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Mom wants a new car
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jonn804
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Jan 29, 2006, 04:48 PM
 
Here's the catch- she wants the parent car company to be headquartered in the USA and the car to be built in the USA. Mid-size car or less. Any ideas?
     
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Jan 29, 2006, 04:49 PM
 

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davidflas
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Jan 29, 2006, 04:53 PM
 
That rules out Chrysler... plus a lot of the American cars for sale in the US are actually built in Canada or Mexico.. be sure to check the window sticker if that will be a problem. Why type of vehicle does your mother want? Two doors, Four doors? SUV, car, truck? convertable?
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Jan 29, 2006, 05:11 PM
 
Some Toyotas are made in the States
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Jan 29, 2006, 05:26 PM
 
Originally Posted by jonn804
Here's the catch- she wants the parent car company to be headquartered in the USA and the car to be built in the USA. Mid-size car or less. Any ideas?
Why? Will she get lynched if someone sees her in a Non-American car?

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olePigeon
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Jan 29, 2006, 05:28 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie
Some Toyotas are made in the States
Toyota has a US headquarters as well. Ironically, Toyota vehicles might be more American than GM, Ford, and Chevy.
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Jan 29, 2006, 05:28 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie
Some Toyotas are made in the States
I think most of them are nowadays. I remember when I got my '92 camry that it was the last year camrys were made in japan. I was told the first letter of the VIN was an indication of where it was made, the J on my car meaning japan of course. In any case the parent company is not American.

Is the car for lease or sale? I find the long term reliability of American cars to be sub-par, but if its for lease a 'fun' car might be in order.
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sek929
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Jan 29, 2006, 07:20 PM
 
Honda has several plants here in the US.

Knowing that I suggest a Honda Accord V6
     
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Jan 29, 2006, 07:31 PM
 
Originally Posted by jonn804
Here's the catch- she wants the parent car company to be headquartered in the USA and the car to be built in the USA. Mid-size car or less. Any ideas?
Its hard to think that way anymore. Although I do understand its your Mother

I have a Honda Ridgeline right now. Designed in the U.S. The engine was built in Ohio. The transmission somewhere in Japan and it was assembled in Alliston, Ontario, Canada. lol.
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leehotti
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Jan 29, 2006, 08:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by jonn804
Here's the catch- she wants the parent car company to be headquartered in the USA and the car to be built in the USA. Mid-size car or less. Any ideas?
Tell her that getting a brand new car is just about the dumbest thing ever.
     
stevesnj
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Jan 29, 2006, 09:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by leehotti
Tell her that getting a brand new car is just about the dumbest thing ever.
Huh?
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leehotti
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Jan 29, 2006, 09:16 PM
 
Getting a new car is about the worst investment anyone can possibly make. It's better to buy used, 3-5 years old.
     
stevesnj
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Jan 29, 2006, 09:31 PM
 
My mom bought a new corolla in '98 and it was the best thing she ever did. She took care of it and drives highway miles all the time. A used car in my opinion is buying someone elses problem. I have bought a few used vehicles and had no issues but for my mom I insisted she buy new and she said she won't buy used again. 3-5 year old cars are either beat up leased or financed vehicles that were traded in. Buying used when its affordable to buy new doesn't make sense to me. Buy used for money reasons not reliability reasons.
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Jan 29, 2006, 09:41 PM
 
Originally Posted by leehotti
Getting a new car is about the worst investment anyone can possibly make. It's better to buy used, 3-5 years old.
Something tells me that someone has never written their depreciation off against tax.
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Jan 29, 2006, 09:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy
Something tells me that someone has never written their depreciation off against tax.

That only works if you actually can write off depreciation against tax. For the average Joe, buying a new car is a mug's investment. You lose 10-30% of the value of a new car the second your tires leave the dealership.
     
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Jan 29, 2006, 09:52 PM
 
Originally Posted by sek929
Honda has several plants here in the US.

Knowing that I suggest a Honda Accord V6

nice - don't know which one i want to drive more

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Jan 29, 2006, 10:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by Mastrap
That only works if you actually can write off depreciation against tax. For the average Joe, buying a new car is a mug's investment. You lose 10-30% of the value of a new car the second your tires leave the dealership.
Yes, but Rob didn't say "the average Joe" - he said "anyone". He's wrong, as usual.
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leehotti
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Jan 29, 2006, 11:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by stevesnj
My mom bought a new corolla in '98 and it was the best thing she ever did. She took care of it and drives highway miles all the time. A used car in my opinion is buying someone elses problem. I have bought a few used vehicles and had no issues but for my mom I insisted she buy new and she said she won't buy used again. 3-5 year old cars are either beat up leased or financed vehicles that were traded in. Buying used when its affordable to buy new doesn't make sense to me. Buy used for money reasons not reliability reasons.
Well your opinion is uninformed and stupid. Today's cars are so well built and reliable that purchasing a new car is a waste of money. I purchased a neon with 20,000 miles on it a few years back, drove it to 100,000 without a problem. Purchased a 92 Subaru with 124 on it, it's now at 192k without a problem. Purchased a honda with 205k on it, it's now at 230k without a problem.

Generally, older single women buy new cars because they're uninformed idiots. I'm not bashing you rmom specifically, my mom did the same thing. She spent over 14 grand for a ford focus wagon, that is now probably worth less than 5k. A 3-5 year old vehicle can be in fine condition as long as you aren't a total moron and check the thing out well, but you seem unable to do that.

Buy used to save money, and laugh at dumb****s who think that all used cars are either 'someone else's problems', 'leased' or 'beat up'. Like yourself.
     
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Jan 29, 2006, 11:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by jonn804
Here's the catch- she wants the parent car company to be headquartered in the USA and the car to be built in the USA. Mid-size car or less. Any ideas?
Why don't you just say that only GM and Ford are an option ?

-t
     
stevesnj
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Jan 30, 2006, 12:26 AM
 
Originally Posted by leehotti
Well your opinion is uninformed and stupid.

Generally, older single women buy new cars because they're uninformed idiots

I'm not bashing you rmom specifically, my mom did the same thing.

A 3-5 year old vehicle can be in fine condition as long as you aren't a total moron and check the thing out well, but you seem unable to do that.

Buy used to save money, and laugh at dumb****s who think that all used cars are either 'someone else's problems', 'leased' or 'beat up'. Like yourself.

Well now, seems like your just intelligent as your insults. I was expressing my opinion in a forum. No need to be like this. Seems you need to respect others opinions without bashing, but if this is your only way to respond than don't bother to respond to my opinions.
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Jan 30, 2006, 12:40 AM
 
Originally Posted by leehotti
Well your opinion is uninformed and stupid. Today's cars are so well built and reliable that purchasing a new car is a waste of money. I purchased a neon with 20,000 miles on it a few years back, drove it to 100,000 without a problem. Purchased a 92 Subaru with 124 on it, it's now at 192k without a problem. Purchased a honda with 205k on it, it's now at 230k without a problem.

Generally, older single women buy new cars because they're uninformed idiots. I'm not bashing you rmom specifically, my mom did the same thing. She spent over 14 grand for a ford focus wagon, that is now probably worth less than 5k. A 3-5 year old vehicle can be in fine condition as long as you aren't a total moron and check the thing out well, but you seem unable to do that.

Buy used to save money, and laugh at dumb****s who think that all used cars are either 'someone else's problems', 'leased' or 'beat up'. Like yourself.
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Jan 30, 2006, 12:49 AM
 
I just hate people who are totally ignorant about any automotive knowledge spouting of stupid crap like it's true. Imagine how you'd react if you heard someone saying that "PCs are better because they can run MS word and play game, and macs are always slow, beat up, and problematic to use." It's irritating when people preach BS like truth.
     
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Jan 30, 2006, 01:16 AM
 
Originally Posted by leehotti
I just hate people who are totally ignorant about any automotive knowledge spouting of stupid crap like it's true. Imagine how you'd react if you heard someone saying that "PCs are better because they can run MS word and play game, and macs are always slow, beat up, and problematic to use." It's irritating when people preach BS like truth.
Let's try to help, not go foff on people...

The Honda Accord is a great car. I had 2.

As for the parent company being in America, I do not see this as such an important factor, especially in light of the upcoming trial.

If cars are made in America, that is doing much more good than the rich folks working here too.

They employ Americans and may be more what she is after.

Just a thought to research, jonn.
     
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Jan 30, 2006, 01:38 AM
 
Originally Posted by leehotti
Getting a new car is about the worst investment anyone can possibly make. It's better to buy used, 3-5 years old.
I said it before, and I'll say it again: Cars are not investments. They're things you buy to move you around.
     
leehotti
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Jan 30, 2006, 01:41 AM
 
Originally Posted by hayesk
I said it before, and I'll say it again: Cars are not investments. They're things you buy to move you around.
Anything you purchase is an investment. I don't like hte idea of spending a lot of money, and losing $3000-5000 in 1 week. More than $10,000 in just a few years.

To me, that's a stupid idea. I'd rather have some other idiot be stupid enough to buy a new car, then be stupid enough to believe it'll start to 'be unreliable' after 70-100k, and buy it from him for dirt cheap, and upgrade whatever seems tired for about 1/10th the cost of what teh vehicle cost new.
     
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Jan 30, 2006, 01:45 AM
 
I think Hyundai has a huge plant here too, might throw in the newly redesigned Sonata. Looks pretty good, I think.

Seriously though, what are her likes and dislikes? More info needed for us to help you.

Oh, yeah, and in before the lock. This has nowhere to go but downhill FAST. Cars and controversy Cash's forte. Bring on the fun!
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Jan 30, 2006, 01:49 AM
 
Originally Posted by leehotti
I just hate people who are totally ignorant about any automotive knowledge spouting of stupid crap like it's true. Imagine how you'd react if you heard someone saying that "PCs are better because they can run MS word and play game, and macs are always slow, beat up, and problematic to use." It's irritating when people preach BS like truth.
I hate it when someone who has knowledge on a subject thinks everyone should act as they would, and then proceed to insult people just because those people have different wants or needs than so-called "experts".

It's worse than Linux geeks who think everyone, including their grandmas, should run Linux as a desktop OS. Your opinion on buying cars could be applied to computers, furniture, appliances, clothes, etc. I'll bet you buy new clothes. But yet you don't hear anyone calling you stupid for wasting your money on new clothes.

I bought two new cars in my life and don't regret it at all. Could I saved money buying used? Sure, but so what. I wanted a new car. Why should I let a complete stranger tell me otherwise?
     
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Jan 30, 2006, 02:07 AM
 
Ford Five Hundred?
     
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Jan 30, 2006, 02:11 AM
 
Originally Posted by jonn804
Here's the catch- she wants the parent car company to be headquartered in the USA and the car to be built in the USA. Mid-size car or less. Any ideas?
How about a Pontiac Solstice? I believe that GM's Boxwood plant in Delaware is manufacturing them.

     
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Jan 30, 2006, 03:55 AM
 
I think it is noble AND smart that your mom wants to buy American. 30,000 workers were just laid off from Ford and the vendors and subcontractors will be affected, too. Just wait until this wave hits YOU. And it will in some way in the next few weeks. It may not be YOU, you, but someone or something near you WILL be affected by the lay off.

Saturn is a great car and is a division of GM. Their cars are ALWAYS at the top of the safety, customer satisfaction and resale value lists.

If someone plans to keep the car until it falls apart it's better to buy brand new. The manufacturer's low interest rates, rebates, other financing incentives, original factory warranty, the latest technology, the new car factor AND the new car smell are all reasons to buy new.

Strictly speaking, an investment is something that gains in value or is expected to do so.

Because, as lee hottie rightly points out, a car loses value as soon as you drive it over the curb and then continues to go down steadily with time, it is not an investment. It is a liability, technically.

If you never see a pink slip of ownership and find yourself always trading in your 3 - 5 year old car you should consider leasing.

Look at the Saturns. My ex-g/f got a brand new Dell computer AND a rebate AND a screamingly low interest rate by purchasing her new Ion.
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leehotti
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Jan 30, 2006, 09:33 AM
 
Originally Posted by hayesk
I hate it when someone who has knowledge on a subject thinks everyone should act as they would, and then proceed to insult people just because those people have different wants or needs than so-called "experts".

It's worse than Linux geeks who think everyone, including their grandmas, should run Linux as a desktop OS. Your opinion on buying cars could be applied to computers, furniture, appliances, clothes, etc. I'll bet you buy new clothes. But yet you don't hear anyone calling you stupid for wasting your money on new clothes.

I bought two new cars in my life and don't regret it at all. Could I saved money buying used? Sure, but so what. I wanted a new car. Why should I let a complete stranger tell me otherwise?
Nah, I don't buy clothes new much either. Besides, there's a world of difference between a new $30 shirt and a new $30,000 car.

But it's okay. Stupid people like yourself who believe that used cars are always problematic and abused are the reason intelligent people like myself are able to get good deals on reliable transportation for not much money.
     
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Jan 30, 2006, 09:34 AM
 
Originally Posted by aberdeenwriter
If you never see a pink slip of ownership and find yourself always trading in your 3 - 5 year old car you should consider leasing.
I think you should consider a finance class instead.
     
leehotti
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Jan 30, 2006, 09:47 AM
 
Originally Posted by aberdeenwriter
I think it is noble AND smart that your mom wants to buy American.
I don't. First off, a lot of American cars are produced in Mexico. Secondly, they produce generally inferior products, and have absolutely horrid resale value. Why is it 'noble' or 'smart' to spend money on a car who's value is going to sink like a rock and that generally doesn't have the fit and finish or reliability of an 'import', which are generally built HERE IN THE STATES GIVING AMERICANS JOBS?

Saturn is a great car and is a division of GM. Their cars are ALWAYS at the top of the safety, customer satisfaction and resale value lists.
That's a joke. Saturn has great resale value compared to something like GM, but it's not even on the same planet as Honda or Toyota. Using archaic engines with only 2 valves per cylinder designed in the 1980s doesn't help them much either.

If someone plans to keep the car until it falls apart it's better to buy brand new. The manufacturer's low interest rates, rebates, other financing incentives, original factory warranty, the latest technology, the new car factor AND the new car smell are all reasons to buy new.
You state this like you are speaking facts, but again you're speaking bullshit. Low interest, rebates, and factory warranties still aren't enough to beat the value of a slightly used car. For example, let's say you spend $25,000 on a new accord, drive it about 15k miles a year, and drive it for 15 years. It'd now have 225,000 miles, and if you took care of it it would still be a reliable car. So you've spent $1500 per year for the past 15 years to drive 15k miles.

Now let's say you spent $5000 on a used accord with 75k miles on it (easy to do). You drive it for 15k for 10 years. That's 150k miles, giving you a total of 225k miles. Again, the car would still be reliable as long as you took care of it, only you've spent $500 per year for the past 10 years to drive 15k. Notice hte difference. That's literally ONE THIRD of the cost of a new car, to drive a honda to 225,000 miles which is a cakewalk. EVEN IF you needed an entirely new suspension, engine, exhaust, and transmission, you'd still come out WAY AHEAD compared to purchasing a new car.

Look at the Saturns. My ex-g/f got a brand new Dell computer AND a rebate AND a screamingly low interest rate by purchasing her new Ion.
That's because GM is trying desperatly to move it's cars since nobody is buying them.
     
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Jan 30, 2006, 09:48 AM
 
Originally Posted by what_the_heck
I think you should consider a finance class instead.
OK, Lucy. Start 'splainin.
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Jan 30, 2006, 09:56 AM
 
its impossible to get 100% made in the US. Every car has some parts made in china, canada, mexico you name it. Even if most of the car is made in the US, a part in it will not be.
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:07 AM
 
Originally Posted by leehotti
I don't. First off, a lot of American cars are produced in Mexico. Secondly, they produce generally inferior products, and have absolutely horrid resale value. Why is it 'noble' or 'smart' to spend money on a car who's value is going to sink like a rock and that generally doesn't have the fit and finish or reliability of an 'import', which are generally built HERE IN THE STATES GIVING AMERICANS JOBS?

That's a joke. Saturn has great resale value compared to something like GM, but it's not even on the same planet as Honda or Toyota. Using archaic engines with only 2 valves per cylinder designed in the 1980s doesn't help them much either.

You state this like you are speaking facts, but again you're speaking bullshit. Low interest, rebates, and factory warranties still aren't enough to beat the value of a slightly used car. For example, let's say you spend $25,000 on a new accord, drive it about 15k miles a year, and drive it for 15 years. It'd now have 225,000 miles, and if you took care of it it would still be a reliable car. So you've spent $1500 per year for the past 15 years to drive 15k miles.

Now let's say you spent $5000 on a used accord with 75k miles on it (easy to do). You drive it for 15k for 10 years. That's 150k miles, giving you a total of 225k miles. Again, the car would still be reliable as long as you took care of it, only you've spent $500 per year for the past 10 years to drive 15k. Notice hte difference. That's literally ONE THIRD of the cost of a new car, to drive a honda to 225,000 miles which is a cakewalk. EVEN IF you needed an entirely new suspension, engine, exhaust, and transmission, you'd still come out WAY AHEAD compared to purchasing a new car.

That's because GM is trying desperatly to move it's cars since nobody is buying them.
The assumptions you are making are ABNORMAL, ATYPICAL assumptions. The things you are saying MAY be true (and they may not be, I can't attest to what YOU say but I can vouch for what I say) but does the average consumer WANT to behave in the manner you proscribe?

That reminds me of the person who builds their own computer. Saves money. Better specs. But who really wants to do that? And how many people CAN do that?

We are talking about a MOM.

As for buying American, I don't know what you do for a living, but if everybody in America buys foreign cars just what do you think would happen to our economy? You live in America? Then you should drive the best American car you can when the country is in economic trouble. All of you who say that every car is a mish-mosh of parts and assembly from here and there, this country and that, well you are all correct. But jonn804's Mom wants to do what's good for the American workers because she is noble and smart. The cars that will most help Detroit is what she wants to buy.

The difference in fit and finish YOU can't even quantify and I challenge you to prove your assertions. They MAY be true but they may NOT be true.

If you are so interested in the mechanics of the car, I hope you are just as demanding of your computer. Ooops, I think there's a new updated iMac that came out last week. Unless you have the very latest and best you are ****! Isn't that your philosophy?

C'mon, be real. Ease up. Calm down. Be right and be nice. It's easy to be hard. Can you master the challenge of finding fulfillment as a NICE person?

Cars, stuff, things. It's all to make you feel good inside. But when you have all the stuff and all the stuff you have is the very best stuff and you still feel bad inside is the answer really more stuff? Better stuff?

How about more love?

A better me?

jonn804, I stand by my original post. Check out Saturns.
( Last edited by aberdeenwriter; Jan 30, 2006 at 10:15 AM. )
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:11 AM
 
Originally Posted by aberdeenwriter
Check out Saturns.
Yuck. They are fugly. Why would anyone buy them.

Uhm, no, wait. Yeah, I can see people buying them just because they are built in the US by a US owned company. How dumb.

-t
     
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:14 AM
 
Originally Posted by Mastrap
That only works if you actually can write off depreciation against tax. For the average Joe, buying a new car is a mug's investment. You lose 10-30% of the value of a new car the second your tires leave the dealership.
It really depends. For the way I drive and how lazy I am taking care of cars, for me it would be a total waste. but for some one who takes total care of there car drives nice it could be better in the long term unless they are just doing to ditch the car 5 years later. Gotta look at all options.
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:26 AM
 
Originally Posted by leehotti
Tell her that getting a brand new car is just about the dumbest thing ever.
Except if one wanna buy a stick shift... Buying a used one in ths country is hazardous to say the least.
     
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:30 AM
 
She should be able to get the car that she wants.

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Jan 30, 2006, 10:34 AM
 
Originally Posted by Athens
It really depends. For the way I drive and how lazy I am taking care of cars, for me it would be a total waste. but for some one who takes total care of there car drives nice it could be better in the long term unless they are just doing to ditch the car 5 years later. Gotta look at all options.
And, of course you know that when to many people begin buying used cars rather than new cars, the price of used cars will go up to reflect the demand. And by then there will be even more US auto workers and plants that will be affected.

To leehotti and turtle777:

By the way, check out the Michael Moore film, "Roger & Me."

Maybe if the progressive man's hero says it's good to help Detroit you might pay attention.
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turtle777
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:37 AM
 
That's BS. Why help Detroit, when you can help other US cities by buying Honda or Toyota?

And to me, it doesn't really matter if the company is US owned or not. You can buy stocks of all these companies and participate in their profts. So what's the farkin deal ?

-t
     
Doofy
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:37 AM
 
Originally Posted by villalobos
Except if one wanna buy a stick shift... Buying a used one in ths country is hazardous to say the least.


That reminds me of a relevant point...
...since car manufacturers no longer include ash-trays unless the original buys specifies "smoker's pack", how many used cars are now coming up without adequate smoking facilities? And since the law and people like Rob are coming down hard on people who flip butts out of their windows, is there going to be a problem in a few years' time?
Been inclined to wander... off the beaten track.
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turtle777
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:39 AM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy
...since car manufacturers no longer include ash-trays unless the original buys specifies "smoker's pack"
My 2004 Jetta has an ash tray. No special order, it comes standard.

-t
     
aberdeenwriter
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:39 AM
 
Originally Posted by wdlove
She should be able to get the car that she wants.
I don't know wdlove. Maybe she should do EXACTLY what leehotti says. And not just about what car to buy and how to buy it, but about EVERYTHING in her life. leehotti knows best. And for THAT matter, who are WE to exercise free will? Or even think for ourselves? We ALL should do exactly and ONLY what leehotti says.

He knows best. He knows everything. And turtle777 is his altar boy.
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turtle777
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:40 AM
 
Originally Posted by aberdeenwriter
And turtle777 is his altar boy.
Wow, you are a even greater moron that I thought. Good for you

-t
     
Doofy
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:41 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777
My 2004 Jetta has an ash tray. No special order, it comes standard.
Right. But they're moving that way. New Fords don't come with an ashie unless you specify.
Been inclined to wander... off the beaten track.
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turtle777
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:42 AM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy
Right. But they're moving that way. New Fords don't come with an ashie unless you specify.
I think you have to think different with Ford. The WHOLE car is the ash tray

-t
     
aberdeenwriter
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:48 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777
That's BS. Why help Detroit, when you can help other US cities by buying Honda or Toyota?

And to me, it doesn't really matter if the company is US owned or not. You can buy stocks of all these companies and participate in their profts. So what's the farkin deal ?

-t
There are people in this world who are dangerous because they have the ability to be persuasive by virtue of qualities having little to do with well researched advice.

The US manufacturing base is dwindling and with it our middle class. Without a sizable manufacturing segment increasing numbers of people are forced into service jobs.

Certainly there must be a Wikipedia page on all of this for you to read.
Consider these posts as my way of introducing you to yourself.

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deedar
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Jan 30, 2006, 10:49 AM
 
Originally Posted by leehotti
Getting a new car is about the worst investment anyone can possibly make. It's better to buy used, 3-5 years old.
Anyone who considers a car an "investment" isn't too bright, either...
     
 
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