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DaKiwi2788 · Jun 6, 2005, 05:41 PM

I read through some of the bug post, but I thought I would ask here is anyone is just having general performance issues since installing Tiger.

Here is a short list of some of the problems I have had.

http://www.emilyhambidge.com/blog/techno-nonsense/68/

phataccord04 · Jun 6, 2005, 06:13 PM

did u do an install ontop of what u had or a wipe/erase install?

ManOfSteal · Jun 6, 2005, 06:30 PM

No.

DaKiwi2788 · Jun 6, 2005, 07:33 PM

I did an upgrade. I was just informed that was the problem. Sorry for the dumb questions.

phataccord04 · Jun 7, 2005, 08:54 AM

yea never do an upgrade even though it sucks to do a back up but you should back up your stuff day by day or week by week

Randman · Jun 7, 2005, 11:45 AM

Upgrade sucks. Tiger is rock solid.

TheTraveller · Jun 7, 2005, 11:52 AM

Originally Posted by Randman

Upgrade sucks. Tiger is rock solid.

I didn't do an upgrade - I reformatted and re-installed everything - and Tiger is far from rock solid for me. Numerous freezes and a couple of kernel panics. Far less stable than Panther in my experience. Actually, the least stable of any Mac OS X version.

themexican · Jun 7, 2005, 12:03 PM

We upgraded all our computers here (lots of them)... while there were some minor issues (like disk churning until we turned off indexing of the microsoft user data folder) and various compatibility issues usually traced back to a third party system util (norton, techtool, etc) it all basically worked and once we sorted out the issues everyone has been running rock solid. I haven't heard a reboot since the 10.4.1 upgrade.

If you are regular crashing issues in ichat or pages there is almost surely something else going on, corrupt preferences or something... you should get a mac guru to investigate.

One simple way to test if if is something in your user folder or in the system itself: Create a new user. This will be a fresh start with new prefs. If you don't crash there the problem lies in your user folder, probably in your library folder. Otherwise it's a system thing... some system util or printer driver or something...

gururafiki · Jun 7, 2005, 12:33 PM

Originally Posted by TheTraveller

I didn't do an upgrade - I reformatted and re-installed everything - and Tiger is far from rock solid for me. Numerous freezes and a couple of kernel panics. Far less stable than Panther in my experience. Actually, the least stable of any Mac OS X version.

Something is up with your system. I don't think this is what the majority of Tiger users is experiencing. I know I have yet to see any problems in Tiger, and I have lots of extra's (PCI cards, external drives, scanners, etc.). If I were you I would take your computer in to be checked, because regular freezes and kernel panics is not how Tiger normally operates.

Hi I'm Ben · Jun 7, 2005, 01:15 PM

Whether it be upgrading or fresh installs I've never had huge issues with any version of OS X I've installed. Except 10.0 because it was junk and I had to go back to 9 for awhile. I think most problems with Tiger are user created.

Voxorion · Jun 7, 2005, 06:32 PM

No - Tiger does indeed suck. Imported mail? Shot. XVID? Shot. Attempting to do business with an Apple? A fools errand.

Going back to Panther on all my systems tonight, I've had it with the half-assed Tiger, and with Apple pretending there are no problems with it when their own messageboards are gutted with problems the company won't recognize - the "Dissapearing Imported Mail" is the most business critical and insufferable.

Apple is becoming quite an embarassment -

wadesworld · Jun 7, 2005, 08:21 PM

No - Tiger does indeed suck. Imported mail?

Imported every one of my messages without a problem.

Attempting to do business with an Apple? A fools errand.

Strange - I work for a *major* Fortune 500 company and I do business on one every day.

Apple is becoming quite an embarassment

I'm not downplaying your problems, but your assertion that Tiger is a complete piece of crap is a huge over generalization.

Wade

Clive · Jun 7, 2005, 10:01 PM

It imported all my mail too. But somehow it decided that stuff that was in my junk folder really wasn't junk after all!?

Then, when I wanted to search my mail I couldn't find anything in "Entire Message" - until I figured out that you have to turn on Spotlight indexing... but I don't want to search my mail in the Finder, that's what the mailer is for!?

Of course then I noticed that the Mail "Scripts" menu had disappeared...

And that's just mail.

It's a buggy release of that there's little doubt. But at least they seem to have finally fixed the problem with turning off relative dates in the Finder - it never stuck previously.

-- Clive

“Join me, and together we can rule the galaxy…”

glyph · Jun 7, 2005, 11:33 PM

i reinstalled panther too. tiger was just too buggy for me. panther works fine here, it truely does.

brapper · Jun 8, 2005, 12:24 AM

I enjoy tiger.

gururafiki · Jun 8, 2005, 01:24 AM

Originally Posted by Voxorion

Apple is becoming quite an embarassment -

Randman · Jun 8, 2005, 01:33 AM

Originally Posted by Voxorion

No - Tiger does indeed suck. Imported mail? Shot. XVID? Shot. Attempting to do business with an Apple? A fools errand.

Going back to Panther on all my systems tonight, I've had it with the half-assed Tiger, and with Apple pretending there are no problems with it when their own messageboards are gutted with problems the company won't recognize - the "Dissapearing Imported Mail" is the most business critical and insufferable.

Apple is becoming quite an embarassment -

Are you sure it's not operator error?

analogika · Jun 8, 2005, 09:30 AM

I did a simple upgrade on both my machines, and they're both working very well - Powerbook 1.5 GHz and iMac DV 400.

No lost e-mail.

The only problems I've had were Windows Media Player crashing (fixed by deleting BOTH preference files in my user/Library/Preferences folder) and Stickies losing its database (have had to restore from backup twice in six weeks).

Oh, and the occasional folder showing up with zero items after unstuffing (workaround: change view).

That's about it.

DivX and Xvid and everything else that worked before still play fine in VLC.

Hi I'm Ben · Jun 8, 2005, 09:52 AM

I bet most people are just downloading bad copies of Tiger.

I've imported mail in 3 different systems, all had multiple mailboxes, all imported perfect like I was just opening mail on any given day. Yes that's only 3 systems and there are millions of systems out there that installed Tiger. I'm secretly a rocket scientist, I wanted you to all know that. It's my only explanation for my actions.

naphtali · Jun 8, 2005, 10:56 AM

Originally Posted by Clive

It imported all my mail too. But somehow it decided that stuff that was in my junk folder really wasn't junk after all!?

Then, when I wanted to search my mail I couldn't find anything in "Entire Message" - until I figured out that you have to turn on Spotlight indexing... but I don't want to search my mail in the Finder, that's what the mailer is for!?

How do you even turn off Spotlight indexing?! Mail search works very well and swiftly for me.

And you do have to train the Junk mail filter if you've just started using Mail. Helped my tutor import her mail from Entourage and it worked like a charm.

Clive · Jun 8, 2005, 05:43 PM

Originally Posted by naphtali

How do you even turn off Spotlight indexing?!.

It seems somehow not to kick in straight away, perhaps you have to select the Spotlight search from the menu bar or something, then it starts indexing. If you want to stop it indexing, go to the Spotlight settings in System Preferences, click on the "Privacy" tab and add your system hard drives - no more indexing.

The stupid thing about this is that if you disable content indexing like this (I really don't want to search for content, but thanks all the same) you cannot search for file names. Additionally, whatever you do, you cannot search for file names on mounted disks like CD, portable hard drives or server drives.

So I think this is rather a large mess that Apple has created for itself.

In my opinion, if you want to search for content, then that should me a separate function to searching for standard file attributes like name and modified date - perhaps using tabs like the old Sherlock used to be. If you want to combine the two things, then fine, but they shouldn't be reliant on each other.

If we go back a little in the development of X/search on the Mac, this is one of the reasons "Find file" got split from Sherlock/other search methods - because people "just" want to find a file name, in a really simple and reliable interface. That's exactly what Spotlight is not.

Originally Posted by naphtali

And you do have to train the Junk mail filter if you've just started using Mail. Helped my tutor import her mail from Entourage and it worked like a charm.

Right, but I didn't just start using Mail, I upgraded from Panther. Also, the move really did move stuff out of the Junk and into the "useful" mail folders. I'm not complaining that the Junk filters didn't work, but that stuff was moved.

-- Clive

naphtali · 10:45 PM

Originally Posted by Clive

It seems somehow not to kick in straight away, perhaps you have to select the Spotlight search from the menu bar or something, then it starts indexing. If you want to stop it indexing, go to the Spotlight settings in System Preferences, click on the "Privacy" tab and add your system hard drives - no more indexing.

The stupid thing about this is that if you disable content indexing like this (I really don't want to search for content, but thanks all the same) you cannot search for file names. Additionally, whatever you do, you cannot search for file names on mounted disks like CD, portable hard drives or server drives.

So I think this is rather a large mess that Apple has created for itself.

In my opinion, if you want to search for content, then that should me a separate function to searching for standard file attributes like name and modified date - perhaps using tabs like the old Sherlock used to be. If you want to combine the two things, then fine, but they shouldn't be reliant on each other.

If we go back a little in the development of X/search on the Mac, this is one of the reasons "Find file" got split from Sherlock/other search methods - because people "just" want to find a file name, in a really simple and reliable interface. That's exactly what Spotlight is not.

Ohh no my statement was one that was more of disbelief

For me, I just left my Mac alone for a while after first installation to allow Spotlight to index whatever it wanted to. Seems to pay off cos everything's nice and peachy - mail, filename search etc work fine, even on my external drive (haven't had the need to search CDs so I wouldn't know about that).

But yeah I do agree that Tiger needs some improvements to be more accomodating to various searching habits, to ease users into Spotlight. Perhaps we're not as flexible/advanced users as Apple might think we are in terms of file management (a work process thing?), or maybe Apple just overlooked some stuff in its enthusiasm to give us something cool and left out the good old filename search. Lots of functionality I guess, but it's quite a bit away from the very traditional method of finding stuff by filename.

Make some noise! http://www.apple.com/feedback I suggested a better interface for indexing and more options for preview information in the search pane (like short snippets from searched emails).

Originally Posted by Clive

Right, but I didn't just start using Mail, I upgraded from Panther. Also, the move really did move stuff out of the Junk and into the "useful" mail folders. I'm not complaining that the Junk filters didn't work, but that stuff was moved.

Oh my bad sorry. Had misunderstood it as you were moving from Entourage.

I'm really sorry I can't be of more help! I hope Apple/someone else solves your problem soon.

E's Lil Theorem · Jun 9, 2005, 04:27 PM

The only problem I have with Tiger is that my system seems to slow down quite noticeably after a few days, something I did not experience with Panther. It may be a memory leak, but I have not had the chance to troubleshoot it yet.

Scooterboy · Jun 11, 2005, 12:07 AM

Panther has been nearly perfect for me. So perfect I have no need to upgrade. Is Tiger worth it, or are there too many problems?

Tsilou B. · Jun 11, 2005, 06:41 AM

Panther has been nearly perfect for me. So perfect I have no need to upgrade. Is Tiger worth it, or are there too many problems?

I know this won't help those people who are having problems and I certainly don't want to suggest that it's their fault that Tiger crashes on their Macs. Nevertheless, I think it's worth noting that I have upgraded four Macs (iMac G4, Mac mini, iMac G3, iBook G3) to Tiger so far and none of them has had any problems. I have experienced one single crash on an iMac G3 (while watching TV with EyeTV) since installing Tiger on these Macs 5 weeks ago. By the way, I simply upgraded them, I did not choose "archive and install" and I did not fix permissions before or thereafter.
Based on my experience, I'd guess that most people are having no serious problems with Tiger.

Talleyman · Jun 11, 2005, 11:46 AM

I have two upgrade installs of Tiger on a laptop and desktop and they both work very well. This is why I'm sold on Apple stuff and have been since my SE30. It simply works. Even in the OS9 days and before, Mac OS worked better than windows or Amiga, or whatever.

Mac OS X is very reliable for my work and play. I have used every version (even the pre-beta) and It's gotten better and better. I have only found a few UI bugs in Tiger. Other than that, I am very impressed with the ideas and the engineering.

eddiecatflap · Jul 2, 2005, 04:41 AM

tiger is lame

the search function is totally and utterly useless

i get the beachball EVERY time i try and use it as the stupid thing goes straight into find mode as soon as i type ONE letter

really pathetic

Randman · Jul 2, 2005, 04:43 AM

Originally Posted by eddiecatflap

tiger is lame

the search function is totally and utterly useless

i get the beachball EVERY time i try and use it as the stupid thing goes straight into find mode as soon as i type ONE letter

really pathetic

You could try to reinstall Tiger because obviously you are having problems that the majority of users are not having.

Tiger is not lame, Tiger is great.

eddiecatflap · Jul 2, 2005, 04:44 AM

is there an alternative to the search function ?

Randman · Jul 2, 2005, 04:46 AM

I suggested something in your other thread.

eddiecatflap · Jul 2, 2005, 04:59 AM

i probably sound like a troll , i'm not , i'm a 100% mac zealot through and through

i'm just bewildered by some of the rough edges in tiger

cambro · Jul 2, 2005, 09:53 AM

Originally Posted by eddiecatflap

i get the beachball EVERY time i try and use it as the stupid thing goes straight into find mode as soon as i type ONE letter

I have a 2.5 year old Powerbook and Spotlight is virtually instantaneous for me and Tiger is noticeably faster in most things than 10.3. For example, typing slowly...

"this"

into the Spotlight menu search brings up instantly the best matches and within a few seconds 7000+ matches without any beachballing or slow down at all.

While I agree Tiger isn't perfect yet, it is faster than 10.3 and offers great features that work very well on my several machine installations.

It seems that PERHAPS installs of Tiger are very sensitive to pre-existing conditions of the OS, or is more widely incompatible with things that users are assuming work. For example, how many times in this forum have we heard complaints about Tiger functionality followed by...

"Oh yea, by the way, I've installed ShapeShifter, and am running useless and non-updated Virus protection software."

The ONLY issue I've run into on multiple machines is a process called "mds" that rarely (but sometimes) hogs CPU cycles and causes a system-wide slowdown. Logging out and back in fixes that problem (at least as I've run into it).

Kevin · Jul 2, 2005, 09:58 AM

If Tiger sucks, I wish Apple would start sucking a lot more.

And continue to suck in the future.

Weyland-Yutani · Jul 2, 2005, 11:42 AM

In my experience Tiger does not suck. It is the most solid version of OS X yet. Ah well. It is usable in any case. More attention to human interface and persistant bugs since 10.0 would do a lot for the OS

cheers

W-Y

mAxximo · Jul 2, 2005, 06:15 PM

Tiger with all of its quirks and stupid bugs is *considerably* better than any other OS X version ever, hands down. Memory management alone is so superior that makes me forget about the many moronic Spotlight issues so well described by Clive.

If Tiger sucks then we'd have to invent a new verb to describe previous versions.

glyph · Jul 2, 2005, 06:49 PM

Originally Posted by mAxximo

Tiger with all of its quirks and stupid bugs is *considerably* better than any other OS X version ever, hands down. Memory management alone is so superior that makes me forget about the many moronic Spotlight issues so well described by Clive.

If Tiger sucks then we'd have to invent a new verb to describe previous versions.

Nah-uh, Panther is better! Is too....Is too.....Is too!

eddiecatflap · Jul 3, 2005, 02:11 AM

well , it DID make it to 10.3.9 , give tiger a chance i guess

10.4.9 will probably be amazing !

funkboy · Jul 3, 2005, 03:07 AM

Tiger does not suck.

CharlesS · Jul 3, 2005, 03:20 AM

Originally Posted by mAxximo

Tiger with all of its quirks and stupid bugs is *considerably* better than any other OS X version ever, hands down. Memory management alone is so superior that makes me forget about the many moronic Spotlight issues so well described by Clive.

How is the memory management in Tiger different from the memory management in previous versions?

Tiger is better than previous versions of OS X, but that reason just seems weird.

Graymalkin · Jul 3, 2005, 05:38 AM

Tiger's memory management apparently doesn't have user permissions and everything runs in a single memory space. Otherwise Max would be sputting and spitting about that by now.

I'm just curious what kind of crap people have loaded on their Macs or where they're getting their copies of Tiger from. I've loaded it onto six machines and haven't seen any of the described problems with it. Two machines were upgrades, one an archive and install, and the other three as clean installs. From my experiences I've got these suggestions.

1.) Disable any login items before you upgrade! If you've got something like Virex running at startup you're going to have issues. You also never know if some AiO printer/scanner monitoring software needs a Tiger update to work properly.

2.) Back up your friggin data, you ought to be doing this to begin with. It makes no sense to blame Apple/your Mac/some guy if your computer borks up and you lose data. Things break down, sometimes for seemingly random reasons. Make sure your important stuff exists in multiple places (hard disk and CD-R).

3.) If you do an Archive & Install or Upgrade Install let your computer just sit and let Spotlight finish doing its thing. If you've got a laptop or Mac mini this might take a while because they've got slower drive speeds. It can take a while but let it run while you're at work or out and about doing something. Don't upgrade to Tiger in the middle of a super important project.

4.) Check for updates to the software you currently use. While some old version of something might work fine in Tiger; it's possible they relied on things that were one way in Panther and below but slightly different in Tiger. I noticed Office 2004 was loading and running a little sluggish (v11.0) but when I grabbed the latest version (v11.1.1) things sped up perceptibly.

5.) Double check for third party driver updates. A slight change in the way some low level call works could take a driver from stable to completely FUBAR unstable. Some drivers are simply shoddy and fall down when things aren't exactly how they expect to see them (these can break between minor revisions even) while others just might use some deprecated or broken function that was replaced by a better working one along the line.

6.) While it might take a little time, configure your preferences in apps and the system by hand once you've updated, don't port over old preference files. While most of the time you won't have trouble, one corrupt preference file could lead to program crashes. Don't assume that a file won't be corrupt just because it copied to a CD-R or external disk without an overt error.

BWhaler · Jul 3, 2005, 06:08 AM

Whether Tiger "sucks" or not is really a matter of opinion.

One thing is for certain. Apple rushed Tiger out the door. Yes, your mileage will vary, but in general, the number and type of bugs in Tiger is pretty disgraceful. I hope .2 is the gold release we should of received.

But Apple needed to hit their numbers for Wall Street. iPods sales are slowing down this quarter. Apple needed another hit.

Funny thing is given the release timing of .2 of Tiger, "the first half of the year" meaning June 31st in Apple-speak would of given us a solid Tiger.

But that is all water under the bridge. People have a right to complain about the bugs...there are tons. But when they are fixed, Tiger will please the masses. There is a lot of neat things that Apple threw in there.

IFLY2HIGH · Jul 3, 2005, 12:49 PM

I got 5 systems in the house running Tiger all of witch were done with a simple "upgrade" and havn't had a single problem.

Kristoff · Jul 3, 2005, 01:16 PM

I have upgraded since Public Beta and I have used CCC to move from my Pismo to a Dual 800 to a Dual 2.0. It's the same image that started life as Public Beta, and I have no issues whatsoever. Go Figure.

Randman · Jul 3, 2005, 01:43 PM

User error > blame Apple/others/God.

occupant · Jul 3, 2005, 01:51 PM

My issues with Tiger so far:

- Find no longer lets you 'find' your .private and .etc folders, even if you telll it you want to find invisible folders. Just try accessing them.

- You can't use the Appletalk network communication protocol to access shared files on another Mac.

- Overall performance seems to have taken a hit. I get 'beachballed' much more often than in 10.3. I wonder if this is because of Spotlight?

- The anti-aliasing seems to have changed. Nothing is near as crisp as it was on 10.3 on an LCD or CRT. I'm not sure if this is just my eyes or real.

If it weren't for them finally having fixed my longstanding VPN/SMB issues (dropped connections/inability to remember passwords) I'd have already switched back.

The heavily touted new features (Spotlight and Dashboard) are pretty underwhelming.

timmerk · Jul 4, 2005, 04:39 PM

Yes, Tiger sucks balls.

glyph · Jul 4, 2005, 05:09 PM

I sent this feedback to Apple. I doubt that it will be posted though.

I hope Apple gets its act together soon with its Tiger OS. I guess I should have been happy with the perfectly fine Panther OS, but I expected more from Tiger. I won't go into detail the problems I've experienced after installing Tiger save to say that the bottom line is Panther is superior and I'm out 130 bucks. I hope by the time 10.4.9 comes out, Tiger will be useable. In the future, I won't be as eager to upgrade an Apple product as I now know what could happen.

I'd like to suggest that the next time you come out with a hyped-up product, you continue to sell the previous version for a period of time instead of pulling it off the shelf.

I'm back to running Panther and I couldn't be happier, it's such a nice OS.

Graymalkin · Jul 5, 2005, 01:29 AM

Bah, when Panther was released everyone was whining about how much it sucked and how great Jaguar was. Tiger does things differently than Panther in some respects, it is also the future. There's not going to be a Tiger Lite which is just Panther with Safari 2 and iChat 3. Reading the anti-Tiger posts I think quite a few of the problems only exist between the keyboard and the chair. There's some definite bugs and things to work out but a change in the functionality of implementation of something is not a bug.

Randman · Jul 5, 2005, 01:51 AM

Originally Posted by Graymalkin

Bah, when Panther was released everyone was whining about how much it sucked and how great Jaguar was. Tiger does things differently than Panther in some respects, it is also the future. There's not going to be a Tiger Lite which is just Panther with Safari 2 and iChat 3. Reading the anti-Tiger posts I think quite a few of the problems only exist between the keyboard and the chair. There's some definite bugs and things to work out but a change in the functionality of implementation of something is not a bug.

Well said.

occupant · Jul 5, 2005, 02:15 AM

Originally Posted by Graymalkin

Bah, when Panther was released everyone was whining about how much it sucked and how great Jaguar was. Tiger does things differently than Panther in some respects, it is also the future. There's not going to be a Tiger Lite which is just Panther with Safari 2 and iChat 3. Reading the anti-Tiger posts I think quite a few of the problems only exist between the keyboard and the chair. There's some definite bugs and things to work out but a change in the functionality of implementation of something is not a bug.

No, I think quite a few of the problems exist with the 150 bucks I spent to find out it was no better than what I had. Panther added to the system (mainly in terms of performance/UI consistancy). Tiger doesn't seem to. The new 'features' don't help my workflow, there are old features I need and now need to find alternatives for. Basically I feel like I paid 150 bucks for vpn software that works as advertized. I wouldn't say it 'sucks' but I think Tiger is a short on value.