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Republicans: account for yourselves (Page 3)
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Chongo
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Jan 11, 2016, 07:59 PM
 
Originally Posted by OAW View Post
The Christian Identity movement, the Ku Klux Klan (KKK), the Irish Republican Army (IRA), the Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF) and the Ulster Defence Association (UDA), etc.

OAW
I knew you would list the Klan and the IRA. None of them are Christian. None of then follow the teaching of Jesus. The IRA was fighingt for independence from the UK and Ulster groups were/are trying to keep NI in the UK. You can blame the Crown for any religious overtones.



The Klan has always been a bunch of heritcs.
     
OAW
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Jan 11, 2016, 09:20 PM
 
^^^

But according to them they very well are Christian. And just like you think they don't speak for Christianity ... well therein lies my point.

OAW
     
Chongo
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Jan 11, 2016, 09:52 PM
 
Originally Posted by OAW View Post
^^^

But according to them they very well are Christian. And just like you think they don't speak for Christianity ... well therein lies my point.

OAW
Was the Irish War of Independence a Jihad?
     
Chongo
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Jan 11, 2016, 10:11 PM
 
You tell who is following more closely the teachings of whom they claim to follow.

     
OAW
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Jan 11, 2016, 10:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
Was the Irish War of Independence a Jihad?
It was a war rooted in nationalism AND religious sectarianism.

OAW
     
Waragainstsleep
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Jan 11, 2016, 10:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
Was the Irish War of Independence a Jihad?
The divide is every bit as religious as it is political if not more religious. In fact if they were all one religion, its safe to say they probably wouldn't care which government they were paying taxes to.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Chongo
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Jan 11, 2016, 10:17 PM
 
It's Henry VIII's fault?.
     
Chongo
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Jan 11, 2016, 10:19 PM
 
And the Scot's desire for independence, is that sectarian as well?
     
Waragainstsleep
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Jan 12, 2016, 06:13 AM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
And the Scot's desire for independence, is that sectarian as well?
No, they just hate us. Besides in Scotland the two seem to manage to live side by side without blowing each other up.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
Waragainstsleep
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Jan 12, 2016, 06:39 AM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
It's Henry VIII's fault?.
Protestantism is. How they and the Catholics choose to deal with each other is entirely their own issue.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
OAW
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Jan 12, 2016, 01:15 PM
 
Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants View Post
Muslims? They account for >90% worldwide. But no, there's nothing fundamentally wrong with Islam. No sir.
More unsubstantiated claims stated as fact. And completely devoid of this little thing we call context.

Religious extremism has become the main driver of terrorism in recent years, according to this year’s Global Terrorism Index.

The report recorded 18,000 deaths in 2013, a rise of 60% on the previous year. The majority (66%) of these were attributable to just four groups: Islamic State (Isis) in Iraq and Syria, Boko Haram in Nigeria, the Taliban in Afghanistan and al-Qaida.

Overall there has been a fivefold increase in deaths from terrorism since the 9/11 suicide attacks.

The report’s authors attribute the majority of incidents over the past few years to groups with a religious agenda.

While the chart below shows that this varies across region, bear in mind that more than 80% of deaths from terrorism in 2013 occurred in just five countries: Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Nigeria and Syria.

Religious extremism main cause of terrorism, according to report | News | The Guardian

The operative phrase here is "in recent years". Islam has been around since the 7th century which was the time of the Prophet Muhammad and the origins of the Quran. Or perhaps I should say it's been around that long as we in the West see it. Muslims consider Islam to be much older than that as Muhammad was their last prophet whereas Adam was their first. And what we view as "terrorism" in the modern sense is certainly not endemic to that entire history. In any event, the main point here is that with the exception of Nigeria .... this undeniable increase in religious extremism in the Islamic world is direct fallout from the regional destabilization that occurred as a result of the US invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq. Let's remember that ISIL is a revitalized and even more extremist version of "al-Qaeda in Iraq" ... founded by the Jordanian Abu Musab al-Zarqawi (remember him?) ... which did not even exist until the the US invaded that country on some bullsh*t. But naturally you mindlessly blame Islam as a whole and pretend like that had nothing whatsoever to do with it.

OAW
( Last edited by OAW; Jan 12, 2016 at 02:10 PM. )
     
Chongo
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Jan 12, 2016, 01:47 PM
 
A little perspective. There has been continual jihad with small breaks since the time of Mohammed, hellfire be upon him. This "recent" extremism is just a revival of what has been a break since the end of WW I.
     
OAW
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Jan 12, 2016, 02:13 PM
 
^^^

I could have sworn the discussion was about "terrorism" and not military conflicts between nations which is what that video is discussing? Let's not start using the terms interchangeably.

OAW
     
Chongo
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Jan 12, 2016, 02:41 PM
 
Originally Posted by OAW View Post
^^^

I could have sworn the discussion was about "terrorism" and not military conflicts between nations which is what that video is discussing? Let's not start using the terms interchangeably.

OAW
That doesn't include Jihad? That is what the video is discussing.
     
OAW
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Jan 12, 2016, 03:25 PM
 
No. It doesn't. That video is talking about naval battles. The Moorish conquest of Spain. The expansion of an empire. It's NOT discussing some religious nut blowing himself up in a crowded market full of civilians. So let's not play that game ok? If you want to make a legitimate comparison of what that video references then compare these two empires at their greatest extent.

So if one is going to take issue with this imperial expansion from the Arabian Peninsula ...

The Umayyad Caliphate



... then surely one will also take issue with this imperial expansion from the Italian Peninsula.

The Roman Empire



Right?

OAW
( Last edited by OAW; Jan 12, 2016 at 03:40 PM. )
     
Chongo
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Jan 12, 2016, 03:39 PM
 
The Islamic empire. The purpose was the spread of Islam.

If you pay attention to the those sending people to blow themselves up in markets you would realize that is what they want, to put us under the yoke of Islam and Sharia.
     
OAW
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Jan 12, 2016, 04:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
The Islamic empire. The purpose was the spread of Islam.
Just as the Roman Empire spread Christianity.

Originally Posted by Chongo
If you pay attention to the those sending people to blow themselves up in markets you would realize that is what they want, to put us under the yoke of Islam and Sharia.
Actually they want to put people under the yoke of religious fundamentalism. And personally I have no use for such foolishness whether it's Christian, Islamic, or whatever.

OAW
     
Cap'n Tightpants
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Jan 12, 2016, 04:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by OAW View Post
More unsubstantiated claims stated as fact.
Even your source says they're fact. Because what we're dealing with now matters more than what happened decades ago. Not that I expect you to understand what exists outside your prescribed narrative. Or do you have another no-true-Scottsman fallacy to add to that?
"I have a dream, that my four little children will one day live in a
nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin,
but by the content of their character." - M.L.King Jr
     
Chongo
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Jan 12, 2016, 04:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by OAW View Post
Just as the Roman Empire spread Christianity.

OAW

I'm sure that was after Constantine created it based on Mithras or was it Horus.
     
OAW
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Jan 12, 2016, 05:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post

I'm sure that was after Constantine created it based on Mithras or was it Horus.
Created? Not hardly. Co-opted? Most definitely. You didn't think that the story of Jesus as a "resurrected savior-god" was original did you?

OAW
     
Chongo
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Jan 12, 2016, 05:18 PM
 
Originally Posted by OAW View Post
Created? Not hardly. Co-opted? Most definitely.

OAW
Not even co-opted. If he did, then Arianism would have won the day at Nicaea.

Constantine Has Been Beaten to Death | Catholic Answers
Constantine did not fully understand why Arianism was so controversial, and he even endorsed many of Arius’s ideas. Historian Dr. James Hitchcock explains:

[W]hen Constantine also endorsed Arius’s ideas, there was an uproar that led the emperor in 325 to call the Council of Nicaea (Asia Minor) to settle the issue. After an intense struggle, the Council condemned Arius, declaring the Son to be “consubstantial” with the Father, that is, sharing the same substance (History of the Catholic Church, p. 83).


     
 
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