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soul sauce · Jan 20, 2001, 10:14 AM

Please help... I'm having problems with frequent crashes on my imac DVSE (400/128/13GB, on 9.0.4.) Norton utilites 5.0 tells me some OS files are fragmented, ie catalog BTree, Desktop DF, Finder, HD library, and a couple of Base OS extensions. Having had problems with the catalog BTree before, I know I"m in trouble.(however I dont actually know what this BTree is!?).I cant boot from the Norton CD, because I dont have the original ; )..Nor do I have means to Back-up yet....I'm working through the extensions (by halves) to eliminate coflicts, but I know my mac wont be happy till its HD Is fully defragmented..What should I do............

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Soul Sauce
Mac Addict

WDL · Jan 20, 2001, 12:45 PM

Don't know about your other problems, but Norton was always reporting "b-tree" problems on two
Macs with two different operating systems - would "choose to fix" - it would fix - run it again and it
would report the problem(s) again. After a while, I just ignored these messages because everything
was running stable and smooth.

Quit using Norton a couple of years ago - went to TechTool Pro (latest version 3.0.2 - Micromat) and
DiskWarrior 2.0.2 (there's a later update for those going to 9.1 - Alsoft).

Smooth sailing and reliability since.

WDL

soul sauce · Jan 20, 2001, 02:10 PM

Thanks WDL...I'll checkout TTPro and DW, and see what they have to say.. Bit of a cash flow problem, so I'm hoping I can find a demo out there..Do you happen to know what the B-Tree is/does..Thanks again

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Soul Sauce
Mac Addict

P · Jan 20, 2001, 02:50 PM

The B-tree is part of the system that keeps track of your files on the disk. It's not a file per se.

You can fix this with Norton 5, but it'll take some work. You need to have both the OS and Norton itself on a disk other than the main one. You can have it on two disks, if you wish, but neither can be the one you're repairing.

If you have a CD-burner, you can make such a CD quite easily. Install OS 9 and Norton on a Disk image, then burn this to a CD. If you don't, you can boot from a OS 9 CD and have Norton (including the "Shared lib" on a RAM disk or something)

Anyway, when you have this setup, you can have Norton Disk Doctor fix the disk and Speed Disk defragment it. It will work much better this way.

soul sauce · Jan 20, 2001, 04:11 PM

Cheers P, No burner as yet, so I'll give your advise a go...So install Norton inc shared lib on to a Ram disk, and boot from the OS9 CD, and then I can run Norton from Ram disk to defragment my hard disk. Top...A bit confused how the extention will run from the ram disk but it sounds like you speak with experience.Cheers again...........

yoyo52 · Jan 20, 2001, 05:00 PM

Stick to DiskWarrior for this--it's a guaranteed fix for what ails your poor Mac

Gregory · Jan 20, 2001, 05:41 PM

Norton 6 seems okay so far but I can't say the same for NU 5 as it caused problems or if there was a problem, made it worse. And if you run DW first, then NU 5 it really could hose a drive. Stick to DW and when you need to maybe Nu 6. DW 2.1 was announced so maybe you can download and get 2.1 also.

Backup first. Firewire disk drive? No guaranteees. Initialize and clean install after that. no utility is perfect, only enough to let you get your files backed up and stuff.

Greg

Jan 21, 2001, 03:40 PM

I've had good experience so far with NU 6.0, including repairs of B-tree problems and fixing a problem caused by OSXBeta that left an HFS standard Partition rendered "invisible" in OS9.x

NU 6.0 seems a pretty good piece of software, though everyone seems to agree that disk-specific issues are best dealt with by DiskWarrior. Too bad they don't have an educational version.

Jan 21, 2001, 03:45 PM

I was having problems like this a few days ago, and I didn't own any disk utils (Disk First Aid always worked for me), so I bought Norton SystemWorks (the store didnt have utils) and I started up off the included CD. A half-hour later, and my Mac is running better than ever!

soul sauce · Jan 22, 2001, 07:00 AM

Thanks very much people..lots of advise... I ran Norton from a Ram disk, whilst booted from the Apple OS9 CD, this defragmented many of the original OS files, hurrah, everthing but the BTree....Arghhh.......I plan to test drive Disk Warrior, it sounds like that'll fix it, but GREG, you say if I run both this could 'hose' my Hard drive.. Is this a bad thing, ie do you mean they conflict with each other or that my Hard drive will not be pleased with this much attention from two Utilites..... Having had some problems recently I plan to buy a CD burner for back-up, I fancy the Que Drive CDRW,(cash permiting the Firewire version), any feedback on this would further help........Thanks again all....

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Soul Sauce
Mac Addict

oscar · Jan 22, 2001, 09:21 AM

Disk First Aid should help, if not fix it
Its been on every os install cd for years

Gregory · Jan 22, 2001, 09:28 AM

What I said and echoed by others - don't let Norton 5.03 touch your drive. Don't use Norton after running Disk Warrior at least until a reboot. Norton 6 seems fine, even great, and has an improved set of optimization routines (faster, does 80% of the files). And Norton 6 and Disk Warrior get along.

Noron 4 and 5 were junk. The Norton CrashGuard which users said was junk was finally admitted to by Symantec and killed. Good grief their techs use to be the best, bought out their competition, and luckily they have gotten better but also spawned competition - TechTool Pro 3.02 and Disk Warrior.

Gregory

soul sauce · Jan 22, 2001, 01:55 PM

Cheers Gregory for confirming that, I'm on the lookout for DW and an update for Norton..Thanks Oscar, I always run First Aid prior to any other utility, in this case First Aid didnt even recognise the fragmented BTree catalog. Should First Aid have pick-up on these problems..?................

[This message has been edited by soul sauce (edited 01-23-2001).]

Fredo · Jan 22, 2001, 03:28 PM

It would be wise of you to purchase all three main utility brands, Norton, http://www.symantec.com/ TechTool Pro, http://www.micromat.com/ and DiskWarrior, http://www.alsoft.com/
You can run them all together, someone said in one of these fora to run your most recent one last.
And remember, when running your iMac's Disk First Aid, either run it by booting from your OS disk, or run it with extensions off. (Hold down shift key at startup) Otherwise you'll freeze trying to run it. Good luck, and welcome to MacNN!

[This message has been edited by Fredo (edited 01-22-2001).]

soul sauce · Jan 23, 2001, 06:25 PM

Cheers for the links Fredo, and the advise...

penfold · Jan 25, 2001, 03:34 PM

I've tried Norton products, and in my experience, DiskWarrior is the best - since I got a copy, my HD has been as happy as larry - any problems and I boot from CD with DiskWarrior on - and it repairs it.

An excellent app., well worth the money