[sph]

Supposedly Apple will be including 3G and GPS support in the new iPhone models coming out in the 1st quarter of 2008. Makes me want to put my phone up on eBay... I know technology changes quickly but this is getting ridiculous. First the price drop and now the coveted 3G technology that should have been included in the first place.

MacNN | Report: 3G/GPS iPhone due in Q1 of 2008

[mduell]

3G and GPS were both available before the iPhone was released... that they would be coming out next year is actually kinda late to the party.

The industry appears to move fast after you pay a premium for ancient technology.

[sph]

Yes, I'm well aware thtat 3G and GPS technology have been around for some time now. But that's exactly my point....the phone should have had it in the first place and now only 6 months into it the entire platform will change. Oh well.

[analogika]

Have you seen the battery life on a Nokia N95 (which has both GPS and 3G)?

It's about HALF that of the iPhone, apparently.

Ridiculous.

Apart from that, the N95's GPS reception is a joke compared to a *real* GPS unit.

3G okay, but I really don't want GPS built in. I *DO* want the ability to connect to a decent $40 GPS device via Bluetooth.

[mduell]

Well 'good' news, the UK gets the same outdated phone the US has.

[jbleisure]

yes on one of the worst networks, O2. They will only have 30% EDGE converage by the time the iPhone is released. Sad.

[threestain]

edge network? why bother? what would have actually worked is waiting until the version 2 comes out - because in the UK the market is far too advanced for such a poor phone. It's a shame because it has fantastic features tacked onto a poor mobile phone background...

[butterfly0fdoom]

Originally Posted by analogika 

3G okay, but I really don't want GPS built in. I *DO* want the ability to connect to a decent $40 GPS device via Bluetooth.

I'd rather have GSM triangulation (whatever the term was, the stuff they use to figure out where you are when you call 911 on a cellphone). Apparently, it can be used for GPS purposes, from what I read somewhere.

[Cold Warrior]

Originally Posted by butterfly0fdoom 

I'd rather have GSM triangulation (whatever the term was, the stuff they use to figure out where you are when you call 911 on a cellphone). Apparently, it can be used for GPS purposes, from what I read somewhere.

It's nowhere near as accurate as GPS. 'Triangulation' on GSM would work by calculating your estimated distance from various cell panels (most 'towers' consist of 3-4 directional antennas) and then estimating your approximate location from that data. However, if you're in a rural area pulling service from only one high-power tower ('macro-cell'), your location becomes far less accurate. Basically, the fewer the towers and the farther away you are, the less accurate your approximate location -- margins of error measured in 9+ kilometers, potentially, as opposed to 1 or less km.

[butterfly0fdoom]

Originally Posted by Cold Warrior 

It's nowhere near as accurate as GPS. 'Triangulation' on GSM would work by calculating your estimated distance from various cell panels (most 'towers' consist of 3-4 directional antennas) and then estimating your approximate location from that data. However, if you're in a rural area pulling service from only one high-power tower ('macro-cell'), your location becomes far less accurate. Basically, the fewer the towers and the farther away you are, the less accurate your approximate location -- margins of error measured in 9+ kilometers, potentially, as opposed to 1 or less km.

Oh well. I'm happy with Gmail's directions. I just wish Apple (or someone) would release some sort of "iPod Dash Dock" for easier viewing. Kinda hard to drive while holding the iPhone in a visible location...

[::maroma::]

There are plenty of documented reasons that came straight from Apple that explain why they didn't put 3G and GPS in the iPhone 1.0. Both of those things will be added eventually, exactly when Apple feels its time to do so.

If they would've put both of those things in this version of the iPhone, you'd all be bitching about horrible battery life and the sheer bulk of the thing, and/or how the GPS unit sucks compared to "real" GPS units. Think about it. Go use other phone with this technology for any real period of time.

Have some patience. When Apple implements those things you can be damn sure it wont be done at the sacrifice of other very important things.

[SEkker]

I think some people forget - this is Apple's FIRST phone. And first OSX-based iPod. And first thin client for the internet.

And it works pretty well. It delivers what it promised - Edge DOES connect you to google maps and email almost across the US. Wifi hotspots gets you decent internet access - without paying for the extra 3G bandwidth or the extra hardware and larger battery.

I see Apple updating the phone over the next few years such that the current model is the 'classic'; people will be able to buy an uber phone with 3.xG/GPS/high mag camera and other assorted bells and whistles (the 17" laptop style of phone), might be too big to fit in some people's pockets; and maybe an iPhone 'nano' that is a flip phone 'nano' when closed, a basic phone when open.

Getting the basic first phone out the door is a big task - Apple is entering a new market. Every new release will be much easier.

I'm amazed there haven't been more glitches, frankly.

I still wish they'd fix VPN to work with my business' Cisco system, tho!

[analogika]

Originally Posted by ::maroma:: 

There are plenty of documented reasons that came straight from Apple that explain why they didn't put 3G and GPS in the iPhone 1.0. Both of those things will be added eventually, exactly when Apple feels its time to do so.

I really hope GPS doesn't make it. Built-in GPS in non-dedicated devices sucks.

[TETENAL]

Originally Posted by analogika 

Built-in GPS in non-dedicated devices sucks.

Now this isn't a law of nature, is it? Let's hope that GPS makes it in once it doesn't suck.

[mduell]

SJobs mentioned at the event today that a 3G/GSM iPhone will be out next year.

[nonhuman]

Originally Posted by analogika 

I really hope GPS doesn't make it. Built-in GPS in non-dedicated devices sucks.

How could built-in GPS in an iPhone possibly suck? It would just make the already existing mapping application that much more useful and powerful. How awesome will it be to be able to whip out your iPhone and get a satelite image of the location you're standing at?

[analogika]

The same way built-in GPS in the N95 sucks.

It gets about a third of the satellites that a dedicated $40 device gets, and it SUCKS BATTERY LIFE like the MegaMaid.

That's two ways for you right there.

All I want is Bluetooth to support tethering to a *decent* GPS device.

Would also mean that people don't pay for it that don't need it.

[::maroma::]

I agree with analogika. I challenge anyone to find a cell phone with a built in GPS navigator that doesn't suck compared to stand alone GPS navigators, and that doesn't eat up battery life like mad.

The demand was there, Apple knew it, and Apple decided not to include it in this version. Apple sells experience more than they sell hardware and software. They left out plenty of features people wanted because it would seriously detract from the overall experience of using an iPhone. Apple will include these features. And they'll do it precisely when those features are ready to be included in the iPhone and won't take away from the overall experience.

Its OK to trust Apple. They are smart people. They have a vision and they know what they're doing. We're just along for the ride. We can enjoy it or we can bitch about how its not what we want. I choose to enjoy it.

[vln2]

I have to say that it was rather disappointing to read that Steve Jobs thinks that it may take till late next year for 3G iPhone. But I guess revamping local network infrastructure to 3G may take just as long.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/09/18/te...in&oref=slogin

I would not want to have GPS in my iPhone but I was hoping for a new model early in the year.

[Big Mac]

Apple can't win with the iPhone when it comes to this thread. Either it's crappy because it's not 3G, or Apple is way too aggressive in upgrading it/lowering its cost, thereby screwing over early adopters.

[Eriamjh]

Forget GPS and 3G. There is no way Apple is going to release a 3G iPhone in the first year to 18 months of the original iPhone. People got pissed the price was reduced. They'd be even more pissed if one year later a new phone they couldn't buy what was introduced because they are locked in a two-year contract.

Now this would mean that Apple would have to wait at almost two years for the next iPhone release, but I think they have a trick up their sleeves: contract extensions.

Negotiations with AT&T probably have terms for allowing people to end their contract early to sign up for another two years if a new iPhone is released. Expect Apple to release a new phone about every 18-22 months so they keep people upgrading. Don't forget they have to announce the phone 6 months before release or the FCC will do it for them. I expect no new announcements for an iPhone 3G, GPS, or whatever until about June-July of 2008.

Since Apple has a 5-year contract with AT&T, maybe Apple is pushing AT&T to upgrade to 3G to coincide wtih the upcoming 3G iPhone? Otherwise, 3G ain't gonna happen.

[nonhuman]

AT&T already has 3G, they don't need to upgrade. And Steve Jobs confirmed that we'd be getting a 3G iPhone in 2008: Confirmed: Jobs Confirms 3G iPhone Coming 2008 - Gizmodo.

[Gee4orce]

What's the point in GPS on a phone anyway ? you're most likely to want it for streetmaps when in a city - but GPS reception is terrible if there are tall buildings around, and most street have names and postcodes displayed anyway. If you're out walking in the country, then you'll get decent GPS reception (as long as there are no trees around) - but what are you going to use it WITH ? Google Maps are hopeless for on-foot mapping.

[jamito]

Originally Posted by Eriamjh 

Forget GPS and 3G. There is no way Apple is going to release a 3G iPhone in the first year to 18 months of the original iPhone. People got pissed the price was reduced. They'd be even more pissed if one year later a new phone they couldn't buy what was introduced because they are locked in a two-year contract.

I don't believe that you are prevented from buying a new iphone because of the contract you signed. If you decided to buy a new phone, the only thing that would happen is that you would renew your contract.

[nonhuman]

Navizon brings WiFi location to iPod: Apple: iPhone GPS Hack Works and is Awesome - Gizmodo

I haven't installed it on my iPhone yet, but I'll probably try it out later this week.

[nonhuman]

Just installed it and tested it out. It's not perfect, but it's pretty good. Place me about 100 yards from where I actually am.

[theDreamer]

Originally Posted by nonhuman 

Just installed it and tested it out. It's not perfect, but it's pretty good. Place me about 100 yards from where I actually am.

Most people are saying it can be off by as much as a few miles, and others are getting an error message that says they can not be found or something.
I do not hold this as a down side as it actually does not matter for the fact that it is not on the phone and can only improve.

[Eriamjh]

Originally Posted by jamito 

I don't believe that you are prevented from buying a new iphone because of the contract you signed. If you decided to buy a new phone, the only thing that would happen is that you would renew your contract.

It's not that you are prevented from spending more money, it's just the fact that a newer and better one is out so fast that you want to spend more money, but you know you shouldn't. It's kind of like when they cut the price.

Curse Apple for upgrading their hardware so fast!

[King Bob On The Cob]

Originally Posted by Gee4orce 

What's the point in GPS on a phone anyway ? you're most likely to want it for streetmaps when in a city - but GPS reception is terrible if there are tall buildings around, and most street have names and postcodes displayed anyway. If you're out walking in the country, then you'll get decent GPS reception (as long as there are no trees around) - but what are you going to use it WITH ? Google Maps are hopeless for on-foot mapping.

I use GPS on my phone all the time.

Here's the usual situation:

1. I'm low on Gas in the country.
2. I start up MGMaps.
3. I type in "Gas" then select "My GPS Location"
4. It gives me a map to the nearest gas station (Which can be ~10 off the interstate.)

It's also useful so you don't have to put in a starting address. Just search "Seafood". It doesn't matter if it's off by ~400 ft, it's still location contexted so it'll pop up the closest seafood restaurants. (All Without having to enter "I'm at the corner of 49th and Washington")

[icruise]

Originally Posted by Eriamjh 

It's not that you are prevented from spending more money, it's just the fact that a newer and better one is out so fast that you want to spend more money, but you know you shouldn't. It's kind of like when they cut the price.

Curse Apple for upgrading their hardware so fast!

Eh, you can sell your current iPhone (admittedly, not for as much as one might have thought a few weeks ago) and the new phone will likely cost you around $200-$250 out of pocket (assuming they keep the current pricing). That's really not that much considering that iPhone users are paying $60+ a month for the monthly service.

[analogue SPRINKLES]

Originally Posted by sph 

MacNN | Report: 3G/GPS iPhone due in Q1 of 2008

I don't get where they are getting Q1 from when I remember steve saying "HOPEFULLY END OF NEXT YEAR".