; it's because this kind of stupidity was encouraged to grow unchecked with the creation of the political lounge and has made otherwise normal, intelligent human beings utterly incapable of discussing interesting subjects with a minimum of brain involvement.

**** this.

Doofy · Nov 5, 2011, 10:32 AM

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot

If you "pole" [sic] American women on what they prefer, they'll opt for what they know. Duh.

Well, unless it ~~cums~~ comes with a British accent. And then they tend to "pole" the other way.

lpkmckenna · Nov 5, 2011, 10:34 AM

Originally Posted by Athens

Correction, lpkmckenna said Asian culture is dirty and disgusting....

Doofy · Nov 5, 2011, 10:37 AM

Originally Posted by andi*pandi

I had no idea this was a lefty/righty issue...

It's not. Other than the fact that Big Mac's boys are all cut therefore anyone who isn't cut must support the other boys in the Middle East therefore must be a leftie!

I agree with the lefties in this thread (even hyteckit! Strewth, must go have a lie down). It's a mutilation of God's fine handiwork to rid one's little guy of his turtle neck.

Waragainstsleep · Nov 5, 2011, 12:30 PM

If foreskins were really that bad us (or even just for our penises or our love lives) then surely they would have evolved away by now.

subego · Nov 5, 2011, 12:34 PM

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot

Erogenous Tissue Loss after Circumcision
(warning: It's a scientific paper with some photographs—not of the procedure itself. NSFW)

Is there a reason you directed this at me?

I've had it done, I don't need to read a paper about it.

Doofy · Nov 5, 2011, 12:54 PM

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep

If foreskins were really that bad us (or even just for our penises or our love lives) then surely they would have evolved away by now.

Or, to use the other argument if you're so inclined, God wouldn't have put them there in the first place.

Doofy · Nov 5, 2011, 12:55 PM

The 4-Skins - Evil - YouTube

subego · Nov 5, 2011, 01:27 PM

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep

If foreskins were really that bad us (or even just for our penises or our love lives) then surely they would have evolved away by now.

Like our appendix did when we evolved the kitchen?

Shaddim · Nov 5, 2011, 01:53 PM

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot

There is absolutely nothing political about this subject.

The whole soap boxing on the risks of gay sex is a completely pointless tangent, and ebuddy's totally idiotic stamping it as a leftie/rightie issue just put the final nail in the thread.

This thread is a perfect example of why this forum is dying.

It's not the mods, it's nothing that can be saved be reintegrating the Poli lounge into the regular lounge; it's because this kind of stupidity was encouraged to grow unchecked with the creation of the political lounge and has made otherwise normal, intelligent human beings utterly incapable of discussing interesting subjects with a minimum of brain involvement.

**** this.

I dunno, the "usual suspects" started dog piling on subego because he's clipped, telling him how terrible he is for doing it. AND it was someone from the Left (OldManMac) who brought religion/politics into this, he started the whole, "it's a barbaric practice which is based on superstition and mythology" thing. It wasn't ebuddy. I guess you guys don't realize just how intolerant and antagonistic you can be.

FWIW, if we have a boy we're not getting him circumcised, we're going to wait until he's older and let him decide. But that's not because we feel that it's "mutilation" but because it is a sensitive matter in a sensitive area. If he then wants to get it done, more power to him.

Athens · Nov 5, 2011, 02:14 PM

Originally Posted by Big Mac

Your analogy would only make sense, hyteckit, if a portion of people also circumcised their tongues, and if those who did so experienced lower incidences of serious medical problems like infections, cancers and STDs. It's ironic that you claim to want to keep your senses intact when you're so very senseless on practically every (political) issue, including this one. But I digress.

The truly humorous thing is that more and more of the medical community has weighed in decidedly in support of circumcision, sometimes strongly so. The major part of the controversy, to the extent one exists, is one manufactured by the Left, which has no problem crushing baby skulls long after fetuses are viable, but once they're delivered you dastardly parents better not dare follow medical and religious advice to remove some extraneous, often problematic small piece of skin!

such fools.

Your info is out of date for Europe, Canada, Australia, and not sure of the US because I didn't look it up. The medical communities as a whole no longer recommend it for every boy. Just those high risk of some things. And reading into the history of the change has more to do with political pressure then medial knowledge.

-------- reply to B ended

I hate religion. I can't stand religion. Ask any one here including Big Mac how anti religious I have been. But there is one truth to religion that even I can't argue with. Many of the practices in religion had sound reasons and back in the dark ages of no education, sanitation they made absolute sense. The eating of meat from animals that ate cud was a protection from sickness in a time when bacteria and viruses was not understood. Snipping the boys was a practice of preventing infections of the boys gear in a time of no sanitation. Do these things still apply today with modern sanitation? In parts of the world YES. Other parts of the world No any more. You still have the cultural aspect of it and the religious aspect of it that applies everywhere as well. Its also as old as the worlds oldest profession. It started with the Egyptians or even predates them.

I can't remember who it was that said the HIV study in Africa isn't valid because the evidence was so over whelming. That's retarded because if the evidence is that strong that early on and makes that big of a difference for Heterosexual men in a environment FULL of HIV of course a study will be cut short to fast track policy change.

Even in North America with good sanitation and medical treatment, uncut boys still suffer 3 times the infections and penis problems then cut boys.

besson3c · Nov 5, 2011, 02:20 PM

Originally Posted by andi*pandi

I had no idea this was a lefty/righty issue...

Let's keep this out of the pol lounge...

Nor did I...

Maybe the question is what is *not* a lefty/righty issue?

besson3c · Nov 5, 2011, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

I dunno, the "usual suspects" started dog piling on subego because he's clipped, telling him how terrible he is for doing it. AND it was someone from the Left (OldManMac) who brought religion/politics into this, he started the whole, "it's a barbaric practice which is based on superstition and mythology" thing. It wasn't ebuddy. I guess you guys don't realize just how intolerant and antagonistic you can be.

FWIW, if we have a boy we're not getting him circumcised, we're going to wait until he's older and let him decide. But that's not because we feel that it's "mutilation" but because it is a sensitive matter in a sensitive area. If he then wants to get it done, more power to him.

The whole "he started it first" bit stopped working once I hit my teens.

It doesn't matter who started it, we are all perfectly capable of ending it.

besson3c · Nov 5, 2011, 02:24 PM

I still want to learn more about how an uncircumcized penis can become infected, and how common this is... I'm too scared to Google it too.

Waragainstsleep · Nov 5, 2011, 02:30 PM

Originally Posted by Doofy

Or, to use the other argument if you're so inclined, God wouldn't have put them there in the first place.

That would just be undermining a rational point with an irrational one though.

Athens · Nov 5, 2011, 02:45 PM

Originally Posted by besson3c

I still want to learn more about how an uncircumcized penis can become infected, and how common this is... I'm too scared to Google it too.

Circumcision - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

besson3c · Nov 5, 2011, 02:49 PM

Originally Posted by Athens

Circumcision - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Thanks, interesting, although this stuff makes me skemish....

Also from this Wikipedia page, Canada's stance on circumcision:

The Fetus and Newborn Committee of the Canadian Paediatric Society posted "Neonatal circumcision revisited" in 1996 and "Circumcision: Information for Parents" in November 2004. The 1996 position statement says that "circumcision of newborns should not be routinely performed",[49] and the 2004 information to parents says: 'Circumcision is a "non-therapeutic" procedure, which means it is not medically necessary. Parents who decide to circumcise their newborns often do so for religious, social, or cultural reasons. [. . .] After reviewing the scientific evidence for and against circumcision, the CPS does not recommend routine circumcision for newborn boys. Many paediatricians no longer perform circumcisions.

subego · Nov 5, 2011, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

I dunno, the "usual suspects" started dog piling on subego because he's clipped, telling him how terrible he is for doing it. AND it was someone from the Left (OldManMac) who brought religion/politics into this, he started the whole, "it's a barbaric practice which is based on superstition and mythology" thing. It wasn't ebuddy. I guess you guys don't realize just how intolerant and antagonistic you can be.

I was dogpiled?

FWIW, I didn't really want to have it done. It got too tight and snapped (not fun).

besson3c · Nov 5, 2011, 02:57 PM

I'm assuming we can all agree that female circumcision is barbaric?

Doofy · Nov 5, 2011, 02:58 PM

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep

That would just be undermining a rational point with an irrational one though.

Don't

at me you big girl!

lpkmckenna · Nov 5, 2011, 02:58 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

I dunno, the "usual suspects" started dog piling on subego because he's clipped, telling him how terrible he is for doing it.

I don't recall a single person criticizing subego. Myself, I assumed it was medical.

OAW · Nov 5, 2011, 03:04 PM

Only page 2 and the thread is already off the rails huh? Circumcised here. Wouldn't have it any other way. Had my son done as in infant. Didn't see much point in waiting since IMO potentially subjecting him to such a procedure as an adult would have been far worse experience. Wanted to have my daughter's ears pierced as a baby for the same reason but I was overruled by her mother. She then got it done anyway as a pre-teen and received the "full experience". Wasn't very thrilled about that but it wasn't too bad. I shudder at the thought of an adult circumcision though. I have no idea how this is even remotely a left/right issue. It's a personal/family concern. The million dollar question I have for the OP is … why do you care one way or the other?

OAW

Shaddim · Nov 5, 2011, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by besson3c

The whole "he started it first" bit stopped working once I hit my teens.

It doesn't matter who started it, we are all perfectly capable of ending it.

That's great, but it's better when it never gets started in the first place. Right?

besson3c · Nov 5, 2011, 03:30 PM

Originally Posted by Shaddim

That's great, but it's better when it never gets started in the first place. Right?

This is true.

Doofy · Nov 5, 2011, 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by OAW

Wanted to have my daughter's ears pierced as a baby for the same reason but I was overruled by her mother.

Wait. What?
I pierced my own ear with a blunt stud whilst walking down the local high street. It's not that painful.

Why don't we all go the whole hog and give our sons a Prince Albert while they're babies? Y'know, just in case.

Shaddim · Nov 5, 2011, 04:38 PM

Yeah, pierced mine with a sewing needle, did my nipples the same way. It didn't hurt that much at all.

subego · Nov 5, 2011, 04:45 PM

My ear was with the staple gun contraption thing. I remember it hurting, but not like crazy bad or anything.

What was more irritating is the stem wasn't long enough to accommodate a little swelling.

OAW · Nov 5, 2011, 05:02 PM

Originally Posted by Doofy

Wait. What?
I pierced my own ear with a blunt stud whilst walking down the local high street. It's not that painful.

Why don't we all go the whole hog and give our sons a Prince Albert while they're babies? Y'know, just in case.

If I knew what a "Prince Albert" was …

OAW

Doofy · Nov 5, 2011, 05:15 PM

Originally Posted by OAW

If I knew what a "Prince Albert" was …

moonmonkey · Nov 5, 2011, 05:30 PM

I has my clitoris removed by a witchdoctor in Uganda.
Was definitely worth the money having it done properly.

OAW · Nov 5, 2011, 06:05 PM

Still not catching the joke. Maybe it's a British humor thing.

OAW

brassplayersrock² · Nov 5, 2011, 06:25 PM

I come back and read through and think, ffs, it is the same people ruining the thread that ruin other threads here.

Athens · 07:41 PM

Originally Posted by besson3c

Thanks, interesting, although this stuff makes me skemish....

Also from this Wikipedia page, Canada's stance on circumcision:

Originally Posted by Athens

Your info is out of date for Europe, Canada, Australia, and not sure of the US because I didn't look it up. The medical communities as a whole no longer recommend it for every boy. Just those high risk of some things. And reading into the history of the change has more to do with political pressure then medial knowledge.

I did already said that up above....

Originally Posted by brassplayersrock²

I come back and read through and think, ffs, it is the same people ruining the thread that ruin other threads here.

You mean to say the only resident people on MacNN are doing what is done in forums and that is to discuss topics?

Is it your opinion that the only way a thread can't be ruined is if every one involved agree with each other? You have people that are for snipping and those that are against it. What would be the point in a discussion if every one agreed with it. Wouldn't last more then a couple posts. Between the bickering useful information for and against is being published as well and many people are learning stuff they might not have known about before. It is your kind of post that add's nothing. Perhaps its your kind who are ruining threads by expecting the unrealistic and imaginary...

Waragainstsleep · Nov 5, 2011, 08:00 PM

Originally Posted by subego

Like our appendix did when we evolved the kitchen?

Foreskins have been around much longer than kitchens. Give it time.

Waragainstsleep · Nov 5, 2011, 08:13 PM

Originally Posted by Athens

And I bet there are papers that say otherwise out there too, which makes it debatable.

Sorry Athens but your opinions on scientific papers lost all credibility in the thread about Burzynski.

For OAW:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_...nital_piercing)

Warning, there is a pic (NSFW).

brassplayersrock² · Nov 5, 2011, 08:30 PM

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep

Sorry Athens but your opinions on scientific papers lost all credibility in the thread about Burzynski.

For OAW:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_...ital_piercing)

Warning, there is a pic (NSFW).

Fixed

hyteckit · Nov 5, 2011, 08:32 PM

There was a dogpile on subego?

At 22, if subego wanted to do it for aesthetic or medical reasons, it's his choice. Why would I criticize him for it?

OldManMac · Nov 5, 2011, 08:38 PM

Originally Posted by andi*pandi

I had no idea this was a lefty/righty issue...

Let's keep this out of the pol lounge...

Neither did most of the rest of us, but some need to bring that up, as they have nothing else.

Shaddim · Nov 5, 2011, 09:16 PM

Originally Posted by OldManMac

Neither did most of the rest of us, but some need to bring that up, as they have nothing else.

Athens · Nov 5, 2011, 09:53 PM

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep

Sorry Athens but your opinions on scientific papers lost all credibility in the thread about Burzynski.

For OAW:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_...nital_piercing)

Warning, there is a pic (NSFW).

Excuse me asshole?

Waragainstsleep · Nov 5, 2011, 10:08 PM

Abandoning a study because the data was one sided is bad science. Guessing/hoping that scientific papers that agree with your point might exist instead of finding them is just lazy and foolish.

The fact you don't realise this along with your getting sucked in by the pseudoscience and the criminally bad published works of an obvious con man in the other thread means you have no credibility to comment on scientific papers or their validity.

Great comeback though.

Waragainstsleep · Nov 5, 2011, 10:10 PM

Originally Posted by brassplayersrock²

Fixed

Am I missing something? Did you fix my post or were you just agreeing with me?

subego · Nov 5, 2011, 10:10 PM

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep

For OAW:

Warning, there is a pic (NSFW).

subego · Nov 5, 2011, 10:10 PM

Better let him out.

Athens · Nov 5, 2011, 10:10 PM

What science for or against. No one has shown anything for or against. Put up and show a paper of scientific merit against his claims then. Bringing up Burzynski here is also retarded. Your just being a inflammatory goof now.

Jawbone54 · Nov 5, 2011, 11:53 PM

Glad to see my son's circumcision caused World War III.

Shaddim · Nov 6, 2011, 12:01 AM

Originally Posted by Jawbone54

Glad to see my son's circumcision caused World War III.

At least your team won...

... barely.

Athens · Nov 6, 2011, 12:01 AM

ROFL!!!!

When you put it that way