[GusR9]

hello to everyone
I am planning to buy a new Apple MacBook this summer for college but after Apple announced the delay of Leopard until October I dont know what should I do. I have the hope that the new line of Intel processors (Centrino Pro) will be avaible for the MacBook soon enough at least for mid July it sounds very logical because it has been 164 days since the last update of the MacBook line (the average is 204) for July have passed away more than 200 days since the last update (and more than 250 for the MacBook Pro) and that for me it's too much...I also support my theory that summer is the second most important season of the year for Macs (after Christmas) and that is because school season starts and Apple tends to update his computers more soon than later, if Apple release the new line of MacBooks by October with the release of Leopard almost a year could pass away for the MacBook which is the best selling Mac and for that time many PC makers like Dell, HP could have Centrino Pro on their computers (IMPORTANT!! I dont want a PC I just try to focus on the PC market) and that it's not good for Apple.
So...what should I do?
I would buy my MacBook (hopefully soon) with the new Intel Centrino Pro and then buy Leopard on October and that it would perfect for me (after all Tiger its OK).
What do you think about that?
There's at least a little chance of having a new MacBook line for this summer? (so I can buy one)

[brokenjago]

I imagine that the MBPs and MBs will be updated with Santa Rosa.

[butterfly0fdoom]

Santa Rosa comes out on May 9th, a Wednesday. I'd expect to see a new MBP with Santa Rosa the following Tuesday, and then a MacBook with Santa Rosa two weeks later (the Core 2 updates were about 2 weeks apart after 6 months since each was updated, and Apple needs the MacBook to be updated before the summer Back-To-School season, providing a logical basis for my estimation.). I'm waiting on the Santa Rosa MacBook, as well.

[brokenjago]

What do you need that the Santa Rosa chipset will provide for the Macbook, out of curiosity?

[butterfly0fdoom]

Well, my dad (who's more technical about computers than I am) says the faster front side bus is worth the wait. Until he read that there was a faster front side bus, he was telling me that it doesn't matter if I wait or not since he figured the upgrades would mostly benefit Vista users than Mac users. I technically don't need the computer until September, anyway, but my Mac mini and iBook drive me insane sometimes (because I have the horrible habit of running Adobe apps while having 3 other apps open, or Garageband in the place of an Adobe app).

[im_noahselby]

I'm in the same boat as you. I am hoping that Apple updates the MacBook line before August, so that I can take advantage of any updates to the new machines. I'm not expecting much of an upgrade, because there isn't much more Apple can add to the new books that isn't already there, but anything they do add is worth waiting a month or so for.

- maybe they will bring the black colour down the line-up a little
- faster front side bus
- faster, increased hard drive storage
- more ram (one can always hope!)
- better graphics card (doubtful, but it would be nice)
- free back to school iPod nano offer?

Have I missed anything that is likely to be upgraded, when Apple updates the new machines?

Noah

[mduell]

Originally Posted by im_noahselby 

- more ram (one can always hope!)

4GB dual-channel should become an option, and I wouldn't be surprised to see 1GB become the base config.

Originally Posted by im_noahselby 

- better graphics card (doubtful, but it would be nice)

Extremely likely, since 965GM includes GMA 3000 or X3000; a big bump over GMA 950.

[gummialien]

Looks like I'm in the same boat as you Gus.

I think noah got most of it in his post but one thing that I'm hoping for is a non glossy screen option. I've owned a glossy screen Sony for 3 years and the glare, when not under florescent lighting, fatigues my eyes.

[GusR9]

I'm will start university this summer I certainly need a new and a good notebook, the MacBook is my unanimous decision is all I want and well all I need is to have the security that I'm going to have a good computer for the next two or three years (because I'm sure that I'm not going to change of laptop every 1 or 2 years) that's why I want to wait for the processors or at least a decent upgrade I can wait for Leopard with the new upgrade so that's not a problem. I dont really need or expect something else that the current line of the MacBook doesnt have, well maybe more ram 3 or 4 GB and an standard of 2 it could be great, and upgrade of the CPU, anything else it would be extra for me so I'm anxious about the next upgrade that hopefully is before September so I can start college with a MacBook

[brettcamp]

Originally Posted by im_noahselby 

Have I missed anything that is likely to be upgraded, when Apple updates the new machines?

Dunno if it'll happen this time around, but there have been rumors that Apple will eventually shift at least some of its laptops to flash memory rather than hard drives, which would seem an advantage in power consumption and durability. The price may not come down enough to do that for awhile, or they may do it only on the rumored ultralight notebook. There's also been talk of switching to LED displays, which use less power. Anybody have an idea if/when these changes will happen?
Oh, and here's a site that collects such speculation, FWIW.

[brokenjago]

It's not going to happen in the MacBook. Santa Rosa has Flash memory on Board to help boot times and load some apps, but they're not going to replace the HDD.

[zubro]

Originally Posted by mduell 

Extremely likely, since 965GM includes GMA 3000 or X3000; a big bump over GMA 950.

OK, but what does that mean in English?
I found this on wiki:
It can also share up to 384MB of RAM with the computer's CPU
Could this be true?
384 MB of VRAM would be real nice on an iBook!

[brokenjago]

VRAM has very little performance impact on most apps, including many games.

What is nice is that it's a much more powerful GPU. I believe it supports DX9 and even has Hardware T&L!

[mduell]

Originally Posted by zubro 

OK, but what does that mean in English?
I found this on wiki:
It can also share up to 384MB of RAM with the computer's CPU
Could this be true?
384 MB of VRAM would be real nice on an iBook!

GMA 3000 and X3000 are the new integrated graphics cores from Intel; they're quite a bit faster than the current GMA 950 (used in the MacBook/Mac mini/iMac).
As the other poster said, VRAM isn't that important.

[brokenjago]

That's all I am to you? The "other poster"? You don't even have the good taste to refer to me by my screen name?

What cheek!

[butterfly0fdoom]

Originally Posted by brokenjago 

What is nice is that it's a much more powerful GPU. I believe it supports DX9 and even has Hardware T&L!

Only the X3000; I'd expect Apple to cheapen out and toss in the 3000 instead.

[rafg]

If you dont need it yet dont worry about it.
The reason I got mine was because of a great financing offer at compusa.
if you have a mini just upgrade its ram for now so you get a performance boost (newegg has 2 gb of ram for it for about $150)
Your adobe apps will run faster. Also get CS3 (however you can) that will boost your adobe speeds too.

You keep obsessing over the macbook now and you will get one sooner than you want.
Maybe waiting till they offer a deal of a free ipod with macbook purchase (usually will offer these deals closer to the end of a product cycle)

[hempcamp]

I find that "planning" purchases based on supposed release dates or suspected upgrades is pointless. Unless something is really imminent, buy the Mac Book when you need the Mac Book and be happy.

(I just did this myself. To hell with waiting for the next incremental upgrade. I can't carry this G5 around with me!)

--Chris

[amazing]

There's a real "art" to buying a laptop for college. Namely, keeping the costs reasonable, and planning ahead budget-wise so that you're able to buy the best education-deal at the very end, just before you no longer qualify for the discounts or the freebies.

One way to afford a better model, is to wait for the back-to-school free iPod deal, which you sell off "package-unopened." Or you keep the new model and sell off your old iPod.

Basic question: do you a have a Mac that you can use at college until either Leopard comes out, or until the newer model/revisions come out, or until you see the best back-to-school deal you can afford? Of these choices, waiting for the next expected revision is most important, provided you've got something to tide you over at college until it comes out.

Next most important decision is glossy vs matte. Eye-fatigue is a big factor, because you're going to be staring at that screen for endless hours in college.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by hempcamp 

I find that "planning" purchases based on supposed release dates or suspected upgrades is pointless.

In the PowerPC era, sure. The only thing to go on was "$foo product hasn't been updated in 9 months", "a major conference is coming", or "Tuesday". The Intel era is a whole different ballgame; we know what's going to be available, when, and for what price. The only guessing game is how long Apple will lag to implement the upgrades (typically 0-1.5 months) and what the other specs of the machine will be (typically marginal upgrades over what the previous machine had for RAM/HDD, often reusing the GPU for 2 generations).

[im_noahselby]

Well, I bit the bullet and purchased a black MacBook yesterday. I was going to wait for the next upgrade cycle, but that could still be several months away, especially when you take into consideration waiting for the newer models to ship. For, me it was saving over $150 Canadian on the notebook that sold me on it. I wanted the black model, but always found it out of reach because of it's higher price point. I bought it from Staples (14 day return policy, no re-stocking fee) and they also had a free printer and iPod shuffle offer, but I didn't bother with it. I got the last one and it was pixel perfect and whisper quiet. So far, I couldn't be happier with the purchase. Sure, upgrades are looming on the horizon, but I got this notebook for a great price and a slight boost to the graphics card and processor doesn't really matter all that much to me. If someone were to give me the choice of slight incremental upgrades or $150 off the sticker price, I'd choose the latter hands down. So for those of you guys still waiting, you might want to check out Staples or another store, as many stores are beginning to clear out their MacBooks and pass the savings on to you. If slight upgrades and a possibly long wait don't amuse you, you might just want to bite the bullet

Now, if Apple releases the new MacBooks with a dedicated graphics card or offers the black Macbook as the base model, I will be kicking myself senseless, but what are the odds of something like this happening.. (I'd predict: not likely)

Noah

[im_noahselby]

double post

[GusR9]

May has arrived, when the new line of MacBooks and Pros will be out??
Other companies like Dell and HP has already presented their new laps...

[ajprice]

Originally Posted by GusR9 

May has arrived, when the new line of MacBooks and Pros will be out??
Other companies like Dell and HP has already presented their new laps...

Well, they have announced new computers with Santa Rosa, but they aren't available yet because Santa Rosa isn't released yet. Apple do things in a different way, very rarely do they say 'we are going to release a new computer 2 weeks on Tuesday' or whatever, especially with a new tech like Santa Rosa. They usually release and announce on the same day, either by Stevenote or website update.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by ajprice 

Well, they have announced new computers with Santa Rosa, but they aren't available yet because Santa Rosa isn't released yet. Apple do things in a different way, very rarely do they say 'we are going to release a new computer 2 weeks on Tuesday' or whatever, especially with a new tech like Santa Rosa. They usually release and announce on the same day, either by Stevenote or website update.

Apparently you missed about half of the new Mac releases in the last 3 years. Apple routinely announces products that won't be available for weeks or months, especially if they have a trade show.

[acash0902]

Originally Posted by butterfly0fdoom 

Santa Rosa comes out on May 9th, a Wednesday. I'd expect to see a new MBP with Santa Rosa the following Tuesday, and then a MacBook with Santa Rosa two weeks later (the Core 2 updates were about 2 weeks apart after 6 months since each was updated, and Apple needs the MacBook to be updated before the summer Back-To-School season, providing a logical basis for my estimation.). I'm waiting on the Santa Rosa MacBook, as well.

^^i really hope your predictions are true about the release

Yeap im in the sameee boat as half you guys. Santa Rosa will be release in two days, and with an upgraded FBS to 800 MHz, i suggest all you wait.

Also i was reading around in other forums and this guy who works at an authorized reseller of apple computers stated that the store computers have all canceled orders of macbooks and macbook pros C2D models and he says this usually happens when there is an update. to be released

[ajprice]

Originally Posted by mduell 

Apparently you missed about half of the new Mac releases in the last 3 years. Apple routinely announces products that won't be available for weeks or months, especially if they have a trade show.

For spec bumps, yes.

[zubro]

Originally Posted by brokenjago 

VRAM has very little performance impact on most apps, including many games.

What is nice is that it's a much more powerful GPU. I believe it supports DX9 and even has Hardware T&L!

OK, VRAM has always been quite important to me!
I used to do a lot of Photoshop + Video work on my macs...
Now, I do iWork .. but still play around with Photoshop, Illustrator and InDesign, there, VRAM is still something to consider.

The funny thing is that a better GPU can do a lot, for example, on the new iBooks, you can get twice as many frames as on the G4 ones... that is cool, but would it help with pro apps? That I don t know..

[tavin64]

Apple is shipping new santa rosa MacBook Pros next week. A friend who works at an apple store told me they have stopped receiving new shipments of the current MBP. No idea when macbooks will be getting the upgrade but it will probably be a couple of weeks after the mbp. Plus I dont think that any macbooks or mbps will come with centrino pro platform because of the cost. PC wise the price premium for robson is looking somewhat high right now and I dont think apple wants to release 2 different versions of the macbook pro.

But other than that the rest of the santa rosa goodies will be there, 800mhz bus core2duos, X3100 graphics for mb and better power consumption. Who knows if the macbook pros will get the newly released 8 series nvidia gpus but it seems likely.

[vtboyarc]

ok, so here we are later on, is santa rosa on macbook yet? when will they get the new graphics card? I need a laptop before college, but I want a better graphics card than the gma 950!!

[mduell]

Originally Posted by vtboyarc 

ok, so here we are later on, is santa rosa on macbook yet? when will they get the new graphics card? I need a laptop before college, but I want a better graphics card than the gma 950!!

No, SR is not in the MB.
No one knows when they will upgrade it.
Buy a MBP.

[vtboyarc]

but do u think they will at least add a better graphics card? I won't buy a macbook until it comes with a better graphics card. I can't afford a pro.

[tavin64]

X3100 on Santa Rosa is a bit of a step up from gma950. The current drivers out for it have yet to tap the full capability of the chipset. Intel is releasing new updated drivers in June that will open up DX10 layers among other tweaks. Robson is only on the Centrino Pro version of Santa Rosa, which is very unlikely to make it to mb and mbps. Also the comment about VRAM amount not very important is untrue. For example in games, vram is very important when it comes to handling the textures. Most games nowadays including FPS, mmos, and others use very large textures. The more vram the more textures it can load at once. This greatly impacts the performance. X3100 can now allocate 256mb of ram for vram whereas gma950 had a max of 128mb. You will see a very decent jump in performance. While this does not mean that you can now game at ultra setting at a very high resolution, it does mean that you can turn up the image quality at your current setting without suffering a performance hit. As far as pro applications are concerned like photoshop and such if you work with very large images you will benefit from more vram. Hell you can even tell how subpar gma950 is nowadays if you go to a flash heavy website and notice the slowdown you will encounter. And that has nothing to do with ram because you can have 2gb of ram on your machine and you will still encounter a slowdown on the browser.

[butterfly0fdoom]

The GMA950's still pretty reasonable. It's still quite an improvement over the 32 MB ATi discrete chip that the old iBooks used.

[Simon]

Originally Posted by vtboyarc 

but do u think they will at least add a better graphics card?

They can't. The GMA X3100 requires the SR chipset. As long as the MB sticks to Napa and integrated graphics the GMA 950 is all you'll get. I wouldn't count on another MB update soon. If you need more than a GMA 950 you should be getting a MBP (those will likely be updated soon btw). If you can't afford one (have you considered the refurbished C2D 2.16 GHz model for $1599?), you'll have to get a MB with its GMA 950.

[vtboyarc]

but they might update to santa rosa in june, and possibly add a better graphics card then? I mean, apple must realize how graphics get better all the time, and their pathetic gma 950 is way outdated.

[butterfly0fdoom]

Originally Posted by vtboyarc 

but they might update to santa rosa in june, and possibly add a better graphics card then? I mean, apple must realize how graphics get better all the time, and their pathetic gma 950 is way outdated.

The GMA isn't as horrible as you all make it out to be. -____- Coming from a ThinkPad with a discrete graphics chip, I'd say the GMA is probably as capable. It just shares RAM. Big deal.

Apple most likely won't update MacBooks again in June, only MBPs.

[coolmacdude]

Originally Posted by butterfly0fdoom 

The GMA950's still pretty reasonable. It's still quite an improvement over the 32 MB ATi discrete chip that the old iBooks used.

I have to agree with this, I just upgraded to a new Macbook with the gma950 from a Powerbook which had a 32mb radeon 7500 and the graphics on the Macbook is noticeably faster (I'd say at least 3-4x faster) even with 3d games. Obviously it's still not anywhere near the MBP's X1600 card but it's still a nice improvement over older chipsets.

[Simon]

The GMA 950's weakness isn't the update over the previous 9200. It pales in comparison to what a GMA X3100 offers. At the time the 9200 was already a very weak GPU even though it had its own VRAM. So it comes as no surprise that a much faster CPU and chipset together with a GMA 950 perform better. But if you consider that at supposedly the same cost, Apple could have put in a far superior GMA variant, you see where the disappointment of using a GMA 950 in a new MB today comes from.

And regarding a SR MB, I really doubt Apple will update the MB again in July just to introduce the SR chipset. In order not to compete with the CPU clock on the MBP (which will be 2.4 and 2.2 GHz), they would have to actually use lower clocked versions of Merom (1.8 and 2.0 GHz) than they are using now. It doesn't sound like Apple to introduce an 'update' with lower CPU clock (even if the chipset and GPU were improved).

[aikiwav]

I'm piggybacking on this thread because I'm also considering a MacBook, but my main concern is the problems in the MacBook that I've read about--unusually high heating, power cord melting, random shutdowns, screen problems--are these problems a thing of the past or is this a "buyer beware"? (It seemed like many of the posts are from people who purchased a MacBook in 2006 or early 2007.)

I'm assuming that these MacBooks won't be updated anytime soon, so if I want to avoid these problems, should I look elsewhere for a laptop? Thanks for your opinions and info.

[Johnny Dangerously]

Originally Posted by aikiwav 

...I'm also considering a MacBook, but my main concern is the problems in the MacBook that I've read about...

I too am on the verge of buying a new BlackBook and, like you, I'm concerned with the problems I seem to be constantly reading about. But I remember reading a quote from Apple's own discussion boards, that went something like, "remember, these forums are like the 'emergency room' of Apple products... no one's going to stop by here just to post 'hey, guys, my Mac's doing perfectly!'"

But I don't feel very comforted by that, so I'd understand if you didn't either. I don't really have a choice in my purchase, since (1) I need a Mac, (2) I need a notebook, and (3) I can't afford a MacBook Pro. So now I have to consider AppleCare and making sure I buy from an Apple Retail Store that I can return to that same day if I have a problem with the new machine.

Hope this helps...? *shrug*

"Johnny Dangerously"
Your resident fargin' icehole

[aikiwav]

Johnny,
I thought about that same thing right after I posted, that people who don't have problems aren't likely to run to a forum to post. On the other hand, it seems like some of these problems were very widespread. I'm in a similar position in that I want a notebook and I can only afford a Macbook...I guess I'm looking for some one who follows Mac more closely than I to mention whether or not the problems' frequencies are decreasing, or if these are problems that will be expected to be around until a major redesign. Again, thanks for your thoughts.

[butterfly0fdoom]

Well, the only problem my BlackBook has had so far (it's only been a week) is a non-tactile "S" key (so, naturally, I'm getting the keyboard replaced).