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English help: What does "deacon" mean?
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mindwaves
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Jul 18, 2016, 02:41 AM
 
Working on project and communicating with foreign associate who is versed in UK English, I suppose.

Project is about some legal issues and the foreign associate uses the word "Deacon" as a proper noun as a title of a person versed in the law or related field. What does "Deacon" mean, a lawyer?

edit: After a simple search, I find it is the name of a law firm. Please delete this thread.
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Waragainstsleep
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Jul 18, 2016, 07:02 AM
 
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
andi*pandi
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Jul 18, 2016, 01:44 PM
 
In this content drought of ours, we can't afford ta be deleting precious threads!

I thought it was a religious thing, to be a deacon of some church. I would be suspect of any law firm with a name like Deacon.

Not as bad as Wolfram and Hart, but you know, suspicious...
     
Cap'n Tightpants
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Jul 18, 2016, 11:57 PM
 
^^ I just realized that my anger towards Fox for cancelling Angel still hasn't completely subsided. At least the subsequent comics, seasons 6 & 7, were really good.
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subego
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Jul 19, 2016, 05:53 AM
 
I remember thinking the last season of Angel was building to be one of the best things on television ever... then about halfway to what it was clearly building to, it was over. WTF?
     
Waragainstsleep
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Jul 19, 2016, 06:11 AM
 
Yeah Angel had a couple of episodes left when they found out it was axed. It shows.

Deacon is also a boy's name. Ted "Theodore" Logan's little brother was called Deacon I think.
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subego
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Jul 19, 2016, 06:19 AM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
Yeah Angel had a couple of episodes left when they found out it was axed. It shows.
That actually makes me feel a little better. I thought Joss did it as a **** you. "Oh... I get one more season, do I?"
     
osiris
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Jul 19, 2016, 08:58 AM
 
I grew up thinking that a Deacon was a lower level priest at church. The kind that could give out the host, say mass, but when it came to the big guy priests came first. So I would take Deacon as a legal representative of a higher authority, but not quite the same thing.
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subego
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Jul 19, 2016, 09:05 AM
 
"Legal representative of a higher authority" sounds like a Rabbi.
     
osiris
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Jul 19, 2016, 10:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
"Legal representative of a higher authority" sounds like a Rabbi.
I think Hebrew National used it too.
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reader50
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Jul 19, 2016, 02:08 PM
 
It would be a cool name for a villain.

"Take cover. The Deacon is coming."
     
andi*pandi
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Jul 19, 2016, 02:12 PM
 
Or some kind of vigilante dark hero. "The Deacon takes out the trash."
     
subego
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Jul 19, 2016, 02:16 PM
 
I immediately thought of The Bishop.
     
mindwaves  (op)
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Jul 21, 2016, 05:31 AM
 
Another English question, I am reading a report and it involves comparing 3 numbers, A and B and C.

A is far less than B.
C is even farther less than B.

Is "even farther less" grammatically correct? The guy who wrote it is a lawyer, so I want to be careful of whose toes I step on.
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Waragainstsleep
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Jul 21, 2016, 07:59 AM
 
It might be clearer to say A is a smaller number than B, C is much smaller (or considerably smaller) than B.

Better yet you'd say A is smaller than B, C is smaller than A.

You might use lower instead of smaller if there is a chance any of these numbers could be negative.
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andi*pandi
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Jul 21, 2016, 08:03 AM
 
farther to me implies distance, so I wouldn't use it in this instance.
     
osiris
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Jul 21, 2016, 08:17 AM
 
Originally Posted by andi*pandi View Post
farther to me implies distance, so I wouldn't use it in this instance.
Unless you're in Boston, and your Farther wants you home from the bah.
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subego
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Jul 21, 2016, 11:19 AM
 
Is it "tow the line" or "toe the line"?
     
andi*pandi
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Jul 21, 2016, 11:45 AM
 
Toe the line. put your toesies on the line and stay put.
     
subego
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Jul 21, 2016, 11:58 AM
 
I always thought it was "tow the line attached to that barge".

To make it even more complicated, I've heard people use "toe the line" to describe someone who comes right up to the line and is all "neener neener neener... can't catch me because I haven't crossed the line, just gotten annoyingly close!"
     
andi*pandi
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Jul 21, 2016, 12:20 PM
 
Come up with the rest of us and stand with your toes on the line, stand united with us.

As opposed to the line in the sand, which is for taunting, crossing, being annoying.

barge? what?
     
subego
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Jul 21, 2016, 12:57 PM
 
Well, barges don't have motors, so they have to be towed.

In ye olden days, nothing had motors, so you'd have people, or more likely horses, towing the barge up the river. The banks of rivers would have towpaths, because horses make lousy swimmers.

But there are lots of circumstances where you have something which needs to be towed, you attach a line to it to do so, and then "tow the line".

Regardless of whether it's correct, one of the things I like about it is it implies effort.
     
osiris
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Jul 21, 2016, 01:18 PM
 
that's interesting, toe and tow actually work for a similar analogy. knowledge is good!
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andi*pandi
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Jul 21, 2016, 01:48 PM
 
The meaning is very different though.

Tow the line means "do the work"

Toe the line means "Stand with us, conform"

ha, wiki sides with me!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toe_the_line
     
subego
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Jul 21, 2016, 02:11 PM
 
I would expect wiki to tow the line.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Jul 21, 2016, 02:40 PM
 
Conform is a more concise description I suppose. Stand with us makes it sound like an attempt at motivation "Get off your butt and stand with us". I always thought it had more of an anti-rebellious overtone: "Stop being disruptive and follow the party line on this issue".
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
osiris
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Jul 21, 2016, 02:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by andi*pandi View Post
The meaning is very different though.

Tow the line means "do the work"

Toe the line means "Stand with us, conform"

ha, wiki sides with me!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toe_the_line
hmm, I always understand Toe The Line as "Stand with us, conform, and do the work with us."

but no matter... I gotta run now to Tow and/or Toe the line for someone.
cheers
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subego
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Jul 21, 2016, 02:57 PM
 
I guess "the line", which is the same line as "the company line" or the "the party line" makes more sense as a line of people, but I must admit I never really thought that's what that metaphor meant either.

Not that I ever came up with a better substitute.
     
Cap'n Tightpants
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Jul 21, 2016, 03:41 PM
 
On a ship crews were often told by the captain or first mate to "toe the plank", which was an actual line on the deck, and stand alert. Usually while he gave instructions (or a sound tongue-lashing).
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Waragainstsleep
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Jul 21, 2016, 08:09 PM
 
I always thought the line in question was the company or party position on a given subject. So members would be told "If a reporter asks you if we are in favour the war, tell them yes". The guy not toeing the line would be the one saying he wasn't in favour of the war.

That said I always used to think it was tow the line too. I think it was a discussion here that alerted me to the notion I might be incorrect. But from the context it usually made more sense to me that way. Drag the same line as the rest of us, so to speak.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
mattyb
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Aug 11, 2016, 06:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
Damn that brings back some good memories.

= = = = = = = = =

When I was really young, being called a Deacon (or a Joey) was an insult, after this guy from a popular kids TV show.
     
   
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