[Doofy]

Fat women would willingly pile on extra pounds for NHS surgery | Mail Online

A third of overweight women would rather gain weight with hope of undergoing free weight loss surgery than diet to slim down.

Some 32 per cent would deliberately pile on the pounds and become 'morbidly obese' if it meant they could have an NHS funded operation.

The research, commissioned by Britain's largest cosmetic treatment review website, found one in 10 of the respondents had already requested weight loss surgery from their GP.

The survey also revealed that 28 per cent were happy to claim they were 'depressed' in an attempt to get a free nose job.

The website goodsurgeonguide.co.uk surveyed 1,216 women across the UK to discover if they would consider undergoing NHS funded surgery to improve certain aspects their body and appearance.

It'll be an interesting day when Amaraka starts giving free gastric band surgeries.

[design219]

Finally, an interesting topic for the political lounge!

Thanks Doofy.

[The Final Dakar]

Apparently two-thirds of overweight women aren't as lazy as their weight implies.

[finboy]

This thread is NOTHING w/o pics.

Not a surprising outcome. I've heard of similar things here, because insurance companies would only cover certain types of treatment for people who were "morbidly" obese.

More important, how long after government funding until the American Trial Lawyers Assoc starts sponsoring seminars on how to sue for failed lap-band surgery?

[CreepDogg]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

It'll be an interesting day when Amaraka starts giving free gastric band surgeries.

I think you'll see a different result. What with the food you Limeys eat, I'd go out of my way to get a gastric bypass over there too. Blech!

[Doofy]

By the way, when the article mentions "a third of fat chicks" it actually means "a third of British women", since as far as I can tell there's only about ten women in the country who aren't fatties. Fat acceptance culture has not been kind to the peasants of the kingdom.

[Laminar]

In b4 Face Ache.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by finboy 

This thread is NOTHING w/o pics.

[besson3c]

Not to suggest that I think surgery is a good option in any way, but what is the success rate of these sorts of surgeries?

To me it seems pointless to make stomaches smaller or perform lypo or whatever if the person is just going to stretch them out again and go back to their old dietary ways.

[sek929]

In order to even qualify for the surgery, at least in the states, you have to lose a decent amount of weight and keep it off to show that you are actually serious about changing your ways.

I worked for a woman who had a very obese daughter. The daughter was scheduled for the surgery months and months in advance but still got denied because she ended up gaining weight.

The idea that the state would give out free gastric bypasses to these fat ****s is sickening. My mother can barely afford her medication.

[Laminar]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Not to suggest that I think surgery is a good option in any way, but what is the success rate of these sorts of surgeries?

To me it seems pointless to make stomaches smaller or perform lypo or whatever if the person is just going to stretch them out again and go back to their old dietary ways.

I have an acquaintance that got gastric bypass about a year and a half ago. She dropped 120 pounds and has kept it off. Even now, if she has too much sugar or too much food in general she'll throw up.

The weight loss is something that didn't happen with a strictly regimented diet and regular exercise. Sleep apnia made weight loss more difficult.

[OreoCookie]

Doofy, at least you haven't inundated us with pictures of fat women … yet.
(Keep in mind that this may be considered grounds for instant bannination )

Here, in Germany, you sometimes hear outcries of obese who have been denied hip and knee replacements. What they do not understand is that if they don't lose weight and the hip or (especially) knee replacements breaks, they'd be confined to a wheelchair. Needless to say that if you are seriously overweight, the probability of that can become very, very large.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie 

Doofy, at least you haven't inundated us with pictures of fat women … yet.
(Keep in mind that this may be considered grounds for instant bannination )

Oreo me old fruit, never mind the bannination - the act of looking for pics of fat chicks in the first place is grounds for instant suicide!

Originally Posted by OreoCookie 

Here, in Germany, you sometimes hear outcries of obese who have been denied hip and knee replacements. What they do not understand is that if they don't lose weight and the hip or (especially) knee replacements breaks, they'd be confined to a wheelchair. Needless to say that if you are seriously overweight, the probability of that can become very, very large.

Yeah, we have the same deal here. Local health authority won't operate on obese folks, much to the dismay of the fatties and fat-enablers.

[BadKosh]

What ever happened to stop putting food in your mouth?

[finboy]

Originally Posted by BadKosh 

What ever happened to stop putting food in your mouth?

If only it were that simple. For some people (some Fat Chicks included) the only way to lose weight is to spend an hour or more per day working out. Even then, the wear and tear on their bodies is tremendous. It depends on the person, but a lot of "fat" people eat like birds and still can't lose weight for whatever reason.

I know it's hard for people under 30 to imagine, but when you get "old" your body stops wanting to do some of the things it did before. Keeping weight off gets a lot harder as you age.

[reader50]

Originally Posted by BadKosh 

What ever happened to stop putting food in your mouth?

One of the accomplishments of 1st world countries is the elimination of starvation. Food is plentiful.

Natural selection should eventually fix this. Guys will go for the girls who look attractive (and vice versa). Media stereotyping of slim people will help.

Whoa. Did I just prove media stereotyping can be a good thing?

[richwig83]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Dust? Anyone? No!...... Dust? Anyone? No!

[TheoCryst]

AAAAARE you gonna take me home tonight?
AHHHHH down beside that red firelight
AAAAARE you gonna let it all hang out?
Fat bottomed girls, you make the rockin' world go round!

[CollinG3G4]

Originally Posted by finboy 

IIt depends on the person, but a lot of "fat" people eat like birds and still can't lose weight for whatever reason.

Diet and exercise don't work because most of them are lying to themselves. Oh you ate 5,500 calories each day this week rather than 5,300 and didn't drop 300lbs? Oh you did 100 arm curls with a 3 pound resistance band while watching tv for 6 hours ? Gee, diet and exercise just won't work for you. Better get your stomach reduced to a 4oz pouch. It has got be to your genes or something.

[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by finboy 

a lot of "fat" people eat like birds and still can't lose weight

But what type of bird?

"Grimes: God, he eats like a pig.
Lenny: I dunno. Pigs tend to chew. I'd say he eats more like a duck."

[TheoCryst]

Originally Posted by CollinG3G4 

Oh you ate 5,500 calories each day this week rather than 5,300 and didn't drop 300lbs?

[Shaddim]

Fat cats = cool
Fat chicks = ewww

[lpkmckenna]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Fat women would willingly pile on extra pounds for NHS surgery | Mail Online

Someday, Doofy is gonna realize that the Daily Mail just makes sh!t up.

[smacintush]

Originally Posted by finboy 

If only it were that simple. For some people (some Fat Chicks included) the only way to lose weight is to spend an hour or more per day working out. Even then, the wear and tear on their bodies is tremendous. It depends on the person, but a lot of "fat" people eat like birds and still can't lose weight for whatever reason.

I know it's hard for people under 30 to imagine, but when you get "old" your body stops wanting to do some of the things it did before. Keeping weight off gets a lot harder as you age.

Most of this is just BS. While there are a certain number of people with real metabolic issues, these people are very few. You say "a lot" of fat people eat like birds? I agree. Birds eat constantly. (due to their relatively high metabolism) The fact is that nearly all fat people are eating more calories than they burn. It's really not more complicated than that. Of course they may need to exercise, but what are they doing with the rest of their time? Most people over estimate the number of calories exercise burns and exercise is almost meaningless if you lay around on the couch the rest of the time.

You are right about getting older but...this isn't a secret so there's really no excuse. Besides more studies are showing that as we get older a few extra pounds (not obesity) is actually a good thing, partly because we have more body mass as a hedge against the health issues we face as we get older.

[ThinkInsane]

Originally Posted by sek929 

In order to even qualify for the surgery, at least in the states, you have to lose a decent amount of weight and keep it off to show that you are actually serious about changing your ways.

I worked for a woman who had a very obese daughter. The daughter was scheduled for the surgery months and months in advance but still got denied because she ended up gaining weight.

The idea that the state would give out free gastric bypasses to these fat ****s is sickening. My mother can barely afford her medication.

I don't know about that. I know people that have had it done, and the only thing they had to do was be fat enough, and have a shrink sign off saying that they really want to lose weight or some nonsense. Of the people that I know that have had it, there is only one that comes to mind that has actually kept the weight off.

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Apparently two-thirds of overweight women aren't as lazy as their weight implies.

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by smacintush 

Most of this is just BS. While there are a certain number of people with real metabolic issues, these people are very few. You say "a lot" of fat people eat like birds? I agree. Birds eat constantly. (due to their relatively high metabolism) The fact is that nearly all fat people are eating more calories than they burn. It's really not more complicated than that. Of course they may need to exercise, but what are they doing with the rest of their time? Most people over estimate the number of calories exercise burns and exercise is almost meaningless if you lay around on the couch the rest of the time.

You are right about getting older but...this isn't a secret so there's really no excuse. Besides more studies are showing that as we get older a few extra pounds (not obesity) is actually a good thing, partly because we have more body mass as a hedge against the health issues we face as we get older.

Bingo! I've had to lose a substantial amount of weight in the past and naturally folks will ask how you've done it. It is exactly as simple as you imply. You've got to work off more than you take in. Period. If you're taking in too much, cut back your portions, slow down, and don't scrape the plate. Eat lower fat foods (fat calories less than a third of total calories) more frequently throughout the day. Don't take in the single, large fatty meal once a day and wonder why your body is storing fat. Don't fool yourself into believing you can eat 3500 calories a day, sit @ your office job, plop down on the couch watching 3 hours of tv when you get home, and walk for 20 minutes thinking you should be losing weight. You won't. You're either okay with being overweight (and I've got absolutely no problem with that personally, enjoy life if that's what does it for you!) or you're not and you've been kidding yourself and getting bummed out over how all these circumstances are beyond your control. They're not. @ 30 yrs old there is no reason you can't be in the best shape of your life. @ 40 yrs old there is no reason you can't be in the best shape of your life. @ 50 yrs old there's no reason you can't be in the best shape of your life. @ 60 yrs old... well, you'll likely remain fat for the duration.

You will be uncomfortable when you work out. You will sweat. A lot. It will make your muscles sore and there will be signs of effort being put forth. It has to become habitual. There is no pill, hypnosis, surgery, magic diet, or 5-minute ab-burner that will magically give you the discipline to maintain a decent weight. It's all you. While there are the rare cases of metabolic disorders that lend to obesity, exercise and eating right is not unhealthy for them either and to cite these examples only perpetuates a defeatist mindset IMO.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by ebuddy 

Bingo! I've had to lose a substantial amount of weight in the past and naturally folks will ask how you've done it. It is exactly as simple as you imply. You've got to work off more than you take in. Period.

Again, it just isn't that simple for everyone. I wish it was. Once you guys get a little older and meet some different folks, etc. you'll see that it just doesn't work that way for all of us.

I agree there are plenty of sob stories and couch potatoes out there, but I also think that you're oversimplifying things. I've had to lose lots of weight in the past, for medical reasons, and I could devote 1-2 hours per day to it. But cutting back on portions, parking farther from the building, climbing stairs, and most of the other old saws just don't fix things by themselves.

Think what you want, but judging without knowing is just dumb.

[CollinG3G4]

Originally Posted by finboy 

AI've had to lose lots of weight in the past, for medical reasons, and I could devote 1-2 hours per day to it. But cutting back on portions, parking farther from the building, climbing stairs, and most of the other old saws just don't fix things by themselves.

You’re doing it wrong.

Pick one: Running, jogging, brisk walking, biking, weights, swimming, or any other activity that gets your heart rate up and sweat dripping off your back. Walking up stairs is NOT exercise. Two hours a day is way to much. Build up to it.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by CollinG3G4 

You’re doing it wrong.

Pick one: Running, jogging, brisk walking, biking, weights, swimming, or any other activity that gets your heart rate up and sweat dripping off your back. Walking up stairs is NOT exercise. Two hours a day is way to much. Build up to it.

No, you're thinking about folks with normal metabolism and muscle density. And when I had to do it, for a few years, I built up to 1-2 hours per day over an 8 or 9-month period. But yes, to keep weight off on a perfect diet, and to stay in shape, it took me up to 14 hours per week, every week.

So, one size does not fit all. There are too many factors to generalize, although I can understand the tendency to want to believe that.

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by finboy 

Think what you want, but judging without knowing is just dumb.

I'm telling you why and how I'm "knowing". What I say is not dumb, it is a simple mathematical formula that works. While you're correct that age is a factor of your metabolic rate, simple mathematics still apply. Your metabolic rate is (crudely) 10x your weight in calories. Even if your metabolic rate is half the normal person due to age or other physical anomalies, you're still burning over a thousand calories a day just by living and breathing. Add in cardio to move your heart rate for burn and other means of toning/building as muscle burns calories at idle. (build your largest muscles) If you are burning off more than you're taking in, it is physically impossible not to lose weight. This is not for some humans and not for others, it is for all humans. It is a physical characteristic of being a living thing.

What you're saying is something akin to; "Some people save money and it just disappears from their savings account. No matter what they do, save receipts, bank statements, eat nothing, but potatoes and ramen noodles, sock away x-% of their income... nothing works, the money just disappears."

Work off more than you take in. It is just that simple. If you had absolutely zero metabolism and physically didn't burn a single calorie outside a gym (no case of this that I'm aware of), stay in the gym if you want to lose weight. I've seen people's ideas of working out; the '1' setting on an elliptical, quitting at 20 minutes because the sweat is uncomfortable when it tickles their nose and they've been told all they have to do is 20 minutes of aerobic exercise three times a week. BZZZT! I'm telling you, you will absolutely pour sweat. You will come home from the gym and your clothes will literally be soaked through. There will be times when you wake up the next day and you're very, very sore. You have to count fat calories from calories to stay below 30%, you have to work out daily IMO.

Let me put this another way;
2500 calories of food intake - 600 burnt at the gym and another 2000 just by getting out of bed in the morning = negative, 100 calories/day. It is physically impossible even at a VERY slow metabolic rate (male, 5'9" @ 2000 calories/day) to gain weight at -100 calories/day. Impossible. This is not about "knowing", this is about simple mathematics and the biological sciences. BTW; a filling 6" cold-cut combo @ Subway for example is less than 600 calories.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by ebuddy 

I'm telling you why and how I'm "knowing". What I say is not dumb, it is a simple mathematical formula that works.

Cool! I don't know how I missed it all these years. Such a simple thing, yet millions of people leading regular lives also just miss it. Every day. Truly THIS is the last mystery of the Universe - figure it out and you've got a Nobel coming. They give those in "fitness," right?

I don't want to be snarky, but it just ain't that simple. Math works, but it doesn't translate into living one's life so easily.

[besson3c]

Maybe you two are talking about different things? There is losing the weight and there is leaving the weight off. Apparently (and I don't remember where I read this) if your body type is large by default it is much harder to maintain a default that is different.

[Cold Warrior]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Apparently (and I don't remember where I read this) if your body type is large by default it is much harder to maintain a default that is different.

Perhaps you are thinking of the body's set point.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Cold Warrior 

Perhaps you are thinking of the body's set point.

Yeah, thanks! I'm surprised there is no Wikipedia entry for this...

[besson3c]

Would you guys agree that there is far more pressure for women to not be a fat chick than there is for men to not be a fat dude?

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Would you guys agree that there is far more pressure for women to not be a fat chick than there is for men to not be a fat dude?

Yes, I would agree. There is far more pressure on women in all manner of appearance IMO.

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by finboy 

Cool! I don't know how I missed it all these years. Such a simple thing, yet millions of people leading regular lives also just miss it. Every day. Truly THIS is the last mystery of the Universe - figure it out and you've got a Nobel coming. They give those in "fitness," right?
I don't want to be snarky, but it just ain't that simple. Math works, but it doesn't translate into living one's life so easily.

Look, I understand your frustration finboy and certainly there are a great deal of variables when discussing weight loss and many things I'm not going to type out for expediency's sake. All I wanted to do was point out the 800 lb gorilla in the room and that is that we want a "right now!" solution to years of poor eating and behaviors and too often we want something else to point at for our own negligence. There is absolutely nothing elusive or mysterious about it. Work off more than you take in as opposed to years of taking in more than you work off. For the overwhelming majority of those who are obese, it really is just that simple. Problem is, it's not a popular message. You won't get a Nobel prize for the obvious, but you might lose a few pounds and do your self-confidence a great deal of good in the meantime.

Besides, are there instances where lots of exercise and healthy eating are bad messages? Nah, not really.

[finboy]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Maybe you two are talking about different things? There is losing the weight and there is leaving the weight off. Apparently (and I don't remember where I read this) if your body type is large by default it is much harder to maintain a default that is different.

We ARE thinking about different things, evidently. For a large number of people, keeping weight off and exercising is no big deal. For some of us it's extremely difficult, and the efficacy of exercising diminishes quickly when we commit to it. Dieting plus extensive exercise works, for a while, to a point, and then it doesn't anymore. Maintaining an ideal weight is harder for some of us than it is for others, and that changes as you age.

I'm sure there are some people for whom it never works, at that particular end of the continuum.

Set point is part of the matter, I'm sure.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by ebuddy 

Look, I understand your frustration finboy and certainly there are a great deal of variables when discussing weight loss and many things I'm not going to type out for expediency's sake. All I wanted to do was point out the 800 lb gorilla in the room and that is that we want a "right now!" solution to years of poor eating and behaviors and too often we want something else to point at for our own negligence. There is absolutely nothing elusive or mysterious about it. Work off more than you take in as opposed to years of taking in more than you work off. For the overwhelming majority of those who are obese, it really is just that simple. Problem is, it's not a popular message. You won't get a Nobel prize for the obvious, but you might lose a few pounds and do your self-confidence a great deal of good in the meantime.

Besides, are there instances where lots of exercise and healthy eating are bad messages? Nah, not really.

Yeah, but this will only work up to a point. If you have been fat all of your life, it will be very very hard to lose weight and maintain this beyond your body's (fat) set point.

For most people however, you're right, their body types are normal and this works to return to a normal weight. My point is that it depends on the person. What you say is accurate if you are not naturally obese like so many people are.

[andi*pandi]

When I was on the crew team in college, our winter workout was in the gym twice a day, 6 am and 4pm. We'd stretch, chat, and alternate row machines with weights, etc, for about an hour. When we got there in the morning, there was a girl on the treadmill. She was there when we left. When we got there in the afternoon, she was on the treadmill, and was there when we left. She also taught aerobics classes. Is that normal? I accept that my 2x daily crew practice was a bit extreme, but it is possible to be addicted to exercise, or use it overmuch if you're anorexic.

Also, mocking and scorning the poor fat guy who can only handle a 1" incline on the treadmill isn't a very encouraging way to be. Sure, that's not going to make him lose 100 pounds overnight, but it's a start. It's a personal decision on how to take care of yourself, and there's certainly enough internal personal demons saying mean things without others doing it outright.

That said, I think the article in the OP is ridiculous. It's good that doctors make people show they can lose weight before getting ok'd for this surgery. You have to maintain it, after all.

I know someone who did this surgery, boy were there nasty side effects. Eww. I wouldn't want it.

[ebuddy]

Originally Posted by andi*pandi 

Also, mocking and scorning the poor fat guy who can only handle a 1" incline on the treadmill isn't a very encouraging way to be.

But that wasn't intended to be encouragement, there were other things I said that were. By setting an elliptical at '1' and not generating sweat, you're kidding yourself by thinking this bare minimum will have an impact. Then you will tell others that you're working out and watching what you eat when you're really not putting forth enough effort for a return. I just don't want folks to kid themselves. 1 is a fantastic place to start if you're currently sedentary, but it is no place to remain if you're seriously working to improve. Again I want to be very clear, if it doesn't bother you there's absolutely nothing to address. I'm only talking to folks who are bummed out at their current shape. There is nothing mystical, expensive, or complex about it. They can do something about it, today, right now.

I know someone who did this surgery, boy were there nasty side effects. Eww. I wouldn't want it.

Yeah, this is hard to watch. Particularly when they've returned to obesity. I know two people who had the surgery, one changed her lifestyle into a balance between intake and outgo and the other returned to poor discipline and obesity. For many it is a new investment in themselves and a second chance. For others it is merely expensive, painful, and ineffective. I too am glad that there is at least a modest screening of candidates.

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Yeah, but this will only work up to a point. If you have been fat all of your life, it will be very very hard to lose weight and maintain this beyond your body's (fat) set point.

For most people however, you're right, their body types are normal and this works to return to a normal weight. My point is that it depends on the person. What you say is accurate if you are not naturally obese like so many people are.

Unfortunately... no, not really.

ebuddy is completely right here, I think. It's basic physics: take in less energy than you use. It doesn't matter what your "body type" is per se - you'll simply have to burn fat reserves.

Unfortunately, it's painful. And most of us live in a society where the easiest thing in the world to do is to eat well. Me, I live like a king and it's starting to show this past year.

greg

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton 

Unfortunately... no, not really.

ebuddy is completely right here, I think. It's basic physics: take in less energy than you use. It doesn't matter what your "body type" is per se - you'll simply have to burn fat reserves.

Unfortunately, it's painful. And most of us live in a society where the easiest thing in the world to do is to eat well. Me, I live like a king and it's starting to show this past year.

greg

So you don't believe in the body's set point?

[ShortcutToMoncton]

I don't believe there's a "fat" set-point, no.

There's quite obviously different body types, and some people will naturally have more fat than others. But I have yet to see myself a fat person who did not get that way by overeating (usually their entire life). They're ingesting more energy than they burn - and the rest gets stored.

I've never heard of someone who can legitimately say "oh, I take in fewer calories than I burn every day, but I'm still fat." See a dietician who knows some biochemistry. It's possible that your exercise has too many anaerobic compoments and you're using energy directly instead of stored (fat) energy.

greg

[Uncle Skeleton]

Even if there is a set point, you don't have to be a slave to it. You don't have to eat just because your body tells you you're hungry. Mind over matter.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton 

I don't believe there's a "fat" set-point, no.

There's quite obviously different body types, and some people will naturally have more fat than others. But I have yet to see myself a fat person who did not get that way by overeating (usually their entire life). They're ingesting more energy than they burn - and the rest gets stored.

I've never heard of someone who can legitimately say "oh, I take in fewer calories than I burn every day, but I'm still fat." See a dietician who knows some biochemistry. It's possible that your exercise has too many anaerobic compoments and you're using energy directly instead of stored (fat) energy.

Yup.

Yer main "set point", so to speak, is in yer appestat. Basically, the point at which your brain says "stop eating you fat bastard". This is a variable thing - fatties have their threshold set much higher than regular normal people.

Now, this may be seen as an excuse by some fatties using the "I have fat genes" BS, but the appestat can easily be re-educated in about four weeks through changing one's diet slightly. IIRC, you have to give up meat in the second week - which is why re-educating the body in this way hasn't really caught on.

[reader50]

When are we getting back to the fat chicks?

{quick trip to google images}

Never mind.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton 

Even if there is a set point, you don't have to be a slave to it. You don't have to eat just because your body tells you you're hungry. Mind over matter.

Yes, but what I have heard is that even if you don't eat more than a cracker or two a day or something, it is so incredibly physically difficult to lose weight beyond your set point and to keep things that way.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Yup.

Yer main "set point", so to speak, is in yer appestat. Basically, the point at which your brain says "stop eating you fat bastard". This is a variable thing - fatties have their threshold set much higher than regular normal people.

Now, this may be seen as an excuse by some fatties using the "I have fat genes" BS, but the appestat can easily be re-educated in about four weeks through changing one's diet slightly. IIRC, you have to give up meat in the second week - which is why re-educating the body in this way hasn't really caught on.

There are some that would say that this isn't true. I don't know what to believe, but this theory does seem to account for some of the stories I've heard and people that I've come to know. Whatever, like I said, I don't know if it's true or not, but I'm not comfortable embracing or discarding it based on a gut feeling either.

Lest you go on accusing me of being a fatty, I could stand to lose 20 pounds or so (I'm around 200 lbs at an inch or two under 6 feet), but I'm not crazy out of control fat either.

I also have a very big penis.