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9.9.2014 Wish we could say more. (Page 5)
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Atheist
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Sep 10, 2014, 12:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by ort888 View Post
Apple Pay is alright I guess, but put me in the camp of people who don't find using a credit card a hassle at all. Until my phone can replace my wallet completely, I really don't care that it takes an extra 10-20 second of terrible inconvenience added to each day by pulling out a credit card.

In fact, I found it pretty funny that in the demo video they showed a lady digging through her purse to get her credit card and showed that as an example of why Apple Pay was faster. Wouldn't that same lady have to dig through her purse to find her iPhone? Best case scenario, you're looking at 10 seconds to pay with an iPhone and like 15 seconds to pay with a credit card. OMG!!!!

And any sort of time savings is going to be nullified by the times when you're dinking around with it somewhere that it doesn't work quite right, or the times when you'll have to explain to a cashier what you are doing and why because they have no idea how it works.

I'm not saying it's not a step in a good direction, I'm just saying... meh. For now.
Apple Pay is certainly about convenience but by far the important aspect is safety and security. I'm not sure why Apple didn't play that part up more than the convenience bit. The fact that the credit card number is not used in the transaction is significant. Where I live (the Dominican Republic) credit card fraud is a HUGE issue. Last year I had to cancel at least 6 cards. It was a gigantic pain in the ass. I'm very excited about Apple Pay.
     
Demonhood
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Sep 10, 2014, 01:30 PM
 
For the watch:

It appears they're betting on a few different types of consumers to purchase it:
1) Sporty folk. Automatically track your heart rate and steps and runs and feed it back to your phone. That's worth a bit.
2) Convenience is everything people. This is where Apple Pay comes in. Also, people want to feel like they're living in the future. Extending your wrist to buy a cup of coffee instead of sliding a piece of plastic? Definitely futuristic.
3) Watch enthusiasts. A customizable and nice looking time piece for $350. Not a bad deal.

I'm personally waiting to see what developers come up with and what use cases develop as they trickle out there in the real world. I'm disappointed there wasn't something more interesting regarding music and the watch. Apparently you can use it without your phone to play tunes, but that means it's going to be a tinny speaker swaying back and forth when you go for a run. Maybe bluetooth earbuds haven't advanced enough for Apple to embrace them.
     
OAW
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Sep 10, 2014, 03:57 PM
 
What I want to know is can you use the  Watch with bluetooth headphones without the iPhone? The use case I'm thinking about is working out in the gym and being able to leave my iPhone in the locker.

OAW
     
subego
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Sep 10, 2014, 03:59 PM
 
Seems doubtful. Is there any real on-device storage?
     
Atheist
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Sep 10, 2014, 04:07 PM
 
Originally Posted by OAW View Post
What I want to know is can you use the  Watch with bluetooth headphones without the iPhone? The use case I'm thinking about is working out in the gym and being able to leave my iPhone in the locker.

OAW
The Watch has bluetooth (for syncing) and some amount of internal storage. I can only imagine they'll give you the ability to use bluetooth for audio.
     
OAW
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Sep 10, 2014, 04:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by Atheist View Post
The Watch has bluetooth (for syncing) and some amount of internal storage. I can only imagine they'll give you the ability to use bluetooth for audio.
I certainly hope so. Outside of the fitness tracking features, keeping time, and iPod-like music playback ... it seems like everything else you can do with the device requires an iPhone. Which begs the question ... why not just use the iPhone?

OAW
     
Hawkeye_a
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Sep 10, 2014, 04:50 PM
 
i use my really old iPod shuffle in the gym.

If the iWatch had been a fitness monitor + watch + iPod shuffle with wireless headphones with no *need* for an iPhone, i would have seriously considered one. Pairing with an iPhone could have enabled or opened up even more functionality as was shown (geoservices, notifications, communication, etc).
     
subego
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Sep 10, 2014, 05:03 PM
 
Maybe someday.


For now...

Bluetooth is too slow.
Wifi takes too much battery.
Cable needs a hole, which you must then waterproof.
     
turtle777
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Sep 10, 2014, 05:36 PM
 
Originally Posted by Atheist View Post
. Last year I had to cancel at least 6 cards. It was a gigantic pain in the ass. I'm very excited about Apple Pay.
Local merchants will get NFC readers just in time for Christmas 2019.

-t
     
ort888
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Sep 10, 2014, 05:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
It's not about time.

It's also about not passing credit card numbers to ANYBODY. Completely private transactions make one of the primary vectors of card abuse — simply reading off the numbers wherever the card is used — impossible.
So how do you pay at a sit down restaurant? Do you give your phone to the waiter in one of those little credit card bill caddies? That's the main place numbers get jacked. Handing your card to a clerk who is standing 2 feet from you isn't as problematic. 90% of the places I go make you do the swiping anyway.

How does Apple Pay handle tips?

It's not so much that the problems aren't solvable, but some things are going to have to change.

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turtle777
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Sep 10, 2014, 05:46 PM
 
Originally Posted by ort888 View Post
So how do you pay at a sit down restaurant? Do you give your phone to the waiter in one of those little credit card bill caddies? That's the main place numbers get jacked. Handing your card to a clerk who is standing 2 feet from you isn't as problematic. 90% of the places I go make you do the swiping anyway.

It's not so much that the problems aren't solvable, but some things are going to have to change.
You do it like the rest of the world already does it with credit or debit card payments.

The waiter brings a mobile reader to your table, you enter the tip, swipe your card (enter pin of needed) or "swipe" your phone. Done.

-t
     
Spheric Harlot
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Sep 10, 2014, 06:12 PM
 
Or, you pay via the app (or one of its ilk) they mentioned in the presentation.
     
Laminar
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Sep 10, 2014, 09:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
You do it like the rest of the world already does it with credit or debit card payments.

The waiter brings a mobile reader to your table, you enter the tip, swipe your card (enter pin of needed) or "swipe" your phone. Done.

-t
Mobile readers are hardly ubiquitous. And when a restaurant does have them, you spend most of your time sitting at the table waiting for one to finally be available so you can pay.
     
turtle777
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Sep 10, 2014, 09:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
Mobile readers are hardly ubiquitous. And when a restaurant does have them, you spend most of your time sitting at the table waiting for one to finally be available so you can pay.
In the US, a credit card payment often takes two "runs":
First to bring the check, and then to take your card and process it.

In my experience, payments with mobile readers were faster on average.

-t
     
OAW
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Sep 10, 2014, 09:51 PM
 
^^^

This! When I'm done with my meal I'm ready to go. Just bring me the check and let me pay on the spot so I can bounce. Not having to wait for the server to get around to coming by your table AGAIN is worth the price of admission alone.

OAW
     
SSharon
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Sep 10, 2014, 10:06 PM
 
I've never purchased the lowest capacity phone so I'm not terribly bothered by the 16gb entry model, but it really does suck. I have a 16gb 5S from work and got a warning today that I used all the space up. It has a couple episodes of a podcast, but otherwise 0 songs and 0 videos. The 16gb is mainly pictures and movies and nearly 2gb is from messages (am I expected to go back through every old imessage to delete the large home videos? I don't want to erase the entire thread...).

The protruding camera is ugly. I'd be happier with better battery life.

Watch looks nice, but I'm sure waiting for version 2 will be worth the wait.

Apple Pay has promise and I hope it does well.
AT&T iPhone 5S and 6; 13" MBP; MDD G4.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Sep 11, 2014, 04:21 AM
 
I think people are making a mistake in looking at the Watch as a smart gadget first and a watch second. I think people will buy it because its a nice watch first and because it does a couple of nifty things with your iPhone second.

Its not a must-have gadget, its a must-have fashion accessory.

Until a dev finds something truly awesome to do with it.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Sep 11, 2014, 06:33 AM
 
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
- Thomas Paine
     
Shaddim
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Sep 11, 2014, 06:50 AM
 
See if you notice anything... unusual.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxM-rac7vb4
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OreoCookie
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Sep 11, 2014, 07:37 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
See if you notice anything... unusual.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxM-rac7vb4
Other than that the guy is »reviewing« a product he hasn't touched, I don't quite get it.
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Waragainstsleep
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Sep 11, 2014, 08:14 AM
 
Does the crown magnify the app icons on the home screen? Everyone I've seen moaning about it seems to assume not.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Laminar
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Sep 11, 2014, 08:43 AM
 
Originally Posted by SSharon View Post
nearly 2gb is from messages (am I expected to go back through every old imessage to delete the large home videos? I don't want to erase the entire thread...).
It's a known bug and even wiping and reinstalling isn't guaranteed to fix it.
     
ShortcutToMoncton
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Sep 11, 2014, 09:00 AM
 
Great point about the "cuff test" - I also cannot wear a watch that doesn't fit under a shirt sleeve cuff, and when I saw the first pictures I also thought it could be a problem. That sucks.
Mankind's only chance is to harness the power of stupid.
     
Hawkeye_a
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Sep 11, 2014, 09:17 AM
 
This looks so much cooler....



Verge: What if the Apple Watch was round?

Cheers
     
The Final Dakar
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Sep 11, 2014, 09:20 AM
 
Originally Posted by Hawkeye_a View Post
This looks so much cooler....



Verge: What if the Apple Watch was round?

Cheers
It does look way better. But I'm sure it was a function over form decision. Anything where you're going to be dealing with text and such you won't want a round face.
     
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Sep 11, 2014, 10:55 AM
 
ya - text on a round face = no good. you lose too much space. But I agree the round face does looks better.

...and the cuff test - I haven't worn a watch in so long, but it would suck if the new watch protruded like a fat ass rolex. Though some like being exposed, I don't. In time the watch will lose a lot of weight and height, hopefully.

A key improvement I'd like to see is a new watchband that is actually a battery - will solar cells, to replenish the watch.

but heh, the thing isn't even released yet lol.
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OreoCookie
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Sep 11, 2014, 12:15 PM
 
Originally Posted by osiris View Post
A key improvement I'd like to see is a new watchband that is actually a battery - will solar cells, to replenish the watch.
I don't think solar cells are a good choice here, smart watches are too power hungry and it would interfere with the display and the touch sensor. But a sort of dynamo like in my analog watch would be nice even if it can just extend the battery life beyond a day.
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osiris
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Sep 11, 2014, 12:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
I don't think solar cells are a good choice here, smart watches are too power hungry and it would interfere with the display and the touch sensor. But a sort of dynamo like in my analog watch would be nice even if it can just extend the battery life beyond a day.
The band would have the solar cells, not the face. Totally doable, I believe. This small charging source could easily supplement the watch's battery.

A dynamo sounds good, but a dynamo flashlight I have is pretty hefty and big. We need alien technology!
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Hawkeye_a
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Sep 11, 2014, 12:43 PM
 
I was just looking at Apple's iPhone6 site and almost all the side-profile pictures of both sizes dont have the protruding camera lens. It's almost like they were just photoshopped out. Very misleading and dodgy IMHO
     
turtle777
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Sep 11, 2014, 01:00 PM
 
Originally Posted by osiris View Post
The band would have the solar cells, not the face. Totally doable, I believe. This small charging source could easily supplement the watch's battery.
Nah.

a) Will make the band look ugly as sin. Part of the Apple Watch appeal is that the bands are designed incredibly well, and look nice

b) Will make the band heavy and inflexible, and not a pleasure to wear

c) If watches are covered because worn under a shirt or long sleeves, it's all for nothing.

-t
     
Hawkeye_a
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Sep 11, 2014, 01:30 PM
 
I just heard about the Moto360 and looked it up. It is by far the best looking smartwatche, specifically because it doesnt look like a piece of tech (or a metal marshmellow)

Text doesnt seem to be an issue....

I cant believe i'm saying this, but i prefer the aesthetic design of the hardware and software compared to the Apple watch.

(I also found the general OS UI on the Apple Watch kind of unintuitive (Dont know if the moto360 would fare ant better))







( Last edited by Hawkeye_a; Sep 11, 2014 at 02:27 PM. )
     
The Final Dakar
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Sep 11, 2014, 01:34 PM
 
That's only two lines of text. And very short sentences.
     
Hawkeye_a
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Sep 11, 2014, 01:37 PM
 


     
OreoCookie
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Sep 11, 2014, 01:39 PM
 
Originally Posted by osiris View Post
A dynamo sounds good, but a dynamo flashlight I have is pretty hefty and big. We need alien technology!
I don't think it needs to be big, in my analog watch, it's just a small flywheel. Of course, analog watches can be quite heavy, but at least I don't mind.
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The Final Dakar
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Sep 11, 2014, 01:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by Hawkeye_a View Post
That's a good example. To me, you can see the margins are very generous. If the watch were square, more text could be used (or bigger). I'd have to see it in person to see of the latter might be necessary.
     
osiris
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Sep 11, 2014, 01:43 PM
 
ah, look at that - not bad at all!
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Jawbone54
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Sep 11, 2014, 02:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by Hawkeye_a View Post
If we really want to see some disingenuous marketing, check out how the hands (particularly the minute hand) is set to a seemingly random 5:30 to conceal the "flat tire" design by obstructing the cut-off 30-minute mark.

Clock hands are always set to 10:10 for advertising purposes. To break that rule is either ignorant or purposefully misleading.

[EDIT] Unless that's not an actual Motorola publicity image.
     
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Sep 11, 2014, 03:08 PM
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOHWdesr54U

It looks like its really difficult to get rid of the notifications stripe over the watch face. The UI seems to have some responsiveness issues. Also looks like its as bulky as the Apple Watch in terms of thickness too.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Jawbone54
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Sep 11, 2014, 03:17 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOHWdesr54U

It looks like its really difficult to get rid of the notifications stripe over the watch face. The UI seems to have some responsiveness issues. Also looks like its as bulky as the Apple Watch in terms of thickness too.
Nice video.

1. The face of the Moto 360 itself is huge.
2. As you said, that UI does not look responsive at all.
     
Hawkeye_a
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Sep 11, 2014, 03:28 PM
 
Just so we're clear, i'm not advocating the Moto360 for purchase. I do not know much about it.

I was merely highlighting that i prefer the aesthetic design of the hardware and the software, over the Apple Watch.

Features/performance/price/battery life/etc... don't know, and not particularly interested in comparing them as i have no intention of buying either product.

Bottom line: IMO the Moto360 *looks* much better than the Apple Watch
     
subego
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Sep 11, 2014, 03:32 PM
 
I think they're both kinda ugly.
     
Hawkeye_a
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Sep 11, 2014, 03:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by Jawbone54 View Post
If we really want to see some disingenuous marketing, check out how the hands (particularly the minute hand) is set to a seemingly random 5:30 to conceal the "flat tire" design by obstructing the cut-off 30-minute mark.
An argument can be made that they chose that particular time to highlight the fact that the flat tire isn't as obtrusive as one would assume; seeing that, that particular time is the worst case scenario for the 'flat tire' so far as the primary function of the product.

It would be misleading if they had photoshopped the pixels in, or as Apple apparently did, omitted the protruding lens in the side-profile pictures of the iP6/+.
     
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Sep 11, 2014, 03:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
I think they're both kinda ugly.
Equally?
     
subego
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Sep 11, 2014, 03:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by Hawkeye_a View Post
Equally?
Yeah. The Moto is oversized for the style it's emulating, and the iWatch looks all Dick Tracy.
     
Jawbone54
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Sep 11, 2014, 03:54 PM
 
I posted two photos today to show the difference in screen size overlaid with a working iPhone 5 by using the paper print-out comparison on Apple Insider:

4.7"



5.5"

     
Laminar
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Sep 11, 2014, 04:52 PM
 
Arts and crafts time at work today?
     
subego
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Sep 11, 2014, 04:58 PM
 
It's been shopped.
     
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Sep 11, 2014, 05:01 PM
 
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
OAW
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Sep 11, 2014, 05:28 PM
 
Originally Posted by SSharon View Post
... and nearly 2gb is from messages (am I expected to go back through every old imessage to delete the large home videos? I don't want to erase the entire thread...).
Personally I'm looking forward to the feature in iOS 8 where the content of message threads are automatically deleted after X days. I'd love to be able to set and forget mine at 30 days. That will free up a lot of space on my 16 GB. I already don't store any music and just stream from iCloud. I'm looking forward to doing the same for photos in iOS 8 as well. So between these 3 features I should be able to get away with 16 GB in an iPhone 6.

OAW
     
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Sep 11, 2014, 09:37 PM
 
I think it will be interesting to see whether people start customizing their Apple Watch to become a walking billboard for various products. These watches attract attention, I can see this being a highly effective way to advertise.
     
 
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