[mduell]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Oracle is using and supporting the same product, although it is possible that the Solaris/Linux versions are more stable. What version did you try? I run gobs of VMs on my Mac and haven't had a problem with stability. Perhaps these problems were fixed in an update?

Whatever version they were offering about 9 months ago. Not interested in chasing updates.

Originally Posted by besson3c 

On the Mac side, no... On the Linux side, yes.

Did you miss the thread title?

Originally Posted by dzp111 

Good to know. I just assumed that any malware (intended for Windows) would have to get through the Mac's admin first, even while connected to the net.

The "Mac's admin"?? WTF?
A Windows box in a virtual machine is a Windows box.

[Tee]

MacOS X can't even handle the needs of a small business without resorting to Windows...

[dzp111]

Originally Posted by Tee 

MacOS X can't even handle the needs of a small business without resorting to Windows...

Maybe they don't know how or specifically don't want to know how. I'm aware of at least a handful of businesses including a fairly large pharmacy where I live who use Macs only. And we're not even 160,000 population.

Figure that one out.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by dzp111 

- As for Parallels or Fusion, we're still sitting on the fence since both seem to offer the same capabilities, and are easy to use. We might even eenie-meenie-minee-moe it. : )

Parallels is WAY faster.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Saying that Parallels has some sort of seal of quality and trust that Virtualbox lacks based on the merits and history of the parent company is what is the brilliant argument, really.

The point about Parallels is that you get a CD that you stick into your computer, double-click something from which will auto-update to the latest version and step you through installing a fully functioning Windows VM with less than two minutes total personal involvement and gives you a support hotline, should you need it, and a vendor you can shout at to help you make it work if it doesn't.

Seriously, you haven't the slightest ****ing clue about why people hate computers - and rightly so - and why novices choose to STAY novices.

In short, I keep wondering what the **** you're doing on an Apple forum if you haven't the slightest idea what Apple is actually doing.

[Spheric Harlot]

Edit: This post contained an unfair and incorrect slight of another member (not besson), as research showed. Sorry.

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot 

Edit: This post contained an unfair and incorrect slight of another member (not besson), as research showed. Sorry.

Well I feel better. Thanks.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by mduell 

Did you miss the thread title?

Nope, this was in response to Turtle asking for my Linux data.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot 

The point about Parallels is that you get a CD that you stick into your computer, double-click something from which will auto-update to the latest version and step you through installing a fully functioning Windows VM with less than two minutes total personal involvement and gives you a support hotline, should you need it, and a vendor you can shout at to help you make it work if it doesn't.

Seriously, you haven't the slightest ****ing clue about why people hate computers - and rightly so - and why novices choose to STAY novices.

In short, I keep wondering what the **** you're doing on an Apple forum if you haven't the slightest idea what Apple is actually doing.

Why does this get you so wound up? Really? Do you even know?

I provided an option. It's the internet, people are going to provide options that you think are good and bad, you can't protect everybody from advice you think is bad. I'm a fan of starting with assessing viable free options and going from there, that is what I often recommend. If it works, great, if it doesn't, it doesn't. You perhaps don't, no big deal. There is no reason in the world to be aggressive and confrontational about this.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by dzp111 

- For accounting and payroll, we'll be using Simply Accounting 2010 (Canadian version) for Windows. The primary reason for this is that the owner (cousin) hired her new secretary today, one who is familiar and knowledgeable with this particular program. Bonus.

Don't let the tail wag the dog. Pick the package to suit your cousin, not her employees.

Anyone familiar with Simply Accounting should be able to pick up any other package within about ten minutes. If they're not capable of that, they're not worth hiring.

Originally Posted by dzp111 

Not wanting to sound anti anti-virus, my question is, what are the chances of getting malware if VM is never running while online?

Simply remove the network connection on the VM machine. Then there's next to no chance it can pick up a virus, even if running while the Mac is online.

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Originally Posted by dzp111;4011594Not wanting to sound anti anti-virus, my question is, what are the chances of getting malware if VM is [U

never[/U] running while online?

Simply remove the network connection on the VM machine. Then there's next to no chance it can pick up a virus, even if running while the Mac is online.

The only truly safe and secure computer is one that is completely isolated from the outside world, including no network connection and no local media access. This tends to also make the computer pretty useless. Doofy's suggestion, removing the network connection from the virtual machine, will work just fine. But then you need to consider how you'll get updates, patches and fixes into the virtual machine...because these things will almost certainly be needed relatively routinely. Downloading such things via the Mac and then dragging them to the VM is a workaround-but you still have to trust those downloads to be clean...

I also have to ask how billing, accounts payable, payroll and such will be connected to the outside world? Is the plan to do all of the outside contact by mail? Paper bills and paper paychecks? Paper purchase orders? Modern business accounting packages usually have the capacity to do at least some of this online. Simply Accounting's web site doesn't give a lot of details about how it does some things, like "pays bills," but if you're looking at keeping this app in an isolated VM, you will need to consider the whole "paper only" approach. Which may not be as efficient or effective as your end user wants.

In short, while getting started, isolating your VM is probably a good choice. But as the business gets settled in, I'd recommend going with a connected VM that's well protected by a decent antivirus package, which will give the users more business flexibility while protecting the business data.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by ghporter 

In short, while getting started, isolating your VM is probably a good choice. But as the business gets settled in, I'd recommend going with a connected VM that's well protected by a decent antivirus package, which will give the users more business flexibility while protecting the business data.

Good advice here.

Good antivirus software is affordable.

Really, just avoid going on shady websites, don't do email with the VM, and you'll be good.

-t

[pcryan5]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

For #1 I would look for a web service for this task so that this data is not tethered to a single computer, unless you are absolutely sure that this sort of tethering will not pose a problem in the future.

This alternative is certainly worth a deep dive into. The expanding options available seem perfect for same starter companies. And many large ones.

FWIW - I use Crossover and find it works very well with the selection of apps it supports.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by ghporter 

I also have to ask how billing, accounts payable, payroll and such will be connected to the outside world? Is the plan to do all of the outside contact by mail? Paper bills and paper paychecks? Paper purchase orders? Modern business accounting packages usually have the capacity to do at least some of this online. Simply Accounting's web site doesn't give a lot of details about how it does some things, like "pays bills," but if you're looking at keeping this app in an isolated VM, you will need to consider the whole "paper only" approach. Which may not be as efficient or effective as your end user wants.

I'm a bit of a luddite in this respect, since I have a rule I stick to: No accounts machine ever connected to the Internet. It's a bit more work, but I know my accounts are never going to be taken down by a stray worm/virus which the AV vendor didn't catch.

Updates? Meh. My accounts app hasn't had an update in seven years.

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

I'm a bit of a luddite in this respect, since I have a rule I stick to: No accounts machine ever connected to the Internet. It's a bit more work, but I know my accounts are never going to be taken down by a stray worm/virus which the AV vendor didn't catch.

Updates? Meh. My accounts app hasn't had an update in seven years.

That's a reasonable, practical attitude. Assuming none of the tax tables or other background stuff needs updating, it'll work fine. And with such things as "the official tax tables" files, there is almost no chance that you'll wind up with something corrupted by downloading it from a government site. But I would still have something on hand to scan such files before moving them to the accounting machine/VM; you can never tell when some disgruntled worker decides to "get even" with his government employer and hose up everybody in the process.

[turtle777]

As a loyal VMWare Fusion user, I must say: go Parallels.

I just ran a trial of Parallels 6, unbelievable. It blows Fusion 3 completely out of the water.

Sad to say, but VMWare dropped the ball.

-t

[hart]

Speaking from outside the Super Geek Zone, I checked into both Parallels and Fusion fairly extensively a couple of months ago after deciding to not go with virtualBox. The low-down seems to be that benchmark testing places Parallels as significantly faster but this is only really an issue if you're using intensive software (I'm doing 3D stuff so it is relevant to me but probably not for you.) I previously used Fusion and found it perfectly functional speed-wise.

The other issue is support. Both have a fair number of negative reviews on this front. However, Parallels has a much larger installed user base so there are lots more fellow users out there to turn to when the company itself can't come through.

Finally cost. When I purchased it Parallels had a generous rebate so it turned out to be a lot cheaper than Fusion.

As to the virus stuff, it seems simple enough to install one of the free or low-cost (since this is for a company) anti-virus apps and keep it running in the background. I've used both AVG and Avast and found them to be relatively painless. Quarantines are made to be broken. It's not hard to imagine a likely scenario in which someone just happens to fire up the virtual machine while you're online and suddenly you're recovering from a mess.

[JKT]

Is it worth pointing out that Parallels can be quite expensive to use in the long run as their product development strategy is to release - and charge for - a new version practically every year? It might be cheaper up front, but if you need to stay current (due to OS X upgrades which cause the version you have to become incompatible, for example), it has the potential to end up being more expensive than VMWare. E.g. Snow Leopard obsoleted my Parallels 3 install not that long after I had got it, and rather than making version 3 compatible with SL, they shipped version 4 which was a paid upgrade (and extremely buggy on release as well).

[JKT]

Fwiw, I should mention that my recent exposure to VMWare 3 wasn't entirely a happy one either - the coherence mode in particular was too buggy to use.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by JKT 

Is it worth pointing out that Parallels can be quite expensive to use in the long run as their product development strategy is to release - and charge for - a new version practically every year? It might be cheaper up front, but if you need to stay current (due to OS X upgrades which cause the version you have to become incompatible, for example), it has the potential to end up being more expensive than VMWare. E.g. Snow Leopard obsoleted my Parallels 3 install not that long after I had got it, and rather than making version 3 compatible with SL, they shipped version 4 which was a paid upgrade (and extremely buggy on release as well).

To clarify:

Parallels 3 was released in June 2007.
Parallels 4 was released in November 2008.
Snow Leopard was released in late August 2009 and required Parallels 4.
Parallels 5 was released in November 2009.

So it was possible to buy Parallels 3 and have it obsoleted by SL about ten months later, if you were unlucky. Anybody who bought 3 in late October/November 2008 qualified for a free upgrade.

[mduell]

And Parallels 6 is already out, less than a year after 5.

[P]

So... buy now, whatever you do? With Parallels 6 just out and no new OS announced yet, the situation will never get better.

Has anyone heard about VMware updates? I like VMware for my experiences with them on other platforms, but the reviews I've read paint Parallels 6 as the far superior choice right now.