[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by ort888 

$500 PS3 66% more expensive then $300 Xbox 360
$500 PS3 25% more expensive then $400 Xbox 360
$600 PS3 50% more expensive then $400 Xbox 360

For the person who doesn't have an HDTV and has no interest in going online (this covers a lot of people) the cheapest PS3 is 66% more then the cheapest Xbox 360. That's not good.

There is a 50% difference between the ideal 360 and the ideal PS3.

That is all fine and good but I don't know anyone who got an core Xbox and didn't have to spend money on a memory card which wasn't taken into account.

You also don't get the same thing for each system and get way more with the PS3. Waaay more, even the low end one.

Honestly if you don't have an HDTV there is no point in getting the 360 as it will look the same more or less on an SD TV.

[icruise]

Originally Posted by ort888 

$500 PS3 66% more expensive then $300 Xbox 360
$500 PS3 25% more expensive then $400 Xbox 360
$600 PS3 50% more expensive then $400 Xbox 360

For the person who doesn't have an HDTV and has no interest in going online (this covers a lot of people) the cheapest PS3 is 66% more then the cheapest Xbox 360. That's not good.

Don't forget, though, that the Core system cannot save games without a $30+ memory card. Also remember that it doesn't come with a wireless controller.

There is a 50% difference between the ideal 360 and the ideal PS3.

These comparisons can be misleading because the high-end PS3 gives you quite a bit more than the high-end Xbox 360. Specifically: wi-fi, 40GB more hard disk space, a card reader, and a blu-ray drive. You can't get a hard disk larger than 20GB on the Xbox, but I know a lot of people would happily pay extra for one. Although it's possible to get wi-fi cheaper using one of those Logitech "game adapters," Microsoft's official wi-fi adapter costs $99. And I don't think you can get a card reader for the 360. So to bring the high-end 360 as close to parity with the 60GB, you'd have to spend an additional $300, making the system $100 more expensive than the PS3 and still it wouldn't have as much hard disk space or the card reader.

Of course, the Xbox Premium system comes with component cables, while neither of the PS3 models do, but the PS3's controller comes with a built-in lithium-ion battery, while the Xbox 360 forces you to either use AAs or buy Microsoft's battery/charger kit, so I think this is a wash.

Anyway, for these reasons I think it makes the most sense to compare the high-end 360 with the low-end PS3 -- they have the closest feature set.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by icruise 

So to bring the high-end 360 as close to parity with the 60GB, you'd have to spend an additional $300

You also forgot the sexy HDMI 1.3.

Yup. Eug has spent more than on his Xbox with wireless ($100) and HD-DVD ($200) and then thinks the PS3 is too much.

But to be honest, for the money, the Wii has the LEAST value for the cost. Games + Nothing else. You may not want some of those other features yadda yadda but for the ones who do it is gonna cost em more in the end.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

But to be honest, for the money, the Wii has the LEAST value for the cost. Games + Nothing else. You may not want some of those other features yadda yadda but for the ones who do it is gonna cost em more in the end.

Uh…wireless? And as long as we're comparing what it takes to make one system equal another, you can't get the Wii's main feature (the unique control scheme) for the Playstation or Xbox at all.

[icruise]

Of course, the PS3 has a sort of limited version of the Wii's control scheme, but admittedly it is not really comparable. Don't forget the Wii's card reader, too.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

Uh…wireless? And as long as we're comparing what it takes to make one system equal another, you can't get the Wii's main feature (the unique control scheme) for the Playstation or Xbox at all.

I consider XBL just as unique and innovative. I find the Blu-ray player the main sell for my PS3.

So who's to say one is better than the other?

[Weezer]

are you people still bickering over this? jesus

[Brien]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

Most of the stores around here seem to sell out of HD-DVD addons pretty fast (though that's obviously just anecdotal evidence). It may be that Microsoft simply didn't expect more people to want it.

Well I know a lot of the local stores around here only get one or two shipped at a time, so that's likely.

[Eug Wanker]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

You also forgot the sexy HDMI 1.3.

Yup. Eug has spent more than on his Xbox with wireless ($100) and HD-DVD ($200) and then thinks the PS3 is too much.

But to be honest, for the money, the Wii has the LEAST value for the cost. Games + Nothing else. You may not want some of those other features yadda yadda but for the ones who do it is gonna cost em more in the end.

Not everyone needs wireless.

And the Wii has the lowest cost. It seems like a reasonable value.

[Dakar²]

Originally Posted by Weezer 

are you people still bickering over this? jesus

are people still surprised by this? jesus

[Dakar²]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

I consider XBL just as unique and innovative.

That seems like a massive stretch.

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

So who's to say one is better than the other?

Every person who has ever lived or breathed, if this thread is any indication.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by Dakar²

That seems like a massive stretch.

I'm very impressed with the way XBL is set up. I can't think of any complaints off the top of my head, except for perhaps having to spend money on new themes and gamer pictures. Well, come to think of it, $50 a year is a chunk of money for someone who watches every dollar he spends, at least whenever he can look at the PS3 and see online play for free.

Every person who has ever lived or breathed, if this thread is any indication.

[Dark Helmet]

So apparently the PS3 shortage isn't hurting sony that much because people are just getting PS2's instead:

Some interesting PS3 shortage effects - Joystiq

Other news:
Gears of war sold 2 million copies. Fastest selling next gen game.
PS3's outnumber HD-DVD add ons by 5 to 1.

[Dakar²]

Originally Posted by Jawbone54 

I'm very impressed with the way XBL is set up.

I don't deny its a very good system, but I'm not sure how I see it as innovative, anymore than the PS1 controller was 'innovative'

Also, fix your tags.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Dakar² 

I don't deny its a very good system, but I'm not sure how I see it as innovative, anymore than the PS1 controller was 'innovative'

Also, fix your tags.

Well I do. XBL was done brilliantly even if you never use it to play with others online.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by Dakar² 

Also, fix your tags.

Fixed.

[icruise]

Even though I don't really like online multiplayer (in fact, I mostly dislike it, given the number of idiots you run into) I still think XBL is very well done. I don't understand why so many people get off on shooting strangers over the internet, though.

[Dakar²]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

So apparently the PS3 shortage isn't hurting sony that much because people are just getting PS2's instead:

Some interesting PS3 shortage effects - Joystiq

I don't buy it. Wasn't the PS2 still the best selling system when Nintendo and Sony launched their next-gen consoles?

[icruise]

Yes I believe it was. Joystiq has never exactly been known for critical thinking.

[Jawbone54]

Originally Posted by Dakar² 

I don't buy it. Wasn't the PS2 still the best selling system when Nintendo and Sony launched their next-gen consoles?

Yup.

Originally Posted by icruise

Even though I don't really like online multiplayer (in fact, I mostly dislike it, given the number of idiots you run into) I still think XBL is very well done. I don't understand why so many people get off on shooting strangers over the internet, though.

Agreed; XBL is very well-designed. I also am getting turned off by online multiplayer as well. I'm getting sick of Gears of War teammates swearing at each other, doing whatever they want, roaming solo all over the map in a strategic, team-based game. My favorite multiplayer experience is getting at least 8 people together and having an old-fashioned Halo 1 match at someones house, with a long ethernet cord running from a living room to a bedroom. People able to hear one of your friends scream, "How'd he snipe me from THERE?" from the other room instead of over a garbled headset is priceless.

[Mrjinglesusa]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

PS3's outnumber HD-DVD add ons by 5 to 1.

So? People buying the HD-DVD add-on are purchasing it ONLY to watch HD-DVDs on. The people buying PS3s are buying them for GAMING. No one, I repeat no one, purchased a PS3 only for the Blu-Ray player.

[starman]

Originally Posted by Mrjinglesusa 

So? People buying the HD-DVD add-on are purchasing it ONLY to watch HD-DVDs on. The people buying PS3s are buying them for GAMING. No one, I repeat no one, purchased a PS3 only for the Blu-Ray player.

Wrong. The Sammy is $1000. There are a LOT of people that got a PS3 just to have a cheap BR player.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Mrjinglesusa 

No one, I repeat no one, purchased a PS3 only for the Blu-Ray player.

I have said flat out many times that I did. Games are gravy on top of it for that price.

I got my 360 if I want a ton of good games today.

Many many home theatre buffs have done the same.

[Dakar²]

Originally Posted by Jawbone54 

Agreed; XBL is very well-designed. I also am getting turned off by online multiplayer as well. I'm getting sick of Gears of War teammates swearing at each other, doing whatever they want, roaming solo all over the map in a strategic, team-based game. My favorite multiplayer experience is getting at least 8 people together and having an old-fashioned Halo 1 match at someones house, with a long ethernet cord running from a living room to a bedroom. People able to hear one of your friends scream, "How'd he snipe me from THERE?" from the other room instead of over a garbled headset is priceless.

Since we're sharing online comments, I occasionally would play NBA Live online.

My last game (perhaps literally), my opponent would do the following:

In bound immediately on a long half to three-quarter court pass which results in 'camera lag'
Shoot the three immediately, out of muscle memory than actually watching the player shoot.
Wash, rinse, repeat.

One of those things that's fun to try maybe for a game, but I can't spend my online existence doing it.

I wonder if the quality of play would improve if they removed win-loss records? (Isn't that why people do that crap?)


Edit: Oooo! Dakar� is within 3 posts of Original Dakar for this thread! Wheeeeee

[exca1ibur]

Originally Posted by Dakar² 

I wonder if the quality of play would improve if they removed win-loss records? (Isn't that why people do that crap?)


Edit: Oooo! Dakar� is within 3 posts of Original Dakar for this thread! Wheeeeee

Yeah I know what you mean. I am hoping one day to see a team based game where there are no individual scores just a team based score. Give points for doing objectives and missions. Thats kinda what I like about Battlefield 2. Its close to that system, being you can score up there with everyone with hardly any kills, IF you are doing your job as your class. I'm so tired of team games where no one is working together and going after the objectives. All they worry about are their kills.

[Dark Helmet]

Ha ha my friend works at the company that does Nintendo Canada's website and they just called her asking for her to make a button for the strap recall

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

Ha ha my friend works at the company that does Nintendo Canada's website and they just called her asking for her to make a button for the strap recall

We're proud of you?

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by goMac 

We're proud of you?

Aw thanks!

Perhaps your friend works at sony and will get a button request one day also.

[Hawkeye_a]

At least its not a faulty power brick(the size of your TV) that will burn your house down lol

PS>>Yeah a button to let the PS3 run on all TVs at the appropriate resolution

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye_a 

At least its not a faulty power brick(the size of your TV) that will burn your house down lol

Yickes, I must have missed that recall.

[Mrjinglesusa]

Originally Posted by starman 

Wrong. The Sammy is $1000. There are a LOT of people that got a PS3 just to have a cheap BR player.

I doubt very seriously "A LOT" of people did that. And I'm sorry, but that's just dumb to buy a game machine just to get a Blu-Ray player if you have no intention of playing games on it.

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

I have said flat out many times that I did. Games are gravy on top of it for that price.

I got my 360 if I want a ton of good games today.

Many many home theatre buffs have done the same.

Well, here's ONE. And you did that because you are a gamer. There are NOT people searching out a PS3 just to get a $599 Blu-Ray player.

Along with that, I question that "many many home theatre buffs" would buy a PS3 just for the Blu-Ray player. A serious home theatre buff would shell out the extra $400 and get a stand alone.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Mrjinglesusa 

Well, here's ONE. And you did that because you are a gamer. There are NOT people searching out a PS3 just to get a $599 Blu-Ray player.

Yeah, considering the trouble you have to go through to get one for less than $1000, I doubt many serious home theater buffs are relying on that.

[starman]

I suppose you don't read the home theater forums.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by starman 

I suppose you don't read the home theater forums.

No, not really. Are there many who are saying, "I'm willing to spend $3000 on my TV and other equipment, and I refuse to buy the much cheaper HD-DVD format, but damned if I'm going to spend an extra $400 on a Blu-Ray player rather than sit outside a store for several days to have a meager chance at getting one cheap"?

[Mrjinglesusa]

Originally Posted by starman 

I suppose you don't read the home theater forums.

No I don't (except AVS Forums occasionally). And the people on those forums buying a PS3 ONLY for the Blu-Ray player are NOT serious home theatre buffs. See above post for the reasoning.

[icruise]

Originally Posted by Mrjinglesusa 

I doubt very seriously "A LOT" of people did that. And I'm sorry, but that's just dumb to buy a game machine just to get a Blu-Ray player if you have no intention of playing games on it.

I have no first-hand knowledge one way or the other about this issue, but I don't think it's entirely implausible that people would buy a PS3 just to play movies, given how well it performs as a movie player and how much cheaper it is than the stand-alones that give you very little more.

Well, here's ONE. And you did that because you are a gamer. There are NOT people searching out a PS3 just to get a $599 Blu-Ray player.

Obviously if someone were buying it just for movies, they would get the 20GB model, so it would be a $499 Blu-Ray player. Coincidentally, the 20GB models are also the easiest to come by at the moment.

But I don't think it matters whether some people buy the PS3 only as a movie player. Clearly, it's not something that the general population will do. What matters is that bundling a Blu-Ray player with the PS3, Sony has made it the defacto choice for just about everyone who's buying a PS3. Very few people are going to be buying a separate HD-DVD player if they already have a Blu-Ray player in the PS3.

The real question is, does the average person see the advantage in HD movies over DVD? That's not an easy question to answer, especially since most people don't even have HDTV yet. For people who want to both play games and watch HD movies, the PS3 is actually a great value (after all, Sony is losing money selling them at these prices). But if you don't want an HD movie player, the Xbox 360 (or the Wii) might seem like more attractive choices.

[Mrjinglesusa]

All good points. Maybe I was being too black/white with the idea that no one is seeking out PS3s just to get a Blu-Ray player. There probably are some people doing that. My point is that those who are, are not home theatre buffs. Personally, I'm no home theatre buff either. That's why I went with the $199 add-on to a game console I already have. If there were no add-on to the 360, I would not even consider getting a PS3 just to watch movies. In fact, I would have likely waited until the standard is set and prices on stand alones go down. If Blu-Ray wins, I'm only out $199 and the price of a few HD-DVDs. I'll still have a great gaming console.

[smacintush]

It's been MY experience that when you go to "specialty" forums like home theater forums you aren't generally getting a good cross section of the "average" person.

It's not ludicrous to suggest that there are a number of people that will buy (or attempt to buy) a PS3 strictly to get a cheap Blue Ray player, it IS ludicrous to suggest that it will be a large number of people.

Most people with PS3's will be Blue Ray customers because of the PS3, not the other way around.…IMO.

[smacintush]

Originally Posted by Mrjinglesusa 

That's why I went with the $199 add-on to a game console I already have. If there were no add-on to the 360, I would not even consider getting a PS3 just to watch movies. In fact, I would have likely waited until the standard is set and prices on stand alones go down. If Blu-Ray wins, I'm only out $199 and the price of a few HD-DVDs. I'll still have a great gaming console.

[Miniryu]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

 
Let's not get carried away. Nintendo is making Sony its bitch, but Microsoft is still the top dog now and probably will retain that spot even if its lead decays a little.

Microsoft is top dog in units sold, but don't they have yet to turn a profit from the Xbox? I heard they are expecting it to start making money this year, for the first time since the original Xbox was released.

Meanwhile, Nintendo is making money from each unit sold.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Miniryu 

Microsoft is top dog in units sold, but don't they have yet to turn a profit from the Xbox? I heard they are expecting it to start making money this year, for the first time since the original Xbox was released.

Meanwhile, Nintendo is making money from each unit sold.

If we're just talking about the companies' financials, Microsoft wins and it's not even funny. They make Office and Windows fercryinoutloud. I think the issue here is more about the "console wars" — which one gets the most support and all that.

[eddiecatflap]

The worst thing about the 360 is the noise , it's terrible.

It ruins any enjoyment of having the hd dvd add on and means I use it less and less these days.

By all accounts the PS3 is virtually silent , which is indicative of Sony's excellence in engineering and microsuck's complete incompetence in everything imaginable ..

[Eug Wanker]

At least in my setup, the 360 sounds like a leaf blower only when you use built-in DVD drive. The 360 itself is noticeably quieter, although not silent. The HD DVD drive itself is silent though, and you don't use the internal DVD at all when playing back HD DVD.

ie. In my setup, watching HD DVD movies is usually fine, unless the room is like 25 degrees Celcius and there isn't much air flow around the 360. I tried that once and the fans revved up and the 360 became noticeably louder. With a 21C (70F) room and adequate air flow around the 360 however, HD DVD playback is fine in terms of noise. YMMV.

[Jawbone54]

I'm going to enjoy my 360 and save up money for a PS3 for the eventual price drop. I'm tired to switching/trading systems, so I'm going to give both of them a shot at the same time. The noise is literally the only complaint that I have about the 360 at this point. Everything else feels really well done.

[Eug Wanker]

Wiimote strap recall form.

[MaxPower2k3]

The 360 is pretty loud, and as Eug said, it seems to mostly be the DVD drive. Playing arcade games or demos, the system is pretty quiet, certainly quiet enough for me. But as soon as you go into a real game and the DVD drive kicks in, it's loud enough to hear over any game sounds, which can get pretty annoying. I've been trying to think of some way to cover it that will reduce the sound without making it heat up too much.

[icruise]

I got my copy of Blue Dragon yesterday. So far, it's pretty good. Definitely high production values, although I personally find the art style (especially the way the main characters are drawn) to be rather off-putting. Everyone looks like a Precious Moments figurine. But aside from that, the graphics are very good. It's hard to tell the rendered cut scenes from the action that you control, and I mean that in a good way.

I've only played about an hour and a half so far, so I'm still just getting into the meat of the combat, magic and skill system. I don't really think it does anything revolutionary, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. It's a very competent Japanese RPG with a few new twists. Actually, come to think of it, this is the first next-gen Japanese RPG that I've played (well, aside from Spectral Force 3, but that's a tactical RPG and it has rather low production values). In fact, Blue Dragon is probably the first honest-to-goodness Japanese next-gen RPG ever (I never played Enchanted Arms, so I can't really comment on that). Ironic that it should show up on the Xbox 360.

[starman]

I have Enchanted Arms and I haven't played it yet. I'll have to look into BD.

[goMac]

Apparently MGS4 is no longer a PS3 exclusive:

Heightened Rumor: Metal Gear Solid 4 not a PS3 exclusive - Joystiq

[the_glassman]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Apparently MGS4 is no longer a PS3 exclusive:

Heightened Rumor: Metal Gear Solid 4 not a PS3 exclusive - Joystiq

Not good news for the PS3 or it's fanboys!