[Powaqqatsi]

MSN Messenger, until something better comes along that is full featured. And yes I've tried them all.

[Sarc]

Originally posted by Earth Mk. II:
It's a group bubbles window layout, I titled it "Slick!" but I'm not very imaginative with names, and I'm not on MSN in that screen shot.

I can post the layout and color files if you want though.

yes please !
anyway, it look's good, you should upload it to the Adiumxtras.com site ... so everyone gets it.

[theJoKell]

Adium since CK.

[Earth Mk. II]

Originally posted by Sarc:
yes please !
anyway, it look's good, you should upload it to the Adiumxtras.com site ... so everyone gets it.

I don't think the xtras site is updated for the new list themes and styles yet, but here's a zip archive of the files.

Put them in your "App Support/Adium 2.0/Contact List" folder - they're not double clickable yet.

Slick!.zip - 2.3 KB

[Sarc]

thx !

[brapper]

Originally posted by ambush:
Where is aMSN?

yup, I use aMsn.

[F_Elz]

I use iChat.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Earth Mk. II:
I don't think the xtras site is updated for the new list themes and styles yet, but here's a zip archive of the files.

Put them in your "App Support/Adium 2.0/Contact List" folder - they're not double clickable yet.

Slick!.zip - 2.3 KB

Safari can�t open the page �http://students.cua.edu/54holt/adium/Slick!.zip� because it can�t find the server �students.cua.edu�.

[Earth Mk. II]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Safari can�t open the page �http://students.cua.edu/54holt/adium/Slick!.zip� because it can�t find the server �students.cua.edu�.

works here, the school's DNS is probably broken though.

if it doesn't work later, let me know and I'll complain to the computing center.

[Tick]

Originally posted by Earth Mk. II:
works here, the school's DNS is probably broken though.

if it doesn't work later, let me know and I'll complain to the computing center.

Works here

[leperkuhn]

adium is the best browser, hands down. so flexible, so beautiful.

iChat is the worst app ever. come on, it doesn't even have groups.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally posted by leperkuhn:
adium is the best browser, hands down. so flexible, so beautiful.

iChat is the worst app ever. come on, it doesn't even have groups.

It does have groups...it just handles them differently. Tiger's iChat will have groups that look like Adium's...or is it the other way around.

Although the Adium team won't admit it, they've borrowed the some of the better iChat and Proteus features over the course of development. And Proteus has borrowed heavily from iChat. Not saying Adium doesn't have it's own innovations...it does. The huge customizability isn't iChat or Proteus' forte. Which is fine, IMO.

Adium pleases the people that love customization. Proteus pleases the people that prefer ease-of-use over customization. And iChat pleases the people that want A/V.

[VEGAN]

Originally posted by Thain Esh Kelch:
You dont send instant messages to a specific user, at general, but just messages to a large chat-room...

[Edit:] Oh, and Proteus! But I plan on switching to Adium at the 0.7 release..

How is that different from iChat?
In IRC I have an option to join a channel or open a window for /msg that is for one person only.
Pretty much the same as iChat. You can join a channel or you can "private message" someone.

I'm still confused about the lines drawn here...

[Nacente]

iChat man!

[theJoKell]

Originally posted by Horsepoo!!!:
Although the Adium team won't admit it, they've borrowed the some of the better iChat and Proteus features over the course of development.

I'm just wondering what you think they "borrowed" that wasn't an obvious addition to an IM program. I'd say that Proteus has borrowed a lot more from Adium than Adium has from Proteus. Unless there's just some stuff I can't think of right now...

[Sarc]

Originally posted by Earth Mk. II:
I don't think the xtras site is updated for the new list themes and styles yet, but here's a zip archive of the files.

Put them in your "App Support/Adium 2.0/Contact List" folder - they're not double clickable yet.

Slick!.zip - 2.3 KB

I installed it, thx.

now ... anyone know how to hide the MSN user name ? (ie. [email protected])

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by theJoKell:
I'm just wondering what you think they "borrowed" that wasn't an obvious addition to an IM program.

I'd like to hear it as well.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally posted by theJoKell:
I'm just wondering what you think they "borrowed" that wasn't an obvious addition to an IM program. I'd say that Proteus has borrowed a lot more from Adium than Adium has from Proteus. Unless there's just some stuff I can't think of right now...

Maybe it's because you've been living in La La Land.

Considering Proteus was around waaay before Adium X was released publicly or even a blueprint, I think most of the ideas were borrowed by Adium X. Heck, Proteus 3 was out before Adium X even began making sense when it was in (more or less) private development. And the first public Proteus 4 beta and Adium X beta were pretty much simultaneous releases...and Proteus 4 hasn't changed much since the betas. Adium has been busily adding things Proteus has had for years and things Proteus 4 had when it was released.

And still, some of the better features of Proteus still haven't shown up in Adium yet. imservice daemons for each account so that a crash doesn't take down the whole app...they relaunch safely so you don't stay disconnected...in theory they shouldn't crash so maybe this point isn't very valid, but it's nice to know that Proteus heals itself...the daemons also allow the Proteus front-end to be quit...and you can still remain online and get messages and access these messages locally if you relaunch Proteus or remotely.

Away status'...when will Adium get these? Jebus Christ. Is that too much to ask? History that doesn't suck.

Adium is beginning to look more and more like Proteus as days go by. You don't notice it because you probably never use Proteus...but I have and Adium is definitely starting to look like Proteus but with a few more bells and whistles.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Horsepoo!!!:
Maybe it's because you've been living in La La Land.

Considering Proteus was around waaay before Adium X was released publicly or even a blueprint,

Adium X, not just Adium. Adium X borrowed a lot from Adium. More so than Proteus.

I think most of the ideas were borrowed by Adium X. Heck, Proteus 3 was out before Adium X even began making sense when it was in (more or less) private development. And the first public Proteus 4 beta and Adium X beta were pretty much simultaneous releases...and Proteus 4 hasn't changed much since the betas. Adium has been busily adding things Proteus has had for years and things Proteus 4 had when it was released.

Things that all IM apps have. Not just Proteus.

And still, some of the better features of Proteus still haven't shown up in Adium yet. imservice daemons for each account so that a crash doesn't take down the whole app...

NEver happens to me with Adium but it WAS a problem when I used Proteus.

[b]
Away status'...when will Adium get these? Jebus Christ. Is that too much to ask? History that doesn't suck.

[b]
Er what do you mean? I hover over a user, BAM status.

Adium is beginning to look more and more like Proteus as days go by. You don't notice it because you probably never use Proteus...but I have and Adium is definitely starting to look like Proteus but with a few more bells and whistles.

LAWL!

BOTH copied off of Fire. Adium doesn't look or feel anything like Proteus.

But you know, I have seen LOTS of posts from Proteus users on their boards that say "How do I make Proteus look like Adium"

[theJoKell]

Originally posted by Horsepoo!!!:
Maybe it's because you've been living in La La Land.

Considering Proteus was around waaay before Adium X was released publicly or even a blueprint, I think most of the ideas were borrowed by Adium X. Heck, Proteus 3 was out before Adium X even began making sense when it was in (more or less) private development. And the first public Proteus 4 beta and Adium X beta were pretty much simultaneous releases...and Proteus 4 hasn't changed much since the betas. Adium has been busily adding things Proteus has had for years and things Proteus 4 had when it was released.

And still, some of the better features of Proteus still haven't shown up in Adium yet. imservice daemons for each account so that a crash doesn't take down the whole app...they relaunch safely so you don't stay disconnected...in theory they shouldn't crash so maybe this point isn't very valid, but it's nice to know that Proteus heals itself...the daemons also allow the Proteus front-end to be quit...and you can still remain online and get messages and access these messages locally if you relaunch Proteus or remotely.

Away status'...when will Adium get these? Jebus Christ. Is that too much to ask? History that doesn't suck.

Adium is beginning to look more and more like Proteus as days go by. You don't notice it because you probably never use Proteus...but I have and Adium is definitely starting to look like Proteus but with a few more bells and whistles.

Zim already replied, but you're wrong. Adium was out before Proteus, Justin will admit that. Adium 2 was the previous name for Adium X and was out before Proteus 4 was.

The inclusion of imservice daemons is simply a design decision that the Adium devs have decided they will not do. There are pros and cons to both, and one is not inherently better than the other.

Adium has had away statuses since the very first version. They're currently working on a status system rewrite that will allow for more statuses than simply "away" (for the protocols that support them).

But now lets see what Proteus borrowed from Adium. Two biggest things: libgaim and webkit. Adium used Colloquy's idea of using webkit for the message views and Proteus picked up on it. Adium was the first to use libgaim (they had access to the code before anyone else) and Proteus picked up on it.

[Tick]

*sigh*

Guys, it's just an app, stop flaming over it

[Zimphire]

Horsepoo has ALWAYS bashed other multi-service IM apps other than Proteus. He has a emotional attachment to it. Even when he is proved wrong time and time again, he still repeats the same inane drivel.

I and most people don't care who uses what. But he at times will be in PAIN knowing someone is using something other than Proteus for their multi-service needs, and will try to berate them till they switch. It's quite pathetic.

[Drakino]

Proteus currently.

I'd probably switch to Adrium if:

1. I didn't lose my log files in the move.
2. I could import my contact list. About 99% of the list has been renamed, and when I went from Trillian->Proteus, I wrote a very messy PHP script to convert the XML types. Not really willing to do this again because it was such a cludge.

Though Adrium is libgaim based too, and libgaim seems to hate dual ISP routers like thet one I use at home. iChat and Trillian don't mind, but with certain settings, Gaim and Proteus go nuts and get into disconnect/reconnect loops.

[Lancer409]

Originally posted by manofsteal:

lucky devil...

i want a barry bonds version =P I DO live in San Francisco after-all..

[Turnpike]

Seems last I heard, Proteus and Adium devs were more or less friendly. I guess they let their fans do the flaming?


Earth Mk. II: I've been making contact list views in my SVN build for a week or two, and believe me, your names are MUCH better... First... Second... Third... I've just been linking colors and layouts more or less by number. Best I have is "dark"


As to the person trying to hide MSN contact addresses (I think I've seen this in a few threads... or maybe I've read this one too many times): highlight a contact, hit cmd-I (or go to contact -> view contact's info). Last tab is "settings". Choose an alias for your contact.


Drakino: I think you mean "lose". This isn't too hard to keep straight. Sorry if it was just a typo, but this is easily in the top 5 of word misuse on the Internet (ignoring l33t and chat abbreviations).


Horsepoo: for all the noise you've been raising, you certainly didn't give very many features that were "copied" from Proteus... in fact, I can't find a single one. You just state which you believe came out first (I didn't bother to check, and I see it is in question... either way, it doesn't matter unless you say WHAT was copied). I by no means take offense if you prefer Proteus over Adium... but I do like it when people who claim they have an argument back it up with something. Especially when you claim somebody else was "living in La La Land" to have not seen the things copied. You argument lacks substance. I've seen more examples of Proteus copying from Adium listed than the other way around. You started a debate, picked a subject on which to debate, and have yet to actually participate on it on behalf of the side you seem to represent. Very, very confusing, considering you MUST have a logical argument somewhere.... I personally believe things have been copied back and forth, but I'd be hard pressed to say what besides WebKit Message Views (copied from Colloquy)... but I think it is fairly common practice in software development. Unless they are stealing code, I don't see anything wrong with it... besides, Adium, at least, is GPL'd. I'm assuming Proteus isn't, since they charge, but I don't recall the details of the GPL.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally posted by Turnpike:
...besides, Adium, at least, is GPL'd. I'm assuming Proteus isn't, since they charge, but I don't recall the details of the GPL.

It's comment like these that reveal how ignorant you (and a few others) really are. imservice is GPL'd...the only not GPL'd is the front-end...and with good reason.

An open-source front-end usually ends up with a complex and bloated UI, not unlike Adium's, where users suggest things to the many developers who then implement them as they see fit.

Adium has always had status messages, but like you said Jokell, it doesn't let you set it.

libgaim and WebKit were a Proteus first. Heck Adium X is still in beta. Just because WebKit showed up in a public beta in a very crippled way it doesn't mean it wasn't working very well in private Proteus betas.

Oh the ignorance on these boards.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally posted by Zimphire:

I and most people don't care who uses what. But he at times will be in PAIN knowing someone is using something other than Proteus for their multi-service needs, and will try to berate them till they switch. It's quite pathetic.

It doesn't pain me at all, as long as credit is given where credit is due. Many Adium users on these boards seem to have their facts mixed up about who borrowed from who.

I'm seeing lots of things being borrowed from Proteus and I'm in a better position than most of you to say this since I actually used Proteus 3 and 4 and Adium X regularly...while most of you only used Adium and hang around the Adium forums where all sorts of nonsense is spewed.

I'm still surprised people think Proteus copied of Adium X when Proteus 3 was out way before Adium X...so what is it? Proteus 4 copied Adiumx?

I could mention copied features but I'm pretty sure the Adium fans will simply tell me it was 'natural progression of an IM client'.

One that astounds me is the hacked menuling...Proteus has had that nasty hack since Proteus 3 I believe. Never was fond of it. A few Adium developers said they'd never put that in Adium because it was a bad hack...all of a sudden it's in 0.7b? Really boggles my mind.

Let me know if you want more examples.

Still...Adium X is pretty slick for those that love customization. And Iser and the boys are doing a good job. I just don't like the misinformation and doublespeak going on in the Adium community.

[Tick]

Originally posted by Horsepoo!!!:
libgaim and WebKit were a Proteus first. Heck Adium X is still in beta. Just because WebKit showed up in a public beta in a very crippled way it doesn't mean it wasn't working very well in private Proteus betas.

Oh the ignorance on these boards.

Just so you are clear, and don't look like an idiot in front of people with a little clue from now on, here is the time line of events.


1) Adium was starting to implement other protocols due to iChat's release. Who would use adium with iChat around? Not many. Proteus was using their imservices, which gaves them multiple protocols. But no libgaim. This was not libgaim on either front. A msn and jabber plugin were in the works for Adium.

2) Adium implemented Libgaim. This is posted as the big surprise on Adium's web page. No name change to Adium X yet. FYI, the Jabber and MSN plugins are still in source, but they aren't really used, and are eventually removed, along with the TOC2 plugin, which was dying anyhow.

3) Colloquy does webkit. Also, around this time is when Justin and company saw that libgaim would end up being easier for implementing protocols.

4) Adium gets webkit.

5) Adium X is released, to signify the change from just Aim to a bunch of other protocols, and also match the adiumx.com name.

6) Within the week, Proteus 4 is released. URL changes from indigofield.com to proteusx.com. Proteus implements libgaim and webkit.

7) Colloquy gets adium tabs.


All the projects are friendly. Why are you guys hating on each other over this?

(my memory may be sketchy on some stuff.)

[resImadA]

Originally posted by Horsepoo!!!:
One that astounds me is the hacked menuling...Proteus has had that nasty hack since Proteus 3 I believe. Never was fond of it. A few Adium developers said they'd never put that in Adium because it was a bad hack...all of a sudden it's in 0.7b? Really boggles my mind.

Incorrect. Adium .7 and 0.63 (although it was disabled by default) have a NSStatusMenu. A NSStatusMenu is the non-draggable menubar item which apple wants us to use.

The draggable .menu menubar items are the ones that require a hack to work and that Apple does not want us to use. Our current stance on .menus is that we have no plans to include one at this time, although that (as always) may change in the future.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally posted by Tick:
Just so you are clear, and don't look like an idiot in front of people with a little clue from now on, here is the time line of events.


1) Adium was starting to implement other protocols due to iChat's release. Who would use adium with iChat around? Not many. Proteus was using their imservices, which gaves them multiple protocols. But no libgaim. This was not libgaim on either front. A msn and jabber plugin were in the works for Adium.

2) Adium implemented Libgaim. This is posted as the big surprise on Adium's web page. No name change to Adium X yet. FYI, the Jabber and MSN plugins are still in source, but they aren't really used, and are eventually removed, along with the TOC2 plugin, which was dying anyhow.

3) Colloquy does webkit. Also, around this time is when Justin and company saw that libgaim would end up being easier for implementing protocols.

4) Adium gets webkit.

5) Adium X is released, to signify the change from just Aim to a bunch of other protocols, and also match the adiumx.com name.

6) Within the week, Proteus 4 is released. URL changes from indigofield.com to proteusx.com. Proteus implements libgaim and webkit.

7) Colloquy gets adium tabs.


All the projects are friendly. Why are you guys hating on each other over this?

(my memory may be sketchy on some stuff.)

I'm glad all the projects are friendly and sharing. But your timeline is incorrect.

Private betas of Proteus had Webkit implemented before Adium X had Webkit implemented. Just because Adium has been open source and openly offering builds of what I consider extreme beta software, it doesn't mean that the Adium implementations were good enough for public consumption.

libgaim or separate libraries, who cares...as long as things work. And in both cases (Adium and Proteus) they don't. Maybe I'm wrong about who implemented libgaim first, and I regret being sucked into the 'Adium used libgaim first' argument because I don't think libgaim is a feature per se.

The dream of multi-IM clients is just that...a dream. If people don't mind uncertainty and being perpetual beta-testers, great...I've long moved to official clients. Multi-IM clients Proteus and Fire have been around for over 3 years now and they still have big problems. So does Adium.

Don't get me wrong...I'm glad you're all pooling your knowledge together. And I do think Proteus and Adium beat other multi-IM clients on every other platform in terms of ease-of-use.

[theJoKell]

Originally posted by Horsepoo!!!:
I'm glad all the projects are friendly and sharing. But your timeline is incorrect.

Private betas of Proteus had Webkit implemented before Adium X had Webkit implemented. Just because Adium has been open source and openly offering builds of what I consider extreme beta software, it doesn't mean that the Adium implementations were good enough for public consumption.

For the record, I'm not hating on any IM client. Just discussing the timeline here.

Horsepoo, your argument is just that, horse poo. Adium worked with Colloquy, the guys who originated the webkit message view, to put webkit into Adium. Proteus picked up on it soon after. I'm sure Justin would be able to tell you that.

And just because Proteus 3 was out before Adium switched names to Adium X doesn't mean it had features included first. A change of a name doesn't matter to the development cycle at all, and Adium 2 betas/alphas/whatever had plenty of features that you fail to recognize.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally posted by theJoKell:
For the record, I'm not hating on any IM client. Just discussing the timeline here.

Horsepoo, your argument is just that, horse poo. Adium worked with Colloquy, the guys who originated the webkit message view, to put webkit into Adium. Proteus picked up on it soon after. I'm sure Justin would be able to tell you that.

And just because Proteus 3 was out before Adium switched names to Adium X doesn't mean it had features included first. A change of a name doesn't matter to the development cycle at all, and Adium 2 betas/alphas/whatever had plenty of features that you fail to recognize.

********. Webkit was implemented in private betas almost a week before Adium even thought about implementing it. Someone on the boards suggested it and Justin quickly added it to Proteus.

Anyways, Adium 2 does have plenty of new and original features...never said it didn't. But there has been a lot of stuff that was copied from iChat and Proteus. And there are *still* things that remain unimplemented in Adium that Proteus has had for a long time. Setting status messages, a GUI for file transfer.

Mind you, Proteus still needs to get chat room support. So Adium is the winner in that respect...but also packaged in the form of a buggy beta...buggier than anything Justin or Defaultware ever put out, IMO.

Adium = open source software that releases builds or even allows people to compile from CVS

Proteus = closed source front-end...it's only normal that you don't know when things are implemented unless you're a beta tester

And it's ridiculous that because Adium had a very alpha form of a certain feature, that it's considered fully implemented.

Even if Webkit in Adium had been implemented before Proteus, it wasn't usable by the mass in any form until a few weeks after Proteus released a usable form of it.

[Tick]

Originally posted by Horsepoo!!!:
I've long moved to official clients.

Originally posted by Horsepoo!!!:
iChat for AIM
Proteus for MSN
and Yahoo Messenger for Yahoo

I haven't had any problems with this setup for a few months

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally posted by Tick:

Ok...partially moved to official client.

Would you rather me use the buggy MSN in Adium?

Proteus' MSN works like a champ.

And you guys are starting to push me into writing the list of features copied from Proteus...natural progression? I don't think it is.

The contact list is starting to get features Proteus 4 has had for months.

Status icons and service icons as badges? Customizable status icons? Rewriting the status system? Sounds a lot like Adium is going the Proteus way.

Oh but, but...it's only natural progression.

Proteus has had Address Book support and mega-contacts or whatever you want to call grouping same contacts together for more than a year...Adium just got these things recently and are hailed by Adium users. Proteus has had contact pictures in the Contact list since Proteus 4's release...Adium is just getting this and, yet, Adium has always been the greatest!

Ok there.

Anyways...I'm done...I'm sure I'll be back Sunday and there will be tons of angry Adium fans flaming me.

[Zimphire]

Horse with the smackdown you just received, I wouldn't come back with that nick.

[resImadA]

Saying that Proteus copied Adium with webkit or Adium copied Proteus with webkit is completely silly guys. Both clients "copied" their webkit message views from the irc client Colloquy. Copy is of course the wrong term, since both Justin and the Adium team worked with the Colloquy developer in adapting his technology.

It's a real shame that any IM related threads on this forum are consistently and deliberately derailed by certain individuals.

[macintologist]

But the bottom line is that Fire ownz u all

[TeknoTurd]

Adium for me, but it sorely needs an update. It's been about 1 or 2 months since the last one I believe. It has a long way to go, but it's still the most customizable and has the best interface.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by resImadA:
It's a real shame that any IM related threads on this forum are consistently and deliberately derailed by certain a individual.

Fixed. It's usually only one person that comes in here saying the SAME tired old stuff.

It's been going on for years. And it's tiresome.

I don't know why he does it. Emotional attachments to software is silly.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by macintologist:
But the bottom line is that Fire ownz u all

I loved Fire. Nothing wrong with it. I just like Adium's GUI options.

I've tried them all.

I didn't like Proteus because it had a habit of being more buggy than the betas of Fire and Adium in it's final version.

And there is no way I would PAY for Proteus when Adium is free and better.

IMHO of course.

[Luca Rescigno]

On my Mac, a combo of iChat (most of the time, due to very good file transfer) and Adium (best client that has multi-protocol support).

On my PC, I use the official AIM client, modified with DeadAIM. Removes the AOL ads, and gives you many more options, while retaining excellent support for all of AIM's features (file transfer, direct connection, audio and video chat, shared folders, and so on).

I voted Adium

[macintologist]

Originally posted by Luca Rescigno:
On my Mac, a combo of iChat (most of the time, due to very good file transfer) and Adium (best client that has multi-protocol support).

On my PC, I use the official AIM client, modified with DeadAIM. Removes the AOL ads, and gives you many more options, while retaining excellent support for all of AIM's features (file transfer, direct connection, audio and video chat, shared folders, and so on).

I voted Adium

I use iChat because of the A/V and file transfer. I send files to friends every day and talk to other iChat AVers on audio chat a lot too.

[G-Force]

I have been using Fire for years. Then I read this thread and saw all these people talking about AdiumX. So I thought it must be worth trying out if all these macheads are raving about it.

To make a long story short, I'm really liking the interface and customization options. I plan on dropping Fire entirely once I get completely comfortable with Adium.

[azdude]

Originally posted by Earth Mk. II:
It's a group bubbles window layout, I titled it "Slick!" but I'm not very imaginative with names, and I'm not on MSN in that screen shot.

I can post the layout and color files if you want though.

All I'd really like to know is the name of the font in your Groups titles... superb choice.

[Earth Mk. II]

Thanks!

It's Futura, medium-italic, 13 pt. Right aligned, as you can see.

[ReggieX]

Fire, but only because IXQ had weird crashes.