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Kindle Fire — Doesn't drift like a Prius (Page 15)
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Shaddim
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Dec 23, 2011, 04:25 AM
 
When there's motion and size, they always win. No way my chicks could get by with a puny 7"er anymore, not when they love my big 10"...

record of their favorite blues.
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Spheric Harlot
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Dec 23, 2011, 06:41 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
I did answer that:
No, you didn't. I wrote my post in response to yours, taking up specifically your bit about "fun to drive".

The concept of financial priorities is obviously (and understandably) completely alien to you.


Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
A good deal of the time (most of the time) you don't have to spend much more to get a better product. Some products are just crap in value or performance. The Prius and Fire are examples of being poor in both. You live and learn.
Much of the time you don't have to spend "much" more to get a better product.

Much of the time, the better product is actually the cheaper one. My car costs me about one third of what an older BMW would cost me, per year. I could have got a BMW wagon for just a little more, and it would be a vastly better ride.

But for one, even that "just a little more" was MUCH better invested in moving house, and for another, over five years, that "little bit more" would have run up a huge difference in mileage, insurance, and tax.

Utility wins.

I waste my money on indulgences that actually matter to me. Cars don't, at the moment.
     
Spheric Harlot
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Dec 23, 2011, 06:44 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Clarkson and I disagree and we're unimpressed.
Who the **** is Clarkson, and who the **** are you, and what relevance do you have to my life, and how I spend money between my needs and wants?
     
Wiskedjak
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Dec 23, 2011, 09:28 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
You know, you're right. And when you're right, you're right. Right? When we buy that house in Bermuda I'm getting an 80, glad you talked me into it. Just saw a really nice one for sale in Charleston for $820k, solid service records too.

Now, you just have to brow-beat those other guys for their wayward Fire and Prius purchases.
Of course, even then, what's 80' when compared with 150' and the value of having your own private island ... for just a little bit more money. I mean, Bermuda's a POS, what with all those other people getting in the way.
     
Shaddim
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Dec 23, 2011, 01:29 PM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
Who the **** is Clarkson, and who the **** are you, and what relevance do you have to my life, and how I spend money between my needs and wants?
So much anger, try some Valium or maybe get a nice massage.
Originally Posted by Wiskedjak View Post
Of course, even then, what's 80' when compared with 150' and the value of having your own private island ... for just a little bit more money. I mean, Bermuda's a POS, what with all those other people getting in the way.
Hell with that, I went ahead and put a down payment on Australia. What's the benefit of a private island when for just a little more I could have koalas? Right now I'm negotiating to purchase the Eclipse from Roman, but it's still a little small at 538', so I'll have to have a bigger one commissioned. No big thing.

How's it coming with those Prius and Fire owners? You silver-tongued devil.
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brassplayersrock²
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Dec 23, 2011, 08:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Want the best ebook reader ever made at a fantastic price? I just ordered one to replace my aging original DX, I've just about worn the damned thing out.

Woot® : One Day, One Deal™
You want us to buy a Yamaha 5.1 Home Theater Speaker System with Powered Subwoofer
?
     
Shaddim
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Dec 24, 2011, 01:05 AM
 
Originally Posted by brassplayersrock² View Post
You want us to buy a Yamaha 5.1 Home Theater Speaker System with Powered Subwoofer
?
At the time it was a Kindle DX for $200, which was a great price.
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Uncle Skeleton
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Dec 24, 2011, 08:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
At the time it was a Kindle DX for $200, which was a great price.
That's a dumb purchase, when for just $300 more you could get an iPad
     
Shaddim
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Dec 24, 2011, 11:41 PM
 
Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton View Post
That's a dumb purchase, when for just $300 more you could get an iPad
E-ink is far superior to LCD when reading books, no doubt about it. I'll do some casual reading for an hour or so on my iPad, but for more than that I use my DX.
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ghporter
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Dec 25, 2011, 10:50 AM
 
...not to mention that the suggestion was basically "spend 150% more," instead of "you could get a lot more features with an iPad," though it looks like the point was originally all about the Fire anyway...

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Dec 25, 2011, 03:43 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
E-ink is far superior to LCD when reading books, no doubt about it. I'll do some casual reading for an hour or so on my iPad, but for more than that I use my DX.
And the Prius has superiorities over the BMW like fuel economy, but that doesn't make it a "correct" choice over the clearly better BMW. Does it?
     
Shaddim
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Dec 25, 2011, 05:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton View Post
And the Prius has superiorities over the BMW like fuel economy, but that doesn't make it a "correct" choice over the clearly better BMW. Does it?
and there are cheaper cars that get fantastic fuel economy, are cheaper than the Prius, and cost much much less. That's what makes it a poor value.

TBH, at it's regular price, the Kindle DX isn't a good buy for many people. However, it was selling for $200 a few days ago, which made it a stellar deal.
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Dec 25, 2011, 10:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
and there are cheaper cars that get fantastic fuel economy, are cheaper than the Prius, and cost much much less.
Which they get by virtue of being lighter because they lack modern safety gear
     
Shaddim
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Dec 25, 2011, 10:36 PM
 
Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton View Post
Which they get by virtue of being lighter because they lack modern safety gear


Umm no. It's because they aren't toting around hundreds of extra pounds worth of batteries.
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imitchellg5
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Dec 25, 2011, 10:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post


Umm no. It's because they aren't toting around hundreds of extra pounds worth of batteries.
The Prius' battery pack weighs 115 lbs... less than a full grown adult or a load of groceries.
     
Shaddim
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Dec 26, 2011, 01:05 AM
 
115lbs, if that's what it is, can have quite an impact on driving performance and fuel economy. That's a hell of a lot of groceries, and a lot of lithium and other by-products that will end up in landfills*.


*Since we're all not naive and realize that many of those packs will end up not being recycled properly.
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ghporter
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Dec 26, 2011, 07:36 AM
 
A battery pack doesn't shift around, and doesn't decrease like the weight of a regular fuel load. In my completely conventional Civic, I notice some significant handling differences between nearly empty and full tanks.

It's my impression that Toyota is making a strong effort to capture all Prius battery packs, though I'm sure a few will slip through their fingers. On the other hand, scrap dealers are not stupid or naive, and will certainly do what they can to maximize their profits. In other words, they'll get the batteries recycled rather than pay to have them hauled off. They've been doing that with conventional automotive batteries for decades, and there's no reason to think they'll do less with these high-interest batteries.

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Spheric Harlot
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Dec 26, 2011, 08:05 AM
 
^ True.

This thread has taken a hard right turn for the stupid.

It might be time to put it out to rust in peace.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Dec 26, 2011, 10:36 AM
 
Well lets sum it up then by declaring what was pretty obvious in the first place that the Kindle is extremely unlikely to provide a genuine challenge to the iPad's dominance.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
sek929
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Dec 26, 2011, 10:55 AM
 
My sister got a Kindle Fire for xmas. I was playing with it and I honestly don't see what all the hatred it about.

Sure it didn't run as butter smooth as an iPad 2, but the damn thing worked pretty well.
     
Shaddim
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Dec 26, 2011, 12:58 PM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
A battery pack doesn't shift around, and doesn't decrease like the weight of a regular fuel load. In my completely conventional Civic, I notice some significant handling differences between nearly empty and full tanks.

It's my impression that Toyota is making a strong effort to capture all Prius battery packs, though I'm sure a few will slip through their fingers. On the other hand, scrap dealers are not stupid or naive, and will certainly do what they can to maximize their profits. In other words, they'll get the batteries recycled rather than pay to have them hauled off. They've been doing that with conventional automotive batteries for decades, and there's no reason to think they'll do less with these high-interest batteries.
Hmmm, then there must be some reason it drives so poorly, the handling is just god-awful. No joke, it's the worst handling car I've driven since the Chevy Cavalier, which also suffered from terrible weight distribution.

Anyway, I did give my friend that Asus Transformer as a gift, and he loved it. He'd already bought a Kindle Fire but ended up taking it back to Wal-Mart. I liked the Transformer so much I ordered a Prime with KB doc for myself.
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Dec 26, 2011, 01:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Hmmm, then there must be some reason it drives so poorly, the handling is just god-awful.
Maybe they made it that way on purpose to encourage people to save gas by driving as little as possible
     
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Dec 26, 2011, 02:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
Well lets sum it up then by declaring what was pretty obvious in the first place that the Kindle is extremely unlikely to provide a genuine challenge to the iPad's dominance.
Agreed. Although, I think the only people comparing the Fire with the iPad are those who are trying to say the Fire is a POS.
     
Eug
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Dec 26, 2011, 04:28 PM
 
So I got a leather iPad case for Xmas with a built in Bluetooth keyboard. Now the iPad is much less irritating to use. I have a physical keyboard on which to type, and I don't have to hold the thing up anymore. I can put the case on the table and fold the case so the iPad is kept upright, but with much more stability than with Apple's Smart Cover.

However, now it just feels like a 10" netbook with more OS peppiness, but less functionality and no trackpad, which means I still much prefer using a real laptop.
     
Shaddim
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Dec 26, 2011, 06:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by Wiskedjak View Post
Agreed. Although, I think the only people comparing the Fire with the iPad are those who are trying to say the Fire is a POS.
The reviewers?
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Dec 26, 2011, 07:23 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
115lbs, if that's what it is, can have quite an impact on driving performance and fuel economy. That's a hell of a lot of groceries, and a lot of lithium and other by-products that will end up in landfills*.


*Since we're all not naive and realize that many of those packs will end up not being recycled properly.
If you're that concerned about weight in your daily driver, you should probably ditch your wife and child.
     
Waragainstsleep
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Dec 26, 2011, 08:52 PM
 
115lbs sounds like a lot of groceries to me.

I wouldn't have thought the difference between a full and empty tank would be that much since the full tank doesn't have too much room for the fuel to actually move around in and an empty tank doesn't have much fuel to move around.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Shaddim
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Dec 26, 2011, 08:52 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
If you're that concerned about weight in your daily driver, you should probably ditch your wife and child.
Not so much concerned about the weight as wondering why it waddles around like a river barge.

like I said earlier:

...there must be some reason it drives so poorly, the handling is just god-awful. No joke, it's the worst handling car I've driven since the Chevy Cavalier, which also suffered from terrible weight distribution.
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Dec 26, 2011, 09:06 PM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
115lbs sounds like a lot of groceries to me.

I wouldn't have thought the difference between a full and empty tank would be that much since the full tank doesn't have too much room for the fuel to actually move around in and an empty tank doesn't have much fuel to move around.
Gasoline weighs just over 6 pounds per gallon. My Civic has a 12 gallon tank, so when full the fuel load weighs roughly 72 pounds. The tank on my car is mounted just aft of the rear axles and very low, yet there is still a significant and noticeable difference in handling between pulling into the gas station with an empty tank and leaving with a full tank. I know for a fact that there are very few baffles in my gas tank, so there isn't much to keep a partly full tank from sloshing around in a hard corner.

The battery pack on a Prius weighs 118 pounds according to the Wikipedia article on the car, and that battery pack is mounted ABOVE and forward of the rear axles. I think this is where the handling issue comes from: the weight of the batteries is too high and mounted in an inappropriately forward location.

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Dec 26, 2011, 09:10 PM
 
I wonder how many people are expecting their Prius' to handle like a Formula One race car?
     
ghporter
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Dec 26, 2011, 09:13 PM
 
Considering the fact that many dump truck drivers in my area appear to think that their trucks should handle like the "riced up" Eclipse they drive to work, I think the answer to that is "too many." Of course Formula 1 cars have horribly rough handling and suspensions built for a ride somewhere between "masochism" and "psychosis," but most people don't think about that either.

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Shaddim
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Dec 26, 2011, 11:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by Wiskedjak View Post
I wonder how many people are expecting their Prius' to handle like a Formula One race car?
I expect it to handle as well as other cars in its class, it doesn't.
( Last edited by Shaddim; Dec 27, 2011 at 12:50 AM. )
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Dec 26, 2011, 11:15 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
I expect it to handle as well as other cars in it's class, it doesn't.
What exactly to you expect it to be able to do?
     
Shaddim
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Dec 27, 2011, 12:49 AM
 
Originally Posted by Wiskedjak View Post
What exactly to you expect it to be able to do?


I expect it to handle as well as other cars in its class
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Wiskedjak
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Dec 27, 2011, 12:59 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Describe. "Handling" to me means it turns left when I steer left and stops when I press the brake pedal. I'm uncertain what you're expecting it to be able to do.
     
Shaddim
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Dec 27, 2011, 02:04 AM
 
Originally Posted by Wiskedjak View Post
Describe. "Handling" to me means it turns left when I steer left and stops when I press the brake pedal. I'm uncertain what you're expecting it to be able to do.
I expect it to not have understeer to the point that it feels like a safety hazard, I expect to not get completely locked out of all feel of the road, which it also does. That's a very bad, bad combination. Add in regenerative brakes that tend to grab too hard and tires that don't grip for sh*t and it's almost the worst handling car I've ever driven. I say almost because it still doesn't beat the first gen Hyundai Excel or the Yugo, which very well could be the worst car ever imported into the USA.

That would be an awesome Prius ad: "Buy the Prius, it's sort of environmentally friendly and it handles better than a Yugo!"
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Dec 27, 2011, 01:55 PM
 
And this is at normal speeds (ie: within the speed limits)?
     
Luca Rescigno
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Dec 27, 2011, 02:31 PM
 
What are you guys talking about? Because it doesn't appear to be the Kindle Fire.

"That's Mama Luigi to you, Mario!" *wheeze*
     
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Dec 27, 2011, 02:37 PM
 
Shaddim is trying to convince us that the Fire sucks just like the Prius. So, now he's trying to explain why the Prius sucks.
     
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Dec 27, 2011, 03:42 PM
 
Love the thread re-titling!
     
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Checkmate.
     
Shaddim
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Dec 27, 2011, 04:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by Wiskedjak View Post
Shaddim is trying to convince us that the Fire sucks just like the Prius. So, now he's trying to explain why the Prius sucks.
You guys like to bitch and I was bored, so I've been feeding your bitchiness for the last couple weeks.

Plus, I got a couple of you to lose your tempers and start swearing and foaming at the mouth, which is worth extra points.
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Shaddim
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Dec 27, 2011, 04:42 PM
 
Originally Posted by Luca Rescigno View Post
What are you guys talking about? Because it doesn't appear to be the Kindle Fire.
They decided to like the Fire because I didn't. Then I decided to give them all the finger and lead them around by their noses and piss them off for a while. The Lounge has been too quiet, had to do something.
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Luca Rescigno
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Dec 27, 2011, 05:46 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
You guys like to bitch and I was bored, so I've been feeding your bitchiness for the last couple weeks.

Plus, I got a couple of you to lose your tempers and start swearing and foaming at the mouth, which is worth extra points.
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
They decided to like the Fire because I didn't. Then I decided to give them all the finger and lead them around by their noses and piss them off for a while. The Lounge has been too quiet, had to do something.

"That's Mama Luigi to you, Mario!" *wheeze*
     
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Dec 27, 2011, 06:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
Love the thread re-titling!
That is awesome.

Originally Posted by Luca Rescigno View Post
Heheh.
     
imitchellg5
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Dec 27, 2011, 07:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
They decided to like the Fire because I didn't. Then I decided to give them all the finger and lead them around by their noses and piss them off for a while. The Lounge has been too quiet, had to do something.
I didn't "decide" to like the Fire, I've enjoyed using it as long as I've had it. But whatever.
     
Shaddim
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Dec 27, 2011, 10:58 PM
 
If you guys ignore my sage advice and buy junk, don't blame me.
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Dec 28, 2011, 03:24 AM
 
Ah the lounge ... where everyone worries that if people don't agree with them their penises will shrink.
     
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Dec 28, 2011, 04:02 PM
 
     
Shaddim
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Dec 28, 2011, 05:01 PM
 
Because they made a few dozen prototypes? I'm pretty confident in saying that Apple has made that many 7" iPads to tinker with, but that doesn't mean they'll ever see the light of day as a consumer device.
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