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zazou · Jun 21, 2003, 01:44 AM

http://www.4osx.com/forum/index.php?act=ST&f=1&t=1408

RedStar · Jun 21, 2003, 02:43 AM

expos� sounds cool...although I'm sure we don't know anything near what it's really capable of. Funny, also no mention of piles.

I'mDaMac · 01:38 AM

Hmmm, this is supposed to be the finder with the brushed metal look:

.
I hope not. Though I don't mind the brushed metal the navigation seems too reminiscent of Windoze.

Nice new DVD controller BTW.

Desktop experience?

neo_2510 · Jun 21, 2003, 06:52 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by I'mDaMac:
[B]Hmmm, this is supposed to be the finder with the brushed metal look:

.
I hope not. Though I don't mind the brushed metal the navigation seems too reminiscent of Windoze.

That's exactly what I thought the first time I saw that pic - plain ugly (the navigation)...

I don't want Windows on my Mac - I hope you can change it to the Jag-Style

swiz · Jun 21, 2003, 07:09 AM

I hope themes still work because that new titlebar for windows is fugly. All the new features look kick booty though

Krypton · Jun 21, 2003, 08:45 AM

Can someone make the new look into a theme? I remember someone doing something similar before Jaguar as I modified it a bit to fix the missing pieces.

phillryu · Jun 21, 2003, 09:52 AM

Interesting dvd player. I wonder if that 'black' area is for metal drawers.

And the finder kicks ass, I want iTunes style tagging! Insta searching for french homework tagged documents.. yum. I've always wanted to just drop all my stuff in the documents folder, instead of putting all my hw in this huge folder hierarchy of months.

bbxstudio · Jun 21, 2003, 10:23 AM

Originally posted by swiz:
I hope themes still work because that new titlebar for windows is fugly. All the new features look kick booty though

Tell me about it - overall (besides the cool extra functionality of iTunes-style finder windw modes) it looks like a huge step backwards visually. I was all for the flattened Aqua elements, but that finder titlebar is pure 5h!t (no offense). The labels also look pretty fisher-price, almost infantile.

Man, why abandon the realistic semi-translucent thing they had so going on with Aqua in favor of this flat non-commital plastic garbage? Bah >=p The visual design lead for the OS division at Apple needs a shake - they should have went with the obvious - Smoothstripes Glossy. Hey Steve Jobs - your guy is making you look silly... why not fly in Max Rudberg from Sweden to give everything a once-over before you release this puppy. People are laughing at you.

Well, some things we know for sure - we'll have Metal as a system-wide option throughout, so basically 2 designs in one (pretty cool)... also, we've got NOTHING to worry about in terms of being upstaged by Apple... the NEED us more, now than ever. I think Panther will make themes NECESSARY for a good number of people (well, those with taste and the need for some consistency in any case).

So, my review of the Panther UI (from a visual standpoint based on what we see here) can be summed up in one word: blecchh.

bbxstudio · Jun 21, 2003, 10:28 AM

Originally posted by Krypton:
Can someone make the new look into a theme?

Why? It's hideous. The only cool things about it are functional - from a design standpoint it looks like an amateurish Aqua mod (and a badly done one at that). Those stripes? They're worse than the original ones by far - they're so non-commital and a thousand times more annoying now. Apple bad!

Hi I'm Ben · Jun 21, 2003, 10:33 AM

complain complain complain

You haven't seen it yet. You don't know.
Everytime a new apple product is released it's like a game to see who can come up with the wittiest ways to bash it. I'm sure there will be ways around that finder or other options. Just as there are now.

I think it looks similar to Not windows up
:gasp: Safari!
Maybe... MAYBE they plan on implimenting a browser into their OS. I think that's a good idea, some don't. Either way I'm sure they'll have the option to change that if not.. THere's always alternative finders. Stop ripping about a group of 4 screen shots and trying to decide everything about the OS from them. I actually think that the new screen shots look a million times better then the regular pinstripe aqua.

bbxstudio · Jun 21, 2003, 10:52 AM

Originally posted by phillryu:
Interesting dvd player.

Bah, it's 5h!t (no offense). C'mon, in this day and age of funky skin design, you'd think Apple could do a little better than expand upon the crappy half-assed brushed metal look they introduced IN SYSTEM 7!!!! Man, that brushed Quicktime thing is so old it's got whiskers. Just look at some of the Aqua-inspired Audion faces and you'll see that there's a million and one things they could've done to create a funky DVD remote. It makes me a bit upset - even WindowsMediaPlayer has skinnable remotes built right into the system (and they don't even have 8-bit window masks)... sadly, the best interface eye-candy is being produced in Windows these days (much of it by guys working on Macs shut out by Apple's proprietary stance and aversion to true customization) while Apple rests on its laurels and arrogantly assumes that Aqua and (more infuriatingly) Quicktime brushed metal are the final word in hi-tech... it really is pathetic, where's the innovation? When are they going to get some GUI design talent that finally reflects the quality of their hardware design? Oooh, I could go on and on...

bbxstudio · Jun 21, 2003, 11:04 AM

Originally posted by Hi I'm Ben:
complain complain complain...
You haven't seen it yet. You don't know.

Man, we're looking at it, we're simply commenting on what we see... I don't think anybody's trying to be witty. I also don't think it's unrealistic to expect that Apple have a clue as to how things like a stripeless (or stripe-diminished) Aqua should look. I think anybody with any design sense (especially those of us who've tinkered and worked with Aqua for so long) is looking at this and saying 'wuh?'... it's like a total departure from the consistency and quality we're used to seeing come from Apple. Blur your eyes a little bit (you don't even have to) - the titlebar is a totally different tone than the stripe panels... it also looks like a completely different material than anything else and bears no resemblance to any of the real-world materials in Apple's hardware. Crappy, there's no other word for it. And that green progress bar thing - where the hell did that come from? It's like the whole OS is becoming a mish-mash of elements from all of their applications. Horrible. Complain complain complain ad infinitum

ambush · Jun 21, 2003, 11:08 AM

I think it looks very very very very nice!

More professional, too.

I can't wait!

Giano · Jun 21, 2003, 11:21 AM

mumble mumble....
there's 1 thing that i'm thinking....someone remember how was in Puma the icon in the system preference panel of Desktop? ....i don't want to fall in error but i remember that Puma had a different default desktop than Jaguar and the icon in system preference was a thumbnail of this different desktop.....so why Panther should have (following the ppics) a desktop icon equal to Jaguar?

i'm saying stupid things? i don't remember well....

Hi I'm Ben · Jun 21, 2003, 11:24 AM

check your caches cause the pictures are gone ! =D

Giano · 12:32 PM

-

phillryu · Jun 21, 2003, 12:07 PM

BBX..

Yeah, the DVD player is nothing radical.. but it sure as hell looks better than the current one. Maybe quicktime will start supporting skins. Doesn't it already have rudimentary support for them?

bbxstudio · Jun 21, 2003, 12:49 PM

Originally posted by phillryu:
BBX..

Yeah, the DVD player is nothing radical.. but it sure as hell looks better than the current one. Maybe quicktime will start supporting skins. Doesn't it already have rudimentary support for them?

Quicktime skins are embedded in the movie itself. Not really skins.

phillryu · 01:21 PM

Hmm are these fake?

For one, the 'panther' look could be made into a 10.2 theme. Second, check out Mail's 'working offline'. Weird with the o and the n huh? Then, look how in the system prefs, the "General" icon hasn't been updated with the panther look. Minor, but worth noting.

Those are some things I noticed. Personally, if this is it, Apple better have themes. I like my smoothstripes sunken

Plus, how much would it suck if BBX had his theme 100% complete by August, then found out that panther doesn't support themes?

EDIT: Also, what's with the fluctuating activity bar in the ichat shot even though there is no camera connected?

Also, why the name Expos�? Seems kind of abstract compared to the other system prefs. My prediction?

A: This is an older panther build
B: This is fake

There is no option C. Panther will NOT look like this by monday.

bbxstudio · Jun 21, 2003, 01:33 PM

Originally posted by phillryu:
Plus, how much would it suck if BBX had his theme 100% complete by August, then found out that panther doesn't support themes?

Man, you need therapy - you've got a one-track mind

In any case, if OSX ever locks out theming , I'll probably be buying a Windows machine and start doing some serious skinning for WindowsXP instead. I'd hate to see this happen, but it's a monkey I'll need off my back one way or another. At least with Windows I'll have more flexibility and won't have to ram designs into an existing footprint (but on the downside it would still suck seeing as it's Windows). Can't win.

bbxstudio · Jun 21, 2003, 01:35 PM

Originally posted by phillryu:
Hmm are these fake?

Quite possibly - or perhaps an 'unskinned' pre-release developer's build to pinpoint leaks or keep the surprise under wraps (let's hope).

bbxstudio · Jun 21, 2003, 01:40 PM

Originally posted by Hi I'm Ben:
check your caches cause the pictures are gone ! =D

new link:

http://www.deskmod.com/panther/

phillryu · Jun 21, 2003, 01:41 PM

BBX, another thing I noticed. (Since you're the only one that seems to be receptive to possible fakeness

)

Note how after Nice, it's 0,00. Curious huh? The others use decimal points.

EDIT: And why post a picture of the Finder 'About Box' rather than more important snapshots of column view, or finder preferences??

phillryu · Jun 21, 2003, 01:46 PM

Oh, and with expos�'s screen corners, what the hell would happen to the screensaver activation via screen corners?

quandarry · Jun 21, 2003, 02:19 PM

some things to note...

this will be the first developers release so relax...remember the beta compared to release 10.0...big difference...

anyone notice the "appearance" control panel in the system preferences ala classic...the general panel is gone...hoping this means something...

the finder has BORDERS...

release date still months off...they have had no feedback yet for this build...remember 10.3 is a result of feedback from the past year or so on 10.2...

what you see is not always what you get...this may be the default appearance and maybe it can be changed radically...like font colors and borders etc...

i'm psyched!

bOOzo · Jun 21, 2003, 02:27 PM

I kinda hope they are fake too. If not fake, then at least not the final appearance. The new titlebar and menubar looks out of place and if they are going to make the stripes subtle, why not go the whole way and remove them? Maybe they are just too stubborn.

I'm hoping that they will officially support themes in 10.3, that would be kick ass.

quandarry · Jun 21, 2003, 02:32 PM

oh just a little clue that's really got me dancing a jig...

notice in the finder shot that applications os9 is selected...what color is the font...WHITE!...you don't get this in jag!

dancing madly backwards...yeehaaaaaa!

ubba · 03:21 PM

quandarry: Do you mean that's isn't a Jag theme?
Anyway it could be fake, a photoshop manipulation, or some PC user which is kidding

.....
jo

danielsh · Jun 21, 2003, 03:18 PM

Originally posted by quandarry:
notice in the finder shot that applications os9 is selected...what color is the font...WHITE!...you don't get this in jag!

That looks like it's probably just an interface change. I kinda like the white-on-rounded-blue mode of selection, personally.

It does look like these screenshots came from an early developers' build�like phillryu said, there's that comma error. I really don't think that they're fake, though, considering that some of the changes aren't too terrible.

ubba · Jun 21, 2003, 03:24 PM

I believe that white text on blue is an applied label. They were visible on the shots published on 4 OS X site

.....
jo

sushiism · Jun 21, 2003, 03:24 PM

Originally posted by Hi I'm Ben:

I think it looks similar to Not windows up
:gasp: Safari!
Maybe... MAYBE they plan on implimenting a browser into their OS. I think that's a good idea, some don't. Either way I'm sure they'll have the option to change that if not.. THere's always alternative finders. Stop ripping about a group of 4 screen shots and trying to decide everything about the OS from them. I actually think that the new screen shots look a million times better then the regular pinstripe aqua.

GOD NO! web browsing does not belong in the finder, this is one thing that made me switch to a mac.

Dace · Jun 21, 2003, 03:35 PM

If OS X is gonna look like that, I'm switching over to the dark side. I love the stripes and I love Jaguar's new look; this doesn't look like an improvement, it looks like OS X Beta. If this is fake, then now you know why Apple hates rumors...it's bad for their reputation. I thought Apple wasn't suppose to be like "1984", looks like that's where they're headed.

quandarry · Jun 21, 2003, 04:06 PM

you guyz mean this is an applied label and not a selection?

dang!#$%&*#

this person went out of his way to obscure the date in the menubar but he/she forgot the ical in the doc...he/she is using a laptop...heh maybe they snuck it out under securities nose...

i wonder how many heads are rolling with the website fiasco and now this leak from an apple employee obviously (since it has not been seeded yet)...

peeps must be getting really pissed off at steve jobs...i think things are not going very well at apple...just a feeling...

Gatorzx2 · Jun 21, 2003, 04:15 PM

I'm hoping they are fake or at least a very, very early build. The GUI is even more inconsistent then it is in Jaguar right now.

I've been hoping that with Panther they'll pick one style, tweak it and suprise us all with a new and amazing slightly tweaked aqua.

I'mDaMac · Jun 21, 2003, 04:34 PM

Okay I'll be one of the few to say that I like the look. The harshness of the pinstripes is gone; I like the subtle/understated look. I like the titlebars and the embedded widgets. I don't like being distracted by the interface so this will be a nice change.

bbxstudio · 04:44 PM

Originally posted by quandarry:

anyone notice the "appearance" control panel in the system preferences ala classic...the general panel is gone...hoping this means something...

It means (probably) that you can choose Aqus or Metal, standard or graphite system-wide (plus the usual hilite color, etc.)... fonts? doubt it... colors beyond standard traffic light and graphite? doubt that too...

the finder has BORDERS...

Another brutal inconsistency. They probably only exist in the finder with the metal appearance applied. I'd be willing to bet that they're not an option the user can opt for or against. I would say this is a bonus for themers except for the fact that they're stupidly fat and seemingly inconsistent with apps like Safari - so I guess we'll see...

Where we really need to see exploitable borders is in places like dropdown headers, toolbars, menus and the like. Add some edges on things like menubar items, sortlist buttons, etc and you blow the possibilities wide open. I'm not seeing any of that in Panther.

bOOzo · Jun 21, 2003, 04:45 PM

Originally posted by Dace:
If OS X is gonna look like that, I'm switching over to the dark side. I love the stripes and I love Jaguar's new look; this doesn't look like an improvement, it looks like OS X Beta.

That's a bad reason to switch.. Just apply a theme.

bbxstudio · Jun 21, 2003, 04:51 PM

Originally posted by I'mDaMac:
I don't like being distracted by the interface so this will be a nice change.

I find the glaring inconsistencies enormously distracting

It's not that it's boring or too simple (that would be okay), it's just so damned sloppy. All I can say is that if this is what the final Panther looks like, Steve Jobs and/or anybody responsible for Aqua's appearance at Apple should be ashamed.

970 · Jun 21, 2003, 05:02 PM

Haha they've gone back to OS 8 and 9 grey with flat buttons. Funny that a "superior" OS like Mac OS X is becoming more like Mac OS 9 as it "advances." I've never seen a company before this put out an OS that actually strived to be like the one preceeding it, I can tell you that.

neoTony · Jun 21, 2003, 08:07 PM

Originally posted by bOOzo:
I kinda hope they are fake too. If not fake, then at least not the final appearance.

They're not fake. Those screen shots were taken yesterday...

Zimphire · Jun 21, 2003, 08:07 PM

Originally posted by 970:
Haha they've gone back to OS 8 and 9 grey with flat buttons. Funny that a "superior" OS like Mac OS X is becoming more like Mac OS 9 as it "advances."

It is? Hmm

I've never seen a company before this put out an OS that actually strived to be like the one preceeding it, I can tell you that.

For one I don't think it's doing this. But even if they was doing this, people loved OS 9s GUI and layout for a reason.

But hey I really don't think it's going to look like that. If it does, I will be surprised. And disappointed. I like that brushed metal Finder though.

Target Practice · Jun 21, 2003, 09:25 PM

Hey, I just noticed the separators in the drop-down menus. I've missed those.

phillryu · Jun 21, 2003, 09:52 PM

LOL Neotony!

What, because iCal says it's the 20th? If I were faking a photo, I'd make sure the date was very recent.. In fact, even better if it looks like I was trying to hide the date (by blurring out the menu clock) but conveniently forgot to blur out iCal's icon and app window. Hmm

brainchild2b · Jun 21, 2003, 11:38 PM

I don't understand why every whines about the navigation being like windows. If you use windows XP with plenty of ram it's navigation options makes my mac look like a toy.

And why do you b itch so much about this? TURN IT THE HELL off if you use windows and stick to classic navigation. You'll be able to do the same type of thing in Mac OS X

Let those of us who like cool new navigation features have them. STOP whining. If you don't like them then you can turn them off.

Sheesh. Most of us like new ways to navigation and having OPTIONS. Don't force the rest of us to be stuck in your system 7 navigating' ways.

I'll take my file navigation in windows XP over the current OS X one any day. You have cool ways to browse photos in the finder (i don't want to launch a freaking app just to browse some photos and find one to open) and cool ways to browse your music collections. Lots of nice options to change and customize the displays.

You'd think in the GUI Customization thread everyone would be all for CUSTOMIZATION. Just remember you can turn all this off at the end of the day if you want your system 7 old school navigation. Please no more bitching based upon one screenshot you saw in brushed metal. Besides even if it couldn't be turned off (AND IT CAN) the few of you who decided not to like it would hack it out anyway.

SO SHUT UP.

Mike S. · Jun 22, 2003, 12:07 AM

Here is what I think is wrong with it.

That and the iChat video screen that has a video icon in the XP style amongst Aqua icons and a wierd bar of some kind that also looks like it was ripped straight out of XP.

MindFad · Jun 22, 2003, 12:58 AM

I actually like the new gray-ish titlebar mixed with teh pinstripes and Aqua. Don't worry -- it's only one person.

Not liking the brushed Finder, though; at least we'll be able to turn that off. Labels look awesome. Can't wait. And the big question will be, of course...

...is it snappy?

Dace · 01:19 AM

Looks like $hit to me so far.

In this image:

Shouldn't CPU, System Memory etc be tabs

Plus does OS X really need or presently have such an Activity Monitor? Seems Windows-y to me *cough*Task Manager *cough* "Quit Process"? Guess "Force Quit" is gone. Why is there a process with no name?

And if you look closely at another of the screenshots, the iTunes button displays the stop icon...shouldn't it display pause??? And why is the Finder icon in the dock different from the dock in the About Finder Box?

Maybe its some Windows User that is playing a trick on us

NetworkShadow · Jun 22, 2003, 01:20 AM

It does look ugly and hodgepodge to me, they should have redesigned Aqua from scratch instead of this. The new finder makes me want to vomit, it looks so windows... I do like the new DVD remote though.

neoTony · Jun 22, 2003, 03:26 AM

Originally posted by phillryu:
LOL Neotony!

What, because iCal says it's the 20th? If I were faking a photo, I'd make sure the date was very recent.. In fact, even better if it looks like I was trying to hide the date (by blurring out the menu clock) but conveniently forgot to blur out iCal's icon and app window. Hmm

Uh, no, because I was shown these on the 20th.

ubba · Jun 22, 2003, 03:26 AM

I believe that shots are true, yesterday I found a rumors site which says that shots were real, but... my thought is that Apple hidden the real appearance so themers cannot copy it (like when new cars are tested on the road).

.....
jo