Welcome to the MacNN Forums.

ajprice · Sep 16, 2007, 03:45 PM

There's a few examples of iPod freakiness coming out, now that they are on sale and in peoples hands. Looks like they missed a few bits of iPhone code on the iPod touch OS when they transferred/deleted the iphone apps...

An iPod touch is not a camera

An iPod touch is not an iPhone

Any others?

MacinTommy · Sep 16, 2007, 03:53 PM

Thats pretty funny. But I guarantee it will be fixed very soon.

::maroma:: · Sep 16, 2007, 04:19 PM

Poor little dude. He wants to be an iPhone like his big brother so badly. Lets just all play along to make him feel a little better.

kuchiki · Sep 16, 2007, 04:34 PM

This is too funny....
too bad that this will be fixed soon....

kuchiki

Atheist · Sep 16, 2007, 07:02 PM

Apple seems to have way too many pots in the fire right now. Not that any of these are major guffaws, but Steve must be livid every time one of these crops up.

macgeek2005 · Sep 16, 2007, 08:33 PM

Things like these are what enforce my belief that the iPod Touch is a terrible, disabled copy of it's glorious brother, the iPhone.

Aside from either A. Not living in the states, or B. not being able to afford the monthly fee, no one would EVER buy an iPod Touch over an iPhone.

macuser9909 · Sep 16, 2007, 09:19 PM

Originally Posted by macgeek2005

Things like these are what enforce my belief that the iPod Touch is a terrible, disabled copy of it's glorious brother, the iPhone.

Aside from either A. Not living in the states, or B. not being able to afford the monthly fee, no one would EVER buy an iPod Touch over an iPhone.

Now don't you think that was a pretty dumb thing to say?

macgeek2005 · Sep 16, 2007, 09:46 PM

Originally Posted by macuser9909

Now don't you think that was a pretty dumb thing to say?

Not at all. Is there anyone out there who wants an iPod Touch over an iPhone for any logical reason aside from the two that I stated in my last post?

icruise · Sep 16, 2007, 09:51 PM

How about twice as much storage space? Thinner, lighter device?

But the whole monthly fee thing is reason enough for most. it's not a matter of "not being able to afford" the monthly fees. Not everyone wants a combination cell phone and media player, and not everyone can or wants to use AT&T.

Keep in mind that I'm a happy iPhone owner, but I can see the attraction of the touch.

::maroma:: · Sep 16, 2007, 09:56 PM

There is definitely a solid place for the Touch. Apple's iPod line now extends from the tiny Shuffle to the mighty iPhone. Users have such a broad choice of which iPod to buy its perfect. The Touch fits right in there for those who don't want/need the iPhone (there are plenty who fit both of those demographics), but want that sweet touch technology as well as a sexy device.

macgeek2005 · Sep 16, 2007, 09:57 PM

Originally Posted by icruise

How about twice as much storage space? Thinner, lighter device?

But the whole monthly fee thing is reason enough for most. it's not a matter of "not being able to afford" the monthly fees. Not everyone wants a combination cell phone and media player, and not everyone can or wants to use AT&T.

Keep in mind that I'm a happy iPhone owner, but I can see the attraction of the touch.

The iPhone will go 16GB sooner than most people expect. Probably by the end of this month. People who bought the 8GB for $399 won't be mad because the 16GB will be priced at $499 or more.

And just because some people don't care for the loads of extra features that the iPhone has, it doesn't change the fact that the iPhone is a superior device.

icruise · Sep 16, 2007, 10:06 PM

I don't argue that it's the superior device overall (although that's partially because Apple has artificially made it so). But that doesn't mean that it's the best choice for everyone.

MacosNerd · Sep 17, 2007, 07:06 AM

Originally Posted by macgeek2005

Things like these are what enforce my belief that the iPod Touch is a terrible, disabled copy of it's glorious brother, the iPhone.

I disagree. I think the iPod Touch could be a great alternative to the iPhone. Not everyone wants the iPhone but we want a lot of its functionality such as the wide screen, the touch screen. Even the wireless surfing (albeit wifi for the Touch). So its not a terrible disabled copy of its glorious brother to use your hyperbole.

While there seems to be "teething" issues with both products I suspect that Apple will correct the short comings of both products in short order.

Hanul · Sep 17, 2007, 07:42 AM

I like having a camera with me all the time for taking snapshots. So, a mobile phone with a high MP camera AND a flash is my gadget of choice. Sometimes I like having an iPod around for listening to music, watching video or showing photos.

There are two possibilities: Buying an iPhone and a small stand-alone digital camera or buying an iPod touch and a mobile with a camera. The camera on the iPhone is too bad. There are decent cameras on current mobiles (Nokia N95 and SE K850 both having a 5MP camera with flash). With an iPhone I always had to carry two items. With the iPod touch, I take it with me, only if I need it.

MacosNerd · 07:57 AM

Originally Posted by Hanul

I like having a camera with me all the time for taking snapshots. So, a mobile phone with a high MP camera AND a flash is my gadget of choice.

I've never gotten the whole camera and phone thing. Perhaps when technology catches up with the idea I'll think differently but quality of the pictures are so poor and low res that I never consider the inclusion of a camera on a phone as a requirement.

CorpITGuy · Sep 17, 2007, 08:18 AM

The whole entire point of the iPod touch is to drive growth towards the iPhone. Apple makes recurring money off of the iPhone. Also, almost everyone needs a phone, but not everyone needs an iPod. I think they want to drive future iPod buyers towards the iPhone. It's good for market share AND revenue.

It also serves a niche market, as mentioned above; e.g., people who (a) cannot get AT&T or (b) people who cannot afford a recurring monthly cell bill.

Big Mac · Sep 17, 2007, 08:33 AM

Originally Posted by macgeek2005

Not at all. Is there anyone out there who wants an iPod Touch over an iPhone for any logical reason aside from the two that I stated in my last post?

There are many reasons why the touch makes sense.

theDreamer · Sep 17, 2007, 11:12 AM

I think if I did not get the iPhone that the touch would be my choice currently.
16gb of space is plenty to store my daily music selection and still room to carry a movie or TV shows. While the lack of editing calendar would be a draw back, if it just my "iPod" then I would not even worry about that really, but as my phone I need to have the edit on the calendar.

CharlesS · Sep 17, 2007, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by macgeek2005

Not at all. Is there anyone out there who wants an iPod Touch over an iPhone for any logical reason aside from the two that I stated in my last post?

Because the iPhone's media features are great, while its phone features are... not. The iPod touch lets you get the iPhone's media features while still being able to use a phone that actually works well as a phone.

CorpITGuy · Sep 17, 2007, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by CharlesS

Because the iPhone's media features are great, while its phone features are... not. The iPod touch lets you get the iPhone's media features while still being able to use a phone that actually works well as a phone.

This just isn't true.

It's a values judgment. In terms of call quality, it's not as good as my 3G Blackjack was. In terms of dropped calls (number of them) it's easily the best phone I've ever had. It means more to me to keep the call connected than it does to have the ability to play my Coldplay collection over a voice connection. My Blackjack dropped calls constantly. In terms of feature set, it's at least in the top 10% of phones I've owned (various sundry flip/candy bar phones, Cingular 8125, iPAQ, Treo 750, Blackjack, etc.).

icruise · Sep 17, 2007, 12:20 PM

And it's easy to use as a phone as well. Do you have an iPhone, CharlesS? What's wrong with it as a phone? The only issue that can see is that it can take a fair number of taps to accomplish some things.

::maroma:: · Sep 17, 2007, 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by icruise

The only issue that can see is that it can take a fair number of taps to accomplish some things.

And on the other hand, there are a lot of phone functions that take considerably less time to do than on every other phone.

The iPhone's phone features are great. I don't understand why anyone would call it out as being bad. As far as criticism, I've heard very little on the actual phone function from the media and/or users.

TETENAL · Sep 17, 2007, 01:24 PM

Originally Posted by MacosNerd

I've never gotten the whole camera and phone thing. Perhaps when technology catches up with the idea I'll think differently but quality of the pictures are so poor and low res that I never consider the inclusion of a camera on a phone as a requirement.

I use the camera on my phone to take notes all the time. Quality of the picture is not important as long as I can read the text of what I photographed. It's actually quite useful.

CharlesS · Sep 17, 2007, 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by icruise

And it's easy to use as a phone as well. Do you have an iPhone, CharlesS? What's wrong with it as a phone? The only issue that can see is that it can take a fair number of taps to accomplish some things.

I don't have an iPhone, but from what I've read, it has poor reception compared to most other GSM phones, which is a huge deal for me. It also requires more button presses to access many phone functions than most phones. It generates loads of GSM interference in audio devices. Its Bluetooth is quite crippled, and lacks OBEX support. It lacks MMS messaging. You have to ship it to Apple and be without a phone for a few days if your battery dies and you need to replace it - not so big a problem with an iPod, but a huge problem with a phone. It lacks any way to officially write or use third-party apps. It lacks iSync support (bizarrely), meaning you have to open iTunes instead of just using the iSync menu extra. It's difficult to enter text if you have large fingers. There doesn't seem to be a way to quickly get to the address book from the main screen with one click. It's quad-band GSM, but you'd better not take it out of the country because it constantly accesses the network in the background without letting you know that it's doing so, running up a huge roaming fee on your bill, and there's no way to turn this off. There's also no official way to unlock the phone to work around this (there are some hacks out there, but who knows if they will be broken by a future software update). And then of course there is the well-publicized fact that it's a phone designed around data features which doesn't have 3G and that it's available with only one US cell provider.

Now a lot of these things are just 1.0 problems, and will probably be fixed for the iPhone 2.0. As it is now, if I needed the iPhone's features right now and had the money to spend, I'd definitely go with a regular cell phone and an iPod touch.

theDreamer · Sep 17, 2007, 05:48 PM

I don't have an iPhone, but from what I've read, it has poor reception compared to most other GSM phones, which is a huge deal for me.

This has a clean clear call since I have had mine, I live in a highly populated city (Houston), and have yet to have a dropped called (my fault) or any major problems with not hearing people.

It also requires more button presses to access many phone functions than most phones.

Can not argue this, it took a, swipe, phone, slide to contact, click, click to call (if I so choose) or click on other options. Though once I am next to my contact list I have many options to do anything I want with that contact from there, email, message, call.

It generates loads of GSM interference in audio devices.

Have not had a problem with this with mine, but maybe I am not around that many devices that it is having problems with...

Bluetooth sucks that is a clear problem and one reason I am sad with my phone, and lack of MMS is a downside, but really? In my years of owning a phone I think I have only ever gotten one picture message in my entire life and really ever wanted to send a few (which were not even that important). Though you might send 10 a day which for you makes it a big feature, it is a give and take situation.

You have to ship it to Apple and be without a phone for a few days if your battery dies and you need to replace it - not so big a problem with an iPod, but a huge problem with a phone.

They offer replacements while you want for it to be fixed, yes they charge you, but really if your battery has died this early then it was defective. Now if it dies after a year of use then you are a heavy user and probably do not care about paying for a rental for a few days.

It lacks any way to officially write or use third-party apps.

Are third party apps ever official with phones or other devices? Also, I have put on and taken off plenty of third party apps on my phone since I have gotten it, along with free ringtones. I currently do not have third party apps, but that is because I did a system restore a week ago for my own reasons. Adding third party applications is very easy to add or remove.

It lacks iSync support (bizarrely), meaning you have to open iTunes instead of just using the iSync menu extra.

I use windows, so I can not comment, sorry.

I am tired of highlighting and quoting so I will just finish up.
I have a large hand (long fingers) and do not have problems at all, now if you have wider fingers I could see where problems might occur, but the same problem would be with most/any smartphone since they all have tiny keyboards, so why just point at the iPhone? Clicking on phone takes you right to all of my contacts and by picking a name it shows telephone, email, etc. These stories of people with huge phone bills are there own faults. There are (on both websites Apple & AT&T) ways to show you how to disable these features so you do not have to worry about your phone racking up huge phone bills. Also whenever I travel overseas (as others do to with there phones) I contact my cell provider and ask about international fees and what plans are available, and other situations I encounter. I have AT&T for awhile (Cingular before that), and they have always been helpful with my questions about these topics, normally hoping to add some plan to my contract usually. Who says they have to provide a way to unlock your phone? Is it in the contract they must provide it? My phone before the iPhone was with only one provider, where was the big problem with that? The blackjack was only with Cingular (then AT&T) where was the fight for that phone? Finally, who ever said it was going to have 3G? When it was announced we all knew it was going to be EDGE, and while upsetting we made a choice whether EDGE was worth it or not.

icruise · Sep 17, 2007, 06:24 PM

First of all, we were talking specifically about the iPhone's functionality *as a phone* so a number of these points seem rather irrelevant.

I was going to go through point by point, but suffice it to say that most of the issues mentioned are either overblown (reception and GSM noise seems the same on my iPhone as on my RAZR, and who cares if it doesn't use iSync for syncing as long as the sync process works well?) or are only important to a certain segment of the population (MMS, bluetooth tethering, etc). People who live and die by MMS are not going to be buying the iPhone in the first place -- most people who actually own them won't care.

As someone who actually owns an iPhone, the biggest problem with it as a phone in daily use is that it's too quiet -- both the ringer and the speakerphone volume. The vibration feature is good enough that I don't miss calls, but it's much quieter than I would like at max volume.