[Snow-i]

Hey guys,

I've decided to pick up a second language - Romanian. Unfortunately, the universally revered Rosetta Stone doesn't offer that language in their learning sets. I have a few books that are pretty much totally worthless (as their too colloquial and often incorrect for modern Romanian speakers). Anyone with experience know of a good alternative to Rosetta Stone that offers interactive components? I've heard Pimsleur is good from my googling, but I need more than that before investing into an expensive and time consuming endeavor.

Any tips, products, classes, methods, anything at all that might help me would be greatly appreciated.

[turtle777]

Romanian ? What ?

Chasing tail ?

-t

[Oisín]

I’ve known lots of people who are very fond of Pimsleur, also. For me personally, both Rosetta Stone and Pimsleur are useless—not because they’re bad, but because the entire concept is completely wrong for me. It depends entirely on what kind of person you are, and how you learn.

Some people learn languages better by learning the rules and adding words and expressions on top of that; others learn better by learning words, expressions, and entire phrases, and then figure out how to work the rules (consciously or not) after that. Some people learn well on their own; others need human interaction to learn well.

Before you spend a lot of money on a course that may end up not working for you at all, I’d suggest going to the library and seeing if you can’t find a similar course available for loan. Try that out first, and see how it works for you.

It’s nearly universal, though, that human interaction (and lots of it!) is needed to achieve any kind of fluency or real, usable knowledge of a language; so whatever method you decide to go with, trying to find actual Romanian classes is a plus. Speaking (or trying to speak) a foreign language with a teacher who knows what (s)he’s doing and knows the language is indispensable, at one point or another.

Edit: Also, noroc!

[andi*pandi]

I had some Romanian cassette tapes that were somewhat useful, but I didn't keep up with them. Good luck.

[imitchellg5]

Immersion in the language. Also, see if your local library offers access to any online learning programs for languages. Mine does and it's actually quite good.

[OreoCookie]

Oísin, don't tell me, you also speak Romanian?

@Snow-i
Have you met a Romanian woman or why did you choose Romanian? Are you traveling to/working in Romania?

[Oisín]

^ Don’t worry, I don’t. Limba română is fairly unintelligible to me (especially when spoken—in written form, I can sort of make sense of it, mostly).

[Snow-i]

Originally Posted by turtle777 

Romanian ? What ?

Chasing tail ?

-t

Haha, good call.

I've been with my girl for 3 years (as of dec 20th). Her family came here when she was 3 as the communist regime collapsed. She learned english alongside romanian and speaks both fluently. Her household is pretty much all spoken in Romanian which makes it awkward for me when they have parties and friends over. They still have (many) properties over there and she travels there for 2-3 months out of the year. Her parents are very accommodating to me and speak english when I'm around, but if I ever want to take it to the next step I need to gain the parents permission and it would help, alot. Its also extremely awkward when they have parties and such as the romanian community is pretty close and alot of diplomats, dignitaries, and celebs make regular appearances (yes I've met George Muresan). I'm that quiet american guy in those situations and I'd like to be able to share that side of her life with her. I'd have plenty of help (just by going over there) but fundamentally I need to learn on my own.

I learn best with interactive environments, and she (and her mom) would definitely help me along. I've got alot of the basics down (vocabulary) but I have no concept of syntax and word order.

For any of you that really must know, I once posted a picture of us together in a "post pictures of yourselves" thread several years ago.

@Oisin, the library idea is a GREAT idea. Thanks and I'm going to go there on my way out today.

EDIT: Multumesc.

[Oisín]

This changes a lot: you’ll basically be looking for grammatical breakdowns, then, with examples. If you’ve already ‘soaked up’ a lot of words, and you have an entire family to teach you, but you’re still not speaking it—that would indicate that you’re one of those people (like me) who needs to learn the system behind a language in order to learn the language.

So go online and to the library and get some good grammar books. Brush up on your English grammar (and general knowledge of grammar) beforehand, though, if this is your first foreign language—you’ll need it. And then, when you feel you have a decent idea about how sentences are constructed and how the morphology works (i.e., what ending to add to make it what you want), just start jumping right into it with your girlfriend and her family. Make ‘Romanian time’ where you try your darndest to speak only in Romanian, and only resort to using the English word if you really, really, really can’t think of any way to say it with Romanian words you know.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by Oisín 

Make ‘Romanian time’

Is that some code speak for hitting it ?

-t

[Snow-i]

Originally Posted by Oisín 

This changes a lot: you’ll basically be looking for grammatical breakdowns, then, with examples. If you’ve already ‘soaked up’ a lot of words, and you have an entire family to teach you, but you’re still not speaking it—that would indicate that you’re one of those people (like me) who needs to learn the system behind a language in order to learn the language.


So go online and to the library and get some good grammar books. Brush up on your English grammar (and general knowledge of grammar) beforehand, though, if this is your first foreign language—you’ll need it. And then, when you feel you have a decent idea about how sentences are constructed and how the morphology works (i.e., what ending to add to make it what you want), just start jumping right into it with your girlfriend and her family. Make ‘Romanian time’ where you try your darndest to speak only in Romanian, and only resort to using the English word if you really, really, really can’t think of any way to say it with Romanian words you know.

Thanks so much for the suggestions. I'm going to go to the Library (forgot they even were still around ) to start learning sentence construction and whatnot. Oisin, thank you!

[andi*pandi]

Sounds like you've already progressed further than I did. I attempted to learn to also impress future Romanian inlaws, only to be told when I tried using it, "Oh, you're learning Italian?" And "You speak Romanian with a fine French accent." After that I said WTH and just resigned myself to missing half of the conversations at family parties. This may be a blessing however. Family politics, brrr.

Good luck, keep your head down, and swotseya de bene. (sp)

[Oisín]

^ Something with soartă and …?

Originally Posted by turtle777 

Is that some code speak for hitting it ?

-t

Only if you rrrrroll yourrr rrrrr’s prrroperrly when you make the Rrrromanian time.

(And preferably only when you’re--err, when Snow-i’s making Romanian time with his girlfriend; not with her family)

[Snow-i]

Originally Posted by turtle777 

Is that some code speak for hitting it ?

-t

I'd make a joke here but considering she might see this at some point I'd best nu vorbesc.

[Snow-i]

Originally Posted by Oisín 

Only if you rrrrroll yourrr rrrrr’s prrroperrly when you make the Rrrromanian time.

(And preferably only when you’re--err, when Snow-i’s making Romanian time with his girlfriend; not with her family)

I always wondered why the first thing she taught me about romanian was to roll my rs .

[Snow-i]

Originally Posted by andi*pandi 

Sounds like you've already progressed further than I did. I attempted to learn to also impress future Romanian inlaws, only to be told when I tried using it, "Oh, you're learning Italian?" And "You speak Romanian with a fine French accent." After that I said WTH and just resigned myself to missing half of the conversations at family parties. This may be a blessing however. Family politics, brrr.

Good luck, keep your head down, and swotseya de bene. (sp)

Are you still with this romanian?

[OreoCookie]

Originally Posted by andi*pandi 

Sounds like you've already progressed further than I did. I attempted to learn to also impress future Romanian inlaws, only to be told when I tried using it, "Oh, you're learning Italian?" And "You speak Romanian with a fine French accent." After that I said WTH and just resigned myself to missing half of the conversations at family parties. This may be a blessing however. Family politics, brrr.

[andi*pandi]

Originally Posted by Snow-i 

Are you still with this romanian?

Heading towards our 10th wedding anniversary this year.

[Oisín]

Originally Posted by Snow-i 

I always wondered why the first thing she taught me about romanian was to roll my rs .

Probably because she (and many other Romanians) consider the retroflex r’s the most easily identifiable giveaway of an American trying to speak Romanian.

[dzp111]

I decided a few weeks ago to learn a 3rd language (already French and English). I forever thought I'd learn Latin but was never sure why. Then it dawned on me, 'who the hell am I going to converse in Latin with?' The pope? Nah, he doesn't get out much..

So I looked around my own community and realized that the ancestral/Native language in my area is Cree, and the opportunity to speak it exists in the several Pow-Wows featured on a quasi monthly basis. Also, it is now being taught in several Native-based schools as they (the Cree), particularly the youth, are re-learning their culture.

I looked it up and guess what? There's an app for that! It makes it easy to learn, but more importantly, fun! I'm now in the process of speaking, reading and writing Cree at my own pace. The language is not only a 'tongue' but it is pure expression; what is spoken is deeply connected through one's own tune with his/her world and environment.

If you search, I bet you'll find some kind of assistance on the net.

Good luck Snow-i, and have fun!


: )

[Oisín]

So I looked around my own community and realized that the ancestral/Native language in my area is Cree, and the opportunity to speak it exists in the several Pow-Wows featured on a quasi monthly basis. Also, it is now being taught in several Native-based schools as they (the Cree), particularly the youth, are re-learning their culture.

both to the community for giving strength back to Cree, and to you for going with a language that is close to home, even if it’s not exactly useful in a more global scope.

[Snow-i]

Originally Posted by andi*pandi 

Heading towards our 10th wedding anniversary this year.

I'd like to further converse with you via PM, if you don't mind helping a young chap out.

Originally Posted by Oisín 

Probably because she (and many other Romanians) consider the retroflex r’s the most easily identifiable giveaway of an American trying to speak Romanian.

Yeah, thats what I was thinking too

Originally Posted by dzp111 

I decided a few weeks ago to learn a 3rd language (already French and English). I forever thought I'd learn Latin but was never sure why. Then it dawned on me, 'who the hell am I going to converse in Latin with?' The pope? Nah, he doesn't get out much..

So I looked around my own community and realized that the ancestral/Native language in my area is Cree, and the opportunity to speak it exists in the several Pow-Wows featured on a quasi monthly basis. Also, it is now being taught in several Native-based schools as they (the Cree), particularly the youth, are re-learning their culture.

I looked it up and guess what? There's an app for that! It makes it easy to learn, but more importantly, fun! I'm now in the process of speaking, reading and writing Cree at my own pace. The language is not only a 'tongue' but it is pure expression; what is spoken is deeply connected through one's own tune with his/her world and environment.

If you search, I bet you'll find some kind of assistance on the net.

Good luck Snow-i, and have fun!


: )

Thank you for sharing your experiences and encouragement!!

[andi*pandi]

Originally Posted by Snow-i 

I'd like to further converse with you via PM, if you don't mind helping a young chap out.

de-asigur! (which my husband tells me means sure thing)

[Snow-i]

Multumesc!

[Laminar]

Speaking of rolling 'r's, if I cannot, is there any way to gain that ability, or am I stuck like this?

[brassplayersrock²]

Stuck how?

[Person Man]

Originally Posted by Oisín 

Probably because she (and many other Romanians) consider the retroflex r’s the most easily identifiable giveaway of an American trying to speak Romanian.

Retroflex r's? Is that the way R's are rolled in Greek and Spanish? Or the way they're rolled in German?

[Person Man]

Originally Posted by Laminar 

Speaking of rolling 'r's, if I cannot, is there any way to gain that ability, or am I stuck like this?

Try one of the methods given here.

I was 10 or 11 before I could roll my R's correctly when speaking Greek.

[olePigeon]

Originally Posted by Snow-i 

... I have a few books that are pretty much totally worthless (as their too colloquial and often incorrect for modern Romanian speakers) ...

Any tips, products, classes, methods, anything at all that might help me would be greatly appreciated.

Did you try YouTube comments?

[Oisín]

Originally Posted by Person Man 

Retroflex r's? Is that the way R's are rolled in Greek and Spanish? Or the way they're rolled in German?

No, the Greek rho and the Spanish single r are taps; the double Spanish rr (and initial r) is a trill. The retroflex (which just means that the tip of the tongue is ‘folded’ backwards, towards the roof of the mouth) is the American r. Technically, it’s not a real retroflex in most dialects (though in some it is), but ‘retroflex’ is just easier, both as a word and as a distinct concept, than ‘labialised, retracted, velarised alveolar approximant’.

[brassplayersrock²]

Thanks oh i sin. Now I feel all that much more wiser.

[imitchellg5]

Listen, Br. Ass Player.

[brassplayersrock²]

If you ever have the urge to have a real conversation, then you know where to find me.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by brassplayersrock² 

If you ever have the urge to have a real conversation, then you know where to find me.

Blowing br. ass ?

-t

[brassplayersrock²]

“I feel like I want to punch you.”


Mă simt ca şi cum aş vrea să vă punch


Is that close?

[Oisín]

I doubt it. “Punch” is not likely a Romanian word, for one.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by Person Man 

Try one of the methods given here.

I was 10 or 11 before I could roll my R's correctly when speaking Greek.

That's a killer link - thanks!

The glottal "r" of high German is what I grew up with, but I've always wanted to do the drawn-out alveolar "r" roll.

Just going through those exercises, I could immediately see two or three of them work for me.

Very cool.

[Laminar]

Speaking of translations, has anyone seen Word Lens?

[Oisín]

Yeah, seen it. Impressive, technology-wise, but not so much language-wise. The translations are usually horrible, verbatim manglings of the English/Spanish language.

[andi*pandi]

still, it's nice to know when there's shark sightings or anchovies around.

[Snow-i]

BTW,

I didn't realize there would be (so m)any iphone apps for english -> romanian!

[andi*pandi]

Excellent!

[brassplayersrock²]

Originally Posted by Snow-i 

BTW,

I didn't realize there would be (so m)any iphone apps for english -> romanian!

“I kiss like a donkey in heat.” ?

[Person Man]

Originally Posted by brassplayersrock² 

“I kiss like a donkey in heat.” ?

No, no, no...

"I will not buy this record... it is scratched." or "My hovercraft is full of eels"

[Buckaroo]

Wait till you two have gotten married. If you break up and a future girlfriend/wife will always hound you about the smallest of details after a couple years. "Oh, you can learn Romanian for "name of previous girlfriend from Romania" but you can't go to Yoga (or whatever you don't like) class with her.

Originally Posted by Snow-i 

Haha, good call.

I've been with my girl for 3 years (as of dec 20th). Her family came here when she was 3 as the communist regime collapsed. She learned english alongside romanian and speaks both fluently. Her household is pretty much all spoken in Romanian which makes it awkward for me when they have parties and friends over. They still have (many) properties over there and she travels there for 2-3 months out of the year. Her parents are very accommodating to me and speak english when I'm around, but if I ever want to take it to the next step I need to gain the parents permission and it would help, alot. Its also extremely awkward when they have parties and such as the romanian community is pretty close and alot of diplomats, dignitaries, and celebs make regular appearances (yes I've met George Muresan). I'm that quiet american guy in those situations and I'd like to be able to share that side of her life with her. I'd have plenty of help (just by going over there) but fundamentally I need to learn on my own.

I learn best with interactive environments, and she (and her mom) would definitely help me along. I've got alot of the basics down (vocabulary) but I have no concept of syntax and word order.

For any of you that really must know, I once posted a picture of us together in a "post pictures of yourselves" thread several years ago.

@Oisin, the library idea is a GREAT idea. Thanks and I'm going to go there on my way out today.

EDIT: Multumesc.