[BrandonCorbin]

All,

I am looking for Cocoa Developer to join forces with. I have the money, the marketing, the sales channels, and the ideas. Now, I need a bad ass developer. Not a newbie thats willing to "learn", I need someone that can pull off killer work and do it fast. This will be a joint LLC. This is not an LLC for developing software that already exists, unless the concept is so incredibly better than what is currently in the marketplace. This LLC is meant for developing killer applications.

So if you are interested please email me at [email protected]

[djohnson]

I can vouch for the authenticity of Brandon's request. If you need more credentials, PM or email me.

[chinakid]

Unfortunately , Why not a Carbon man!!

[PBG4 User]

Damn, if only I wasn't so new to Cocoa programming. I've put this together over the past 3 months working on it about an hour every week or so. If I had more time and had more in-depth Cocoa knowledge I'd be all over this.

[Chuckit]

Originally posted by djohnson:
I can vouch for the authenticity of Brandon's request. If you need more credentials, PM or email me.

While I don't doubt that it's an authentic request, I can't help but think it sounds basically like this: "I want somebody more skilled than than myself to come do all the work so I can take credit and get money."

What exactly is Brandon proposing that makes this any more beneficial to an "experienced, badass Cocoa programmer" than simply striking out on one's own?

[BrandonCorbin]

Man Chuckit, you always hit the nail on the head! Good work. I forgot that the key to successful software is just the ability to code a successful product.. That whole sales channel management, market analysis, competitive research, traditional and viral marketing, cost assessment, pr stuff, and great ideas are totally not needed. I retract my request for a great developer. Thank you Chuck for opening my eyes. I once was blind, but now I can see!

Originally posted by Chuckit:
While I don't doubt that it's an authentic request, I can't help but think it sounds basically like this: "I want somebody more skilled than than myself to come do all the work so I can take credit and get money."

What exactly is Brandon proposing that makes this any more beneficial to an "experienced, badass Cocoa programmer" than simply striking out on one's own?

[Chuckit]

For modest, one-man apps, I'd say no, a lot of that is not really needed, and what is needed does not require a full-time, full partner diluting the profits. If all of that were so necessary for success, freeware would've died out long ago.

And with the public-relations skills you're displaying here, I feel confident in predicting that any developer who chooses to saddle himself with this kind of an ego stands to make cents upon cents. My concern was a legitimate one, but your answer was condescending and really did nothing to help me see how agreeing to such an arrangement would benefit anyone but you.

Seriously, you've been talking about this stuff for months, and the only skills you've shown are a talent for huckstering and a remarkable propensity for throwing tantrums when people don't stand back in awe at your glory.

[BrandonCorbin]

Actually Chuck your right. A modest one-man add doesn't need all of that, and there are some great freeware apps out there that hit the grassroots movement and totally kick ass, QuickSilver is a great example.

However, QuickSilver is a minority in a sea of horrible applications out there. It takes a rare form of art and development to make a killer application. It takes even more to make a killer application that generate revenue.

And your right that you can not see any value in partnering with me, because you never contacted me in regards to the partnership arrangement, or what I have planned and researched as far as a killer app.

I have a proven track record in enterprise level applications that serve 28% of the Fortune 500. And I feel that I can take what I have learned in enterprise level apps, and do something great in the mid market. But no matter how good I can be, I am only as good as a developer that can work in tandem with me. Hence why I have been looking for this over the past few months.

As far as tantrums go, I am pretty jaded here in the macnn forum. Considering 80% of the comments left on this board are by depressed 13 year old that are only posting to get their numbers up and piss off any one, while at the same time offering nothing helpful.

So Chuck, can I ask what you do for a living?

[Angus_D]

I have no idea who you are or whether anything you've just said is actually the truth or just smoke and mirrors. You don't back any of that up. You don't give any details about what you're talking about and are deliberately vague, which will immediately inspire nothing but doubt. You were also very rude to ChuckIt for no good reason, who was making very valid points.

May I ask that if you have a proven track history in enterprise applications, why exactly are you reduced to trawling a fscking BBS to find business partners? Not to mention it should be patently obvious that MacNN's Developer Center is hardly where the action is at in the Mac development community.

Either you're incredibly naive and lazy, in which case I wouldn't want you in charge of marketing, or you're just ********ting us. Or I'm missing something.

[BrandonCorbin]

I'm all fluff my man! Your right, Im sorry I do not want a partner now. So no more emails. Im just going to go and weep in my own sorrow.

The truth is, Im a 9 year old who's ultimate goal is being a trash-man and having a side job at a chicken sausage slaughter house. Yesterday was my birthday, but no one came, because Im blind and have a big piece of metal in my frontal lobe. So every time some one "lets fly of a loud trumpeting" it almost blows my ear drums out.

During my free time (when I am not at the clinic), I like to super-glue kittens together. And troll around message boards writing fictional messages, just for the specific purpose of hear 19 year old, who are so far superior in so many ways, prove everything I say and do, wrong! Its such a great place to post ideas. The other day I posted a message at BlindPlateHeads.com, asking for advice how to stop my left ball from twitching every-time someone opens a garage door. You know what I absolutely love! I love deep fried pickles, seriously, they are quite possibly the greatest food on the whole damn planet! Ever have steak milkshake? Angus I bet you have, well either you love AC/DC or Hardee's, so maybe you haven't. Well anyway, its an interesting drink. Did any of you watch the pilot for CSI: Compton?

Oh yea, I almost forgot. Just so everyone knows Im running a PowerBook 520c, this thing ROCKS! Yea, I max'd it out with 36 meg of ram! Smokin!

Damn, your still reading? Well if you want the real truth, I found a developer partner, that thus far has impressed me the hell out of me. So really as fun as it has been talking indepth about business I will have to stop. And Angus, what do you know, I found someone trawling a fscking BBS! Go figure.

Hugs And Kisses!
Brandon

[Chuckit]

Originally posted by BrandonCorbin:
So Chuck, can I ask what you do for a living?

I'm an editor at a newspaper, and I also do IT work (fixin' the broke boxes, creating in-house software) part-time.

Anyway, good luck with your new partner. Hopefully this one will work out better than that taskbar thingamajigger.

[BrandonCorbin]

Conceptually the task bar was going to rock, however it was going to take a lot more hacking then was worth it at the time. So on to the next thing.

Thanks
B

Originally posted by Chuckit:
Hopefully this one will work out better than that taskbar thingamajigger.

[Angus_D]

Originally posted by BrandonCorbin:
I'm all fluff my man! Your right, Im sorry I do not want a partner now. So no more emails. Im just going to go and weep in my own sorrow.

Blah blah blah, more sarcasm and stupidity. You're giving off the impression of a real class act. Really, you are.

[BrandonCorbin]

There are a few things that I stand for, one is coming up with killer products that in some form or another generate revenue. This can be done with little or no class at all! (I learned that from an infomercial!)

[djohnson]

Dang! Why is everyone so harsh? I guess we could post what Brandon does for a living... though I would not want ya'll to look bad. Anyways, the dockbar is still going, just had to wait on finances to come around for me so I could afford a new Powerbook. Who knows if we will release it though? The other app ideas are a little larger and more complex than 1 or even 2 people can accomplish in a short amount of time. But anyways...

[spacefreak]

Yeah, there is no need to be so harsh. Brandon simply was looking to find a good developer who might be interested in a joint project.

As far as I'm concerned, I wish more people would have the balls to swing for the fences.

[PBG4 User]

Originally posted by djohnson:
Dang! Why is everyone so harsh? I guess we could post what Brandon does for a living... though I would not want ya'll to look bad. Anyways, the dockbar is still going, just had to wait on finances to come around for me so I could afford a new Powerbook. Who knows if we will release it though? The other app ideas are a little larger and more complex than 1 or even 2 people can accomplish in a short amount of time. But anyways...

Why would we look bad if we found out what Brendan did for a living?

I'm actually interested in developing business apps since I'm currently a conduit between management reporting and the PeopleSoft tech. group and have been for a few years. Just got my CS degree in May and I'm looking to get out of management finance / accounting / reporting for good.

[djohnson]

Originally posted by PBG4 User:
Why would we look bad if we found out what Brendan did for a living?

I'm actually interested in developing business apps since I'm currently a conduit between management reporting and the PeopleSoft tech. group and have been for a few years. Just got my CS degree in May and I'm looking to get out of management finance / accounting / reporting for good.

Because people are bashing him and acting like he does nothing for a living... I did not mean that people would feel bad if they knew what he did, wrong wording I guess.

[Angus_D]

Originally posted by djohnson:
Because people are bashing him and acting like he does nothing for a living... I did not mean that people would feel bad if they knew what he did, wrong wording I guess.

No, people were just being healthily suspicious and he reacted by being obnoxious.

[BrandonCorbin]

Originally posted by Angus_D:
No, people were just being healthily suspicious and he reacted by being obnoxious.

I prefer "deplorable".

I have to side with Chuck. He was not being rude, beligerant, or insulting. Brandon's response was uncalled for. Then he insulted the Mac freeware community by calling everyone's products a "sea of horrible applications." I wouldn't want to work for someone with such arrogance.

Why is Brandon being so secretive? What does he do for a living? Why doesn't he just put out proper employment ads in appropriate places? I just don't understand why, if he is legit, he isn't acting like a professional.

[BrandonCorbin]

Im a product manager for an HR technology company. Our products serve a good chunk of the fortune 500. Our software is integrated with the biggest enterprise level applicant tracking systems, including PeopleSoft and soon SAP and Microsoft. Since this has absolutely nothing to do with my goals of Mac software, I dont feel the need to clarify, pretty simple.

As far as "insulting" the mac community, thats a load of ****. The truth is, there are a sea of horrible applications out there. It has nothing to do with the mac community. It encompasses all operating systems. Actually, I feel there are more quality freeware applications out there than shareware. Most people who do freeware applications are purists, and they appreciate the beauty of great software.

What I find the most amusing about all of this, is the fact that I was simply looking for a partner. Once again, pretty simple. And I expected getting bashed, because that is part of posting to forums. Its a big dick swinging contest, lets see who can act smarter than the next guy. I dont give a flying fart about what people think about me personally, but no one can say that I dont have the desire for creating killer applications.

The proof will come from the software that our partnership will release. So if everyone is done "swinging, and banging on their chests" we can end the thread. Lets talk when some software released.

[GeeYouEye]

^Why does "What's in it for me?" deserve a sarcastic response? Had it already been asked and answered, then maybe, but it hadn't, and frankly, I still fail to see the advantages of a one developer-one marketer partnership, especially one where the marketer has the ego with roughly the size and contents of the atmosphere in the Sahara Desert: a hell of a lot of hot air.

The only valid point you seem to have made is that you have an idea for a killer app. Whoop-dee-do. Despite your apparent perception of us, developers can have great ideas too.

[/rant]

Originally posted by BrandonCorbin:
I dont give a flying fart about what people think about me personally, but no one can say that I dont have the desire for creating killer applications.

Then why not just post a proper want ad, and hire a developer to make your product? What's with all the "partnership" nonsense? You are being very vague. From your first post, all I got out of it was:

- I have a great idea
- I want it done in Cocoa
- I cannot program Cocoa
- Will someone do it for me?

And the fact that you are suggesting a partnership says to me:
- I have no money to pay a Cocoa programmer
- I still want to reap the profits because it is my idea

Not that I don't think the idea is worth anything. If it is truly the great idea you think it is, find the money to pay a programmer and post a want ad saying what skills you require and what type of payment they can expect. Or learn to program Cocoa.

[BrandonCorbin]

A Challenge.

Each of the people that think I am full of hot air. (Which I will not argue with in many instances).

Show me your products. Simple as that, show me your great products that have brought you either fame or money.

[Angus_D]

Originally posted by BrandonCorbin:
A Challenge.

Uhm, you need to get a grip of yourself.

Each of the people that think I am full of hot air. (Which I will not argue with in many instances).

Nobody ever accused you of being full of hot air. They merely pointed out that some of the actions you have carried out might suggest that you are, and wanted you to substantiate yourself in order that they could discount that possibility. This is a logical approach, and one I'd hope anybody I did business with would take - it shows some form of COMMON SENSE. The fact that you've been so defensive would indicate that it perhaps touched a nerve.

Show me your products. Simple as that, show me your great products that have brought you either fame or money.

Well, I'm still in full-time education and I don't consider fame and money to be my major goals in life.

Despite that I have done contracting work for a variety of people, including writing an OS X application several years ago at the tender age of 15 which has been distributed millions of times, and doing a fair bit of the engineering, marketing, and support for Clich� Software (although I left on less than amiable terms).

I liaised with Apple engineers to track down an annoying bug in an OS X kernel extension, and became somewhat infamous as a result of that and the way Apple reacted when they found out how old I was. You know, like mentioned on TechTV, Slashdot, article in Wired, etc.

I am apparently quite well respected in the Mac development community, as the comments such as those here.

I am currently involved with the OpenDarwin project, and involved in discussions vaguely related to that with some Apple engineers and managers on a regular basis.

So, like, whatever. I don't really care who you are or what you do, I wouldn't be able to help you at the moment because I already have other priorities. But I do take offence at your attitude.

[BrandonCorbin]

I do not doubt that you are a great developer, and getting mentioned on /. techTV etc is a great feat. And I am more than willing to give props where they are do. So you have my respect as a developer to the fullest.

However, what I am looking for here is a business partner. Like the very first message said. The key point of this business is ultimately making money in some form or another. And for software to hit the mainstream (meaning not just being geek-chic) you have to have the business infrastructure to support it.

So Angus, you have proven my idea of you wrong, and now all my future comments will reflect that respect. Unfortunately, I was never given any respect from the few people in this forum that was questioning me. I am all for questioning every, that is a statement that I even ingrain in my kids. But when your questioning, try to look at both the good and bad. Cause if all you do is automatically look for the negative, you just looking for fight.

[PBG4 User]

Originally posted by Angus_D:
[major SNIPpage]

You were the guy that fixed the MODEM extension, then lost your ADC account because you weren't 18? I remember you! Or at least I remember reading about you a couple years ago.

[itistoday]

I think you're all bloody nuts. Both sides. The guy simply asked for a partner, and posted his email to those interested. If you were interested you could reach him and I'm sure he'd explain things more plainly since he's obviously afraid of posting his "great idea" on an open forum.

And he's right about this:

And I expected getting bashed, because that is part of posting to forums. Its a big dick swinging contest, lets see who can act smarter than the next guy.

Because there were two correct responses to this thread (IMO of course): 1) Email him, or 2) Ignore the thread.

Instead, he was assailed by several people all questioning his integrity, his personality, and calling him an arrogent asshole.

That was all pointless. It doesn't matter if he's arrogent, and not all arrogent people are assholes just because they're arrogent (perhaps they have a good reason to be). Perhaps he's just proud and not arrogent? Who gives a flying ****?

This thread ended about 3 posts down, yet it continued into a "big dick swinging contest".

And BrandonCorbin, you continued to aggravate an already aggravated group of individuals by "challenging" them??? Why'd you do that? Now you're just joining the dick swinging contest too.

There is no actual purpose for this thread anymore. The problem that caused its posting has been solved. Everyone go home now.

[djohnson]

The product that Brandon is asking about will be a challenge. Sometimes I wonder if it would be a legal or programming challenge. Anyways, if you are interested in this program or other ones, let him know!

[Brass]

Originally posted by itistoday:
There is no actual purpose for this thread anymore.

I beg to differ. This thread is great entertainment!

[itistoday]

Originally posted by Brass:
I beg to differ. This thread is great entertainment!

Touch�.

[Angus_D]

Originally posted by itistoday:
Because there were two correct responses to this thread (IMO of course): 1) Email him, or 2) Ignore the thread.

I'm sorry, but why then would it be posted on a DISCUSSION forum?

[BrandonCorbin]

Originally posted by Angus_D:
I'm sorry, but why then would it be posted on a DISCUSSION forum?

Good point!
[not being sarcastic either]

[BrandonCorbin]

Originally posted by Angus_D:
I'm sorry, but why then would it be posted on a DISCUSSION forum?

Damn duplicates. Does anyone else's safari go nuts on the cpu for all of the emoticons when adding or editing?

[PBG4 User]

Originally posted by BrandonCorbin:
Damn duplicates. Does anyone else's safari go nuts on the cpu for all of the emoticons when adding or editing?

Yes, I see this every time I reply on a message board with animated emoticons.

Originally posted by itistoday:
Instead, he was assailed by several people all questioning his integrity, his personality, and calling him an arrogent asshole.

So, people aren't allowed to question a poster's motives on a discussion board? Don't you question any business deal you consider? You'd be a fool not to. This is a discussion board so we are free to question his motives if we feel it is appropriate.

He clearly is ok with it, although I feel he is responding rudely. But if he didn't want feedback (which means both negative and positive) then he shouldn't have posted here. He should have paid for an banner advertisement instead.

[BrandonCorbin]

I agree that putting it on a "discussion" board, is asking for both positive and negative responses. But since I found the exact person I was looking for the first day, the rest of the "discussion" was purely to entertain myself. And I would like to set something straight. I few fights as pure entertainment, and at the end of the day I harbor no negitive thoughts on anyone I get in to it with.

Also, if anyone would get in to a business deal with out questioning everything, your nuts! Make sure there are contracts, and make sure to read them.

[itistoday]

Originally posted by hayesk:
So, people aren't allowed to question a poster's motives on a discussion board? Don't you question any business deal you consider? You'd be a fool not to. This is a discussion board so we are free to question his motives if we feel it is appropriate.

He clearly is ok with it, although I feel he is responding rudely. But if he didn't want feedback (which means both negative and positive) then he shouldn't have posted here. He should have paid for an banner advertisement instead.

Read what I wrote. He posted his email. I fully support questioning his motives, but you can do that by emailing him directly if you really are interested. I have a feeling that most of the people who replied to him "questioning" his motives had no intent whatsoever to actually team up with him, hence the dick swinging contest.

He posted what seemed to me like a direct request for help, kinda like those that you see in news papers, the only difference being that this one was online, probably because he figured he would have better luck here than anywhere else and it's free. The post, to me at least (you might have "special" views of it), was not intended to start a long debate and discussion of his moral values and/or personality.

The fact that he was posting in a "discussion" forum does not mean that his post had to contain material designed for group discussions, and this clearly seems to be the case, so I don't think that is a valid defense at all.

Edit: To be perfectly honest, I don't know how you can argue at all. Sure it's important to know what you're getting into, but that's only if you are interested in the job in the first place. Angus_D said himself that he wasn't, yet he and others did their best to insult and nit pick through this rather simple request.

Originally posted by itistoday:
Read what I wrote. He posted his email. I fully support questioning his motives, but you can do that by emailing him directly if you really are interested. I have a feeling that most of the people who replied to him "questioning" his motives had no intent whatsoever to actually team up with him, hence the dick swinging contest.
[snip]...

Actually questioning his motives in the discussion forum is preferred. Others who read it can benefit from the discussion. There might be someone with little business sense that might dive into something they shouldn't. This can serve useful to other readers. You may be thinking "that's their problem, mind your own business" but since this is a community of sorts, discussing in public seems would be more prudent as it benefits everyone. It has got nothing to do with "dick swinging" as you so eloquently put it.

Anyway, Brandon, I'm glad you found your developer. Be sure to come back and tell us about your product when it is finished.

[Chuckit]

Originally posted by hayesk:
Actually questioning his motives in the discussion forum is preferred. Others who read it can benefit from the discussion.

This is, in fact, the reason discussion forums exist in addition to e-mail. The most fruitful conversations usually have more than two sides (at least when you count all the listeners). Making a post on a discussion forum that reads "e-mail me" has long been considered questionable Netiquette at best, and expecting people to strictly honor the request and not post in the thread has never been acceptable.

[Angus_D]

Originally posted by itistoday:
Edit: To be perfectly honest, I don't know how you can argue at all. Sure it's important to know what you're getting into, but that's only if you are interested in the job in the first place. Angus_D said himself that he wasn't, yet he and others did their best to insult and nit pick through this rather simple request.

How exactly was I insulting and nit picking? BrandonCorbin was extremely rude and overly sarcastic from the start.

Also, since when do you have to conform to certain "requirements" to participate in a discussion on these forums? I wasn't going to respond initially (even though it would have been perfectly acceptable and valid to have done), but was provoked into it by the reprehensible contempt and rudeness shown towards those that were only expressing the same concerns that had immediately entered my head when I initially read his post.

Don't try and paint me as the one that was out of line. I find that rather insulting.

[BrandonCorbin]

Good lord, who thought this would have turned out to be such an interesting discussion?

[itistoday]

Angus_D, hayesk, and chuckit:

I agree that at times group discussions do occasionally yield productive results, yet sometimes it is just the opposite, as can be seen daily in the Lounge, and especially the Political forum. There people banter on and argue like brick walls to one another for days, never yielding, and only getting angrier and angrier. Sometimes such discussion end in bitter wars, to the extent that people call the FBI on one another, and other deplorable pranks. These "discussions", though I use the term as loosely as possible, usually result in only time being wasted, and new enemies being created.

My point here is simply to show that there are many occasions when discussions do in fact end up being unproductive, and even detrimental.

Here is such a "discussion". Angus_D only replied to this forum after BrandonCorbin behaved "rudely". However, BrandonCorbin was provoked into such antics by Chuckit. I do however concede that BrandonCorbin's remarks overshadowed Chuckit's, whose were much more amiable.

In my original post, I declared what I thought were the best responses to this thread: to email him, or ignore the thread. I highly doubt that any professional developer (which was what BrandonCorbin was asking for) would be dumb enough to fall into any potential "trap" that BrandonCorbin could have created. I'm sure that any serious developer would have emailed him with similar questions asked in this forum, as it takes a certain level of intelligence to be a good developer. Had people responded to this thread in such a manner, we would have no long-winded debate/argument, and nobody would feel "insulted". BrandonCorbin would find a developer, and the developer him, without any casualties along the way, and no wasted time bickering over each other's etiquette, who has what job, and defending/boasting about each one's achievements.

So, if I have offended anyone with my posts, please know that you have my apologies, and please know that my only intent was to point out that all this was unnecessary.

[BrandonCorbin]

Wow, I know sometimes I have been known to cause chaos, but I am besides myself! I would like to thank the academy, the three wise-men and most importantly my kitten sno-white.

[itistoday]

Originally posted by BrandonCorbin:
Wow, I know sometimes I have been known to cause chaos, but I am besides myself! I would like to thank the academy, the three wise-men and most importantly my kitten sno-white.

[BrandonCorbin]

HAHAHAHAHAHAH thats perfect! Now lets hope this closes out this discussion!

[Arclite]

It won't. Believe me.

[Detrius]

Originally posted by PBG4 User:
You were the guy that fixed the MODEM extension, then lost your ADC account because you weren't 18? I remember you! Or at least I remember reading about you a couple years ago.

Yup; that's him. It made me want to start scouring the kernel source code... but I'm too lazy.

[Detrius]

Originally posted by Arclite:
It won't. Believe me.

Hmmm... my input... uhhh...

Beavis.