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Jim Paradise · Jul 15, 2004, 05:25 PM

And although I've played with it a bit at a friend's house, it really hadn't sunk in how much the new Finder absolutely bloody well sucks! The brushed metal is bulky and out of place (often I find myself hitting Apple-Q to close windows for some reason thinking that it's an iApp), the sidebar is daft and cluttered, and what the **** is the point of having Column View if it doesn't show me the previous folders?!?

Sorry; I know this'll sound all pissy, but I absolutely detest this Finder and needed to vent. It makes me even more sad that Apple apparently has done little work to improve the Finder's UI in 10.4 (from the screens, previews, etc., that I've seen). First thing is to get my links up to apps back up in the title bar, and then Aquafy the Finder with whatever tools possible.

Okay... move along now. Nothing more to see.

*edit* Are there any programs that hack the Finder so that Column View acts as it did in 10.2?

wataru · Jul 15, 2004, 06:12 PM

Wow, welcome to a year ago.

If you don't like the sidebar then just close it. And there are no changes in column behavior! It still shows you just as much as it always did. Perhaps the window you were using only showed one pane; did you try widening the window or adjusting the column width? Did you actually use it for more than 30 seconds?

Thank you for an extremely crappy, ignorant post.

mdc · Jul 15, 2004, 06:12 PM

there is still a year left until 10.4 comes out, maybe apple will do more work on the finder. i like the sidebar in the finder, i find it really useful.

especially when an app's save dialog box mirrors your sidebar.

SMacTech · Jul 15, 2004, 06:13 PM

Originally posted by wataru:
Wow, welcome to a year ago.

If you don't like the sidebar then just close it.

That's what I thought too. At first the Panther Finder didn't impress me until I started to use it. Now I don't like the way it was in the pre-Panther days.

I think he doesn't like how column view will not navigate to the root of the drive if you select your home folder as a starting point. Just click on your computer icon and navigate the entire drive.

Terri · Jul 15, 2004, 06:49 PM

I love Panther's Finder and think it is the best Finder that Apple has ever made.

The sidebar rocks and makes the open/save dialogs very easy to use.

I do wish the open/save dialogs behaved like a regular Finder window� maybe in 10.4.

Jim Paradise · Jul 15, 2004, 06:57 PM

Originally posted by wataru:
Wow, welcome to a year ago.

If you don't like the sidebar then just close it. And there are no changes in column behavior! It still shows you just as much as it always did. Perhaps the window you were using only showed one pane; did you try widening the window or adjusting the column width? Did you actually use it for more than 30 seconds?

Thank you for an extremely crappy, ignorant post.

Ignorant, well, that's disputable. I did say that the post would sound (and was) pissy and that I was just ventin'. I know well enough to mess around with the options and preferences to change them so that things work as one would like such as getting rid of the sidebar. Still, that doesn't answer the question as to why Apple got rid of the ability to navigate back without having to do an Apple↑. SMacTech got what I was talking about.

Oh, and you're welcome! Happy to oblige you.

Not all of us immediately rushed out to buy Panther when it was released.

Jim Paradise · Jul 15, 2004, 06:59 PM

Originally posted by mdc:
there is still a year left until 10.4 comes out, maybe apple will do more work on the finder. i like the sidebar in the finder, i find it really useful.

especially when an app's save dialog box mirrors your sidebar.

I do enjoy the sidebar in the Open/Save dialogue box, ironically. Apple definitely improved on the Open/Save dialogue boxes.

And yes, there is still a year before 10.4 comes out. I think is or was a recent thread in the GUI Customization forum about some of the changes seen in the demo that Steve showed and that it looks like there might be more of an Aqua/Brushed Metal option available (from what I infered from the discussion). Apple does a lot of great work, and here's to hoping that the GUI will only improve.

*edited* And while I don't like the sidebar, I wouldn't have Apple remove it. With the Finder Aquafied, it doesn't look so bad, but I have it closed. The brushed metal Finder seemed ridiculously bulky and cluttered looking open first using it, and the sidebar seemed, to me, an addition to that cluttered look. But options are always a good thing!

wataru · Jul 15, 2004, 08:47 PM

Originally posted by Jim Paradise:
SMacTech got what I was talking about.

Ah. Yeah, that can be annoying, but if you hate the sidebar that much you should just close it. Then it acts just like Jaguar's Finder, although you don't have the buttons on the top.

There's also the path toolbar item you can add that will give you a pop-down menu to access higher-level directories.

lookmark · 10:46 PM

I'm always a bit baffled by people saying that they hate the Sidebar. I find that it makes the Finder so much smarter, and easier to use...

But anyway, as everyone else has been saying, you're free to snap the Sidebar shut if you really don't like it. It can also be resized to just icon size and take a very small amount of space.

And if you're willing to give up the toolbar (and just use the handy keyboard shortcuts in the Go menu, if you need to navigate somewhere instantly), you have the option of hiding the toolbar... and returning to the sleeker Aqua Finder in column view.

Give it a try for a few days and explore your options before continuing your rant.

arekkusu · Jul 16, 2004, 02:26 AM

IMHO: the sidebar is not a bad idea, but Panther's Finder is still total crap.

If you also hate it, send Apple feedback telling them so, and why. Maybe they'll fix it for Tiger.

Zadian · Jul 16, 2004, 06:39 AM

Originally posted by SMacTech:
I think he doesn't like how column view will not navigate to the root of the drive if you select your home folder as a starting point. Just click on your computer icon and navigate the entire drive.

Or use keyboard shortcuts to navigate in column view:

The arrow key can be used to go up/down and forward/back in column view.

Option and arrow up will go to the parent folder (not only in column view) and if the folder is in the sidebar it will show the entire path to the parent folder. So if you have the home folder in the sidebar and want to go to the User folder just use option-arrow up.

Option and arrow left will go to the previous folder.

In my opinion the sidebar is very useful. Displaying the volumes in the sidebar is very useful.

Jim Paradise · Jul 16, 2004, 08:09 AM

Originally posted by lookmark:
I'm always a bit baffled by people saying that they hate the Sidebar. I find that it makes the Finder so much smarter, and easier to use...

But anyway, as everyone else has been saying, you're free to snap the Sidebar shut if you really don't like it. It can also be resized to just icon size and take a very small amount of space.

And if you're willing to give up the toolbar (and just use the handy keyboard shortcuts in the Go menu, if you need to navigate somewhere instantly), you have the option of hiding the toolbar... and returning to the sleeker Aqua Finder in column view.

Give it a try for a few days and explore your options before continuing your rant.

Yeah, no worries on me continuing my little annoyed ramble. I was just shocked at how cluttered (to me), the Finder looked in Panther when I first installed it and have a good bit of a geeky vent.

And for the moment I've got the sidebar closed. No worries.

I also Aquaized the Finder which helps out with how it looks and works (IMHO), too.

Jim Paradise · Jul 16, 2004, 08:09 AM

Originally posted by arekkusu:
IMHO: the sidebar is not a bad idea, but Panther's Finder is still total crap.

If you also hate it, send Apple feedback telling them so, and why. Maybe they'll fix it for Tiger.

Yup, feedback will be sent to Apple very soon.

Spheric Harlot · Jul 16, 2004, 08:48 AM

Originally posted by Zadian:
Option and arrow up will go to the parent folder (not only in column view) and if the folder is in the sidebar it will show the entire path to the parent folder. So if you have the home folder in the sidebar and want to go to the User folder just use option-arrow up.

Option and arrow left will go to the previous folder.

No.

COMMAND (Apple) + arrow keys will do what you describe.

Zadian · Jul 16, 2004, 09:02 AM

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
No.

COMMAND (Apple) + arrow keys will do what you describe.

You are right - I always confuse the English names for those keys. Thank you for the clarification.

sushiism · Jul 16, 2004, 09:39 AM

Originally posted by Jim Paradise:
And although I've played with it a bit at a friend's house, it really hadn't sunk in how much the new Finder absolutely bloody well sucks! The brushed metal is bulky and out of place (often I find myself hitting Apple-Q to close windows for some reason thinking that it's an iApp), the sidebar is daft and cluttered, and what the **** is the point of having Column View if it doesn't show me the previous folders?!?

Sorry; I know this'll sound all pissy, but I absolutely detest this Finder and needed to vent. It makes me even more sad that Apple apparently has done little work to improve the Finder's UI in 10.4 (from the screens, previews, etc., that I've seen). First thing is to get my links up to apps back up in the title bar, and then Aquafy the Finder with whatever tools possible.

Okay... move along now. Nothing more to see.

*edit* Are there any programs that hack the Finder so that Column View acts as it did in 10.2?

I agree and it always gets covered in redraw errors about 5 times a day, I just use finder the spatial way now its so much nicer than the browser fad and its one of the things I love the most about macos over other operating systems.

ApeInTheShell · Jul 16, 2004, 12:01 PM

An even better option for the Finder dilemna....

Use Terminal! Hooray!

goose · Jul 16, 2004, 12:34 PM

Originally posted by SMacTech:
[.....]

I think he doesn't like how column view will not navigate to the root of the drive if you select your home folder as a starting point. Just click on your computer icon and navigate the entire drive.

Which almost makes using column view more of a pain if you have to keep navigating the whole drive. I can kinda see the complaint here. I guess I'm lucky I don't use column view (all that much).

typoon · Jul 16, 2004, 12:44 PM

At first I didn't like the sidebar but It's great. I use it all the time. It's great for when you ahve stuff on the Desktop and need to move it to a folder such as the utilities folder. Just drag and drop it over the folder and it goes there. It' odd going back to the Jag finder now that I've been using the Panther one since it's release.

mishap · Jul 16, 2004, 01:05 PM

Try Path Finder.

I dont use it (use Quicksilver for just about everything), but it is very customizable

Jim Paradise · Jul 16, 2004, 03:04 PM

Originally posted by sushiism:
I agree and it always gets covered in redraw errors about 5 times a day, I just use finder the spatial way now its so much nicer than the browser fad and its one of the things I love the most about macos over other operating systems.

The redraw errors are pretty bloody annoying, that's for sure. So far I've just set up my Finder windows to a larger size and have been leaving them there like that as to try and avoid the redraw errors.

I guess my biggest annoyace in all of this is that I've been using OS X since the PB days, and adopted to changes right away since I thought they were an improvement to the old Classic days (more in terms of Aqua over Classic, etc.). But when I loaded up Panther, it seemed a step backwards. I consider the Finder's UI of both 10.2 and 9 a step above the Finder in 10.3. There's something, well, many things (again, IMHO) that just make it seem as though Apple hadn't thought out 10.3's Finder particularly well, and slapped on a new UI for the sake of it.

Jim Paradise · Jul 16, 2004, 03:08 PM

Originally posted by mishap:
Try Path Finder.

I dont use it (use Quicksilver for just about everything), but it is very customizable

I'll give it a shot.

Groovy · Jul 16, 2004, 07:15 PM

Originally posted by wataru:
Ah. Yeah, that can be annoying, but if you hate the sidebar that much you should just close it. Then it acts just like Jaguar's Finder, although you don't have the buttons on the top.

hmmm... I have buttons at the top. What buttons did you lose? When i close
the side bar that is the only thing that changes in all finder windows.

do this for me. Click the finder icon in the dock. Now grab the sidebar
separator (it has a dot in the middle) and drag it to the left to close the sidebar.
now navigate around in that window. All my top buttons are still there no matter
where I go. All new windows are created like that also from then on etc....