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You are here: MacNN Forums > Software - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Applications > OW 5.1 final is out

OW 5.1 final is out
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HOMBRESINIESTRO
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Jan 6, 2005, 12:42 AM
 
Yesterday I asked when it would be released, and it's out today. Hooray!

I think it was time to start a new thread on this, especially for new users that don't want to scroll down nine pages.

Posting it form the final now. Everything seems great so far.
No localized versions yet.
Scarcely pausing for breath, Vroomfondel shouted, "We DON'T demand solid facts! What we demand is the total ABSENCE of solid facts. I demand that I may or may not be Vroomfondel!"
     
bmedina
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Jan 6, 2005, 02:46 AM
 
For those of us not following development, what major changes does 5.1 bring over 5.0?
     
nickm
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Jan 6, 2005, 03:22 AM
 
An up-to-date version of the Webcore rendering engine. So, better support for many sites, including gmail.
     
HOMBRESINIESTRO  (op)
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Jan 6, 2005, 03:23 AM
 
Originally posted by bmedina:
For those of us not following development, what major changes does 5.1 bring over 5.0?
It includes the latest webcore, better java support and tabbing between form elements. This leads to an overall speedup, better compatibility, and, because of further bugfixing, better stability.
Scarcely pausing for breath, Vroomfondel shouted, "We DON'T demand solid facts! What we demand is the total ABSENCE of solid facts. I demand that I may or may not be Vroomfondel!"
     
Phil Sherry
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Jan 6, 2005, 04:36 AM
 
you still have to pay? oh. nevermind.
     
HOMBRESINIESTRO  (op)
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Jan 6, 2005, 04:43 AM
 
Originally posted by Phil Sherry:
you still have to pay? oh. nevermind.
You still have to work for money? oh. nevermind.
Scarcely pausing for breath, Vroomfondel shouted, "We DON'T demand solid facts! What we demand is the total ABSENCE of solid facts. I demand that I may or may not be Vroomfondel!"
     
dru
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Jan 6, 2005, 04:45 AM
 
Seems very slow in rendering pages.

Pity because once the page is rendered, it's very snappy.
20" iMac C2D/2.4GHz 3GB RAM 10.6.8 (10H549)
     
HOMBRESINIESTRO  (op)
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Jan 6, 2005, 04:59 AM
 
Originally posted by dru:
Seems very slow in rendering pages.

Pity because once the page is rendered, it's very snappy.
There is no difference in page rendering speed between OW5.1 and Safari here. Did you trash your prefs from older versions?
Scarcely pausing for breath, Vroomfondel shouted, "We DON'T demand solid facts! What we demand is the total ABSENCE of solid facts. I demand that I may or may not be Vroomfondel!"
     
threestain
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Jan 6, 2005, 08:37 AM
 
have to agree - safari and OW are both just as fast as each other in my opinion... maybe a little prefs clearout might help?
     
cpac
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Jan 6, 2005, 08:41 AM
 
Another big fix in 5.1 over previous version is the cache - it's MUCH better now.
cpac
     
yskar
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Jan 6, 2005, 09:39 AM
 
My feeling is that OW 5.1 is as fast as Safari on recent fast machines (perhaps over-GHz?), but on a-few-years-old machines OW is slower than Safari.
     
cpac
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Jan 6, 2005, 09:50 AM
 
Originally posted by yskar:
My feeling is that OW 5.1 is as fast as Safari on recent fast machines (perhaps over-GHz?), but on a-few-years-old machines OW is slower than Safari.
they're about the same on my TiBook 500....

But its not its speed that makes OW my preferred browser. It's the feature set.
cpac
     
BZ
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Jan 6, 2005, 10:01 AM
 
Why I STILL love OmniWeb and use it 85% of the time at home and have gladly paid for it again and again.

- OmniTabs
- Udating bookmarks
- Individual site prefs
- Syncing bookmarks
- Workspaces
- Full history information

I suggest everyone try it out for awhile (it can easily use Safari bookmarks) and see for yourself.

BZ
     
powermacj7
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Jan 6, 2005, 10:51 AM
 
I have downloaded the browser, and been playing around with it. Truthfully, it appears okay, rendering a bit slow. Not that I am cheap (well sometimes maybe) , I can't see paying for a browser, especially with al the free ones out there. How do you all feel about it?



     
cpac
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Jan 6, 2005, 11:10 AM
 
Originally posted by powermacj7:
I have downloaded the browser, and been playing around with it. Truthfully, it appears okay, rendering a bit slow. Not that I am cheap (well sometimes maybe) , I can't see paying for a browser, especially with al the free ones out there. How do you all feel about it?
tried workspaces yet?
shortcuts?
site preferences?
cpac
     
mdc
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Jan 6, 2005, 12:11 PM
 
i like omniweb, but the one thing i don't like is their version of tabs. as much as i use it (testing out my site, which now works much better with the new webcore) i just can't get used to the drawer.

other than that, it is an awesome browser, and i'd pay for it in a heartbeat. good shareware deserves to be bought.
     
bewebste
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Jan 6, 2005, 02:45 PM
 
Originally posted by mdc:
i like omniweb, but the one thing i don't like is their version of tabs. as much as i use it (testing out my site, which now works much better with the new webcore) i just can't get used to the drawer.

other than that, it is an awesome browser, and i'd pay for it in a heartbeat. good shareware deserves to be bought.
I find the drawer works well on widescreen displays, since there's more space horizontally. I don't like my browser to be too wide anyway, since it makes it harder to read large blocks of text, so the drawer fills up that extra horizontal space nicely. I also only use the list view, not the thumbnail view, that way I can have 20+ pages open when I need to (yes, I do that occasionally).
     
holygoat
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Jan 6, 2005, 03:02 PM
 
The space I would have used for tabs in Safari goes on a much better bookmarks bar.

The additional width of the display goes on a narrow tab drawer, which usefully remains full size when I resize the window. Height is more precious than width in a window.

I couldn't live without OmniWeb's tabs; I have 12 open in this window (and can see them all), 16 and 20 in the other two windows. The great thing is the ability to move them between windows, reorganise them, and save state between sessions. Awesome indeed.

It gets dangerous at times, though; I tend to leave stuff open, and I've reached 1.7GB before for OmniWeb's memory footprint

One of the best software purchases I've made on the Mac.

5.1 seems polished, though I've not noticed many changes over the last beta.
     
cpac
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Jan 6, 2005, 03:08 PM
 
Originally posted by holygoat:
though I've not noticed many changes over the last beta.
That may be because, as the release notes state, there were almost none.
cpac
     
athos_uk
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Jan 6, 2005, 05:38 PM
 
One of my favourite sites is now broken - any page on it loads with a big blank box in the middle. Worse, I can't seem to download 5.0.1 anywhere, so there's no way to go back.



Tam
     
cpac
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Jan 6, 2005, 07:02 PM
 
Originally posted by athos_uk:
One of my favourite sites is now broken - any page on it loads with a big blank box in the middle. Worse, I can't seem to download 5.0.1 anywhere, so there's no way to go back.



Tam
Any chance you have ad blocking turned on?

What's the site? (so we can confirm the problem)
cpac
     
athos_uk
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Jan 6, 2005, 07:19 PM
 
Add blocking is on, but I've tried turning it off. Anyway it's not that kind of blank space, kind of a pinstripe rectangle (can't seem to insert a screen shot).

here's the url http://naim-audio.infopop.net/1/Open...385&f=48019385




Tam
     
Rickster
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Jan 6, 2005, 08:08 PM
 
Worse, I can't seem to download 5.0.1 anywhere, so there's no way to go back.
Browse into the /pub/software/Archive area on their FTP server (or better, one of its HTTP mirrors), and you'll find OW 5.0.1, previous beta releases, and Omni software all the way back to the NeXTSTEP era.
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Mike S.
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Jan 6, 2005, 10:20 PM
 
Originally posted by athos_uk:
Add blocking is on, but I've tried turning it off. Anyway it's not that kind of blank space, kind of a pinstripe rectangle (can't seem to insert a screen shot).
The main page and one link I clicked both rendered just fine.

Quit OmniWeb, go to ~/Library/Caches and trash the folder titled com.omigroup.OmniWeb5

Relaunch OmniWeb and see if that cleared up your problem.
     
holygoat
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Jan 7, 2005, 06:40 AM
 
Originally posted by cpac:
That may be because, as the release notes state, there were almost none.
... I was also referring to rendering, which suggests that I don't use any problematic sites with WebKit
     
GENERAL_SMILEY
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Jan 7, 2005, 08:08 AM
 
Definitely better at the basics, web browsing is improved.

I'm guessing that nobody can get the Real Player streams at the www.bbc.co.uk/radio to work, specifically Listen Again and all that. It's the only thing I keep Safari around for.

Now let me skin it, and life will be further improved.
I have Mac
     
cpac
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Jan 7, 2005, 08:47 AM
 
Originally posted by athos_uk:
Add blocking is on, but I've tried turning it off. Anyway it's not that kind of blank space, kind of a pinstripe rectangle (can't seem to insert a screen shot).

here's the url http://naim-audio.infopop.net/1/Open...385&f=48019385

No problems viewing that page here - try clearing your cache as suggested above. (In short, it's not an OW problem, but something about your configuration that's screwing this up for you)
cpac
     
HOMBRESINIESTRO  (op)
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Jan 7, 2005, 09:30 AM
 
I know it's not 5.1 specific, but I just found a way to solve my only problem with omniweb so far. I always thought it was nice to have the button for the bookmarks window in the favourite bookmarks bar in Safari. In OmniWeb you have a button in the toolbar for the bookmarks window.

Just a few hours ago I found out how to get it to behave like Safari: Just add a bookmark for the URL "bookmarks:/" to your favourite bookmarks bar and give it no name. Voil�, you have the Safari bookmarks' menu.
( Last edited by HOMBRESINIESTRO; Jan 7, 2005 at 09:35 AM. )
Scarcely pausing for breath, Vroomfondel shouted, "We DON'T demand solid facts! What we demand is the total ABSENCE of solid facts. I demand that I may or may not be Vroomfondel!"
     
athos_uk
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Jan 7, 2005, 03:30 PM
 
Well, I've tried trashing the cache, no effect. I've also tried playing with all kinds of options, can't make it work, so in the end I've just gone back to 5.0.1. - thanks for the link Rickster.


Tam
     
tjr124
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Jan 8, 2005, 02:27 AM
 
HOMBRESINIESTRO,

That is one nice tip.
     
Cincojoe
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Jan 8, 2005, 10:09 AM
 
It's slower than Firefox on my Ti 1GHZ. Anyone else notice this?
Power Mac 2.0 with 4GB RAM
     
RedHerring
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Jan 8, 2005, 12:46 PM
 
When I have multiple tabs open, OmniWeb eats up a lot of memory. It always has, so I've come to terms with that (haha).

But when I close every tab and every window, but don't quit the application, I would *think* the memory it had consumed would be released. But even after an hour, with no windows open, only about 2 mb of memory have been released.

Is that normal? It could be, I don't know... but I would think it wasn't. I don't know a lot about how memory works, but I'd think a program that's not actually doing anything wouldn't need almost 70 mb of memory to just exist.
     
roam
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Jan 8, 2005, 12:57 PM
 
Nice release. Still a bit slow, and sometimes workspaces don't seem to remember to load up on launch.

Their implementation of tabs is the best, IMO.
     
cpac
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Jan 9, 2005, 12:20 PM
 
Originally posted by RedHerring:
Is that normal? It could be, I don't know... but I would think it wasn't. I don't know a lot about how memory works, but I'd think a program that's not actually doing anything wouldn't need almost 70 mb of memory to just exist.
Why are you worried about it?
cpac
     
joelcpa
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Jan 9, 2005, 01:08 PM
 
Originally posted by HOMBRESINIESTRO:
I know it's not 5.1 specific, but I just found a way to solve my only problem with omniweb so far. I always thought it was nice to have the button for the bookmarks window in the favourite bookmarks bar in Safari. In OmniWeb you have a button in the toolbar for the bookmarks window.

Just a few hours ago I found out how to get it to behave like Safari: Just add a bookmark for the URL "bookmarks:/" to your favourite bookmarks bar and give it no name. Voil�, you have the Safari bookmarks' menu.

Thanks Hombre, I have been looking for a way to do this too....
     
RedHerring
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Jan 9, 2005, 01:14 PM
 
Originally posted by cpac:
Why are you worried about it?
Curiosity... not worry

I don't understand why OW uses so much more memory than ANY other program I have installed on my computer.
     
poocat
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Jan 12, 2005, 05:13 AM
 
I finally listened to all of you, and have spent the last week using OmniWeb 5.1.

First, i love it. I like the tabs, though really on my powerbook i wish that i could make them smaller sometimes (horizontally i'm out of room or i'm covering something i want to see). I would like the option for across the top tabs, but then i do have Safari.

Second. It imported my Safari bookmarks but won't auto-complete them. I don't know why this is. Perhaps it's just me, but it's definitely strange. In fact, it doesn't seem to be learning to auto-complete at all. Is this a feature i need to turn on? It completes for a set list of things already in the browser, but doesn't seem to remember from my history... or only sometimes? Odd, and i'd like an explanation of when/why/how it learns.

Third. It launches VERY slowly. Now, before i get any questions, my system is not new. I'm on a pismo 500/512. However, twenty seconds plus beachball is not a good sign. Safari launches in less than three seconds. Why? Is there any way i can make it faster? Note this is not to a page, this is to a blank window. Yes, twenty plus seconds to a blank window, and beachballing in the middle.

Fourth, as has been noted elsewhere, why is there no option to have things removed from the download window upon completion? In some ways it seems to me as though Omni is offering us the complex options, but not the simple ones. Why?

Fifth, as a new OmniWeb user, the bookmark system is INCREDIBLY complex. There are eight or ten things in the sidebar of the bookmark window and in some cases i'm not sure what the differences are, and i'm especially not sure why my imported bookmarks were put in their own category. When i select "check for changes" which ones does OW check? It seems to check them at random, and then give me a counter in the dock for how many it has checked... but i would appreciate some hint of order... why is it not checking them systematically? Or is it, but in a way i don't see?

Fifth, i love the flexibility, and the overall feel. I never thought about how much i disliked the metal until i used an Aqua browser. Excellent. I even like the buttons, though i think the newer Camino builds have the nicest buttons i've seen on a OS X toolbar.

Last, i just want to remind people that this is the first time i've ever used OmniWeb, so please, if these are stupid issues, just let me know. I have no idea how 4.0 or 4.5 worked, or anything. Thanks a lot.

And OmniGuys, (i know some of you read this forum) thanks for the great browser... yeah, i'm in the free trial right now, but if i can figure out some of these issues (mostly slow boot, as i'm on a laptop so despite what people will say i have to shut down/restart fairly often) i'll have to figure out a way to get you some money. Great work.

-poocat.
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hiddentrack
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Jan 12, 2005, 06:41 AM
 
Originally posted by poocat:
I finally listened to all of you, and have spent the last week using OmniWeb 5.1.

First, i love it. I like the tabs, though really on my powerbook i wish that i could make them smaller sometimes (horizontally i'm out of room or i'm covering something i want to see). I would like the option for across the top tabs, but then i do have Safari.
Ah, the tabs are resizable. Simply hover your mouse somewhere along the right side of the scroll bar well in the bookmarks pane. The cursor will change to a bar with two arrows on each side, hold down the mouse button and resize until you get bored.
     
poocat
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Jan 12, 2005, 10:52 AM
 
Thanks hiddentrack. Totally stupid, i know, but i'd missed that. Now they're really thumbnail sized, and my pismo feels a bit bigger. I keep going back and forth...

The best part of Apple's site right now, for me, is the Tiger preview stuff, because it shows how nice Aqua (or the Aqua/Metal merger, or whatever) is starting to look. I really, really like it. And that's one of the really awesome parts of OmniWeb. So light feeling!

Woosh. I've been reading through their support pages & faq so i'm a little bit more up to date, but most of the issues above are still issues.
"The supreme irony of life is that hardly anyone gets out of it alive."
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yskar
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Jan 23, 2005, 10:13 AM
 
Hello OmniGuys,

Any news on OW 5.1? Is localization going on? What about the theme switcher?
     
SwarmyCurve
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Jan 25, 2005, 09:15 PM
 
I have a question about OmniWeb:

Why is it that a flash animation isn't working correctly in version 5.1? I am taking a course this semester at school, and on the course web page I can never get content to load in sections of the page (such as the home link). For some reason though, Safari handles this page just fine.

I tried applying a site preference to the page to spoof the browser declaration over to Safari, but that didn't work either. Does anyone have any ideas?
     
electric monk
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Jan 25, 2005, 10:06 PM
 
Works fine for me. What flash plug in do you have installed?

Mines just the normal Shockwave Flash plug in.
     
Mike S.
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Jan 25, 2005, 11:34 PM
 
I get the navigation flash but, as the poster said, the actual content doesn't appear. It just flashes "loading..." forever.

In Safari, the content appears as soon as the section loads.

Seems like an OmniWeb bug to me.
     
m a d r a
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Jan 26, 2005, 08:01 AM
 
i'm afraid i've got to disagree with the general wave of enthusiasm here. i've been using omniweb as my default browser for several months now and really love the GUI and the features, but the last two builds [currently on 563.34] seem to have gone backwards. omniweb takes forever to open, pages seem to load slower than ever and scrolling is nowhere near as smooth as it has been in earlier versions.

i've also noticed a copule of other things -

1. the autocomplete in the URL bar seems really clunky now [i never noticed this in earlier builds]. it seems that as soon as i start typing 'www...' into the URL bar, the GUI half freezes as autocomplete ploughs through my entire cache, trying to find a match straightaway [instead of waiting till i've typed a bit after the 'www...' to narrow the search a bit]. a lot of times i've finished typing the URL into the bar while omniweb's address bar is still displaying just 'www..' and a spinning beachball - before the rest of the URL slowly types itself into place. i have similar problems with deleting part of a URL in the address bar [to quickly jump up a level or subdomain in a site i'm on]. again the autocomplete seems to choke on this and leave me twiddling my thumbs waiting for the address bar to catch up.

2. cookie management. this morning i had to delete a couple of cookies to get a login to work properly on a site i was visiting. when i opened the cookie manager in omniweb's prefs there were 50! cookies from apple.com and a similar number from ebay.co.uk. now i'm not necessarily saying this is omniweb's fault, but it seems very strange. i'm used to a site leaving 3 or 4 cookies behind, but 50?!! just to compare, i checked safari's cookie mamagement window and it had 4 ebay cookies and 5 apple ones stored and i've probably visited those two sites just as much [if not more] with safari as with omniweb

final thought on the speed issue - i finally had enough of omniweb's lethargy this morning and fired up safari for the first time in a couple of months and i can't believe how fast it seems! maybe this omniweb slowdown has been happening gradually over a while now, so i never noticed it. because no way was there such a speed difference between them in the past - or i'd never have switched to omniweb in the first place!
     
Cadaver
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Jan 26, 2005, 09:15 AM
 
Originally posted by m a d r a:
1. the autocomplete in the URL bar seems really clunky now [i never noticed this in earlier builds]. it seems that as soon as i start typing 'www...' into the URL bar, the GUI half freezes as autocomplete ploughs through my entire cache, trying to find a match straightaway [instead of waiting till i've typed a bit after the 'www...' to narrow the search a bit]. a lot of times i've finished typing the URL into the bar while omniweb's address bar is still displaying just 'www..' and a spinning beachball - before the rest of the URL slowly types itself into place. i have similar problems with deleting part of a URL in the address bar [to quickly jump up a level or subdomain in a site i'm on]. again the autocomplete seems to choke on this and leave me twiddling my thumbs waiting for the address bar to catch up.
Try deleting the cache and history. I don't seem to have this problem at all. No GUI freeze/slow down... the auto-complete pops up instantly for me.
     
TheIceMan
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Jan 26, 2005, 09:49 AM
 
I tend to agree with madra. I love the UI of OmniWeb, but the sluggishness of it has lead me back to FireFox and Camino. Sorry Omni, I want to like OW, but I like speed more.
     
roam
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Jan 26, 2005, 10:23 AM
 
Omniweb is probably the best browser out there, IMO. It's so feature-rich, and has so many little attentions to detail that just amazes me.

I can't be without workspaces, 'nuff said.
     
m a d r a
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Jan 26, 2005, 11:26 AM
 
Originally posted by roam:
Omniweb is probably the best browser out there, IMO. It's so feature-rich, and has so many little attentions to detail that just amazes me.

I can't be without workspaces, 'nuff said.
i'd agree with you that omniweb is by far the best browser as regards features and interface. the point i'm making, however, is that all this 'lickability' seems to come at the expense of speed. and at the end of the day, i want my apps to be responsive slightly more than i want them to be pretty to look at.

<slight side note rant type thing>

having started using safari again today, after a long break, it didnae take long for me to rediscover my pet hate wi that browser; where omniweb's autocomplete is sluggish [at least IMHO], safari's practically rips yer arm off, it's so feckin' tenacious.

here's an example from a few minutes ago:

i want to go to www.apple.com. the last page i visited on the apple site was the developer section, but today i just want to go to the home page. so i type in www.apple.com and in the nanosecond between my finger lifting off the "m" key and landing on the return button, safari has autocompleted the URL to www.apple.com/developer so i get taken there... but the developer page instantly forwards to developer.apple.com so now i'm in a feckin subdomain! i mouse to the URL bar and delete the 'developer.' part of the URL [leaving me with apple.com] and hit return... and again, in the nanosecond between my finger leaving the delete button and hitting return, safari has autocompleted the URL again to apple.com/developer. so again i type in www.apple.com in the URL bar and safari autocompletes to www.apple.com/developer. this time i notice that the autocompleted part of the URL [ie. the /developer] is highlighted, so i hit delete to remove it and then hit return again... only to find once again safari has beaten me to the punch and autocompleted while my finger was in mid air between keys!

seriously it took me about 4 or 5 goes to get to the URL i wanted - and this is meant to be a labour-saving device?! jeez! i remember people complaining about safari's autocomplete way back in version 1 - and they still havenae fixed it?!

BTW i know you can turn off autocomplete - but can't they just make it so that if you delete the part of the URL that safari has autocompleted, it disnae keep putting the feckin thing back in again?

</slight side note rant type thing>
     
roam
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Location: A Banana Republic
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Jan 26, 2005, 11:37 AM
 
Originally posted by m a d r a:
i'd agree with you that omniweb is by far the best browser as regards features and interface. the point i'm making, however, is that all this 'lickability' seems to come at the expense of speed. and at the end of the day, i want my apps to be responsive slightly more than i want them to be pretty to look at.
[color=gray]
Yeah, sorry, you're totally right about the speed issue. I just had a bash of Camino, and it was fast as hell, even faster than an optimized Firefox.

But yeah, OW is pretty slow.
     
   
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