[Spheric Harlot]

Well, folks, it's out.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthre...threadid=41721

-s*

[iDriveX]

Hey Piracy, wanna come up here on my Pedestal? You can see everyone from up here!

[piracy]

;-)

[zachs]

Yet someone will still claim that it isn't.

[videian28]

apparently not for student developers

[OwlBoy]

How did it get all over the net if it just now got on ADC? hmmm.

-Owl

[iDriveX]

Originally posted by zachs:
Yet someone will still claim that it isn't.

Actually you are quite on the money there Zack. I just got off the phone with a representative from Apple and they said that the 7B85 that is in the box isn't the same as the 7B85 that was released by accident into the wild. The 7B85 that was leaked was actually a Final Candidate and was not the Golden Master. The 7B85 GM had a few bug fixes compared to its predecessor 7B85 FC. He didn't know if this would ever adverse the people that have 7B85 FC installed later on down the line.

[OpenStep]

ADC select member here and still no sign of 7b85 on the download page

[gorickey]

Originally posted by iDriveX:
Actually you are quite on the money there Zack. I just got off the phone with a representative from Apple and they said that the 7B85 that is in the box isn't the same as the 7B85 that was released by accident into the wild. The 7B85 that was leaked was actually a Final Candidate and was not the Golden Master. The 7B85 GM had a few bug fixes compared to its predecessor 7B85 FC. He didn't know if this would ever adverse the people that have 7B85 FC installed later on down the line.

Hmmm, I seriously doubt that....

[piracy]

Originally posted by iDriveX:
Actually you are quite on the money there Zack. I just got off the phone with a representative from Apple and they said that the 7B85 that is in the box isn't the same as the 7B85 that was released by accident into the wild. The 7B85 that was leaked was actually a Final Candidate and was not the Golden Master. The 7B85 GM had a few bug fixes compared to its predecessor 7B85 FC. He didn't know if this would ever adverse the people that have 7B85 FC installed later on down the line.

That's completely wrong. There is only one build of 7B85. That's the whole *purpose* of build numbers. There are NEVER two builds with the same number. It would violate every principle and means of quality control and software design. Controlled, automatic build numbering and version control are minimal requirements for certifications from industry groups such as ISO.

Also, there is not one person that any end customer can currently call at Apple that will discuss build numbers of Panther, or would even say anything like that. Nice try though. C+ for effort, F for creativity.

To repeat: there is one, and only one, build of 7B85. Anyone with a non-corrupted CD of 7B85 that has not been tampered with has exactly the same OS that will come in boxes on the 24th.

That said, again, this shouldn't be an issue since everyone is buying Mac OS X 10.3...correct?

(And one more important note: the ADC 7B85 seed will identify itself as a "prerelease" version. ALL ADC Mac OS X seeds are identified in this fashion - it does not mean that 7B85 isn't GM.)

[piracy]

Originally posted by OwlBoy:
How did it get all over the net if it just now got on ADC? hmmm.

-Owl

Because ADC does not get seeded every build, nor does it always get seeded instantly, nor does it always get FC or even GM builds in a timely fashion.

7B85 has been done, and declared GM, for a loooong time.

[philzilla]

Originally posted by piracy:
(And one more important note: the ADC 7B85 seed will identify itself as a "prerelease" version. ALL ADC Mac OS X seeds are identified in this fashion - it does not mean that 7B85 isn't GM.)

if i was pedantic, i'd ask why an ADC build of 7B85 would identify itself as a "prerelease" version, but the 7B85 that's in the shrinkwrapped box wouldn't, if there was only one version of 7B85?

but then again, i might just be yankin' yer chain for amusement value before i put this mac to sleep for the night

[piracy]

Originally posted by philzilla:
if i was pedantic, i'd ask why an ADC build of 7B85 would identify itself as a "prerelease" version, but the 7B85 that's in the shrinkwrapped box wouldn't, if there was only one version of 7B85?

but then again, i might just be yankin' yer chain for amusement value before i put this mac to sleep for the night

Just for clarification for other peoples' sake (I know you've been around long enough to know better):

It is the seed notes that will say this, and it is a matter of policy and a part of the seed process. All previous GM releases of Mac OS X that have been seeded via ADC have identified themselves in this fashion.

[gorickey]

Originally posted by philzilla:
if i was pedantic, i'd ask why an ADC build of 7B85 would identify itself as a "prerelease" version, but the 7B85 that's in the shrinkwrapped box wouldn't, if there was only one version of 7B85?

piracy...how's the heart rate?

[TheMosco]

I think idriveX was making a joke guys.

[Gul Banana]

That was quite a good piece of bait, iDriveX. The trouble is that if piracy hadn't taken it, some people would have believed you.

[iDriveX]

Come on Piracy....Come ON

[vasu]

everyone knows this is 7B85v2

[starman]

Originally posted by piracy:
That's completely wrong. There is only one build of 7B85. That's the whole *purpose* of build numbers. There are NEVER two builds with the same number. It would violate every principle and means of quality control and software design. Controlled, automatic build numbering and version control are minimal requirements for certifications from industry groups such as ISO.

Also, there is not one person that any end customer can currently call at Apple that will discuss build numbers of Panther, or would even say anything like that. Nice try though. C+ for effort, F for creativity.

To repeat: there is one, and only one, build of 7B85. Anyone with a non-corrupted CD of 7B85 that has not been tampered with has exactly the same OS that will come in boxes on the 24th.

That said, again, this shouldn't be an issue since everyone is buying Mac OS X 10.3...correct?

(And one more important note: the ADC 7B85 seed will identify itself as a "prerelease" version. ALL ADC Mac OS X seeds are identified in this fashion - it does not mean that 7B85 isn't GM.)

I don't doubt that 7B85 is the GM version, but didn't you just contradict yourself there?

To repeat: there is one, and only one, build of 7B85.

(And one more important note: the ADC 7B85 seed will identify itself as a "prerelease" version.

Anyway, downloading now...

Mike

[natan]

So is a new XCode also up? Or still 7B74?

[piracy]

Originally posted by starman:
I don't doubt that 7B85 is the GM version, but didn't you just contradict yourself there?

Nope, not at all.

7B85 is the GM release of Mac OS X 10.3.

However, the seed notes will say "This is a prerelease version of Mac OS X 10.3". This is because ALL the seed notes associated with all builds of Mac OS X seeded via ADC say that as a matter of policy. What I am saying is this: just because the seed note has that generic disclaimer, it doesn't mean 7B85 isn't GM (I'm not saying YOU will think that; just that others will claim that even though we've already been over this with 3 previous major OS X releases). The seed notes for all previous GM versions of Mac OS X seeded via ADC contained the same standard lanugage, even though the build may already have been declared GM. Note also that GM builds of OS updates seeded via ADC also contain this notice. Some are seeded before going GM, so the notice is technically accurate; some are seeded after already having been declared GM - the language is still there in the seed notes regardless. The disclaimer is present because ALL software seeded via ADC - "GM" or no - is generally intended for testing and development purposes only. ADC is NOT a means to distribute final versions of retail software for routine use (even though said software is identical to retail versions in its GM form). The fact that ADC members get GM versions of OSes at all is incidental, and a courtesy and convenience of the program.

[piracy]

Originally posted by natan:
So is a new XCode also up? Or still 7B74?

What do you think? Of course there is a companion GM Xcode.

[piracy]

Originally posted by iDriveX:
Come on Piracy....Come ON

As others have said, some people actually believe that...

;-(

[starman]

It's just that you said it would identify ITSELF. Forget the seed notes. If you take those 3 CD images (which I just finished DLing) by themselves, is there or is there not anything that would be bit-for-bit different than the retail CDs?

Just clarifying.

Mike

[Art Vandelay]

Originally posted by starman:
It's just that you said it would identify ITSELF. Forget the seed notes. If you take those 3 CD images (which I just finished DLing) by themselves, is there or is there not anything that would be bit-for-bit different than the retail CDs?

Just clarifying.

Mike

He meant the seed notes, not the OS itself. The Panther seeds stop saying pre-release many builds ago.

[addiecool]

Another thread down the drain

Why? Why? Why?

Lets face it people. iDriveX and Piracy and all others who believe that 7B85 is GM are right.

Anyways, it would not matter since you will be going to buy panther, right?

[starman]

EDIT: Nevermind. People have to be more clear about what they type.

And why would I buy Panther if I paid all this money to join ADC?

Mike

[Zadian]

Originally posted by addiecool:
Another thread down the drain

Why? Why? Why?

Lets face it people. iDriveX and Piracy and all others who believe that 7B85 is GM are right.

I love these threads, they are fun. I guess by the time 10.5 reaches GM status i can recite Piracys answers :-D

It's fun to see how history seems to be repeating itself.

But the first thing i will do, after i have installed 10.3, will be checking the build number- just in case ;-)

[- - e r i k - -]

Panther's Feature Comparison page claims iApps are all "improved in Panther", yet they are all the same versions as before (bar iCal and iSync, but those are already released). Is this a reflection of the general system speedup or can new versions these be included on the retail CDs (with the same system build number) even if they weren't included in seeded builds?

[MindFad]

7B85 (GM) is soooo last week.

[philzilla]

Originally posted by starman:
I don't doubt that 7B85 is the GM version, but didn't you just contradict yourself there?

did you completely miss where i had that one cleared up, before any/everyone else said it?

[JLL]

Originally posted by OpenStep:
ADC select member here and still no sign of 7b85 on the download page

I can't see it either.

[philzilla]

Originally posted by JLL:
I can't see it either.

read the original post. click the link in the original post. read the first post in that link. it says:

Apple has released Mac OS X 10.3 Panther Build 7B85 to Premier Apple Developers via their Apple Developer Connection website

Premier != Select

are we all on the same page now?

[starman]

Originally posted by OpenStep:
ADC select member here and still no sign of 7b85 on the download page

Select here. I downloaded and burned the CDs already.

Mike

[JLL]

Originally posted by starman:
Select here. I downloaded and burned the CDs already.

Mike

Still nothin' here.

[SMacTech]

I cannot see it as a select member, so I don't understand why starman can see it.

[voodoo]

Originally posted by starman:
Select here. I downloaded and burned the CDs already.

Mike

Well then ur teh l337 d00d!!1!111!1

I'll just stoop to piracy yet again

j/k

[suthercd]

Nadda. Nothing there.

Craig

[DeltaOP]

How about some ACTUAL impressions instead of the bickeing whether this is the actual GM or not.

[Peabo]

I wonder if they'll update the traffic light widgets in 10.3.1 like in the PR images.

[quadgrande]

"Who is John Galt?"

He's that genius physicist/philosopher guy who works for you, though you never realized it, and solicits information from your assistant in order to lead off your most important vendors and loved ones to a secret utopian society. Oh yeah, and he invented that unlimited supply of cheap, clean energy gismo. Just a guess.

Yeah, I'm select, but not choice, I mean premier, and I'm not seeing 7B85. Alas. Prior releases of OS X to ADC have not been Premier only IIRC.

[philzilla]

Originally posted by DeltaOP:
How about some ACTUAL impressions instead of the bickeing whether this is the actual GM or not.

do you have piracy on ignore, or something? don't you read his posts? hmm?

[pliny]

piracy i was wondering if you could address how much of the debug code is in the 7b85 fc1 vs. that taken out for the 7b85 gm, is the speed difference noticeable?

thanks in advance!

[starman]

Originally posted by DeltaOP:
How about some ACTUAL impressions instead of the bickeing whether this is the actual GM or not.

It was 1:30am when I downloaded the last segement, so I was too beat to try it out. I'll be installing it tonight.

Mike

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by DeltaOP:
How about some ACTUAL impressions instead of the bickeing whether this is the actual GM or not.

How about you just read the HUGE MOFO THREAD on 7B85 that's been running for two weeks if you want impressions?

-s*

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by pliny:
piracy i was wondering if you could address how much of the debug code is in the 7b85 fc1 vs. that taken out for the 7b85 gm, is the speed difference noticeable?

thanks in advance!

Argh.

Seriously, the "debug code" joke has been done a dozen times with this release already.

Just can it until 10.4, okay?

-s*

[pliny]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
Argh.

Seriously, the "debug code" joke has been done a dozen times with this release already.

Just can it until 10.4, okay?

-s*

sorry, can't do that.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by pliny:
sorry, can't do that.

You can't can it?

Instructions:

a) write joke on piece of paper.

b) have a good laugh

c) put paper in small tin can

d) deposit can in highly inconvenient place, such as bottom of large lake or river.

-s*

[pliny]

Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
You can't can it?

Instructions:

a) write joke on piece of paper.

b) have a good laugh

c) put paper in small tin can

d) deposit can in highly inconvenient place, such as bottom of large lake or river.

-s*

sorry, can't do that.

[gorickey]

Originally posted by z0ne81:
I wonder if they'll update the traffic light widgets in 10.3.1 like in the PR images.

Nope.