Welcome to the MacNN Forums.

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

You are here: MacNN Forums > Community > MacNN Lounge > Thoughts on Apple CEO's $347M Salary

Thoughts on Apple CEO's $347M Salary
Thread Tools
liap
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: dc
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 25, 2012, 10:01 PM
 
Ok, so I am sure we can all agree no one man is worth $347 Million Dollars for just signing onto a company-not even doing any work yet. I am sure if you're like most people you would have to agree that at this time in our country most are struggling to get by and when we all go to buy that new shiny Apple product we are going to end up dropping some serious change. So now that this information is out in the open, how does this make everybody feel? Does this make you wish you purchased another competitors product? If Apple thinks it's justifiable to mark up their products only to redistribute that money to one man--NOT R&D..and not even American jobs (over 500,000 apple jobs in china, only around 40,000 in the states), then how will this company continue to prosper? Looking forward to hearing everybody's thoughts on this.
     
Uncle Skeleton
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Rockville, MD
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 25, 2012, 10:51 PM
 
I definitely only bought macs up until now because of Steve Jobs' $1/year vow of poverty. Fortunately I won't need to buy any more macs, because the ones I already have will last basically forever.
     
besson3c
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: yes
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 25, 2012, 10:52 PM
 
I agree with the premise that no one man is worth $347m, and that it is a shame that so much wealth is concentrated like that (even if the shares are not very liquid), I can't fault Apple for embracing Chinese manufacturing like so many other companies have. The factories are not going to return to this country, hoping otherwise or looking at competitors (who are no doubt doing the same) seems futile to me.
     
ort888
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Your Anus
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 25, 2012, 11:26 PM
 
Tim Cook didn't just sign up, he's been running the company for a long time now.

Everything we buy is made in China. Everything.

Apple just had the second most profitable quarter in the history of companies, so yes, someone deserves a lot of money. This is a free market economy, I agree that it sounds obscene, but hey, that's how the free market works. Tim Cook made a lot of people a lot of money and now he gets a butt ton of money.

Tim Cooks salary represents a tiny sliver of the companies profit. They have a 100 billion bucks in the bank.

Besides, that 370 million bucks is stock options that activate in 5 and 10 years. It really represents 10 years of salary.

And his 10 year salary only equates to about 3% of the profit Apple made in the last quarter alone.

Why am I responding to this nitwit?

My sig is 1 pixel too big.
     
The Godfather
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Tampa, Florida
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 25, 2012, 11:57 PM
 
Corporate governance is really missing here. Al Gore?

I doubt that was his last year's salary plus 4%. I bet Cook had a job offer for a third of a billion dollars at another company

Those Apple employees are among the least paid due to non-poaching agreements, yet that doesn't apply to top manager positions.

Socially responsible investment anyone?
     
imitchellg5
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Washington + Colorado
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 12:20 AM
 
Originally Posted by The Godfather View Post
Those Apple employees are among the least paid due to non-poaching agreements, yet that doesn't apply to top manager positions.
The lowest paid job at Apple is more than twice as high as federal minimum wage.
     
The Godfather
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Tampa, Florida
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 01:19 AM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
The lowest paid job at Apple is more than twice as high as federal minimum wage.
Through subcontractors they are effectively paying around a dollar per person-hour, in average.
     
chabig
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Las Vegas, NV, USA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 01:53 AM
 
See my next post.
     
chabig
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Jun 1999
Location: Las Vegas, NV, USA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 01:55 AM
 
I'm a shareholder, and Tim is worth $0.43 per share to me. It's money well spent.
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 03:35 AM
 
Originally Posted by liap View Post
Ok, so I am sure we can all agree no one man is worth $347 Million Dollars for just signing onto a company-not even doing any work yet.
Tim Cook has been with Apple for over 14 years, and he has been largely responsible for Apple's return to financial prosperity during that time.

Also, I can't make up my mind whether you're just a spammer trying to get page views for your spam signature or not: the post doesn't appear to be simply copied and pasted from elsewhere. What gives?
     
Waragainstsleep
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 09:29 AM
 
Lazy journalist trying to make a traffic-grabbing story write itself?
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
mduell
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Houston, TX
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 09:40 AM
 
Most of the $378MM is just accounting for the restricted stock units they gave him for the next 5-10 years. His actual ongoing salary just under a mil with a similarly sized performance bonus available.
     
Spheric Harlot
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: 888500128, C3, 2nd soft.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 09:58 AM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
Lazy journalist trying to make a traffic-grabbing story write itself?
The link in the sig (now hidden by the mods) was to a tech shopping site.
     
ort888
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Your Anus
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 10:45 AM
 
D'oh.

My sig is 1 pixel too big.
     
Eug
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Caught in a web of deceit.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 10:57 AM
 
I don't think anyone is worth a $370 million bonus, regardless of the size of the company.

Originally Posted by ort888 View Post
Besides, that 370 million bucks is stock options that activate in 5 and 10 years. It really represents 10 years of salary.
Uh no. These are not stock options, but actual restricted stock.

Why am I responding to this nitwit?
Harsh words, considering your stock option claim was false.
     
angelmb
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Automatic
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 11:04 AM
 
Everything we buy is made in China. Everything.
Not that 'we' can afford it but Tim on the other hand…

     
ort888
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Your Anus
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 11:12 AM
 
Bah. I just mistyped it. I knew it was real stock and not options.

I have mixed feelings on ridiculously large salaries.

I myself am a very frugal person who lives very modesty and doesn't really crave money... but it's hard to argue that Tim Cook probably isn't worth that much to the company. It sounds like a lot. It is a lot. It's obscene... but the results speak for themselves.

As a percentage of the companies performance, he's probably one of the lower paid CEOs out there.

We live in a free market capitalist country. You take the good with the bad.

If I made that much money I would go full on "Gates" with it and try to make the world a better place. If I ran Apple, I would make improving working conditions in the factories a million times better and push to make them better for everyone over there. I would pay all of the employees more. I would spread the success around.

That's why people like me don't run Apple. Because if I ran Apple, they would never have made it as far as they have.
( Last edited by ort888; Jan 26, 2012 at 11:38 AM. )

My sig is 1 pixel too big.
     
Waragainstsleep
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 11:33 AM
 
Its all about how you look at it. Is it worth spending $400M a year to generate $40B a year? Absolutely. How much less would they have made without him? Nobody knows. Someone has to take the responsibility for if it goes wrong, stands to reason he should take a lot of the credit/rewards when it goes right.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
shifuimam
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Somewhere in the Pacific Northwest
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 11:49 AM
 
Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton View Post
I definitely only bought macs up until now because of Steve Jobs' $1/year vow of poverty. Fortunately I won't need to buy any more macs, because the ones I already have will last basically forever.
You seriously think Jobs only got a dollar a year from Apple? He had bonuses, stock options, and other financial incentives.

Believe me, it was no vow of poverty.
     
Eug
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Caught in a web of deceit.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 11:50 AM
 
Regarding the China manufacturing thing.

I just bought a new centre channel for my living room, because my existing one was undersized and the drivers finally blew up. I wanted a Paradigm Center 3 because I like their price to performance value, my existing mains were Paradigm as well, the speaker size fit perfectly in my AV cabinet, and it was an added bonus that it was manufactured in my home province.

Well, no longer. They now subcontract assembly of their entry level speakers to China. (Not sure about their high end stuff.) I guess they felt they just could no longer compete price-wise at the low end, esp. when their direct competitors had already outsourced to China.

However, would I have paid more for locally made? Maybe a little bit. I paid $500 for the speaker. If it were say $520 and locally made, I wouldn't worry about the price premium much. What about $600? Nah.

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
Its all about how you look at it. Is it worth spending $400M a year to generate $40B a year?
Interestingly, that was the same argument used for Carly Fiorina and HP.

I guess the difference here is that Cook has been around in Apple for a long while and has already been running the day to day operations for a while. However, as a true independent CEO, I'd say he's still unproven. Remember, his stock bonus, although restricted, sets no performance requirements.
     
Waragainstsleep
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 11:54 AM
 
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
ort888
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Your Anus
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 11:54 AM
 
The performance requirement is built into the price of the stock. If he does well, the stock is worth more and if he screws up, the stock is worth less.

My sig is 1 pixel too big.
     
ort888
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Your Anus
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 11:57 AM
 
If I worked for Apple I think I would find this to be a pretty crappy reward for the company having this unbelievably run they've had in the last 5 years. (if this is in fact the only reward, who knows... but all of the reports I've heard is that, generally speaking, Apple employees aren't paid all that well, all things considered...)

My sig is 1 pixel too big.
     
Eug
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Caught in a web of deceit.
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 12:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by ort888 View Post
The performance requirement is built into the price of the stock. If he does well, the stock is worth more and if he screws up, the stock is worth less.
While I'm actually not a supporter of hardcore restrictions on such stock bonuses, I will have to say that your statement above is a bit of a copout. Why? because By most measures if the stock is $400 by the time his 10 year requirement is up, the stock would have performed crappily, not just by Apple's recent standards, but against the stock market at large.

However, if it's $400 in 2021, he will still have gotten a $400 million bonus, for such crappy performance.
     
The Godfather
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Tampa, Florida
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 02:03 PM
 
In this bull market, $400 AAPL in 2022 would be construed as a shameful loss of marketshare. But in reality, the world could go up like it is now, or have its own 2007.
     
jmiddel
Grizzled Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Land of Enchantment
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 26, 2012, 08:54 PM
 
How can one stay 'hungry and foolish' at that salary? That aside, I wouldn't much mind if tax rates were what they were under Eisenhower.
     
beb
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Kill Devil Hills, NC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jan 31, 2012, 04:43 PM
 
While I think Apple could take a stand against using child labor. The subcontractor could just lie or cause delays or have other issues just to be retaliatory to Apple for sticking its nose where it doesn't belong. The problem here isn't Apple. It is a human and workers rights problem with China. If China actually implemented some form of workers rights, many industries might move their manufacturing elsewhere. However, the bottom line is more important to the Chinese government than workers rights. And while this story gets play in the media for the human costs it takes in order to make an ipad, most Americans don't care. Why? Because many of us work 60 or more hours a week just to keep food on the table. As Americans, we are overstressed, overworked, have a healthcare system that charges us into our next lives for the most basic services rendered, and America is the only civilized country that gives no vacation time for its citizens. While I am apologetic to the plight of the Chinese worker, I am more concerned with poverty stateside, and the incompetence of our media to pick that ball up and run with it. So as long as the Duke MBA pays his taxes, I don't really care what he makes.
     
SSharon
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Teaneck, NJ
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 1, 2012, 05:53 PM
 
Why just the Apple employees? Doesn't Apple's wild profits prove that the products are overpriced and Apple could still make money even if they lowered their prices by 10% across the board?

Obviously as a company they are supposed to maximize profits, but then why give the employees a discount?
AT&T iPhone 5S and 6; 13" MBP; MDD G4.
     
ort888
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Your Anus
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 1, 2012, 05:55 PM
 
I read somewhere that if Apple's 97 billion dollar war chest were divided evenly amongst their employees, they would each get 6 million bucks.

If I worked for Apple I'd ask for a raise.

My sig is 1 pixel too big.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 1, 2012, 05:59 PM
 
$347M is not that uncommon.

I will earn that much as well.
Working for the next 3,000 years.
-t
     
Andy8
Mac Elite
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Hong Kong
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 1, 2012, 06:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by ort888 View Post
I read somewhere that if Apple's 97 billion dollar war chest were divided evenly amongst their employees, they would each get 6 million bucks.
What about AAPL shareholders?
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 1, 2012, 06:05 PM
 
Apple WILL start paying dividends in the next years. Mark my words.

-t
     
Waragainstsleep
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 1, 2012, 07:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by SSharon View Post
Why just the Apple employees? Doesn't Apple's wild profits prove that the products are overpriced and Apple could still make money even if they lowered their prices by 10% across the board?

Obviously as a company they are supposed to maximize profits, but then why give the employees a discount?
It is much easier to stay current and knowledable if you can afford to own at least some up to date kit for your own use.
I worked for a reseller for 5 years and couldn't afford a new Mac. The first year I was there I was running a 6 year old laptop that didn't have the oomph to run things like the latest iLife so advising customers how to use it was impossible for me to learn at home. The more products you use ad know, the better you can help with, advise on and sell them.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Salty
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Winnipeg, MB
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 04:35 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
Apple WILL start paying dividends in the next years. Mark my words.

-t
Hope not. Best thing Apple ever did was tell their share holders to suck it.
     
Big Mac
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 06:38 AM
 
How did Apple tell its shareholders to suck it?

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
The Godfather
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Tampa, Florida
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 06:45 AM
 
A corporations duty to make a profit for the shareholder ends when you have enough cash to not depend on your shareholders. There's no law compelling Apple or making it liable for not paying a dividend.
Apple's big account would do wonders towards the quality department, which has been lacking lately.
     
Big Mac
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 06:49 AM
 
No, a corporation's duty is always to deliver returns to its shareholders, which are its owners. Whether that translates to growth that delivers higher share price through higher share valuation or dividends is up to the corporation. There is no requirement to pay a dividend, that's true. But to say there's no duty to shareholders is a gross misunderstanding.

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
Waragainstsleep
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: UK
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 08:03 AM
 
Given the gains they have seen since this year alone, I can't see many shareholders will be complaining too much.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 10:08 AM
 
Originally Posted by Salty View Post
Hope not. Best thing Apple ever did was tell their share holders to suck it.
This doesn't make any sense at all.

Apple was never in a position like today, where they have billions in free cash flow, and no friggin' idea what to do with the money.

Once the growth slows down, a Dividend is the only thing that could potentially stabilize the stock, or prevent it from crashing.

-t
     
Big Mac
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 10:11 AM
 
Well the growth certainly isn't slowing down. Apple's even taking share back from Android. And Apple went on record as saying that the cash isn't sitting around burning a hole in Apple's pocket. I think and hope it's quite a stretch to say they have no friggin idea what to do with the money. And regarding your statement about the share price possibly crashing, Apple is already at a very low P/E ratio. The only way the price per share crashes is if we have another global economic meltdown, or perhaps if Apple brings back Jeff Goldblum for its commercials.

With that said, I agree that there will be dividend soon. It should be pretty modest (at least to start with), but unless Apple has some grand plans for all the profit it's raking in, shareholders should get that extra reward. However, one would hope that growth (and therefore share price growth) would remain the primary attraction of AAPL.
( Last edited by Big Mac; Feb 5, 2012 at 10:18 AM. )

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 10:21 AM
 
The growth can't stay like this forever. It's an exponential function. It's impossible to have those growth rates for the next 20 years.

-t
     
The Godfather
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Tampa, Florida
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 10:29 AM
 
Saving for a rainy day should be a sensible enough grand plan. Wouldn't you prefer long term stability over get-rich-quick investments?
     
Big Mac
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 10:35 AM
 
Are you talking personally or as a corporation? If you're talking personally, saving is good but not great in an environment where most fiat currencies are being consistently debased. If you're not executing on strategies to grow your wealth and get rich (hopefully sooner rather than later), you're losing out. Most governments are selling their citizens out, masking the destruction of their savings.

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 01:20 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Godfather View Post
Saving for a rainy day should be a sensible enough grand plan. Wouldn't you prefer long term stability over get-rich-quick investments?
Sure, some levels of cash is fine. But Apple's cash is just insane.

-t
     
The Godfather
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Tampa, Florida
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 5, 2012, 02:57 PM
 
In your peachy, the-world-is-never-gonna-triple-dip worldview, no one needs 100BN in their accounts.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 6, 2012, 09:59 AM
 
Originally Posted by The Godfather View Post
In your peachy, the-world-is-never-gonna-triple-dip worldview, no one needs 100BN in their accounts.
Right, I'm sure the triple-dip is why Apple keeps all that cash.

Or, much more likely, they don't know what to do with all that cash.

-t
     
ort888
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Your Anus
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 6, 2012, 10:11 AM
 
In related news, did you guys know that Apple is the only company that manufactures things in China. I read it on the internet.

My sig is 1 pixel too big.
     
mattyb
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Standing on the shoulders of giants
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 6, 2012, 10:34 AM
 
Warren Buffet's Berkshire Hathaway doesn't pay a dividend.
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Feb 6, 2012, 11:03 AM
 
LOL, it also hasn't gone anywhere in the last 5 years. Not exactly a growth stock.

-t
     
   
Thread Tools
 
Forum Links
Forum Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Top
Privacy Policy
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:26 AM.
All contents of these forums © 1995-2017 MacNN. All rights reserved.
Branding + Design: www.gesamtbild.com
vBulletin v.3.8.8 © 2000-2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.,