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You are here: MacNN Forums > Software - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Alternative Operating Systems > Data Doubler/BootCamp Issues

Data Doubler/BootCamp Issues
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Nergol
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Apr 4, 2012, 03:40 AM
 
So not long ago I replaced did some surgery on my MBP, adding an SSD (drive name: Suigintou) and replacing the DVD drive with an OWC Data Doubler with a 1TB WD Caviar Blue (drive name: Megu) in it.

So with plenty of room on Megu, I thought I'd do an install of my student copy of Windows 7 (32 bit, sadly) via Boot Camp. So I set up the drive partition, then restarted with my Win 7 DVD in my external DVD drive, and...

Got a blinking cursor. And that's it.

So apparently this is a known issue. Win 7 will install fine on BootCamp on an MBP from an internal DVD drive, but not from an external. Nobody seems to know why, or what to do about it.

But then I came across Microsoft's DVD Download Tool, from which you can make a bootable Win7 install drive on a USB stick. I tried it, and sure enough, it boots the PC in the living room.

So I wonder if anyone knows whether the flash drive will work any better than the DVD did. I certainly hope so.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Apr 4, 2012, 04:49 AM
 
Its been a while since I looked into it but I was under the impression that Boot Camp does not allow a Windows install on anything other than the Mac Boot drive. That would mean you'd need to install OS X on the second drive, then boot from that and run boot camp. You could then delete the OS X partition and it would probably be fine. Might not be a bad idea to keep a small recovery partition on there anyway. 5 or 10GB for emergencies if the main drive falls over.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Nergol  (op)
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Apr 4, 2012, 05:16 AM
 
From what I'd heard, Boot Camp will install on any internal hard drive, but not on externals.

The problem with the install from an external DVD drive is, they say, an issue with EFI.
     
ghporter
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Apr 4, 2012, 06:51 AM
 
Windows does not support installation on external media. Any version of Windows. Period. It is how Windows works, and it's nothing to do with Boot Camp - except that Boot Camp is unable to make Windows install or boot from anything but an internal drive. It's also not EFI; it is Windows' method of running the install and booting.

Windows will read BIOS/EFI information about ports at boot, but then it re-enumerates all the ports anyway. This effectively disconnects the external devices connected at boot time. It also completely loses the connection to the install or boot media. There is nothing EFI can do to prevent that.

There is a hack that changes the boot process and makes Windows use the EFI data, but it is not for the faint of heart.

Finally, this isn't about a notebook, it's about an alternative OS, so I'm moving the thread appropriately.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
Nergol  (op)
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Apr 4, 2012, 01:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
Windows does not support installation on external media.
Well, now, wait a second. Do you mean it doesn't support it just on Macs, or it doesn't support it on anything? I've done Windows installs from external media before on PCs, so I know that works.

I've also booted Chromium Lime on my MBP from a flash drive. I'd hate to think that some 17-year-old kid in England was able to figure out how to make a Mac boot an alternative OS from a flash drive, while Microsoft and Apple can't.
     
P
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Apr 4, 2012, 02:24 PM
 
I think ghporter meant that it does not support installation TO external media. I know it does not support installation to anything connected over USB - I never tried anything else, but at least eSATA ought to work. I have a vague memory that installs to external SCSI drives was possible back in the NT4 days.

Installing from a USB DVD is possible if you have the drivers for it on the disc and loaded in such a manner that it works (Windows is notoriously picky about how it will access the boot device - if anything is even the slightest bit off, it will throw an Inaccessible Boot Device error). Premade DVDs that come with laptops without internal DVDs have such drivers on, and you can make them yourself (so-called slipstreaming). What that USB download tool does is automate the slipstreaming process. It should work to boot your MBP.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
Nergol  (op)
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Apr 6, 2012, 01:50 AM
 
Ah. But again, I'm not trying to install to an external hard drive, I'm trying to install from an external source to an internal hard drive (though not my primary boot drive).
     
ghporter
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Apr 6, 2012, 06:48 AM
 
Windows supports NEITHER installation TO or FROM an external drive. The Windows startup code must be on an internal drive, as must all its kernel files. You CAN COPY the installation disc to an internal partition and install from that, but it's not terribly efficient to do so, and Windows will constantly look for that partition as its installation source whenever it does an update.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
seanc
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Apr 9, 2012, 11:38 AM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
Windows supports NEITHER installation TO or FROM an external drive. The Windows startup code must be on an internal drive, as must all its kernel files. You CAN COPY the installation disc to an internal partition and install from that, but it's not terribly efficient to do so, and Windows will constantly look for that partition as its installation source whenever it does an update.
Sorry Glenn, but oh yes it does. How do you think people install Windows on Netbooks?

Installation from (external) USB optical, flash and hard drives is very much supported. You must however install to an internal disk.
     
ghporter
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Apr 10, 2012, 06:33 AM
 
How does one get past the installer's first reboot, where it rescans all devices? That's the sticking point, and I haven't seen a way to get past that. Is there a different installer for netbooks?

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
P
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Apr 10, 2012, 08:20 AM
 
You need an installation disc with drivers for USB Mass Storage devices. It is possible to make such a disc yourself (slipstreaming), and MS makes a tool that does it for you.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
seanc
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Apr 10, 2012, 02:10 PM
 
IIRC, Vista & 7 doesn't do a reboot until it's finished and one of the first steps in the installation is to copy all files to the HDD. Installing from USB whatever works absolutely fine.

XP is a different ball game, but certainly the initial install will boot from a USB CD-ROM drive. The next stage of the install should in theory detect the device drivers for the USB device. If it doesn't and you're stuck, just copy the i386 folder to the hard drive you're installing to on a separate partition.
     
ghporter
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Apr 11, 2012, 06:52 AM
 
Hmm. Little experience with 7 here, and I've avoided Vista on purpose, but I'd been told the installers were virtually identical. Rethinking lots of stuff now...

Still, the symlink (or whatever MS calls it) that allows the XP installer to stay connected with the external drive will be wrong after the reboot because the UID will be different.

Glenn -----OTR/L, MOT, Tx
     
P
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Apr 11, 2012, 08:00 AM
 
I'm going to stick with what I said at first: To boot from USB, the install media needs the appropriate drivers, and the USB drivers are not there by default on XP. I don't think they're there on Vista/7 either, but I know they can be added, and given that OEMs make discs like that, they're probably present on more than one disc out there. It is also certainly possible to add them yourself (slipstreaming).

The loading of device drivers in the installer (the part where XP has the amusing bug - "insert CD in drive A:", when drive A: always is the floppy drive) is for drivers needed for the media you are installing to. These must be present so the installed drive can be booted from when done. I don't believe it has anything to do with installing to USB - the installer simply has a lock to prevent that for some reason.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
Ubernew
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Aug 2, 2012, 09:17 PM
 
Out of curiosity, did you get windows to load on the second drive using usb? I'm going through the same process but with no luck. If so how did you do it? (slipstream disc?)
     
   
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