[Kdog01]

I like a lot of people on here have been wanting to buy a merom MBP, I think it is funny now how sites like macosrumors are saying the update will be "sometime in the next two weeks".

[bowwowman]

last good rumor I heard was that apple is holding a special event tomorrow. Tuesday the 26th

[Simon]

Nothing today either.

[kernokerno]

if we don't get an update at the applestore in the morning, all the probabilities of a new product (mbp) get reduced a little, no?

[houstonmacbro]

unless they do it silently.

[giggs11]

They're just stringing us along at this point...

[houstonmacbro]

i am sure they have a plan, but they like playing 'god' (little g) ... it keeps them in charge.

[dmcnickle]

I think it still might be awhile because the online store still has the availability as shipping within 24 hours.

[thiagofll]

I don't like to whine or anything but this is starting to piss me off. I sold my MacBook Pro before Sept.14 because I thought that they would update it to Core 2 Duo by Sept. 25 ( I know stupid of me). But the only reason why I believed the rumors this time is because all windows machines are already shipping with the Core 2 Duo chips, so I thought Macs are gonna keep up (was I wrong).

It's not that I want the fastest computer but I like to keep my money's worth, meaning I like to have the latest chip in case one day I wanna sell it, I won't lose more than $100-$150 on it. Also because I don't like having Rev A computers, I rather have a Rev B that have the issues already worked out.
I love Apple's and I do not want to have a Windows only machine, but this suspense is killing me...I am about to give up seriously...

Apple makes so much suspense on their releases that when they don't release what the rumors stated, people get disappointed. I think that they should be straight forward with their release dates just like any other company...Just my opinion...

[Simon]

Just in case it makes anybody feel better - they still have some time left. In order to have ample supplies for the holiday buying season, they could still announce in October as long as they start shipping right after the announcement.

If they don't announce by the end of October, I'd be surprised to see any MBP or MB revs appear before MWSF. So they still have roughly another month. Four more Tuesdays to await anxiously.

[Simon]

I went back and checked when Apple introduced hardware in November. The last time they did it was with the first 20" iMac G4 and Dual 1.8GHz PM G5 in 2003. In 2002 they introduced the Ti PB G4 (second rev with DVI) along with a new iBook G3 rev in November. It's been quite a while since their last Nov intros. And IIRC under Steve they never introduced in December.

[houstonmacbro]

Originally Posted by thiagofll

I don't like to whine or anything but this is starting to piss me off. I sold my MacBook Pro before Sept.14 because I thought that they would update it to Core 2 Duo by Sept. 25 ( I know stupid of me). But the only reason why I believed the rumors this time is because all windows machines are already shipping with the Core 2 Duo chips, so I thought Macs are gonna keep up (was I wrong).

It's not that I want the fastest computer but I like to keep my money's worth, meaning I like to have the latest chip in case one day I wanna sell it, I won't lose more than $100-$150 on it. Also because I don't like having Rev A computers, I rather have a Rev B that have the issues already worked out.
I love Apple's and I do not want to have a Windows only machine, but this suspense is killing me...I am about to give up seriously...

Apple makes so much suspense on their releases that when they don't release what the rumors stated, people get disappointed. I think that they should be straight forward with their release dates just like any other company...Just my opinion...

i mean, even if they just did silent releases it would satisfy folks ... you're right ... other companies are shipping in-quantity, machines with c2d chips so why can't apple?

i am wondering if they didn't realize that moving to intel (also) meant they'd be in direct competition for intel market share with other computer makers (dell, lenovo, sony, hp)? before with the ppc chips from ibm, they could afford to update whenever they felt because honestly, there wasn't any other competition.

[Peter]

It's really really really stupid to plan mac purchases based on rumour sites.

[salaryman]

Not knowing if or when they'll be updating the MBP is getting seriously tedious. Right now the MBP is very expensive and under spec'ed compared to the competition (i.e. all other PC laptop manufacturers). This wait is doing Apple no favours at all and the bulletin boards are full of frustrated people. It's like the G5 Powerbook all over again!

Apple just has to revise the MBP line soon. Not doing so before, say, November would be commercial suicide.

For those of us who aren't from the USA, when people talk about "before the holiday season", when exactly do they mean?

[houstonmacbro]

holiday season typically means from thanksgiving through new years (november 24th - january 2 or so).

[houstonmacbro]

Originally Posted by Peter

It's really really really stupid to plan mac purchases based on rumour sites.

i think it is unwise but not stupid.

there are many of us who need to make the best decision possibly with limited funds. we cannot drop $1500 (or more) per year on a computer system and so must try to purchase the most technologically advanced albeit at the cheapest or best time of the year.

[thiagofll]

Originally Posted by houstonmacbro

i mean, even if they just did silent releases it would satisfy folks ... you're right ... other companies are shipping in-quantity, machines with c2d chips so why can't apple?

i am wondering if they didn't realize that moving to intel (also) meant they'd be in direct competition for intel market share with other computer makers (dell, lenovo, sony, hp)? before with the ppc chips from ibm, they could afford to update whenever they felt because honestly, there wasn't any other competition.

Exactly! And not just that, there seems to be a high demand for the 13" Macbooks, which means that they are not stuck with a bunch of Core Duos (They could have updated by now, like they did with the iMacs). Macbook Pro is a Pro machine, it should be one of the first ones to be updated. They are just cashing in the money. I have heard that they receive some money back on those chips that haven't sold, making even more money.

The only reason why I am waiting is because of the MacOSX, if it wasn't for that, I would have purchased a windows computer already.

Sony is selling for $1999 a Core 2 Duo Machine 2.13 Ghz with 2GB DDR2 RAM (YES 2GB), 120GB HD, Fingerprint Reader for the same price, now tell me, how is that fair?!?!

[mduell]

Originally Posted by thiagofll

Sony is selling for $1999 a Core 2 Duo Machine 2.13 Ghz with 2GB DDR2 RAM (YES 2GB), 120GB HD, Fingerprint Reader for the same price, now tell me, how is that fair?!?!

7 pounds or 9?

[houstonmacbro]

what do you mean by that?

oh yeah, and save for osx i would have already gotten a core2duo machine as well.

[thiagofll]

Originally Posted by mduell

7 pounds or 9?

No not really. It is a very nice machine. Brushed metal and everything.
It only weighs 4.1 pds.

Here's the link:

Sony - VAIO Notebook with Intel® Centrino® Duo - Charcoal - VGN-SZ330P/B

[Elektrix]

The lower end Sony SZ's like the SZ330 aren't as nice; weird bumpy material on the outside of the case and a lower quality less bright screen. You really need to get into the models like the SZ360 and SZ370 for the higher quality materials (carbon fiber casing, etc.) and better screens, and those are more in the $2400-2700 range.

Also note that with Sony, the price of accessories is astronomical; batteries cost $299 for example.

Also note that the GeForce 7400 is not a very powerful card compared even to the underclocked X1600 in the MBP.

And Sony's support is some of the worst in the industry (I speak from having been a Sony Vaio S360 owner).

I can understand the temptation, but I would never invest in a Sony laptop again.

[thiagofll]

Originally Posted by Elektrix

The lower end Sony SZ's like the SZ330 aren't as nice; weird bumpy material on the outside of the case and a lower quality less bright screen. You really need to get into the models like the SZ360 and SZ370 for the higher quality materials (carbon fiber casing, etc.) and better screens, and those are more in the $2400-2700 range.

Also note that with Sony, the price of accessories is astronomical; batteries cost $299 for example.

Also note that the GeForce 7400 is not a very powerful card compared even to the underclocked X1600 in the MBP.

And Sony's support is some of the worst in the industry (I speak from having been a Sony Vaio S360 owner).

I can understand the temptation, but I would never invest in a Sony laptop again.

Hi thanks for the reply. I did some research though and the materials used on the Sz330 are the same used on the SZ360 and SZ370. Also uses carbon fiber casing....

[Elektrix]

Originally Posted by thiagofll

Hi thanks for the reply. I did some research though and the materials used on the Sz330 are the same used on the SZ360 and SZ370. Also uses carbon fiber casing....

I'm sorry, but your research is incorrect. Ever since Sony introduced the SZ series, they have split it up between a "regular" set of models and a "Premium" line. The higher model numbers like the SZx60 and SZx70 have featured the "premium" materials like the full carbon fiber casing (and more recently, a higher quality screen), while the lower end model numbers like the SZx20 and SZx30 have featured more traditional materials. The reason that the "Premium" models are thinner and lighter is because of that use of carbon fiber, especially on the top lid, which allows a much thinner top part of the laptop.

Really, that is the primary reason why the "Premium" models are in the $2500-3000 range and the lower end models are in the $2000-2150 range.

I'm not saying it makes a huge difference; just that Sony has made sure that the regular SZ models are less attractive from a materials standpoint. I think starting with the SZ2xx series, they have also seemed to change the screens on the premium models, so only the more expensive SZ models have the highest quality screens, while the non-Premium models feature more regular screens that are a bit duller.

[thiagofll]

Originally Posted by Elektrix

I'm sorry, but your research is incorrect. Ever since Sony introduced the SZ series, they have split it up between a "regular" set of models and a "Premium" line. The higher model numbers like the SZx60 and SZx70 have featured the "premium" materials like the full carbon fiber casing (and more recently, a higher quality screen), while the lower end model numbers like the SZx20 and SZx30 have featured more traditional materials. The reason that the "Premium" models are thinner and lighter is because of that use of carbon fiber, especially on the top lid, which allows a much thinner top part of the laptop.

Really, that is the primary reason why the "Premium" models are in the $2500-3000 range and the lower end models are in the $2000-2150 range.

I'm not saying it makes a huge difference; just that Sony has made sure that the regular SZ models are less attractive from a materials standpoint. I think starting with the SZ2xx series, they have also seemed to change the screens on the premium models, so only the more expensive SZ models have the highest quality screens, while the non-Premium models feature more regular screens that are a bit duller.

It makes sense. You are probably right. On their website they don't state that, I compared one side by side and I couldnt figure out why the high price tag...
Thanks ...

[Elektrix]

No problem; again, I don't mean to make it sound like there is anything wrong with the regular SZ series compared to the premium models.

I'm not sure which too models you compared, but the most noticeable difference will be found in the lid itself; the SZ330 has a rough textured lid that is thicker (it feels sort of like sandpaper or something), and the SZ370, for example, has a sleeker carbon fiber lid that is also noticeably thinner and stronger. Side by side the screens should also be noticeably different, with the SZ370 being more vibrant and brighter when both are at max settings.

One other thing to note; the "Premium" SZ models also seem to get better battery life, apparently due to a different backlighting technology they use (which also apparently contributes to the overall better screen quality).

[SierraDragon]

The good news is that the Vaio pricing may hopefully help keep Apple's pricing in check. That (too small a screen for me) Vaio looks good - - - until you get to the end where it says "Windows XP, Sevice Pack 2..."

-Allen Wicks

[mduell]

Originally Posted by thiagofll

No not really. It is a very nice machine. Brushed metal and everything.
It only weighs 4.1 pds.

Here's the link:

Sony - VAIO Notebook with Intel® Centrino® Duo - Charcoal - VGN-SZ330P/B

13.3", crappy GPU: should be compared to a MacBook, not a MacBook Pro (look what forum you're in).

[Elektrix]

Originally Posted by mduell

13.3", crappy GPU: should be compared to a MacBook, not a MacBook Pro (look what forum you're in).

The GeForce 7400 in the SZ series is not necessarily a crappy GPU; in fact, considering how underclocked the X1600 in the MBP is, they aren't even that far apart in real-world performance. The SZ of course also has a Core 2 Duo, which neither the MB or MBP have available.

[thiagofll]

Originally Posted by mduell

13.3", crappy GPU: should be compared to a MacBook, not a MacBook Pro (look what forum you're in).

It was a fair comparison...I doubt Apple will provide 2GB DDR2 RAM, Fingerprint Reader, 120GB Hard Drive for that $1,999. Just because the screen is 13.3 does not mean that it cannot be compared to the MacBook Pro....Not counting the recently upgraded Core 2 Duo...
Anyways I am not buying that computer, I was just making a comparison to what you can get for your money....$1,999 for a Core Duo, 80GB Hard Drive, Non DL Superdrive, 512MB DDR2 RAM? I don't think so...

[salaryman]

Originally Posted by thiagofll

Anyways I am not buying that computer, I was just making a comparison to what you can get for your money....$1,999 for a Core Duo, 80GB Hard Drive, Non DL Superdrive, 512MB DDR2 RAM? I don't think so...

Word. The MBP is seriously overpriced and under spec'ed right now. Apple need to sort it out ASAP. The only rational explanation for not updating the MBP yet is that they're reworking the internals and trying to iron out the flaws with MBP revA. And having trouble doing so!

[salaryman]

This is probably old news but I've been reading this interesting thread which observes how Apple software updates always precede new hardware releases. Yeah, I'm bored - so sue me

Anyway, there have been loads of software updates over the past couple of weeks (15 if you include Aperture) which would indicate that a new hardware release is imminent in the next 10 days or so, depending on whether software updates continue to come out of course which would push this date back.

My money is on Tuesday 3rd or Tuesday 10th Oct for new MacBook Pros. You gotta love speculation

[Gossamer]

Originally Posted by thiagofll

It was a fair comparison...I doubt Apple will provide 2GB DDR2 RAM, Fingerprint Reader, 120GB Hard Drive for that $1,999. Just because the screen is 13.3 does not mean that it cannot be compared to the MacBook Pro....Not counting the recently upgraded Core 2 Duo...
Anyways I am not buying that computer, I was just making a comparison to what you can get for your money....$1,999 for a Core Duo, 80GB Hard Drive, Non DL Superdrive, 512MB DDR2 RAM? I don't think so...

Actually that's not a fair comparison, as the MBP has a minimum 15" screen, and the sony is a 13.3".
If you get a MacBook from the Apple store with 2GB of RAM and a 120GB HD, though, it's about $2050.

[salaryman]

check this out then:

Sony Style Europe

1.83 Core 2 Duo
2GB Ram
200GB HDD
15.4" screen
Dual Layer DVD
£1,299 inc. VAT

Make the MBP look hugely overpriced and underspec'd, no?

I didn't even know you could get 200GB drives for laptops

[mduell]

Originally Posted by thiagofll

It was a fair comparison...I doubt Apple will provide 2GB DDR2 RAM, Fingerprint Reader, 120GB Hard Drive for that $1,999. Just because the screen is 13.3 does not mean that it cannot be compared to the MacBook Pro....Not counting the recently upgraded Core 2 Duo...
Anyways I am not buying that computer, I was just making a comparison to what you can get for your money....$1,999 for a Core Duo, 80GB Hard Drive, Non DL Superdrive, 512MB DDR2 RAM? I don't think so...

2Ghz MacBook + 120GB + 2GB all at the Apple store for $2,049.

You really want to compare it to the MacBook Pro, huh? Then you should note the faster GPU, larger screen, higher resolution screen, etc.

Originally Posted by salaryman

check this out then:

Sony Style Europe

1.83 Core 2 Duo
2GB Ram
200GB HDD
15.4" screen
Dual Layer DVD
£1,299 inc. VAT

Make the MBP look hugely overpriced and underspec'd, no?

I didn't even know you could get 200GB drives for laptops

The 200GB 2.5" drives are 4200RPM (slow).

[zaghahzag]

apple makes a lot of money on it's ram. they charge what 500$ to go from .5 to 2 gigs. it's a total rippoff. They'd be a lot more competive if they fixed some of their pricing. (in fact they'd probably be cheaper).

[Person Man]

Originally Posted by thiagofll

Apple makes so much suspense on their releases that when they don't release what the rumors stated, people get disappointed. I think that they should be straight forward with their release dates just like any other company...Just my opinion...

If Apple announced shipping dates of their next computers then sales of current computers would drop like a rock. Especially if they won't ship for a month or two. Apple announces products when they are ready to.

MacBooks (and MacBook Pros) are still selling well enough that Apple isn't too worried about their sales right now. But if they said Core 2 Duo 'books will come out in a month, then NOBODY would buy the current ones.

There was a computer company back in the old days that went out of business because of this. They were selling a computer and then they announced their new computer early, and detailed the specs. Sales of their current computer tanked because everyone was waiting for the next machine. The company went out of business before that next machine could be introduced. Granted, this is an extreme example, but it's something to keep in mind.

You can wait forever for a great deal, but you'll never buy anything. Your best bet is to buy what you need when you need it. If you don't need it, then wait until you do before buying.

My PowerBook G4 has been chugging along for almost 4 years, and it still does what I need. It will be a while before I get a MacBook Pro. And if the next iteration of said computer comes out two days after I bought the previous one, I won't be upset, either.

[zaghahzag]

btw it looks like ship times for macbooks is down to 1-3 days. so the backlog is gone.. i wonder if this is what apple was waiting for to release new ones.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by Person Man

There was a computer company back in the old days that went out of business because of this. They were selling a computer and then they announced their new computer early, and detailed the specs. Sales of their current computer tanked because everyone was waiting for the next machine. The company went out of business before that next machine could be introduced. Granted, this is an extreme example, but it's something to keep in mind.

Unless you're thinking of a different company than I'm thinking of, close but not quite. They went into (and emerged from) bankrupcy rather than going out of business.

Osborne Computer Corporation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[lucksmith]

Originally Posted by salaryman

Not knowing if or when they'll be updating the MBP is getting seriously tedious. Right now the MBP is very expensive and under spec'ed compared to the competition (i.e. all other PC laptop manufacturers). This wait is doing Apple no favours at all and the bulletin boards are full of frustrated people. It's like the G5 Powerbook all over again!

Apple just has to revise the MBP line soon. Not doing so before, say, November would be commercial suicide.

For those of us who aren't from the USA, when people talk about "before the holiday season", when exactly do they mean?

I seldom am spurred to post but... here I am typing this on my 17" 1GHZ G4, which will be FOUR years old in February and Apple has not updated the form factor or kept up to speed with the peecee makers in features. I can' t have a HD drive, a Core2Duo, or 512MB graphics, I am limited to a slow 120 GB hard drive and a blah screen. Is my patience running out? Oh yes it is. Time was a powerbook/macbook pro made peecees look stone age, now it looks like apple has spent a lot of their focus and resources on the ipod while leaving their flagship notebook in the game like a starter heading into the 13th inning. Update this situation Apple.. .Or I will be purchasing a notebook from a peecee vendor. Also go and use a macbook pro in an apple store, it does not rock under tiger, tiger is a resource hog. I rest my rant and my VISA card once more.

[Elektrix]

Huh? Apple offers 7200rpm HD's, so I hardly see how you're limited there - but I think the fastest 7200rpm drive is 100GB. That's hardly Apple's fault.

What do you use your PowerBook for that you need 512MB graphics? The only mobile graphics cards I even know of that use those are the 7800GTX Go and I think one version of the 7900GS.

Regarding a "blah screen"; compared to what? What exactly is blah about either MBP screen that is available; the matte screen is still one of the best I've seen, and the glossy screen compares very well to the PC glossy screen.s

Aside from that, even with a form factor that hasn't fundamentally changed in a while, I don't see how that is a problem. PC notebook makers are still behind Apple in that regard, IMO; HP might be the closest in terms of at least making somewhat good looking notebooks, but they still don't have the elegance of the MBP design. And the stuff from Dell and Toshiba is generally hideous. Acer and Asus perhaps come closest, but at best they seem like pale imitations. Sony makes a few nice designs as well, but more on the subnotebook side of things.

What notebook are you going to buy from a PC vendor that will make you happy, exactly?

I understand your thoughts, I've felt the same way. I bought a Vaio S360 because I was tempted by the specs; but Windows was and still is a mess.

Tiger doesn't rock on an MBP? I disagree, at least from what I've seen of it. With the proper amount of RAM, Tiger seems to do fine even with resource intensive apps like Logic, etc. running.

I found it to still be much better than even the most current PC notebooks, which are still saddled with Windows.

If you really are convinced that a PC notebook with those "missing features" and Windows will be better for you, then good luck to you.

[lucksmith]

512 MB graphics are important in that one thing does not change.. everything released sequentially is video ram hungry. If you plan on staying ahead of the obselesence curve you need the extra graphics power, and trust me on this, so will your OS quite soon. There aren't enough pixels on the macbook pro, especially not for HD. What happened to the initial HD love from Apple? I am stuck with a super drive.. what exactly is super about the super drive? its' a full generation behind. And I am sorry but the enclosure should have been revved by now, and where is the equivalent of the 12" powerbook G4 as an option. Apple switching to intel allowed them to update the powerbook from a processor standpoint but in terms of industrial design they have been sitting on their laurels whilst doing the platform change to Intel. And is it really OK by you that we are still looking at not even one Merom equipped Macbook Pro. Sure Tiger runs fine with 2GB of Ram, which Apple will overcharge us for. Jobs needs to get of his keester and get Ives moving.

[silver]

I agree with Elektrix, how can you fault Apple for offering a 7200 rpm HD. As for the graphics, 512mb card would generate much more heat than whats in there now- I'm a 3D artist and the 256mb works fine for me and thats using Maya and when booted in XP Xsi runs great. Oh you want the core2duo ok you do realize that you wont be able to see that much of a difference till the Santa Rosa chpset, core2duo needs an 800mhz FSB to get to it's full potential. For me I'll get a Merom based laptop when the Santa Rosa chipset comes out. Till then I'll keep enjoying my MBP 17"100G 7200RPM HD w/Ati1600 256MB graphics card.


silver

[Elektrix]

Honestly the lack of a Core 2 Duo MBP doesn't make a big deal to me. I just got back from CompUSA to play around with the Sony and Toshiba laptops they have there that have been upgraded to Core 2 Duo, and you know what? They seem just like the Core Duo models. It's not some amazing new advance or something, really.

I do admit it's a little puzzling at this point that Apple still hasn't released a Core 2 Duo upgrade (it's not like they don't have the chips, or they wouldn't have updated the iMac witht hem). At this point the only thing I can think is that Apple is doing some case modifications, etc. (keep in mind that most PC notebook manufacuters just dropped Core 2 Duos into their existing models without any significant changes).

You don't need to buy your 2GB of RAM from Apple you know; every PC manufacturer overcharges for RAM to some degree compared to third parties, so give me a break on that.

And finally, regarding industrial design; I still honestly just don't get this. What exactly do you have a problem with regarding the current design? As far as I'm concerned, it's a classic timeless design, and it is simple and elegant; most other PC notebook designs are changing regularly, but still really a mess in many ways. I'm not sure what the point of a re-design is at this point; what exactly are you looking/hoping for, or how does the current design not work for you? Is it just cause you want something new, or what?

This seems to me like complaining that BMW or Mercedes still use the same fundamental car designs they've been using for years, or that they aren't releasing radically redesigned cars. A classic design doesn't warrant being updated unless there is a good compelling reason to do so.

Regarding the video card, again, by the time we're seeing 512 megs of VRAM being taken advantage of, even current video cards will be out of date. As it is, on the notebook side, you really generally only see this on the highest-end video cards anyway used in those massive 17" gaming notebooks, etc.

Anyway though, if you are so obsessed with specifications, go and get a PC notebook with the latest Core 2 Duos, a 7900GTX with 512megs of video RAM, etc. and be happy with it. If you're so obsessed with companies who release completely new designs every year trying to find something that works, and companies that spit out machines with the latest specs, then you will be well served by Dell or Toshiba or HP or even Sony.

It sounds like you are also dissatisfied with the performance of Tiger, so you should just love the performance of Windows XP and Vista on those PC notebooks (make sure to wipe out the tons of bloatware though).

-Zadillo

[houstonmacbro]

Originally Posted by Person Man

If Apple announced shipping dates of their next computers then sales of current computers would drop like a rock. Especially if they won't ship for a month or two. Apple announces products when they are ready to.

MacBooks (and MacBook Pros) are still selling well enough that Apple isn't too worried about their sales right now. But if they said Core 2 Duo 'books will come out in a month, then NOBODY would buy the current ones.

There was a computer company back in the old days that went out of business because of this. They were selling a computer and then they announced their new computer early, and detailed the specs. Sales of their current computer tanked because everyone was waiting for the next machine. The company went out of business before that next machine could be introduced. Granted, this is an extreme example, but it's something to keep in mind.

You can wait forever for a great deal, but you'll never buy anything. Your best bet is to buy what you need when you need it. If you don't need it, then wait until you do before buying.

My PowerBook G4 has been chugging along for almost 4 years, and it still does what I need. It will be a while before I get a MacBook Pro. And if the next iteration of said computer comes out two days after I bought the previous one, I won't be upset, either.

all the more reason to do a silent update.

[houstonmacbro]

Originally Posted by Elektrix

Honestly the lack of a Core 2 Duo MBP doesn't make a big deal to me. I just got back from CompUSA to play around with the Sony and Toshiba laptops they have there that have been upgraded to Core 2 Duo, and you know what? They seem just like the Core Duo models. It's not some amazing new advance or something, really.

I do admit it's a little puzzling at this point that Apple still hasn't released a Core 2 Duo upgrade (it's not like they don't have the chips, or they wouldn't have updated the iMac witht hem). At this point the only thing I can think is that Apple is doing some case modifications, etc. (keep in mind that most PC notebook manufacuters just dropped Core 2 Duos into their existing models without any significant changes).

You don't need to buy your 2GB of RAM from Apple you know; every PC manufacturer overcharges for RAM to some degree compared to third parties, so give me a break on that.

And finally, regarding industrial design; I still honestly just don't get this. What exactly do you have a problem with regarding the current design? As far as I'm concerned, it's a classic timeless design, and it is simple and elegant; most other PC notebook designs are changing regularly, but still really a mess in many ways. I'm not sure what the point of a re-design is at this point; what exactly are you looking/hoping for, or how does the current design not work for you? Is it just cause you want something new, or what?

This seems to me like complaining that BMW or Mercedes still use the same fundamental car designs they've been using for years, or that they aren't releasing radically redesigned cars. A classic design doesn't warrant being updated unless there is a good compelling reason to do so.

Regarding the video card, again, by the time we're seeing 512 megs of VRAM being taken advantage of, even current video cards will be out of date. As it is, on the notebook side, you really generally only see this on the highest-end video cards anyway used in those massive 17" gaming notebooks, etc.

Anyway though, if you are so obsessed with specifications, go and get a PC notebook with the latest Core 2 Duos, a 7900GTX with 512megs of video RAM, etc. and be happy with it. If you're so obsessed with companies who release completely new designs every year trying to find something that works, and companies that spit out machines with the latest specs, then you will be well served by Dell or Toshiba or HP or even Sony.

It sounds like you are also dissatisfied with the performance of Tiger, so you should just love the performance of Windows XP and Vista on those PC notebooks (make sure to wipe out the tons of bloatware though).

-Zadillo

i agree with you on several points. i think the case of the mbp is great and doesn't need updating. i mean, why update it just for the sake of updating.

but it is puzzling why c2d has not made it into mbps yet when others are shipping.

also, i have to disagree with you. tiger is a resource hog. i'd love to see (not sure how engineering feasible this is) to have a basic version (quick) and a more robust version (for pro stuff).

but that's just me ... i've always felt that os x was a little sluggish.

[mac128k-1984]

You mean to tell me that a rumor site is wrong - didn't see that coming.

Really you guys should not base your purchasing on what those sites say. They're wrong more then they're right.

If you need a machine now, but now, if not wait. There is always going to be a newer, faster computer being released around the corner buy something and be content.

[houstonmacbro]

funny.

[ViktorCode]

My prediction on Merom MBP: They won't appear until Q1'07. Current generation of Merom CPUs is limited by 667 MHz front side bus - this is dictated by the old 945M chipset. Of course 667 MHz has nothing to do with CPU micro architecture itself since desktop Core 2 enjoys its healthy 1067 MHz bus.

Intel has plans on releasing Santa Rose mobile platform in Q1'07 that essentially is mobile counterpart of 965P desktop solution and that will bring 800 MHz FSB together with Robson technology for mobile users (Robson stands for built-in flash memory disk cache). At the same time the second generation of Merom CPUs with 800 MHz FSB will hit the market.

I think it is reasonable for Apple to skip first generation of Merom CPUs that gives only a small performance advantage over Core Duo, and wait until next generation that will be more distinct in its performance and power saving figures (thanks Robson). In my opinion Robson technology is alone enough to postpone MBP purchase.

[lucksmith]

As has been my experience the mac faithful are slavish in their defense of anything on the platform. I will give the community it's points on the issue of hard drive performance and sure one can elect to choose non apple ram. Nevertheless not a single person has addressed my issue of lack on a next generation optical drive. This is very unlike apple who was quickly to the fore with their original dvd ram drives. Also as perfect as the powerbook design was nearly 4.. I repeat 4 years ago, it demonstrates a failure to innovate, unless you consider adding in an i-sight and front row groundbreaking. For all your studious defenses of the mac book pro it is a dinosaur, and again what of an ultraportable option ala the 12" powerbook? Now on the flipside, the Mac Pro and IMac are tour de forces in many ways. The Macbook, is well at least competitive. There remains after nearly four years no irresistable argument for upgrading my powerbook G4 unitl the next sea change in design. Chances are my having to wait till MacWorld Expo in January will make me glad I did. At which point there will be the inevitable hand wringing of those buyers who bought in the fall/winter cycle of an implementation. Will I buy a PC laptop.. No . Will I remain impatient to upgrade... hell yes.

[zaghahzag]

i think apple has had some serious and costly quality problems with the MBs (the BMPs don't seem to suffer so much).. Why do i say this? Because everyone that I know who has a macbook (4) has had to send it back for either a bad MB, spontaneous shutting down, or bad video. That's 0/4.

I'd be willing to bet that now that they've finally got the problems sorted out, they want to sell some trouble free machines before they upgrade them very much. They will release the core2s before thanksgiving.. probably in the next few weeks, and hopefully, they're testing the crap out of them, so they don't have so many issues.

lucksmith, i agree w/ you on the top-end lappy specs, but apple's laptops aren't huge hulking beasts. if you want fast 250 gig hds and giant video cards in a mac, you'd need to at least double the thickness of the base, and apple won't ever do that. Personally, i think they'd sell a lot of mobile imacs. Then you could have your video card, fast and big HDs, extra sized optical drive, etc. but it'd be a hulking beast.