[macintologist]

I've been going around the web on Sony's site as well as Toshiba, Dell and HP and I've gotten nothing but consistent crap. All PC laptops have the following in common:


-thick and heavy (and therefore FUGLY)
-cheesy hinges, no pivoting hinges like on PBs
-pretty bad keyboard compared to PBs
-ugly "Designed for WinXP" stickers
-annoying lights for Harddrive activity, power and battery indicator
-usually pretty bad 3d graphics (usually less than 64mb)
-usually no Bluetooth included
-no backlit keyboards

oh I almost forgot...

they don't run OS X

Can someone play the devil's advocate here? I really want to see a PC laptop that is as sexy as an Apple one with the same feature set. There has to be one out there, somewhere.

[Kermy]

http://www.dynamism.com/index.shtml

Check the laptops there.

[funkboy]

Alienware makes some very funky looking laptops, too, and it costs just as much as Apple stuff, as well. Seems to be somewhat high quality... I hope, anyway.

[s0litude]

Don't forget the IBM Thinkpad x40
kick @ss

[macintologist]

Originally posted by s0litude:
Don't forget the IBM Thinkpad x40
kick @ss

Yep..nothing like a 16MB Radeon Mobility.
IBM link (should work)

Edit: Sorry that the x31. The x40 is even better! Intel Extreme Graphics 2!

[bcaslis]

They all suck. Dell's the most, IBM and Sony the least. But there is nothing like a PowerBook for a laptop. I work in an all PC company. Some people like to crack jokes about Macs, but everyone who sees my 17" has nothing but admiration and awe to say about it.

[s0litude]

granted, the x40 doesn't do half the stuff that my powerbook can do, but its still a decent computer to do work stuff on. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big apple dork, but if i had to choose, i'd go with a thinkpad. The alienware laptops do well in the portable gaming field, but in the big picture, the mac is just so much better in doing everything else...

edit: You know what else kicks @ss? When i come home and plug my 2 20 in. cinema displays into my powerbook. Not because i need the desktop space, but because i CAN. And i'm out...

[madmacgames]

before I got my powerbook and was tossing around the idea of getting a laptop, on the PC side, I had seriously considered this PC latop:

http://www.buympc.com/home/store/not...ort_t2200.html

As far as PC laptops go, it seems pretty decent in the graphics area, weight, size (1.16" thick comes in thinner than the 12" and a bit thicker than the 15"), etc... though I don't much care for the blue keys & blue trackpad.

But at the time I was going to be taking a job where I needed a laptop and very high security on the laptop which the MPC laptops have biometric fingerprint scanning built into the BIOS (as in, you'll probably have to cut off my hand if you want access.. lol). It didn't work out though and so I waited and mulled over it some more and decided to go Apple

[mr56k dialup]

Im very curious on how you can connect 2 20" Cinema Displays to your Powerbook. Please email me if you get a chance [email protected]


Thanks

[Pierre B.]

How about this one? Unique and insane specifications and features. And of course prices .

[Ryan1524]

i like some PC laptops. namely Thinkpad's T-series, some Toshibas (M30), some Fujitsus, and some Asus notebooks (W1000 - PB15" alter ego - even the hinge design's the same).

[sniffer]

A friend of mine is concidering this one:
http://www.whitebox.no/default.asp?A...y&nComputer=12
It rocks in terms of hardware-price ratio. It's a desktop replacement in a small Centrino package.

That said, he is ordering it without any software. Me? I am going for the 12" PB. With ADC student discount it's a pretty good deal!

[Michel_80]

Nothing is a better deal than the Powerbooks especially with the edu discount end of.

[flypenfly]

Not to get in the way of the big powerbook circle jerk but a T42 pretty much kick's a Powerbook's ass in all respects except perhaps styling and no OS X (except with PearPC who knows how far development goes).

A new Dothan 1.8ghz CPU is much much faster than a G4 1.5ghz CPU and the thinkpad T series uses metal (magnesium for their top covers). They do however only come with 128mb Radeon 9600's for their top end vid card. But it seems a 9700 vs 9600 is about a 10% difference at the very most according to most released benchmarks currently. Also thinkapds don't have firewire but that seems trivial since breakout cards are out there although it would be nice built in.

Oh, the battery life in thinkpads also kicks powerbooks asses... while retaining similar weight and dimensions (1" thick) and much superior performance.

That said, I am going to be buying a $2000+ laptop in the next few months but I will be getting a 17" powerbook on a big EDU discount because I like OS X and in 17" size, that's the lightest I can go.

[Dr.Michael]

Yes right, Thinkpads.

I use a T40, 1.6 Ghz, 1Gig RAM with Suse linux. Its not as pretty as my powerbook, but a lot faster, longer Battery life, nearly as light and - man is this thing robust.

It simply does a good job and does not get in my way.
My Powerbook also does a good job, but have a look at all these "how do I polish it" and "omg, I found a scratch" postings :0)

[bcaslis]

For those with personal experience with the IBM T4x (not those reading off specs), how did you get them? You can't go buy them in a store (that I've ever seen). It seems like IBM is geared to mainly sell to corporations. Personally I'd never buy a laptop until I could see at least a version of the model I wanted so I could judge size, weight, screen, etc... myself. From stories it seems like the IBM is the best on the PC side, but I've never seen one in person myself.

[sniffer]

Originally posted by bcaslis:
For those with personal experience with the IBM T4x (not those reading off specs), how did you get them? You can't go buy them in a store (that I've ever seen). It seems like IBM is geared to mainly sell to corporations. Personally I'd never buy a laptop until I could see at least a version of the model I wanted so I could judge size, weight, screen, etc... myself. From stories it seems like the IBM is the best on the PC side, but I've never seen one in person myself.

Well they also aim against the edu marked and IBMs are the standard equipment in regards to student gears in my part of my uni. About 50% of the portables are IBMs here. From my experience I think they are drop dead ugly and the price/performance ratio isn't very good. Quality wise they are probably higher than any Apples IMO. Compared to IBM I think Apple hardware holds pretty well all in all, even when not taking the software into consideration. You'll get better price/performance ratios elsewhere than IBM, but IBM has the quality. Apple has the design and the software. Both have some of the best solutions out there in their specialized areas IMO (,based on what I've seen so far, what ever that is worth ).

[power142]

I have a lot of experience with the Thinkpad T4x series from work and they are definitely fast (especially the ones with the FireGL cards) at most things. Windows XP is a clunky experience, and Linux doesn't run perfectly on them (power management sucks). Worst thing is that most of the users don't appreciate them fully and don't take advantage of their full processing power.

So, they may be nice, but they're also expensive when kitted out with a nice hard disk, graphics processor and decent amount of memory.

[Saramin]

I was looking into picking up either a Powerbook or a Thinkpad and finally settled on the latter (my dad's 40% company discount helped a little ^^). Anyway, I was wondering how effecive the FireGL 2 card is in terms of gaming. I'll be more than happy with the 9600 since I mostly play older titles, but the FireGL card isn't more expensive by alot anyway. Is it around as good as the 128MB 9700 Mobility, or less? I've never heard of this particular card before so I'm wondering.

Thanks guys.

[Will McGoonigle]

Delsl kick arse. Dont care about the design but the top end ones are tough and nearly every month the latest models break benchmark records at PC Pro.

[Cadaver]

Originally posted by mr56k dialup:
Im very curious on how you can connect 2 20" Cinema Displays to your Powerbook. Please email me if you get a chance [email protected]

Its not possible (not two at the same time, at least).
Though, if you prove me wrong, post how-to here.

[madmacgames]

Originally posted by Cadaver:
Its not possible (not two at the same time, at least).
Though, if you prove me wrong, post how-to here.

I don't think it is either, unless he is using some kind of splitter or cable to send the same signal to 2 monitors.

[riotge@r]

Originally posted by macintologist:
I've been going around the web on Sony's site as well as Toshiba, Dell and HP and I've gotten nothing but consistent crap. All PC laptops have the following in common:


-thick and heavy (and therefore FUGLY)
-cheesy hinges, no pivoting hinges like on PBs
-pretty bad keyboard compared to PBs
-ugly "Designed for WinXP" stickers
-annoying lights for Harddrive activity, power and battery indicator
-usually pretty bad 3d graphics (usually less than 64mb)
-usually no Bluetooth included
-no backlit keyboards

oh I almost forgot...

they don't run OS X

Can someone play the devil's advocate here? I really want to see a PC laptop that is as sexy as an Apple one with the same feature set. There has to be one out there, somewhere.

Alienware, VooDoo and IBM make awesome laptops. A top of the line laptop has better 3D capabilities than the top of the line powerbook.

[iomatic]

With a PC Card slot, yes:
http://www.powerpage.org/cgi-bin/Web...y?newsID=11588

Originally posted by madmacgames:
I don't think it is either, unless he is using some kind of splitter or cable to send the same signal to 2 monitors.

[riotge@r]

Originally posted by Saramin:
I was looking into picking up either a Powerbook or a Thinkpad and finally settled on the latter (my dad's 40% company discount helped a little ^^). Anyway, I was wondering how effecive the FireGL 2 card is in terms of gaming. I'll be more than happy with the 9600 since I mostly play older titles, but the FireGL card isn't more expensive by alot anyway. Is it around as good as the 128MB 9700 Mobility, or less? I've never heard of this particular card before so I'm wondering.

Thanks guys.

The FireGL card is a good work station card and does well with DirectX 8 games. It'll chock on Direct X 9 games though.

[hldan]

Originally posted by macintologist:
I've been going around the web on Sony's site as well as Toshiba, Dell and HP and I've gotten nothing but consistent crap. All PC laptops have the following in common:


-thick and heavy (and therefore FUGLY)
-cheesy hinges, no pivoting hinges like on PBs
-pretty bad keyboard compared to PBs
-ugly "Designed for WinXP" stickers
-annoying lights for Harddrive activity, power and battery indicator
-usually pretty bad 3d graphics (usually less than 64mb)
-usually no Bluetooth included
-no backlit keyboards

oh I almost forgot...

they don't run OS X

Can someone play the devil's advocate here? I really want to see a PC laptop that is as sexy as an Apple one with the same feature set. There has to be one out there, somewhere.

You certainly picked the perfect place to get a bias for the Powerbook. Now I am certainly no PC lover and I own the 17"PB 1.33Ghz but there are some nice PC laptops out there and more than likely Sony wins the styling market from their cheapest to the best and their Z1 laptop certainly has bluetooth albeit bluetooth doesn't function as simple as the Macs of course.

I recommend you take this topic over to a PC forum on the web and see what kind of replies you get.
You will get answers like:
Sure, your Mac looks good but you can't do anything with it because there's no software.
What good is a pretty car if you can't drive it because the engine's too slowwww.
Too bad Macs can't play games.
Your Mac is way overpriced and you will still use an emulator to use Windows software so what's the point???

This is what all us Mac Users have heard from PC users and still hear it. It's their only defense out of ignorance but everything you say bad about the PC's is our defense. Goes both ways.

[sbc]

I guess what I never get about these issues, what is the point? You don't like a PC or MS, don't buy it. You don't like Mac OS and Apple, don't but it. I think there are excellent PC laptop models on the market. Powerbooks are just as strong too. The fact of the matter is, both have features that are wonderful or leave something to desire. Jaguar vs XP debate: two different consumer bases. I think it's completely unfair just to say one is the best and the other has not good qualities. One can find gold in either pot given their desires.

[bcaslis]

Oh Please! Do you use one? My company uses nothing but Dells and the laptops are constantly breaking. I baby my computers and my PowerBook I use constantly and take everywhere. The Dell sits on a desk and gets turned on sometimes. I'd had five die in 3 years. Everyone I know at the company has had their Dell laptop replaced between one and six times in the three years I've been there. If this is tough I'd hate to a fragile PC laptop.

Originally posted by Will McGoonigle:
Delsl kick arse. Dont care about the design but the top end ones are tough and nearly every month the latest models break benchmark records at PC Pro.

[riotge@r]

Originally posted by bcaslis:
Oh Please! Do you use one? My company uses nothing but Dells and the laptops are constantly breaking. I baby my computers and my PowerBook I use constantly and take everywhere. The Dell sits on a desk and gets turned on sometimes. I'd had five die in 3 years. Everyone I know at the company has had their Dell laptop replaced between one and six times in the three years I've been there. If this is tough I'd hate to a fragile PC laptop.

I am posting this on a work issued Dell Latitude D600 Centrino laptop. The HD was replaced within a month of it being issued. I know that all products have a % of defective units, but I haven't had one Dell computer that hasn't had problems.

[flypenfly]

Not sure what the hell you guys do to your laptops but I worked at my University's web development group and IT group, we have a policy of lending out laptops to students who need them...

Of the sixty Dell Inspiron (the shittiest they make) that have gone through 2 years of beatened and battered service, only about 1 had a complete failure because some dipshit dropped it and no other major problems at all.

Of the ten ibooks we lend out, two had logic board failures.

We do need to get more ibooks though becuase they are the most popular.

"The HD was replaced within a month of it being issued. "

This probably isn't dell's fault but the HD manuf's

[hldan]

Originally posted by flypenfly:
Not sure what the hell you guys do to your laptops but I worked at my University's web development group and IT group, we have a policy of lending out laptops to students who need them...

Of the sixty Dell Inspiron (the shittiest they make) that have gone through 2 years of beatened and battered service, only about 1 had a complete failure because some dipshit dropped it and no other major problems at all.

Of the ten ibooks we lend out, two had logic board failures.

We do need to get more ibooks though becuase they are the most popular.

"The HD was replaced within a month of it being issued. "

This probably isn't dell's fault but the HD manuf's

That's very rude and unecessary to use such funky language to prove your point. You can easily get your point across by using smart lingo.

[riotge@r]

I am just going by emperical observation when I stated that the Dell's have problems. My POS Centrino's sleep button doesn't work. When connecting to the dock it won't turn on, etc.

[mbryda]

Originally posted by flypenfly:

Of the sixty Dell Inspiron (the shittiest they make) that have gone through 2 years of beatened and battered service, only about 1 had a complete failure because some dipshit dropped it and no other major problems at all.

You're lucky. Dell = $hit on the PC side of things. They are utter garbage, laptops, PC's, and Printers.

IBM makes the best PC laptops, hands down.

[s0litude]

Originally posted by Cadaver:
Its not possible (not two at the same time, at least).
Though, if you prove me wrong, post how-to here.

Yeah, i end up having a very matrix like experience with three monitors... I'll post pics up soon, i just moved so i'm waiting for the movers...

Here's how i did it: http://www.villagetronic.com/e_pr_vtbook.html

Cheers!

[yoyoman]

Originally posted by Pierre B.:
How about this one? Unique and insane specifications and features. And of course prices .

wow. I like except the price and cpu should be a athon xp 64 or which ever 64 bit is better. Man it is awesome.I really like it. Other than the color man it has things that are awesome excpet the legacy ports

[polendo]

I think your remarks about PC laptops are vague and empty. Generalization is not a good thing -at least on the PC business.

[sniffer]

Originally posted by polendo:
I think your remarks about PC laptops are vague and empty. Generalization is not a good thing -at least on the PC business.

It goes both ways. That's what I hate about these discussions. You get x86s laptops in every shapes, features, prices, qualities and performances. Still you'll always hear comments about Apples being overpriced, underpowered, etc etc, because there is always something cheaper. But the only general thing that does hold some water, is that you get what you pay for, and what is favored depends on what qualities in a product you alone are prioritizing. You'll never get it all in one product, only what you prioritize.

[yoyoman]

man a flash based hd is very nice espically since the os is stored in flash. wow. now imgine osx bein stored in flash hd and stored on every thing that is flash. The speeeeeds you can get.

[gametime10]

these laptops look pretty good

www.voodoopc.com

this one specifically

http://www.voodoopc.com/systems/m370.aspx

[polendo]

Originally posted by sniffer:
It goes both ways. That's what I hate about these discussions. You get x86s laptops in every shapes, features, prices, qualities and performances. Still you'll always hear comments about Apples being overpriced, underpowered, etc etc, because there is always something cheaper. But the only general thing that does hold some water, is that you get what you pay for, and what is favored depends on what qualities in a product you alone are prioritizing. You'll never get it all in one product, only what you prioritize.

I completely agree with you on this. Bottomline, you get what you paid for.

regards

[Defiant Jazz]

I think the PowerBook line would do well to have a hard and virtually unmoving composite LCD lid like IBM ThinkPads do.

[mbryda]

Originally posted by yoyoman:
man a flash based hd is very nice espically since the os is stored in flash. wow. now imgine osx bein stored in flash hd and stored on every thing that is flash. The speeeeeds you can get.

would be very slow. Even the best flash today is only up to "52x", which is 52x 150k/sec which is 7.8MB/sec. Even the slowest hard drive is a heck of a lot faster than that.

[wallaper]

I love osx and my 15AL but I have to say that my 2 year old dell laptop has been rock solid. No problems with it, but my powerbook as been in the shop 3 times in the last 6 months, monitor issues mostly.

Wallaper

[riotge@r]

Originally posted by gametime10:
these laptops look pretty good

www.voodoopc.com

this one specifically

http://www.voodoopc.com/systems/m370.aspx

If I were to buy a pc laptop it would be that one.

[riotge@r]

Originally posted by mbryda:


You're lucky. Dell = $hit on the PC side of things. They are utter garbage, laptops, PC's, and Printers.

IBM makes the best PC laptops, hands down. [/B]

Unless you want to play games... IBMs are great for business users.