[ghporter]

I am relatively immune to most advertising, and don't trust "promotional literature" for related reasons, so I'm having trouble finding good information about credit cards. I'm nearing a point where I want to change my credit card company, and I am curious what other people have to say about their own credit card experiences.

What is it like working with your credit card company? Are there people available by phone 24/7 for non-emergency questions? What sort of rates can you get, and what sort of tradeoffs do these rates come with? How does dealing with customer service make you feel? (Valued customer or lowlife slimeball? Intelligent person with valid issues or idiot?)

[jokell82]

I've never had to "work" with my credit card company. I buy stuff with it and pay it off - don't really need any communication for that.

But I use my card differently than most people I think. I *never* carry a balance and only buy things within my budget. The only reason I use a credit card and not just my debit card is because of the cash back I get for using it. And since I use it like a debit card and put all of my purchases on it, I get quite a hefty sum at the end of the year.

Oh, and I use a Costco Amex Card.

[peeb]

What are you going to use it for? I mean, your patterns of spending / paying it off. That will determine which one you want to go for.

[osiris]

I have to say American Express. Their cards come in all flavors, so finding the right one requires a little research on their site. Customer service is amazing - they'll practically send thugs out to protect you, and with a business platinum card you get a toll free number that's good 24/7 and connects directly to a human on the first ring.
It's interest free because the balance is due in full, unless you opt for the flex-pay (fancy talk for revolving credit) which comes in at around 15%.

The rewards vary, as do the fees. I pay $200 a year, but I get free companion air tickets and membership with Hertz Gold (which gets you a free rental with every 6 days you rent). Depending on how much you travel or spend, you can come out on top pretty easily. Don't leave home without it.

[Gankdawg]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

I've never had to "work" with my credit card company. I buy stuff with it and pay it off - don't really need any communication for that.

But I use my card differently than most people I think. I *never* carry a balance and only buy things within my budget. The only reason I use a credit card and not just my debit card is because of the cash back I get for using it. And since I use it like a debit card and put all of my purchases on it, I get quite a hefty sum at the end of the year.

Oh, and I use a Costco Amex Card.

QFT.

[Paco500]

Originally Posted by osiris 

I have to say American Express.

Except it can be a challenge finding places that accept them, outside of big chains. I put all my business expenses on one account (and I have an obscene amount), but I have 2 cards, and AmEx and a Visa. I get better rewards when I use the AmEx card, but as so many places don't take it, I end up having to use the Visa at least 50% of the time. It probably seems odd having two different cards for one account (it certainly did for me when I signed up), but they were losing too many customers by being aligned with AmEx so they broadened it.

I don't think this is just a UK or Europe thing, I do quite a bit of travel in the US (Mostly San Francisco, RTP and Washington DC) and find that if I go beyond the national chain restaurants and stores, AmEx is generally not welcome. It just costs to much for little guys to accept it.

[Cold Warrior]

I have a very low rate but it never kicks in b/c I never carry a balance. Like jokell, I use it for regular expenses -- things I'd buy or pay (e.g., bills) anyway. I get a small percent back, which is credited to me in January. It makes for a nice little payment, and amounts to them paying me for using their card.

I've never had much reason to deal with customer service, but they've always been responsive through a built-in email interface.

[peeb]

Bizarrely, I am in complete alignment with Cold Warrior on this issue.

[EricTheRed]

I prefer rewards cards. I'm currently running my household on Chase's Freedom card which pays 3% back on whatever are the top three types of expenses are (gas, groceries, home improvement, whatever) and 1% back on all other purchases. Rewards cards works well if you pay your balance every month. Also, be aware that you can negotiate your terms with CC issuers if you spend sufficient amounts per month.

You can compare credit cards of all different types at this site.

Reward Credit Cards and Comparison Guide

The site doesn't have comparisons for specialty financial cards tied into your investment accounts.

[osiris]

Originally Posted by Paco500 

Except it can be a challenge finding places that accept them, outside of big chains. I put all my business expenses on one account (and I have an obscene amount), but I have 2 cards, and AmEx and a Visa. I get better rewards when I use the AmEx card, but as so many places don't take it, I end up having to use the Visa at least 50% of the time. It probably seems odd having two different cards for one account (it certainly did for me when I signed up), but they were losing too many customers by being aligned with AmEx so they broadened it.

I don't think this is just a UK or Europe thing, I do quite a bit of travel in the US (Mostly San Francisco, RTP and Washington DC) and find that if I go beyond the national chain restaurants and stores, AmEx is generally not welcome. It just costs to much for little guys to accept it.

Some good points there. I think amex charges 3% to vendors for the 'privilege'.

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by Paco500 

Except it can be a challenge finding places that accept them, outside of big chains. I put all my business expenses on one account (and I have an obscene amount), but I have 2 cards, and AmEx and a Visa. I get better rewards when I use the AmEx card, but as so many places don't take it, I end up having to use the Visa at least 50% of the time. It probably seems odd having two different cards for one account (it certainly did for me when I signed up), but they were losing too many customers by being aligned with AmEx so they broadened it.

I don't think this is just a UK or Europe thing, I do quite a bit of travel in the US (Mostly San Francisco, RTP and Washington DC) and find that if I go beyond the national chain restaurants and stores, AmEx is generally not welcome. It just costs to much for little guys to accept it.

I have actually never tried to use my Amex and been denied. Pretty much everywhere takes it now.

[turtle777]

I have the Amex Blue Cash as my primary card, and a backup MC that also pays cash rewards. I'm a big Amex fan, they have treated me very well. Plus, their cards look cool

I use it, and pay off the balance in full each month.

For me, using credit cards fur everyday purchases has two advantages:

1) I don't lose track of it, because even if I lose the receipt, I still can get information about the charge
2) Paying with a credit card puts you in a much more powerful situation in any case of problems (like warranty, non-performance etc).

-t

[amazing]

If you have a Costco nearby, then go with Amex. Costco gas will save you a bunch of money if the Costco is convenient to where you live.

That said, keep your old card, but do pay it off, either with a balance transfer or whatever. Then just mothball the card. The length of time that you have a credit card improves your credit score.

[ShortcutToMoncton]

I have a Visa card with my bank, Scotiabank (one of those travel Visas that give you bonus travel points and lots of nice features and whatnot). I try and only use it up to what I can pay off. Failing that, as a student I have a line of credit with a much lower interest rate (prime + 1 as opposed to the high teens), so I usually throw things on my Visa for a few weeks (as no interest accrues before the monthly period), and then pay it off onto my LOC if I can't pay otherwise.

It's very annoying being a student and in debt all the time.

greg

[Rumor]

I have two Visa cards. One from Capital One and the other from State Farm Bank. I have been very happy with State Farm Bank. Interest rates do not mean much to me because I pay my card balance often, however, SFB has very good people on the phone when I make a mistake.

[Rumor]

Originally Posted by Paco500 

Except it can be a challenge finding places that accept them, outside of big chains. I put all my business expenses on one account (and I have an obscene amount), but I have 2 cards, and AmEx and a Visa. I get better rewards when I use the AmEx card, but as so many places don't take it, I end up having to use the Visa at least 50% of the time. It probably seems odd having two different cards for one account (it certainly did for me when I signed up), but they were losing too many customers by being aligned with AmEx so they broadened it.

I don't think this is just a UK or Europe thing, I do quite a bit of travel in the US (Mostly San Francisco, RTP and Washington DC) and find that if I go beyond the national chain restaurants and stores, AmEx is generally not welcome. It just costs to much for little guys to accept it.

AmEx charges the vendors more, which is why less people seem to use them.

[Kvasir]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

I have actually never tried to use my Amex and been denied. Pretty much everywhere takes it now.

That's been my experience as well (Bank of America AMEX Rewards, but I also have a VISA Gold and a Platinum MC). It's been years, literally, since I've used a card at a place which took VISA or MC and didn't also take AMEX. Even ~90% of the online shops I purchase from take it. I think things have changed a lot since AMEX got away from offering strictly charge cards and now seems to do more business with credit cards then the older style charge cards.

[Eug]

Hmmm... You might want to talk to your bank for a loan if you're carrying a credit card balance. Or in the very least, try to get a lower rate from your credit card company.

Several places do not accept American Express, esp. overseas. From my understanding, yes AmEx often charges more than Visa or Mastercard, but it varies depending on the deal AmEx has with the store. So to just say the commission rate is 3% is incorrect.

Rare places don't accept either Visa or Mastercard (if they accept credit cards at all). So, if I were to get just one credit card, it would be one of these two. However, I have come across a couple of places that don't have one or the other. Thus, I have all three:

- My no-fee American Express gives me (up to) 2% cash back, so most of purchases go on that. It also gives me access to Front Of The Line ticket purchases. I have no idea what its interest rate is, because I never carry a balance. (Costco's AmEx offers no advantage to my card, because the rebate rate is the same, but with Costco's card you're forced to spend that rebate at Costco. I get my rebate as a check. However, my card was a limited promotion that they've since cancelled. I guess I was one of the lucky ones.)
- My Visa has a fee, but that's covered by my bank as part of a package with my bank account. It gives me 1% cash back, and it provides me free insurance for car rentals. I have no idea what its interest rate is, because I never carry a balance.
- My Mastercard has no fee, but does not give me any cash back. I have no idea what its interest rate is, because I never carry a balance.

BTW, some of the cards also provide extended warranties. I made use of that once. To my surprise, the process was relatively painless. I went to the repair shop and got an estimate for the warranty in writing, and the company handling the insurance for the credit card approved it.

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by Eug 

(Costco's AmEx offers no advantage to my card, because the rebate rate is the same, but with Costco's card you're forced to spend that rebate at Costco. I get my rebate as a check. However, my card was a limited promotion that they've since cancelled. I guess I was one of the lucky ones.)

Not true. If you bring in your rebate check to CostCo they will just give you the cash at customer service. Or you can buy a cheap item, pay with the rebate, and they will give you the change back in cash.

Also, my rate is dependent on what I spend my money on, but it ranges from 1-3% (3 for gas and food, 2 for travel, and 1 for everything else).

Originally Posted by Eug 

BTW, some of the cards also provide extended warranties. I made use of that once. To my surprise, the process was relatively painless. I went to the repair shop and got an estimate for the warranty in writing, and the company handling the insurance for the credit card approved it.

From what I understand, every Amex card will give you an extra year warranty on any purchases made on the card.
Edit - Yep, see here: http://www.americanexpress.com/buyersassurance/

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

Also, my rate is dependent on what I spend my money on, but it ranges from 1-3% (3 for gas and food, 2 for travel, and 1 for everything else).

Amex Blue Cash gives you:

1.5% on gas, groceries, drugstore purchases
0.5% for everything else
if you spend less than $ 6,500 / year.

However, once you hit the $ 6,500, you're in the sweet spot:
5 % on gas, groceries, drugstore purchases
1.5% for everything else

As far as Cash back goes, I don't think there is anything better out there.

-t

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

I'm going to try and change my Amex card to an Amex business card, which would get me 5% on gas as well. And still the 3% on food, 2% on travel, and 1% on everything else.

Why not get the Cash Blue, it's free.

The only area where you might lose some is on travel, it would go from 2% to 1.5%, given you break the $ 6,500 / year limit. But you have huge upside potential for food (3% -> 5%) and everything else (1% -> 1.5%)

Edit: Darn it, Hampstor.

-t

[jokell82]

I'm going to try and change my Amex card to an Amex business card, which would get me 5% on gas as well. And still the 3% on food, 2% on travel, and 1% on everything else.

[Cipher13]

My experience is limited, but:

I use a Visa Debit. Never had a problem, works as advertised. Others I know have had issues with MasterCard security being overzealous (blocking all attempts to use it overseas, even after explicitly allowing it over and over again. That may have been a Commonwealth Bank issue though).

In Australia Diners and Amex have surcharges associated with use of around 2%, passed on to you, so they're a pain.

As for rewards and whatnot, I've never looked into it. Doesn't concern me too much.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

Not true. If you bring in your rebate check to CostCo they will just give you the cash at customer service. Or you can buy a cheap item, pay with the rebate, and they will give you the change back in cash.

PITA, and I don't shop very often at Costco anyway.

Also, my rate is dependent on what I spend my money on, but it ranges from 1-3% (3 for gas and food, 2 for travel, and 1 for everything else).

Well, that would be much worse for me then for certain purchases at least, because it's 2% for everything, after you hit a certain amount:

1st $2500: 0.50% rebate
2nd $2500: 1% rebate
after that: 2% rebate

No limit for the cash back either. So, if I somehow spent $50000 on the card, I'd get $12.50 + $25 + $900 = $937.50. I don't think there is a limit on the US Costco cards, but there is a $500 limit for the Canadian Costco card.

P.S. There are a few other caveats with the Costco cards.

1) The US card I was talking about was the Costco Cash Rebate card. This is different from the Costco TrueEarnings card which is what you were talking about. The TrueEarnings card is not available up here.
2) You receive the max cash rebate if you carry a balance. If you don't carry a balance your rebate amount may be reduced, at least with the Costco Cash Rebate card.

https://www124.americanexpress.com/c...o.cardselector

[jokell82]

Ah sorry, I didn't know they had more than one card. But I'm happy with the TrueEarnings card.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by Cipher13 

Others I know have had issues with MasterCard security being overzealous (blocking all attempts to use it overseas, even after explicitly allowing it over and over again. That may have been a Commonwealth Bank issue though).

I think in countries other than the US, banks are far less willing to go out of their way to fix things for you or make CC purchases a great experience.
The US is so competitive in that matter, the banks / CC issuer will typically go out of their way to enable you to spend money.

Plus, they offer far better rewards programs.

-t

[amazing]

Are you sure you only wanted advice about credit cards? Because you really should up and move close to a Costco that has a gas station, where you could use your Costco Amex card more conveniently. You could also stroll in and try out all the samples!

Voilà! Problem solved!

[JKT]

Originally Posted by Kvasir 

That's been my experience as well (Bank of America AMEX Rewards, but I also have a VISA Gold and a Platinum MC). It's been years, literally, since I've used a card at a place which took VISA or MC and didn't also take AMEX. Even ~90% of the online shops I purchase from take it. I think things have changed a lot since AMEX got away from offering strictly charge cards and now seems to do more business with credit cards then the older style charge cards.

Fwiw, AMEX is not well supported outside of America and that includes for online shopping - if you try and use AMEX on a non-US web store, it will quite often be denied and you will have to switch to a VISA card or MC instead. I know this because my bank recently switched from issuing us a VISA card to issuing us two cards (which is pretty ridiculous if you ask me), a MC and an AMEX card. Using the AMEX card gets me more Airmiles per pound spent than the MC, but I can hardly use it online as it almost always gets refused.

[Eug]

Yep. I find that AmEx is great for the US, but not so great outside of the US. It's OK in Canada, but not ideal here.

OTOH, I've noticed that a few online stores in the US were sometimes more willing to do international sales to Canada with AmEx. With Visa or MC, I'd have to fax them all sorts of identification, which suggests to me that Visa and MC may see more fraud. In fact, this was one of the reasons I got my AmEx (besides the excellent cash back rebate).

[Kvasir]

Actually, for a lot of online purchases, I do tend to use my VISA Gold (no cash back, but extended warranties and insurance) - only because it offers the feature of generating pseudo-card numbers for use online (my VISA is through BofA too, but they don't have that feature for their AMEX Rewards card yet). My VISA - I can generate the pseudo-numbers with a specific credit limit and expiration date - a useful feature for places I shop a lot at (such as Amazon or Newegg, which have my credit card "number" on file, but it's not the real card number).

Of course a lot of bank cards offer this kind of feature, plus ones like DiscoverCard, and maybe AMEX Blue cards (but I'm not sure about those).

[Zeeb]

Here is an interesting story about credit card reward programs that appeared today on CNN:

Raw Deal: Rewards programs are really a rip off - Jun. 2, 2008

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Zeeb 

Here is an interesting story about credit card reward programs that appeared today on CNN:

Raw Deal: Rewards programs are really a rip off - Jun. 2, 2008

That's why the key is to not maintain a balance. Using your credit card wisely means you can be paid (cash back) to get a 6-week interest free loan.

Fortunately, my financial situation allows me to do this... so that I pay zero interest (except on my mortgage), and get several hundred bux back per year from my credit card.

For those who find it difficult to discipline themselves to spend responsibly on a credit card may want to use debit instead, and if necessary can take out a bank loan to reduce the interest paid on any outstanding balances.

[andi*pandi]

my favorite cards are my citibank subaru reward card and mbna (now bank of america) rewards. I've had the bank of america for a long time, they have the best rate, and since I've been a customer so long they treat me right (if I am late with a payment they will usually knock off the late fee ). I have a citibank Amazon card I'm going to let go.

Rewards are great now that they're gift cards etc not save bazillion points for worthless junk you don't need. The subaru one gives $100 toward parts, service, or a new car. It's nice to hand over $300 in coupons when getting repairs.

And yes, I try to pay off my cards each month in full.

my spouse however...

[turtle777]

I never undeerstood the need to use those virtual numbers with credible merchants.

If something goes wrong, Amex is VERY VERY lenient and fixes problems very quickly.

E.g., I had this company that I bought a Credit Score from, supposedly a one time charge of $ 9.99.
Well, they tried (and still try) to scam me by now charging me $ 17.99 for some subscription, that I have never agreed to.

So, each month, they charge my Amex card, each month, I go in and dispute it (takes 2 minutes), and I receive the credit w/o questions. Thsi game has been going on for months, but Amex never complaint or gave me any trouble.

The company who does those charges will get slapped with a $ 30 surcharge EACH TIME, so instead of making $ 17.99, on me, they lose $ 30 each month. I'm curious how long they want to keep losing money with me.

-t

[Eug]

Originally Posted by andi*pandi 

my favorite cards are my citibank subaru reward card and mbna (now bank of america) rewards. I've had the bank of america for a long time, they have the best rate, and since I've been a customer so long they treat me right (if I am late with a payment they will usually knock off the late fee ). I have a citibank Amazon card I'm going to let go.

Rewards are great now that they're gift cards etc not save bazillion points for worthless junk you don't need. The subaru one gives $100 toward parts, service, or a new car. It's nice to hand over $300 in coupons when getting repairs.

And yes, I try to pay off my cards each month in full.

my spouse however...

The article from CNN that somebody else linked is accurate IMO in its statement that it's usually better to just get the cash.

It all varies, but for example, it takes 7000 points to get a $50 gift card for Esso (known as Exxon in the US). However, if I used a 1% cash back card, the $7000 I would have spent to get those 7000 points, it would get me $70 cash. Or with my AmEx, after I have reached a certain threshold, that $7000 would get me $140 cash back.

Now it's true that some affiliate cards offer better deals for the company they're affiliated with, but you generally you are more locked to that company. The new Costco one seems pretty good for many people, but YMMV.

[Kvasir]

Originally Posted by turtle777 

I never undeerstood the need to use those virtual numbers with credible merchants.

If something goes wrong, Amex is VERY VERY lenient and fixes problems very quickly.

E.g., I had this company that I bought a Credit Score from, supposedly a one time charge of $ 9.99.
Well, they tried (and still try) to scam me by now charging me $ 17.99 for some subscription, that I have never agreed to.

So, each month, they charge my Amex card, each month, I go in and dispute it (takes 2 minutes), and I receive the credit w/o questions. Thsi game has been going on for months, but Amex never complaint or gave me any trouble.

The company who does those charges will get slapped with a $ 30 surcharge EACH TIME, so instead of making $ 17.99, on me, they lose $ 30 each month. I'm curious how long they want to keep losing money with me.

-t

Yeah, but had you used a pseudo-number, they could have just canceled THAT for you, and you would not need to go and dispute anything with anyone each month (doing that constantly would irritate the heck out of me). My main concern is identity theft. Should those numbers be compromised, my actual credit card's number remains unknown, which means I can keep on with my life with minimal hassle. A large number of identity/credit compromises in recent years have been by the companies contracted by large merchants/retailers to handle their credit transactions, so If I can keep an obscurity layer between me and these transaction handlers (who seem to handle data security like a mall cop handles policing), and my true information, so much the better.

[turtle777]

I'm just too lazy to deal with dozens of different card numbers.
How would I keep track of what number is used where and when, and valid for how long ? I'd constantly have to renew cards, extended their vaid through dates etc. Charges will bounce back etc.

Talk about hazzle.

-t

[Eug]

Well, that's interesting.... Incentive for fraud?

I stayed in a hotel in the US a little while back. After getting back to Canada I noticed an errant 2-digit charge on my AmEx. So, I called the hotel, and they claimed I used something from the mini-bar or whatever, but I didn't. So I asked them and they couldn't explain to me what I actually supposedly used and they said that they'd look into it. I called them several times after that and they were completely clueless and had no documentation as to what this charge was for even after "looking into it" several times. (I know for a fact I used nothing in their mini-bar etc., because I went out to purchase drinks and snacks from the local shop down the street, specifically to avoid the insanely high hotel charges.)

So, fed up, I finally just called AmEx to dispute the charges. AmEx cheerfully reversed the charges, but won't actually be contacting the hotel to sort this out. I asked why, and they said it wasn't worth their time and money to do so. They'll just eat the cost. Granted, it isn't a big amount and I have an excellent record with AmEx, but personally I would have preferred that the hotel didn't get away with this incorrect charge.