[Mallrat]

When it came out I think it was only available for school to buy. Then they made it available to everyone.

Anyway, I don't get why Apple still sells them. All they are are an updated original iMac with a flat screen instead of the CRT and of course no color.

I want a 999 flat screen iMac, not an eMac at any price. I just can't even fathom at this point having a huge ass computer on the desk. It doesn't make sense with all the great LCD available.

Apple killed the need for the floppy, when o when are they going to kill the CRT?

I know some of you have and love your eMac. I love everything about them, except the form factor. I just don't like how the screen looks, I think it's too indented and the computer itself is just too big.

Apple needs to give us what we need. Cheaper ibooks, imacs or something similar so we can have the power without having to settle for an inferior design.

When the eMac first came out, I thought it would go the way of the cube. A few updates, low sales, and they would discontiued it. It's because of the emac that Apple can charge more for their other computers.

The eMac is the low end. If it didn't exsist the imac would be the low end, thus much cheaper. Fantastic for us all.

I think it's time for Apple to realize that they dont' have a lower end model that isn't an all in one and the people want choices.

Dell offers like 5 or 6 tower choices. Apple needs what people refer to as a headless iMac. A revisioned cube.

A machine where the consumer has the choice whether to use Apple LCDs or not. On a sidenote, I think the current line of Apple screen are very outdated. They need to revamped the entire line sooner, not later. The plastic around the screen is just too thick for me. It just looks tacky. We need something to match the G5 tower. A nice silver looking screen.

I'm just going off here, but I just had to say it. I don't get the eMac. I want a 799 and 999 desktop option, I just don't want my choice to be the emac combo or superdrive. I want a tower without a monitor.

[Lateralus]

The eMac exists because the iMac is too expensive to manufacture to fill the $700-1000 zone.

The eMac is a great machine, one of the best Apple has put out in years. It is also very effective at bringing in new Mac users who refuse to spend more than $1000 on a computer.

There isn't much to not get about the eMac. It is a fast, good looking, well made and cost effective entry level machine.

[dampeoples]

Originally posted by PowerMacMan:
The eMac exists because the iMac is too expensive to manufacture to fill the $700-1000 zone.

The eMac is a great machine, one of the best Apple has put out in years. It is also very effective at bringing in new Mac users who refuse to spend more than $1000 on a computer.

There isn't much to not get about the eMac. It is a fast, good looking, well made and cost effective entry level machine.

What he said. It's also for people like me - with families that need to spend more on food and shelter than a LCD. Well, maybe in the future, this iMac is still kicking

[zeebe]

You actually answered your own question. The eMac was originally made for the education market. Why? Because schools are made up of lots of little kids who LOVE to touch the computer screen to show their friends or teachers what they are doing. Trust me on this, I teach at a school, and I spend much of my afternoon after classes cleaning the CRTs of the iMacs and eMacs we have. Just think of all the dead pixels a LCD screen would have after all of the touches. Teachers like myself made the request to continue to make the CRT iMac when Apple said they wouldn't. Since Steve said the CRT would die in the iMac, they decided to make the eMac. The only reason they opened it up to the rest of the public, is the out cry for them and actually the illegal selling of them from educational institutions. I know a few people who went into university book stores just to get one and they were not students there.

As far as wanting a tower, Apple believes the towers are for their more experienced users. They figure if the people want a low cost machine, they will go with one of the machines they make for the consumers. I agree, Apple should make a headless iMac. I actually think they should make a smaller tower that can be updated. I purchased an iMac because I wanted a superdrive but didn't want to spend the money on a tower.

Hope this helps explain why Apple makes the eMac. As for why they don't make a headless iMac, who knows, maybe they are, we'll just have to wait and see what Steve WOWS us with next.

[unfaded]

Lets not forget that CRT displays are still used by a ton of graphics pros because LCD's, while being much better at giving you the correct colours over different viewing angles than before, still aren't perfect.

I bought a new eMac. Ships tomorrow - I'll post a thread detailing everything I can when I get it. It's one HELL of a deal.

And while I love LCD's (I prefer them to CRT's) I am going to be excited about having a screen I can watch at all angles for DVD's and graphics.

[turtle777]

Originally posted by Mallrat:

I want a 999 flat screen iMac, not an eMac at any price. I just can't even fathom at this point having a huge ass computer on the desk. It doesn't make sense with all the great LCD available.
...

I'm just going off here, but I just had to say it. I don't get the eMac. I want a 799 and 999 desktop option, I just don't want my choice to be the emac combo or superdrive. I want a tower without a monitor.

Well, if you don't get it, then don't get it !

But stop whining about too high prices.

YES, everyone would like to see an iMac with eMac specs and for eMac prices. But guess what ? It's not economically feasable !

So live with that, or go to hell, uhm, Dell...


-t

[Mallrat]

Originally posted by turtle777:
Well, if you don't get it, then don't get it !

But stop whining about too high prices.

YES, everyone would like to see an iMac with eMac specs and for eMac prices. But guess what ? It's not economically feasable !

So live with that, or go to hell, uhm, Dell...


-t

I still don't get it....



Why are there so many apple defenders always telling us how Apple will go out of business if they sell an ibook for less than 1000 or make a cheaper iMac.

I think that's a lot of B.S.

Are you telling me that a 1100 dollar ibook actually cost 1000 to make? No way!

I think the eMac is a way to appease us.

If they discontinued it, my guess is somehow they would find a way to see a 999 iMac and not go out of business.

[Krusty]

Originally posted by Mallrat:
I still don't get it....



Why are there so many apple defenders always telling us how Apple will go out of business if they sell an ibook for less than 1000 or make a cheaper iMac.

I think that's a lot of B.S.

Are you telling me that a 1100 dollar ibook actually cost 1000 to make? No way!

Of course it doesn't cost $1000 to make a $1100 ibook. Apple generally gets an ~25% margin AFTER other costs. I'd imagine they actually make the iBooks for about $5-600 but then there is shipping cost + markup for profit to a wholesaler (like Ingram Micro), then shipping cost + markup to a retailer (like MacMall or someone). Then advertising/sales staffing/warehouse pullers/company infrastructure for all of the above companies that need to be paid.

Originally posted by Mallrat:

I think the eMac is a way to appease us.

Well .... Yeah.

Originally posted by Mallrat:

If they discontinued it, my guess is somehow they would find a way to see a 999 iMac and not go out of business.

You're absolutely right -- the eMac is a way to get a fully functional Mac into people's hands for less than a grand. But your logic is backward ...when Apple is able to make a $999 iMac and not go out of business then they might discontinue the eMac (for public sale, anyway).

I "get" the eMac (In fact, I'll be getting an eMac in the next few weeks). Its many disadvantages are duly noted, but I'm getting one because its a reasonable combination of features a a bargain price. It'll do everything a mac is supposed to do -- just not as stylishly as mac users are accustomed to

[stoneage]

I went out and got one the day they upgraded. My iMac DV SE display died. I bought yesterdays model. 1 gHz, 1 gig RAM, 80 gig H/D. A little over a thousand with shipping and AppleCare. Not to bad. My iMac cost almost $1500 nearly 4 years ago. The display is great. Here is a pic of me posting on this thread.

http://24.118.196.224/~williamoreilly/eMac.jpg

EDIT: Hey stoneage. Please keep your image size down. Please have a look at the announcement, Rules on Inline Images. Thanks.
-Misc.

[slider]

I think if you go out and look at the prices of lcd screens you'll see why the price points are what they are. The eMac is a great machine and a fair price. You have a whole slew of ports you just don't get on a $500 Dell. One other thing is that Jobs just told it's board members in it's last stock holders meeting, that Apple has choosen not to compete in the lowend PC market. I considered this, I think it might have something to do with the type of buyer. I think Apple wants users that are willing to pay more for a computer that holds to a perticular standard, or minimun of what a computer should have. I know Apple could build a machine that sells for nothing, but runs Mac OS X. Cheap tower case, super lowend monitor, maybe even super low end LCD, but for what? What are you going to do with it? Email and Web? Initially I thought, well, it would increase the user base, but if you go out and buy a $4-5 hunderd dollar machine, I really don't thing you count as a consumer who will desire AutoCAD, or ArcView or many other apps only made for PC therefore Joe Blow cheap PC buyer does nothing for the platform, and they won't even buy Mac apps, not Adobe, finial cut express, nothing. In that respects it makes sense not to bother with super cheap machines, low profit margins and no benifit to the platform. The $800 eMac is the lowest machine you'll find and it's a great machine. I think you would need to seriously increase the size of the iMac base to lower prcie on the iMac too.

[sniffer]

I think the eMac looks dull. But it's a great machine nevertheless. I wouldn't mind having one for a two year period until I later save up for a new machine. All in ones always feel outdated after two years for me it seems. Tho this round I am in the portable marked.

[ApeInTheShell]

I think it will feel less outdated if you switch from a black box pc. The old iMacs look outdated but some people still use them because they really do look different than the competition.

The eMac looks cool but probably better with the stand.

[Lateralus]

Originally posted by ApeInTheShell:
The eMac looks cool but probably better with the stand.

I've always felt that not including it was a stupid move on Apple's part.

[Kilbey]

Hey Mallrat, maybe if Apple listened to you they would finally make some money eh?

[Graymalkin]

The iMac with its LCD is not going to sell for $799 until LCDs are in the same price range as CRTs are today. That time is not now and likely won't be upon us for several years. The eMac is good for people who either don't want to spend much on their first computer or would like a second to kick around with. That is entirely besides their intended role as education systems. They make good lab computers because they're cheap yet survivable.

[turtle777]

Originally posted by Krusty:
Of course it doesn't cost $1000 to make a $1100 ibook. Apple generally gets an ~25% margin AFTER other costs. I'd imagine they actually make the iBooks for about $5-600 but then there is shipping cost + markup for profit to a wholesaler (like Ingram Micro), then shipping cost + markup to a retailer (like MacMall or someone). Then advertising/sales staffing/warehouse pullers/company infrastructure for all of the above companies that need to be paid.

Yes and No

Apple has a Gorss Margin of around 25%, that is the margin after the manufacturing costs.

Besides the costs that you mention above, Apple also has to take care of their own SG&A (Selling, General and Administration) costs.
Plus, you gotta add a portion to cover the R&D expenses.

So, when it all comes down, there might be a 5%, max 10% Profit Margin, probably depending on the sales channel...

-t

[swichd]

Originally posted by sniffer:
I think the eMac looks dull. But it's a great machine nevertheless. I wouldn't mind having one for a two year period until I later save up for a new machine. All in ones always feel outdated after two years for me it seems. Tho this round I am in the portable marked.

I think the eMac looks much better than the iMac and I would take one any day even if the imac was the same price. LCDs are second to CRTs when it comes to picture quality, colors, viewing angles, responce rate, etc.

[rodllew]

I am a 66 year old guy whose first computer was 12Hz with 16K ram and I think it is incredible that an eMac is considered "entry level."

[Applefreak01]

I thought the eMac's design was orignally going to be used for the new iMacs before Jobs scrapped it and went with the flat panel iMacs we now have and kept the design and marketed the eMac as an education machine because education need an update badly. I remember reading that somewhere.

[turtle777]

Originally posted by rodllew:
I am a 66 year old guy whose first computer was 12Hz with 16K ram and I think it is incredible that an eMac is considered "entry level."

Well, as time passes by, your 12Hz / 16K are definitely EXIT level today...



-t

[mbryda]

Originally posted by PowerMacMan:
good looking,

You have to be kidding. Everyone that sees the eMac comments how ugly it is. It is probably the ugliest thing Apple has put out in years. However, it's probably built tough as nails, so it has that going for it.

[turtle777]

Originally posted by stoneage:
Here is a pic of me posting on this thread

Man, could you please post that in HIGHER resolution, I can hardly see anything



-t

[laz]

Not only is the eMac a great soltuoin for schools, but also for companies that have users that act like kids! I know that for our corporation it is a godsend. I just finished rolling out three eMacs today, and they don't take up too much more space than the iMac's they are replacing.

The one thing that sucks about them and all apple products right now is the white keyboard! Boy, you should see those white keyboards after two or three months of use *yuck*

Anyway, all of my users love their eMacs, and they sure look better thatn the all black PC's that some users get.

My 2c's

[NickGra]

I just odered my eMac. Sweet deal at maczone.com. They give you an extra 256mb of RAM. It ships out today. I'm so excited! eMacs are for people who want power at a good price and don't care about size. So quit whining about size.

[Agent69]

The eMac is a good, inexpensive computer. I owned one for a year and it was a great machine. I would also like to suggest that not everyone is in love with LCD screens; I dislike them and I suspect that I am not alone.

And you don't have to "get" it.

[Agent69]

Originally posted by mbryda:
You have to be kidding. Everyone that sees the eMac comments how ugly it is. It is probably the ugliest thing Apple has put out in years.

I totally disagree with you. The eMac is a very nice design, although I agree with another poster here who stated that the tilt and swivel stand should be a standard accessory.

[spokess]

Originally posted by Agent69:
The eMac is a good, inexpensive computer. I owned one for a year and it was a great machine. I would also like to suggest that not everyone is in love with LCD screens; I dislike them and I suspect that I am not alone.

And you don't have to "get" it.

You are not alone ... I wouldn't touch one with a 10 foot pole, or 10 inch for that matter. I find them blurry at any distance.

I work in a small print shop and we have an iMac that we typeset on. I was so in love with it when we got it, that I travelled 2 1/2 hours to the nearest Apple Store to get one for myself. But when I saw that eMac in person with that crisp 17" CRT and realized I'd be paying $600 more for 15" of blurriness, I changed my mind in a hurry. Now I bring as much work home as I can.

I will agree that the tilt and swivel stand is a must ... as everytime I have to move the eMac, I am baffled by how much it weighs.

[Simon]

Originally posted by spokess:
I work in a small print shop and we have an iMac that we typeset on. I was so in love with it when we got it, that I travelled 2 1/2 hours to the nearest Apple Store to get one for myself. But when I saw that eMac in person with that crisp 17" CRT and realized I'd be paying $600 more for 15" of blurriness, I changed my mind in a hurry. Now I bring as much work home as I can.

If your TFT screen seems blurry next to the eMacs CRT or blurry at all you should set it to its physical resolution. For the 15" iMac that's 1024x768. At that setting a TFT will be crystal clear. TFTs are only blurry when they are run at non-physical resolutions where the image is interpolated. (Unless it's damaged and needs to be replaced that is)

[sjk]

Originally posted by Simon:
For the 15" iMac that's 1024x768. At that setting a TFT will be crystal clear.

Like the 1024x768 is on my 12" G3 iBook.

If anything, the CRT on my new eMac looks a bit blurry in comparison @ 1280x960, partly because of the 72Hz refresh rate I'm guessing. I'd like to try calibrating it but am still nervous about messing something up and not knowing how to reset it. I suppose the calibration data is saved in a prefs file that I could remove if anything goes wrong... anyone know which one(s)?

[spokess]

Thanks for pointing that out. I somehow never picked up on that. It certainly makes a difference. I still just don't like the "feel" of that screen though.

I guess that's what makes us Mac users in the first place though - knowing all those little details of what we want and need and our unwillingness to settle for whatever is on sale in the Sunday paper.

[3gg3]

Writing this on a loaner eMac - my PB is in the hospital. Got the loaner eMac cause I was thinking of buying one. Thank goodness for the free trial, as I would have been one unhappy camper if I had bought one. Cannot believe the noise level of the thing in the home. Several levels of magnitude more noticeable than in a big open building setting. Lots of smaller disincentives, too, but THE NOISE. You must all be using them exclusively with iPods stuck in your ears. Dealer says Whaddya expect from low-end Mac

OTOH, do love the SuperDrive. Runs rings around the POS burner in my Windoze machine. I agree with the other Old Fart, this is an incredible piece of technology for an entry level machine. Just wish it were a bit quieter than our Kirby vac!

But I think now I will be sticking to the PowerBook or iBook.

[galarneau]

What model was your loaner? My school has old 700 and 800MHz eMacs, and they are definitley loud. Maybe the newer ones are quieter? I think the 1.25GHz model uses a lower power G4, and thus might make less heat (and thus need less aggressive cooling).

Originally posted by 3gg3:
Writing this on a loaner eMac - my PB is in the hospital. Got the loaner eMac cause I was thinking of buying one. Thank goodness for the free trial, as I would have been one unhappy camper if I had bought one. Cannot believe the noise level of the thing in the home. Several levels of magnitude more noticeable than in a big open building setting. Lots of smaller disincentives, too, but THE NOISE. You must all be using them exclusively with iPods stuck in your ears. Dealer says Whaddya expect from low-end Mac

OTOH, do love the SuperDrive. Runs rings around the POS burner in my Windoze machine. I agree with the other Old Fart, this is an incredible piece of technology for an entry level machine. Just wish it were a bit quieter than our Kirby vac!

But I think now I will be sticking to the PowerBook or iBook.

[Simon]

Originally posted by sjk:
I suppose the calibration data is saved in a prefs file that I could remove if anything goes wrong... anyone know which one(s)?

For each user: ~/Library/ColorSync/Profiles/
For all users: /Library/ColorSync/Profiles/

Or just use the Finder's find command and look for "Profile" folders. You will find ColorSync's prefs there. There is not much you can screw up, since you can always go back to Apple's default settings.

[sjk]

Originally posted by Simon:
For each user: ~/Library/ColorSync/Profiles/
For all users: /Library/ColorSync/Profiles/

And /System/Library/ColorSync/Profiles/

Calibration & ColorSync stuff became clear(er) after reading Krusty's explanation in the eMac benchies thread.

[Simon]

Originally posted by sjk:
And /System/Library/ColorSync/Profiles/

You shouldn't mess around in /System. It only contains Apple's default profiles.

User stuff goes in ~/Library and system-wide stuff in /Library. /System is reserved for the OS and you should (almost) never fiddle around inside that area.