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Black Jack
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SamuraiDL
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May 22, 2004, 09:45 PM
 
I can now say I know what it feels like to loose $480 in 90 minutes...
     
Apple Pro Underwear
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May 22, 2004, 09:48 PM
 
sucka

you need to set limits. never lose more than say $150 in an hour or something like that depending on your funds.



personally, i would have left my friends at the casino and used my $500 on liquor and strippers
     
todrain
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May 22, 2004, 11:27 PM
 
Yep, i was in Vegas for work a couple of months ago, and lost like that too... I never saw so many 13s in my life!
     
djohnson
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May 22, 2004, 11:33 PM
 
That is why I don't gamble. I would wind up loosing all my hard earned money!
     
Xeo
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May 23, 2004, 12:08 AM
 
Black Jack is one of the games you have control over. I've just started to read and am trying to learn more about the counting strategies.
     
mitchell_pgh
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May 23, 2004, 12:25 AM
 
Originally posted by Xeo:
Black Jack is one of the games you have control over. I've just started to read and am trying to learn more about the counting strategies.
Well, it's one of the few games without constant randomization. When you spin a roulette wheel, the odds of hitting green is just as good as hitting any other number.

with black jack, you "use" cards up, so you can better predict what's coming in the next hand (counting cards etc. etc).

Plus, the game is simple enough that there is a small learning curve for basic play.
     
SamuraiDL  (op)
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May 23, 2004, 03:08 AM
 
yeah totally, ive never lost like that before.
     
The Placid Casual
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May 23, 2004, 05:13 AM
 
Black Jack is my game of choice... I was taught by a lawyer friend of mine and have never looked back!

If you truly know what you are doing, you should not lose.

The last 10 visits to the casino, I have played Black Jack for on average 4 hours on each occasion, and only finished 'down' once... the biggest won was well over 200 from a starting stake of 20. The loss was 10 on a 20 starting stake.

I never, ever touch any of the other more 'random' games...
     
Kilbey
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May 23, 2004, 09:55 AM
 
Personally, I like the video black jack and video poker machines built into the bar tops at Vegas. $0.25 a hand plus free drinks the entire time I sit there. I usually drop about $10 an hour and drink way more than that in "free" drinks.

Plus you meet some of the most interesting people doing this. The bar tenders are always willing to talk about the various casinos and where to go for an even better time.

But the big secret is tipping. You HAVE to tip the wait staff.
     
Patrick
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May 23, 2004, 01:01 PM
 
Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
with black jack, you "use" cards up, so you can better predict what's coming in the next hand (counting cards etc. etc).
Don't casinos these days use several decks of cards at each table? I'd think that would make it more difficult to make any predictions. Still possible, though.
     
Xeo
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May 23, 2004, 01:16 PM
 
Originally posted by Patrick:
Don't casinos these days use several decks of cards at each table? I'd think that would make it more difficult to make any predictions. Still possible, though.
It doesn't make it more difficult, but it gives your overall edge less. See, black jack starts out as a game where the house has a pretty large edge over you, something like 3-5% IIRC, if you play the same rules as the dealer. That's why those playing that strategy, thinking it's a way to break even, will lose their money. Playing basic strategy, a non-counting system, will give you just about even edge over the dealer, although he or she still has just a bit. But the various counting systems, depending on house rules of the casino, will give you a 1-1.5% edge over the casino. On a single deck game, your edge might be something like 3%. I don't remember the numbers exactly, just quoting from memory. But in general, having the edge means in the long run you will win more than you lose.

If everyone had that kind of edge, the game wouldn't even be played. It's like if the slots paid out more than they won. They just wouldn't have em. But since a vast majority of players don't play by any system, or at the very least, play by basic strategy, then the casinos make money at it. And when they find a counter, they take 'em down one at a time and eject 'em from the casino. But if you learn how to put on a show, they won't notice you're counting and you'll still walk away with their money.

I've never put a counting system to use at a casino. I've been reading and practicing thus far, but it's all rather fascinating to me and that's why I'm learning.
     
Randman
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May 23, 2004, 01:57 PM
 
Having lived in Las Vegas and spent many an hour (and $$) at the blackjack tables, there is a great deal of difference between how many decks are in the shoe. 1 deck is almost not worth it.
Playing with more than 2 decks is usually a sign that you should just hand your money over (the more decks, the more the odds slip to the house's favor and the harder it is to keep track of what's playing.
Almost as important, if not more, is the people at the table. Blackjack is a team sport. Sometimes you gotta take one for the team.
Biggest night was taking $200 and walking out with almost $5,000 . Quickest loss was $500 on one hand

Also, I hate machines that do the shuffling. Evil things.

This is a computer-generated message and needs no signature.
     
Talk2Angus
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May 24, 2004, 10:49 AM
 
Black Jack is one of the games you have control over.
TALK2U Soon
Angus Pohl
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scaught
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May 24, 2004, 11:07 AM
 
1. i see more and more of the "continuous auto shufflers" at the tables. the dealer puts the stack of "used cards" back into the shuffler (with the rest of the cards) after EVERY hand and they are immediately reshuffled back through the deck. this makes counting, or even just a basic feel for how many face cards have ben played pretty useless.

2. it is certainly all about who else is playing at the table with you. people need to play like theyre supposed to. dont take a bunch of hits when the dealer has a 6 showing. etc.


having said all that, the message was delivered to me by a dealer named "krishna" at harrahs in reno. he said "the game always beats you".

i dont play that much.
     
Turias
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May 24, 2004, 11:18 AM
 
Originally posted by scaught:
2. it is certainly all about who else is playing at the table with you. people need to play like theyre supposed to. dont take a bunch of hits when the dealer has a 6 showing. etc.
It shouldn't matter. In fact, it would probably be better if everyone before you hits like crazy on a 6. It gives you more information about what cards have been played and should allow you to make an even more informed decision after counting.
     
euchomai
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May 24, 2004, 12:18 PM
 
Originally posted by scaught:
2. it is certainly all about who else is playing at the table with you. people need to play like theyre supposed to. dont take a bunch of hits when the dealer has a 6 showing. etc.
The odds don't change at all when people around you hit different than your philosophy says. It is still a statistical numbers game, no effect on you. (This is from the poker pros on "World Blackjack Tour". They debunked this myth this week.
...
     
dcolton
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May 24, 2004, 12:53 PM
 
Originally posted by euchomai:
The odds don't change at all when people around you hit different than your philosophy says. It is still a statistical numbers game, no effect on you. (This is from the poker pros on "World Blackjack Tour". They debunked this myth this week.
Got a link for that. Go to a table where there are a lot of novice players that don't follow the basic rules (hitting a 16 when the dealer shows a bust card). Now imagine if that same novice player is on 3rd base. it does make a difference.

I used to play BJ quite a bit, and from my experience, the better the table, the better chances of winning.

Here is a simple counting method by the way. There are a number of methods, and some don't like this method, but it works for me :

K, Q, J, 10, 9 = +
3, 4, 5, 6, 7, = -

A's, 2's, and 8's are neither + or - (You can add 8 to + and 2 to - if you want)

Everytime you see a = card, you add one. Everytime you see a - card you subtract 1.

So:

If the table has showing:
K 5 J 9 7 8 Q Q 6 5
1 -1 1 1 -1 0 1 1 -1 -1 = +1

or count as you go
1 0 1 2 1 1 2 3 2 1

If the deck is way positive (lot of high cards played), I bet higher. There is more of a chance for the dealer to get a bust card and there is more of a chance for you to be able to double down or get a good hit.

If the deck is way negative, I decrease my bet. More of a chance for the dealer to have a face card under and more of a chance for you to bust. It also increases the chances of the dealer having 18 or higher.

I didn;t think that counting this way would make any difference. But, you will find that it actually works does make a small difference if you can keep up. It isn't the tell tale way to get rich off of BJ, but it does increase your odds if you have an ideal of what is going on.
( Last edited by dcolton; May 24, 2004 at 02:18 PM. )
     
scaught
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May 24, 2004, 01:06 PM
 
Originally posted by Turias:
It shouldn't matter. In fact, it would probably be better if everyone before you hits like crazy on a 6. It gives you more information about what cards have been played and should allow you to make an even more informed decision after counting.
well. it is all "random" assuming everything else is in line.

i dont know. maybe its just one of my stuperstitions.
     
Turias
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May 24, 2004, 02:03 PM
 
Originally posted by scaught:
well. it is all "random" assuming everything else is in line.

i dont know. maybe its just one of my stuperstitions.
But unless the dealer uses 8 decks and shuffles after each and every hand, it's not random. It's this lack of randomness that allows really good blackjack players to up their odds of winning to slightly over 50%.
     
Randman
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May 24, 2004, 02:16 PM
 
Play every hand assuming the dealer has a "10" that he or she is not showing and play accordingly.

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euchomai
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May 24, 2004, 02:51 PM
 
Originally posted by dcolton:
Got a link for that.


This one...
Top Blackjack Myths
Gambling Times Article
Casino Odds Site

It's actually quite a proven fact out there.
...
     
Turias
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May 24, 2004, 03:06 PM
 
How about some good links to card counting strategies?
     
euchomai
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May 24, 2004, 03:53 PM
 
Originally posted by Turias:
How about some good links to card counting strategies?
This is the best thing here! linkey



Blackjack card counter, you keep it in your pocket. They have strategy on their site too.
...
     
dcolton
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May 24, 2004, 03:59 PM
 
Originally posted by euchomai:
This is the best thing here! linkey



Blackjack card counter, you keep it in your pocket. They have strategy on their site too.
Get caught with a device, count on getting banned from the casino
     
   
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