[reader50]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker 

So did Roslin say that "Baltar will have a trial and be found GUILTY"?

A showtrial is a bit off character for Roslin for me especially when no real justice is served by a mock trial.

I noticed this too. It bothered me somewhat, though to her credit, she didn't say what the punishment would be - which would depend on how guilty he was, and of which charges.

One could argue that it's obvious to everyone that Baltar is in fact guilty of a few items, with others unclear.

• Negligence during office, he let the military go to a weak condition in orbit while a threat remained.
• Failure to fulfill the terms of his Presidential Oath. If those terms have legal binding force (likely - military oaths of office certainly do) then Baltar didn't protect the sovereignty of the Colonies with every fiber of his being. He surrendered without a shot being fired, and did nothing to support and build the Resistance. He just sat around, drank a lot, and sacked out with Caprica Six. Oh yes, he whined and complained to the Cylons regularly.
• Left his post when the evacuation did finally happen. He chose to evacuate with the enemy, abandoning his office. That looks like defection, and dereliction of duty. Caveat: the Colonials may not know that Baltar went with the Cylons voluntarily; he could have been removed at gunpoint. We the audience know he went voluntarily. Note: Gaeta almost certainly heard the relevant conversation, but the camera angles don't confirm that beyond doubt - I couldn't see Gaeta (arrive?) until just after that conversation. It's implied that he had to be listening and waiting for the moment to jump in.
• Bad judgement, settling on a world when the Cylon fleet had been fairly close. However, bad judgement may not be a legally enforceable term.
• Helping the Cylons afterwards, with tips on finding Earth. That would be conspiring with them directly against the Fleet's objectives.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

I normally hate courtroom battle episodes, it could easily go on for several episodes also.

The one episode I didn't like in Season 1 was that court one.

[Millennium]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker 

So did Roslin say that "Baltar will have a trial and be found GUILTY"?

A showtrial is a bit off character for Roslin for me especially when no real justice is served by a mock trial.

Just because the verdict is a foregone conclusion doesn't mean it's a mock trial. It's more or less the same as the Nuremburg hearings, the trials of Slobodan Milosevic and Saddam Hussein, and similar situations: there's no chance of a not-guilty verdict, but that doesn't make the trial meaningless.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by Millennium 

Just because the verdict is a foregone conclusion doesn't mean it's a mock trial. It's more or less the same as the Nuremburg hearings, the trials of Slobodan Milosevic and Saddam Hussein, and similar situations: there's no chance of a not-guilty verdict, but that doesn't make the trial meaningless.

I think it is just done to give the illusion of a fair trial and justice when what they really want to do is just hang him.

I mean what the hell good did Saddam's trial do?

[OreoCookie]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker 

I mean what the hell good did Saddam's trial do?

It exposes the truth. And this was really one of the weaknesses of Hussein's trial: instead of covering all of his reign, they focussed on one aspect, found him guilty and then killed him.

Ok, no need to sidetrack the discussion, but I think it's beneficiary to decide on a verdict logically. Neither the victims nor former beneficiaries should determine the verdict, but stick to law as it is instead.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie 

Ok, no need to sidetrack the discussion, but I think it's beneficiary to decide on a verdict logically. Neither the victims nor former beneficiaries should determine the verdict, but stick to law as it is instead.

I'm cool with the trial and all I just thought it was really out of character for Roslyn to say he will be found guilty as she usually follows the rules/laws.

She is taking Baltar very personally and it shows.

[SirCastor]

Baltar is of course not going to be executed. As Gaeta said at some point earlier in the season, Baltar has a knack for ensuring his own survival. I imagine that Baltar's going to have further use for getting to Earth.

There's also the possibility (and I wouldn't be surprised) if Baltar were found not-guilty (not to be confused with innocent) on a technicality. Or possibly, there will be a mistrial because of the problems in the fleet over the trial itself.

Does the general populace of the fleet know that Baltar's Alive?

[scottiB]

Originally Posted by SirCastor 

Does the general populace of the fleet know that Baltar's Alive?

No. And also knows nothing of Caprica6.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by SirCastor 

There's also the possibility (and I wouldn't be surprised) if Baltar were found not-guilty (not to be confused with innocent) on a technicality. Or possibly, there will be a mistrial because of the problems in the fleet over the trial itself.

I wouldn't be surprised if he actually turns against humanity because of the trial and turns to help the cylons purposely.

Apparently season 4 is another huge story shift so I wonder what it is.

[Eug]

Has BSG already been officially picked up for season 4?

[ort888]

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/31565

13 Episodes for season 4. Not official yet...

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by Eug 

Has BSG already been officially picked up for season 4?

I don't think it is official but a given as the season 3 finale wasn't filmed with a conclusion of the whole story and they already talked of what they are doing for season 4.

[Eug]

Hmmm... Hot off the presses today too. Thanks:

The Times also is confirming that a major character will be unmasked as a Cylon before the end of the season. And if my BSG mole is to be believed, it's not Starbuck.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Eug 

Hmmm... Hot off the presses today too. Thanks:

Doc Cottle!

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by Eug 

Hmmm... Hot off the presses today too. Thanks:

Linkie?

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker 

Linkie?

ort's link above links to a TV Guide post from a TV Guide writer.

Direct link here: TV Guide Community: Best <i>Battlestar</i> News Ever!

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by Eug 

ort's link above links to a TV Guide post from a TV Guide writer.

Direct link here: TV Guide Community: Best <i>Battlestar</i> News Ever!

Wait why only 13 episodes?

[Peter]

isn't 13 episodes half a season? ?!

[Millennium]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker 

Wait why only 13 episodes?

My guess is that they've only released details for the first half. This series seems to have a... thing... about splitting its seasons into halves.

[Eug]

I think BSG's biggest season is 20 episodes. The first season was 13 episodes.

EDIT:

Here is that LA Times Article: "At least 13 new episodes will be produced this summer for a premiere next January."

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by Eug 

I think BSG's biggest season is 20 episodes. The first season was 13 episodes.

It is but that is rather typical for first seasons to be shorter as it is a test run.

They shouldn't have 13 episodes for the 4th season when 2 and 3 were 20 each.

I'm guessing they are doing the half season things again.

[SirCastor]

Maybe they're just planning on winding down on 13 seasons. Seeing as where we are in BSG, I wouldn't be upset if the story were wrapped up at the end of season 4 and the series retired...

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by SirCastor 

Maybe they're just planning on winding down on 13 seasons. Seeing as where we are in BSG, I wouldn't be upset if the story were wrapped up at the end of season 4 and the series retired...

It could also be that the Studio is nervous about buying a full forth season and doesn't want to make such a big budget commitment so is playing it by ear and buying in two parts if it works out.

I remember some shows like Earth 2, Seaquest and Space Above and beyond getting canceled super quickly so they either they never got to make part 2 to the cliffhanger or had to wrap up some sort of ending last minute half assed ending. I'm still bothered by the cliffhanger final episodes of Earth 2 and Space AAB. Does anyone else remember how they ended?

[ort888]

Battlestar Galactica is a billion times more popular than any of those shows though. I'm sure they will have a proper ending. I would hope so anyway.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker 

Wait why only 13 episodes?

Studios often order fewer episodes than are actually needed at first, even if they fully intend to order more later. It has something to do with the way pay-or-play contracts work, as I understand it. They could suddenly decide to axe a show no matter how many episodes they'd commissioned — heck, I think Firefly was cancelled just a couple of weeks after the network ordered five more episodes.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by Eug 

[spoiler]Where did you see the ratings? I haven't seen them. I'm not surprised the ratings are declining though.

" Sundays, the science-fiction show's episodes have averaged 1.7 million viewers overall and 1.1 viewers ages 18 to 49, the key demographic targeted by advertisers."

http://www.latimes.com/entertainment...ck=1&cset=true

Star Trek Enterprise had higher numbers but it was considered horrible still. Then again this is the best thing to happen to space so I hope they consider the cost worth it.

Anyone know how much each episode costs?

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker 

" Sundays, the science-fiction show's episodes have averaged 1.7 million viewers overall and 1.1 viewers ages 18 to 49, the key demographic targeted by advertisers."

Bear in mind that we're talking about Sci-Fi Channel. They're not expecting as many viewers as the major networks. 1.7 million is a failure for network TV, but Galactica's all-time high was only 2.4 million (equally pathetic by network standards), if I recall.

[ort888]

Plus DVD sales and syndication, which is usually how these shows make most of their money.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

Bear in mind that we're talking about Sci-Fi Channel. They're not expecting as many viewers as the major networks. 1.7 million is a failure for network TV, but Galactica's all-time high was only 2.4 million (equally pathetic by network standards), if I recall.

Yep, that is the only thing keeping it on the air. It was partly their own fault though for airing it 6 months later in other parts of the world and for those confusing mid season breaks that last 4 months.

"The decision comes after the series' successful move to a new 10 p.m. timeslot on Sundays. Since moving, Battlestar Galactica's audience has grown over its third-season average by 8 percent in total viewers, by double digits in female viewers, by 19 percent in the show's target demographic of adults aged 18-49 and by 14 percent in adults 25-54. The Jan. 28 episode, "Taking a Break From All Your Worries," delivered 2.5 million total viewers and 1.6 million adults 18-49, the largest audience for any episode since the season-two premiere."
SCI FI Wire | The News Service of the SCI FI Channel

[Dale Sorel]

OK, so in the podcast Moore says, "Look at Racetrack out of uniform. Racetrack out of uniform looks fantastic!" So I did a little searching and found this:



Yow!

You can see much more here.

[SirCastor]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker 

I remember some shows like Earth 2, Seaquest and Space Above and beyond getting canceled super quickly so they either they never got to make part 2 to the cliffhanger or had to wrap up some sort of ending last minute half assed ending. I'm still bothered by the cliffhanger final episodes of Earth 2 and Space AAB. Does anyone else remember how they ended?

In the case of Earth 2, there was no resolution. The producers were concerned about the show getting cancelled, so they wrote a cliff-hanger in an effort to force the studio's hand to renew. It didn't work. I enjoyed that show quite a bit as well, unfortunately, the show had already taken a turn for the worse. Changes in plot lines, character behaviors and some of the show's really interesting elements had been pushed strongly by NBC execs...

[reader50]

Originally Posted by SciFi General News

SCI FI Channel announced that it has renewed its Peabody-winning original series Battlestar Galactica, ordering 13 new episodes.

Originally Posted by SciFi BSG Section News

SCI FI renews Battlestar Galactica for a fourth season, ordering at least 13 episodes.

Interesting differance between the two locations. I don't know who has control of each site section, but I hope the BSG section is more accurate. ie - the door remains open for a full 20-ep season. In addition to the direct-to-DVD BSG movie covering the gap between Season 3 and Season 4.

[Oversoul]

If the start date for Season 4 is January 2008, would there even be room for a full 20 episode season, should Scifi decide to order 7 more? Doesn't look too good.

Scifi's usually premiered their 20 episode seasons in summer or fall and continues them into the next spring (summer premiere for the Stargates (which have 20 episodes) and a fall premiere for this season's BSG).

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by Oversoul 

If the start date for Season 4 is January 2008, would there even be room for a full 20 episode season, should Scifi decide to order 7 more? Doesn't look too good.

Yes. That's how 24 works every year.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

Yes. That's how 24 works every year.

Well, this year on 24 they've had three 2 hour episodes already.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

I think Gaita could be a Cylon (if it isn't Starbuck or Baltar) as they haven't developed his character much so we don't know enough about him to be sure he isn't.

[ort888]

What about Roslynn's old assistant Billy?

Helo could be a cylon. That would throw a wrench in the works, since the baby would be 100% cylon.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by ort888 

What about Roslynn's old assistant Billy?

Well they killed the character because the actor wanted off the show so they wouldn't bring him back to make him an important Cylon Character.

Plus Billy was a wimp so nobody would take it seriously, not to mention the writers said "A MAIN character" and Billy nor Doc Cottle are main ones.

[ort888]

Saul Tigh would be interesting.

[OreoCookie]

Nah, that won't fit, really.
Didn't they say that the last five Cylons are a taboo? It would be strange to find out that they are working for the humans and against their own kind.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by ort888 

Saul Tigh would be interesting.

Wouldn't make any sense though and be more of a downer.

Whoever this Cylon is they can't keep them around after they know the truth.

Tight also HATES Cylons to his core and we love seeing him fight them. If found out he was one of them he would prob off himself.

When D'Anna said sorry to one of the final 5 it could have been because she saw Gaita and during the occupation worked closely with him and done some not so nice things.

[Lateralus]

Having Adama be a Cylon would ruin the show. Roslin wouldn't work. Tight doesn't click either. Starbuck would be too obvious.

Having Lee be a Cylon could work. And it'd give another reason for why the Cylons were able to find New Caprica.

[ort888]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie 

Nah, that won't fit, really.
Didn't they say that the last five Cylons are a taboo? It would be strange to find out that they are working for the humans and against their own kind.

I don't think it would be that strange at all. I'm pretty much expecting it actually.

It would make sense if the other 5 hated the rest of the cylons.

How can Lee be a cylon if his dad is not?

A safe, and probably too obvious choice, would be Saul's wife.

More boring choices are Geata, Lee's wife, Starbucks hubby, or Zerek.

[goMac]

Could the Six in Balar's head be his ultimate defense? He could plead insanity, and escape a guilty verdict.

[reader50]

Chances of being a Cylon.

Felix Gaeta Possible, but he served with Adama 3 years before the attack. So far, we only know of Cylons infiltrating the colonies 2 years before the attack.
Adm Adama Zip. He was in the first Cylon war, long before the humanoid Cylons were created.
Col Tigh Zip. In the first Cylon war too.
Laura Roslin Zip. Was in politics 20 years before the attack, with President Adar's campaign from the Caprica City Mayor's office. Was a teacher before that.
Sam Anders Very low. Caught pneumonia. Verified by Doc Cottle. Anders would need to be faking it, and Cottle would have to be covering too, which would require both to be Cylons.
Apollo Zip. Son of someone who can't be a Cylon. Also, was present on the sick BaseShip, and didn't get sick. It's established that Cylons have no immunity unless they've been pregnant with a hybrid baby. Lee has not been pregnant at any point since the sex change operation.
Doc Cottle Prospect. We don't have much independant info on him before the attack, though from his rank, it's implied that he has a service history in the fleet. Seems like it would take longer than two years in peacetime for an officer to reach Major.
Starbuck Low chance. Was in a realationship with Zak that ended two years before the attack. Relationship had to start earlier, and was a Viper flight instructor before the relationship started, which requires more fleet history before that.

[goMac]

The only problem with these theories is it's implied that the final 5 were not working with the other 7. They could have their own agenda, and would have infiltrated the colonies possibly on a different timeline. Or, if this weird 5 priests building the temple paradox is significant, they may even predate the 7 Cylons somehow.

[OreoCookie]

I don't think the people will be impressed by his plea for insanity. It opens just another can of worms when the writers finally have to figure out what is really going on there. Roslin has already figured out Caprica Six is having visions … 

@ort888
Well, perhaps and perhaps not. I just think it would kill a lot of issues Saul has had in the past: his alcoholism, his ambiguous relationship to his late wife Ellen, etc. If it turns out that all this was part of his `programming', I'd be disappointed, because it would imply this hardship was just `illusion of hardship'.

(I know, this isn't a strictly logical argument )

[goMac]

Originally Posted by OreoCookie 

I don't think the people will be impressed by his plea for insanity. It opens just another can of worms when the writers finally have to figure out what is really going on there. Roslin has already figured out Caprica Six is having visions … 

Well, I think it would be an interesting struggle for the end of the season. The struggle is going to be getting Baltar a fair trial, and under a fair trial an insanity plea by Baltar would probably fly.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

Originally Posted by reader50 

Relationship had to start earlier, and was a Viper flight instructor before the relationship started, which requires more fleet history before that.

The thing is these final 5 can be considerably older than 2 years. We know that many of the known Cylons only have a 2 year history but it could be much much longer for some of them or just the final 5. Remember the Cylons were in hiding for 40 YEARS! They could have made the final five 39 years ago for all we know.

I don't KNOW that Six, 8 etc are only 2 years old just that they started the attack mission 2 years ago.

Heck for all we know Adama's wife could have been one of the final 5 making Lee a hybrid. Same goes for Starbuck as her mom seems to have abused her for a reason ("Suffering is good for the soul") that we don't know the reasoning behind yet.

[SirCastor]

I'll be really disappointed if they try to pull an insanity plea with Baltar. That's just weak.
I wonder who's going to act as his lawyer.

What if he represented himself? He's a genius, and with Head-Six's help I bet he could argue through it in such a logical way so as to provide him legal security...
I think my favorite line from Season 2:

Zarek: You're a Genius
Baltar: Yes, what's your point...