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subego
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Mar 16, 2018, 02:43 PM
 


Hide your children and small animals. Flying weed whacker’s a-comin!
     
Laminar
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Mar 16, 2018, 02:54 PM
 
Sweet. Model? Intent? Starting an aerial photography business? Getting your FAA license?
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 17, 2018, 07:29 AM
 
DJI Phantom 4 Pro+

I wanted to start with something cheap enough I wouldn’t get pissed if it suffers catastrophic pilot error.

At $1,350 for the wreckable part, this model fails miserably.

It is the cheapest model with a camera I can practically use, so the bet is on it surviving its own learning curve.

The plan is to add aerial photography to my “hype list” of skills and equipment I can offer a project, which means legally I’m stuck getting a license. In that regard, I’ve been irritated by the hyper-focus of most resources on the passing the test part of getting the license, which I think kinda misses the point.

Luckily, for now, I can still get away with flying under the hobbyist exemption, so next week I intend to give it a whirl. Settled on the forest preserve as my training grounds. Turns out it’s one of the few places around here where you can fly a drone without getting permission.
( Last edited by subego; Mar 17, 2018 at 03:17 PM. )
     
mindwaves
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Mar 17, 2018, 07:35 AM
 
Congrats! Do you live in a low density area? Own a lot of acreage? Would love to see some video.
{{{ mindwaves }}}
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 17, 2018, 02:37 PM
 
Unfortunately, no to both.

Hopefully I can shoot something fun next week. The forest preserve won’t look pretty right now, but all the naked branches will give the camera an extra noisy image to chew on.
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 17, 2018, 04:01 PM
 
It’s dopey, but I’m excited I finally get to use one of these embroidered tag thingies I have lying around unironically.

     
And.reg
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Mar 18, 2018, 03:40 PM
 
What if people are tossing a frisbee and playing with drones in the same area (e.g., a park), and the drone gets hit?
This one time, at Boot Camp, I stuck a flute up my PC.
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 18, 2018, 04:22 PM
 
My knee-jerk response is the pilot’s probably a ****wit. Don’t fly around airborne objects.
     
P
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Mar 18, 2018, 04:54 PM
 
The drone itself isn't very fragile, it is the rotors that can break off.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 18, 2018, 05:04 PM
 
Have three extra sets.
     
Stogieman
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Mar 20, 2018, 04:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post


Hide your children and small animals. Flying weed whacker’s a-comin!
Don't try walking the dog with that.


Nobody ever mentions my legendary sexual prowess.
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 21, 2018, 06:39 PM
 
Decided to play with the software on the remote from the comfort of a cozy chair in a warm apartment rather than standing outside where it’s still below freezing.

I got the model with the integrated smartdevice, rather that the BYOSD model.

Had I gone with an iPad Mini I’d have gotten...

1) Bigger screen (8” vs 5½”)
2) Third-party (supposedly much better) control software
3) Integrated Google satellite if I have cellular
4) iOS instead of Android

In exchange I’m getting...

1) One less component needing logistical support
2) Don’t have to buy an iPad
3) The screen is bright
4) Less weight
5) The smartdevice is really solidly built into the remote
6) It doesn’t look Frankenstein

I still think I made the right choice, but now that I’ve played with it, it’s less of a gimme than I thought. Number one on my list of pros is carrying most of the weight.
( Last edited by subego; Mar 21, 2018 at 07:45 PM. )
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 21, 2018, 07:50 PM
 
Also, I somehow got pushed the control app for BYO remotes, and not the integrated. This borks the mapping function, which isn’t the biggest deal because they’re not satellite anyway, but it took me a good 6 hours of effort ****ing with it before I realized giving up made more sense than fixing it.
     
Doc HM
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Mar 22, 2018, 05:20 AM
 
My daughters boyfriend bought the same drone. Then he noticed that he lives right next to RAF (formerly USAF) Fairford and slap bang in the middle of a 10 mile wide no drone fly zone.
This space for Hire! Reasonable rates. Reach an audience of literally dozens!
     
BadKosh
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Mar 22, 2018, 09:00 AM
 
The best advice I can give you as a micro helicopter pilot is to get a teeny micro drone to practice with. Really small ones cost about 40 bucks and usually don't break when crashed. You can run them into walls/windows etc without harm. A really fun to play with is Blade's MSR 4 channel helicopter.
     
BadKosh
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Mar 22, 2018, 09:02 AM
 
Great advice and how to's

https://www.helifreak.com/
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 22, 2018, 02:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by BadKosh View Post
The best advice I can give you as a micro helicopter pilot is to get a teeny micro drone to practice with.
This is good advice, which of course I’m not following.

Well, I’m sorta following it, but everything is kicked up a notch.

If I want offer aerial photography services for real, this is the equivalent of my micro drone. The “Windy City” thing is really a thing, and I’m going to need a $10,000+ hexacopter death-machine if I want to put up a consistent fight.

I’m imagining there’s so much distance between that and a micro drone, I may as well risk starting on a higher rung.

I’m hoping I can avoid a crash by resisting the impulse to hot dog with it.

Likewise, as a camera platform, I’m more interested in it as something that floats instead of something that flies, if that makes sense. This just isn’t the right environment to safely do all kinds of swoopy shit.


Thanks for the link!
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 22, 2018, 03:56 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doc HM View Post
My daughters boyfriend bought the same drone. Then he noticed that he lives right next to RAF (formerly USAF) Fairford and slap bang in the middle of a 10 mile wide no drone fly zone.
It was very impolite of the USAF not to change it to kilometers when they left.

Here, a regular airport has a 5 mile no-fly zone around it, but I get the impression the FAA forces the control tower to play ball with anyone who follows the rules, even some rando joker like me. They’ll give me clearance if the proposal is reasonable.

I’m not sure how that changes with military bases. I’ve come across info, but didn’t commit it to memory because I’m pretty far from one. Instead, I’ve got the City Hall being a pain in my ass about where it’s legal.
     
ghporter
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Mar 22, 2018, 06:26 PM
 
Think of the mini-drone as “training wheels,” or maybe “learning to drive in your friend’s beater that can get smashed up without many repercussions.” Getting the flying thing down FIRST will save you a bunch of rotor replacements.

Pretty much all quad drones work pretty much the same way, so getting a gadget that can land on a paperback-sized spot will let you get the flying practice you need to avoid having to wait for replacement parts.

Here’s a $23 model with a WiFi controller app for iOS (or at least WiFi video to your phone). To me, “getting one’s wings” by practicing with something inexpensive that might crash is much preferable to learning on something that costs a lot more money...

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
Doc HM
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Mar 23, 2018, 03:18 AM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
They’ll give me clearance if the proposal is reasonable.
Probably not Fairford, although it's no longer a base (but does host the annual Air Tattoo, the worlds largest military airshow), for some reason they still get a lot of B52's, B2's and even U2's (which I thought were now out of service) in and out, hence the no fly drone paranoia.
This space for Hire! Reasonable rates. Reach an audience of literally dozens!
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 23, 2018, 06:39 PM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
Think of the mini-drone as “training wheels,” or maybe “learning to drive in your friend’s beater that can get smashed up without many repercussions.” Getting the flying thing down FIRST will save you a bunch of rotor replacements.

Pretty much all quad drones work pretty much the same way, so getting a gadget that can land on a paperback-sized spot will let you get the flying practice you need to avoid having to wait for replacement parts.

Here’s a $23 model with a WiFi controller app for iOS (or at least WiFi video to your phone). To me, “getting one’s wings” by practicing with something inexpensive that might crash is much preferable to learning on something that costs a lot more money...
What causes quadcopter crashes though?

I get the impression it never has anything to do with them being difficult to fly, it’s always because the pilot flew like a dickhead. A micro drone can’t fix dickhead.

Don’t get me wrong, not being a dickhead for an hour straight while I learn how to fly it isn’t a trivial undertaking. I’m gonna need a nap afterwards.

Likewise, I give your advice the highest compliment, which is to say I originally came up with the same plan. It is therefore brilliant.
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 23, 2018, 06:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doc HM View Post
Probably not Fairford, although it's no longer a base (but does host the annual Air Tattoo, the worlds largest military airshow), for some reason they still get a lot of B52's, B2's and even U2's (which I thought were now out of service) in and out, hence the no fly drone paranoia.
On one hand, I can see that, because military.

On the other hand, if I’m 4 miles away and I only want to go 20 feet up, it’s kind of dopey to say no.
     
BadKosh
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Mar 24, 2018, 08:39 AM
 
Try an indoor practice drone. Cheap. won't destroy itself.

http://www.bladehelis.com/Inductrix/
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 24, 2018, 02:04 PM
 
I’ll do this if someone can point out what I’m supposed to worry about in an empty, open area. Not to mention I can geofence the drone to stay in the area.

The only thing I can hit is the ground. Aren’t quadcopters good at not hitting the ground unless you tell them to?

I can be butterfingers at times, but is it that hard not to pull down on the altitude stick? I’ve used twin-sticks in video games for 20 years.

If this was a helicopter, or fixed-wing, I’d feel differently.
( Last edited by subego; Mar 24, 2018 at 02:21 PM. )
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 24, 2018, 02:34 PM
 
One thing I am curious to find out is whether I want to flip the altitude input.

I’m an “inverted-Y” type, which made me originally think I’m going to need to flip it, but visualizing it, that feels wrong.

I’m assuming it’s because the altitude control is direct translation rather than change via tilt.


I fully admit this is the kind of thing which will cause a crash unless I get it sorted immediately.
     
ghporter
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Mar 24, 2018, 03:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
What causes quadcopter crashes though?

I get the impression it never has anything to do with them being difficult to fly, it’s always because the pilot flew like a dickhead. A micro drone can’t fix dickhead.

Don’t get me wrong, not being a dickhead for an hour straight while I learn how to fly it isn’t a trivial undertaking. I’m gonna need a nap afterwards.

Likewise, I give your advice the highest compliment, which is to say I originally came up with the same plan. It is therefore brilliant.
Aside from the dickhead factor - dickheads will crash because they don’t pay attention to the basics and, well, because they’re dickheads. Otherwise, crashes usually occur in one of three situations. This is from research since I’m still in the researching phase of my own drone purchase - more for goofs and giggles than anything serious.

Takeoffs and landings are the two most obvious crash-inducing situations. Taking off from a flat surface requires the right touch on the power control. You need to provide enough power to overcome the weight of the drone without pouring on all the power, but you can’t be too gentle either or it’ll “pop up” and scare some pilots, so they just cut power completely and the thing crashes. Landings are similar. The key is something called the “ground effect,” which is the flight envelope in which rotor airflow interacts with the ground which redirects the airflow and increases lift by quite a bit. Outside of this, flying rotorwings is (supposedly) easy-peasy, but you’ve gotta get past that ground effect to be able to take off, and you’ve got to land through it.

The third situation is when operating the drone around other objects once in flight. There’s a “bubble” of rotor airflow that changes depending on altitude and power setting. You need to keep the bubble away from other objects like trees, buildings, power lines, etc. Once that airflow bubble interacts with something else, the drone’s flight behavior will get weird.

So all three of those areas are where the learning curve zaps (non-dickhead) people. Once in the air, a drone should be super easy to get confident with. But with anything around it, particularly the ground, you need to be extra careful. Not that a cheap drone will exactly mimic your full-sized unit, but it will help you learn the technique. Just like the first manual transmission car you drove taught you what to look for and feel for, a cheapie drone can help you get the hang of the techniques you’ll need for you big, expensive drone.

Since my own purpose for a drone is things like inspecting my roof and playing chase with my dogs, I don’t need much more than remote WiFi video and a range of less than 100 yards. But I don’t want to need a subscription to a parts supplier, even for an inexpensive drone, either.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
BadKosh
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Mar 24, 2018, 05:14 PM
 
Wind..Gusty wind. worst situation to be in. I never even flew my RC airplanes in gusty winds. I switched to RC racing sailboats.
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 26, 2018, 02:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by BadKosh View Post
Wind..Gusty wind. worst situation to be in. I never even flew my RC airplanes in gusty winds. I switched to RC racing sailboats.
This auto-compensates for wind. It’s like cheating.

If it actually starts getting pushed around, that’s the signal to call it a day.

Compared to what you fly, this is for wusses.
     
andi*pandi
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Mar 26, 2018, 04:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
Takeoffs and landings are the two most obvious crash-inducing situations.
You forgot to mention grabby trees, and curious pets.
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 26, 2018, 04:23 PM
 
Originally Posted by andi*pandi View Post
You forgot to mention grabby trees, and curious pets.
Speaking of pets, I’ve heard it argued slapping a pet-tracker on it isn’t the worst idea.

I’d say grabby trees can be filed under “objects” though.
     
BadKosh
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Mar 26, 2018, 07:22 PM
 
We humans have horible depth perception, and it causes trees to reach out and knock your craft to the ground. You will hear all the birds laughing at you.
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 27, 2018, 02:23 AM
 
Luckily, this has some nice “drone assist” going on. Sorta like the indicator in a first person shooter that you’re getting hit from the sides or behind, this throws up warnings as you approach objects.

Not a cure-all, but that’s gotta help.
     
subego  (op)
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Mar 27, 2018, 03:36 AM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
[Good stuff]
In a shadow of what’s to come with self-driving cars...

I wasn’t going to try and land the thing myself. Holy crap, do I look crazy?

On the other hand, objects like the grabby trees are a huge concern. Not for when I’m getting the basic hang of it, that I’m going to do in an area with no objects, but as I move out of the “safe zone”.

It’s a tough call. There’s no question I’d learn something from the microdrone, but I think the risk it would also instill some false confidence is real. I just know I’d spend all my time past the first 10 minutes doing reckless things with it, and that will have a negative impact on my healthy fear of wrecking its big brother.
     
ghporter
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Mar 29, 2018, 07:33 PM
 
You make valid points there. May I suggest some well controlled practice around minimally grabby things (and at low altitudes) so you can see how the machine (and you) react?

Your thread boosted my interest in drones from mild curiosity about how I might use one for actual purposes other than chasing the cats (not to rule that out, of course), to a much more active interest. Unfortunately, my research has been frustrating, to say the least.

I've spent way too long looking for a non-bank balance killing drone that has a decent camera (not "0.3 MP") and offers some sort of way to do forward point of view on a screen I can actually see. So far, the best I've found is a (very) micro unit with a nice camera but so small a form factor that I would probably lose sight of it before it was out of controller range. Not the best choice for either learning to control or making sure I'm inspecting my own roof rather than my neighbors' roofs.

Price points go from $30-ish for oddly named stuff with sketchy product information, to $50-$70 for "better than that," to well over $100 for something that looks like I could use it. And I'm trying to not spend a bundle on a toy with limited applications.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
BadKosh
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Mar 31, 2018, 09:26 AM
 
The tiny drone, flown indoors as you practice practice practice will be blown around by air currents and as you get better at flying it in those conditions it will give insight to flying the larger one outdoor$.
     
ghporter
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Apr 5, 2018, 08:36 PM
 
I ordered an inexpensive drone on Monday...We'll see what it is like when it gets here.

I'm hoping it'll be useful if not superb, but I am open to being either slightly disappointed or somewhat impressed.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
subego  (op)
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Apr 5, 2018, 09:01 PM
 
This test of the new Russian, drone mail service gave me a fright.

     
Laminar
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Apr 6, 2018, 10:38 AM
 
Someone bought my son a Little Tikes "My First Drone." It got boring after about 8 minutes.

     
andi*pandi
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Apr 6, 2018, 12:48 PM
 
You must not have a pet to chase with it.
try taking it outdoors. The trees will love it.
     
subego  (op)
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Apr 6, 2018, 02:17 PM
 
Is anyone old enough to have that toy where you would lay out a plastic mat, and put this tower thing in the center, which had a long wire with a helicopter toy attached?

You could make the wire go around, or up and down, thus “flying” the helicopter.
     
subego  (op)
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Apr 6, 2018, 02:19 PM
 
Like this:

     
BadKosh
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Apr 8, 2018, 06:58 AM
 
The earlier version was the Marx-O-Coptor Which used a Sikorsky coptor as subject. That is the one with a tower.
     
subego  (op)
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Apr 8, 2018, 02:33 PM
 
Marx wanted it to be a Kamov.
     
ghporter
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Apr 22, 2018, 01:18 PM
 
My cheapie drone arrived yesterday. I guess it came from China by raft... Anyway it'll be an adventure to start using, since the manual is in Mandarin with BADLY translated English. There are pictures at least.

Speaking of pictures, I'll post some soon. The thing looks like it's supposed to be the little brother of a DJI Phantom, including a camera suspended underneath.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
subego  (op)
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Apr 23, 2018, 12:11 AM
 
I’m excited to see them!

Unfortunately, for me, the whole “well controlled environment” you suggested has been the hang up. I haven’t been able to haul myself out to the forest preserve.

I’m not too irritated. It’ll mean it’s 20 degrees warmer when I’m doing it.
     
reader50
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Apr 23, 2018, 12:57 AM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
I’m not too irritated. It’ll mean it’s 20 degrees warmer when I’m doing it.
Trade you. It nearly hit 90 here today.
     
subego  (op)
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Apr 23, 2018, 02:06 AM
 
If you traded me for 20 degrees warmer that’d be 110.

I’d actually be fine with 90. With a few tiny exceptions, it’s going to be 50 here for about a month.

That’s certainly not the worst, but after 6 months of garbage, it’s beginning to get old.

Garbage for me is defined as “unable to comfortably wear shorts”.
     
ghporter
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Apr 23, 2018, 04:56 PM
 
It has been unseasonably mild here in San Antonio lately. Unfortunately for me, that has meant gazing out the window at work and wishing I could be outside in the lovely mildness.

It also means it's more unpleasant that I can't be outside and playing with my drone (or whatever else) because of work.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
   
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