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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > iPhone, iPad & iPod > Hidden $85.95 fee for iPhone

Hidden $85.95 fee for iPhone
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vln2
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Jul 9, 2007, 01:28 PM
 
It is really disturbing that Apple expects all iPhone users to shell out a hidden fee of $85.95 (79.95 + $6.95 shipping) to replace a battery which WILL need to happen to all of us after 300-600 charges. That will happen probably next year. That did not come up in any great reviews in the hype leading to June 29 blitz.
iPhone media blitz missed battery 'fee' - The Red Tape Chronicles - MSNBC.com

I checked my Usage settings and was surprised to see that the last time the phone was fully charged 3 days ago even though I charge it every night in the dock.
Perhaps we need to rethink the charging strategy.
I am sure Apple will be pressed hard on this and hopefully Apple will be forced to replace batteries which die earlier then within a year of warranty. Then we would be better off to charge it every night.
Microsoft had to extend warranty for its Xbox 360 and is eating over 1 billion of charges of replacing overheating units. It will be interesting to see how this plays out with Apple.

I should have been warned. A day before the release of the iPhone I called Apple to ask how would playlist from iTunes work with my video iPod and new iPhone. They refused to talk to me saying that my video iPod was purchased in March of 2006 even though it was purchased new in September of 2006 from Circuit City. Apple even had to replace that iPod and I sent them copy of my original receipt. It did not matter, they refused any support.
So far my iPhone works fine and I hope it will do that for a long time. I deal with Apple warranty issues at work because our iBooks are breaking constantly. This is not a good omen for the future.
     
TimmyDee51
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Jul 9, 2007, 01:47 PM
 
Yes, this hidden fee will apply to ALL iPhone owners. Apple is just out to screw us over. Maybe I should start crying wolf and call for a class-action.

Errr, wait. The battery in my Treo 600 is still going strong after 2.5 years. It's not technically user replaceable (although the newer Treos have replaceable batteries), but I haven't had to worry about that. And I'll be looking to buy a new phone soon. If I don't get another phone for six months, I'll have used this phone for double the average time that people keep their cell phones in use. And I'll have not even had to think about changing the battery.
Per Square Mile | A blog about density
     
::maroma::
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Jul 9, 2007, 01:50 PM
 
You should have been warned? You were warned. You weren't paying attention. Sorry, your fault.
     
iREZ
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Jul 9, 2007, 01:55 PM
 
my name is vln. i don't research the products i buy because i like buying things when they're all hyped up. i then notice that theres something unexpected i don't like so i get on my computer and let everybody know that what most people perceive as a minor annoyance is a GIGANTIC problem for me. i don't understand how apple software manipulates batteries to actually give them longer life and even though this is a good thing for the consumer my ignorance keeps me mad even if it is a good thing for me and my iphone. lets get apple to pay for everything that we incur on ourselves, who's with me?
NOW YOU SEE ME! 2.4 MBP and 2.0 MBP (running ubuntu)
     
vln2  (op)
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Jul 9, 2007, 02:12 PM
 
Originally Posted by iREZ View Post
my name is vln. ... lets get apple to pay for everything that we incur on ourselves, who's with me?
Well then you know what vln stands for.
Apple is supposedly making $200-300 on the cost of each iPhone after its costs. They should set aside $75 for the cost of battery replacement. I think it sounds reasonable.
     
Strix
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Jul 9, 2007, 02:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
Well then you know what vln stands for.
Hmmm. French for whine.
     
icruise
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Jul 9, 2007, 02:41 PM
 
Don't be silly. First of all, I've never replaced the battery in any of my cell phones, or any of my iPods. It's not something everyone is going to have to do. Many people will not be heavy enough users to drain the battery within the working life of the iPhone. And it's not like it'll just die after a certain number of charges. Battery life diminishes over time. A user-replaceable battery would probably be better (although it would likely affect the design of the phone), but it's not the huge issue that people are making it out to be, especially because the iPhone gets exceptional battery life.

By the way, I stumbled on this quote from Dvorak back in April. Man, does he look like a jackass now. (OK, even more of a jackass...)

“He says the amateur mistake that they made is not having a removable battery,” Dvorak said. “You run 20 minutes and you’re using up half the battery power. You get 40 minutes total talk time. And the interface fouls up constantly.”
     
BRussell
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Jul 9, 2007, 02:44 PM
 
Two points:

1) Your assertion that everyone will have to do this within a year is an assumption. If battery-replacement rates for the iPhone are similar to what they are for current ipods - i.e., almost non-existent - there's no problem. It may turn out that people need to replace them sooner for iPhones (perhaps because people use their iphones on a daily basis more frequently), but we don't know that right now. 300-600 charges means full recharges, not every time you stick it in the dock. If your assumption was true, that everyone would have to pay an extra $90 within the next year, that would be a problem. I sincerely doubt it is true though.

2) Even if your assumption was true, there are some legitimate trade-offs involved. The cost of replacing a user-replaceable battery on a cellphone isn't free. Let's say it's around $10 for the street price of a new user-replaceable cellphone battery, and let's also say that other non-Apple services offer iPhone battery replacement for, say, $50. That would put the difference at around $40. You also lose the iPhone for a few days. What are the trade-offs for this? Smaller iphone? No extra latches or screws on its body? Longer built-in battery life? Whether these are worth the extra $40 is up to you, but it needs to be viewed as a trade-off rather than an absolute loss.
     
icruise
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Jul 9, 2007, 02:49 PM
 
I think we should also note that if it really does die during the first year, the warranty will cover it. And if you know you're going to be a heavy user, you can get Applecare for cheaper than the battery replacement charge, and it'll replace the battery if it dies during the coverage.
     
bcaslis
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Jul 9, 2007, 03:27 PM
 
The thing I never see anyone mention is that Apple said after those cycles you would have 80% charge left. Everyone acts like the battery is dead after those cycles and that is not what Apple said. Besides in two years, I'll be buying the Apple iPhone nano super!
MacBook Pro 17" 2.4 Ghz, 4GB ram, 200GB 7200rpm HD
     
Wiskedjak
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Jul 9, 2007, 03:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
It is really disturbing that Apple expects all iPhone users to shell out a hidden fee of $85.95 (79.95 + $6.95 shipping) to replace a battery which WILL need to happen to all of us after 300-600 charges. That will happen probably next year. That did not come up in any great reviews in the hype leading to June 29 blitz.
The charge isn't really all that surprising considering that, unlike the iPod, the iPhone's battery is sautered in place, meaning that it will most likely have to be removed and replaced manually. Either that, or they may just replace the main-board and swap your data, which may actually be cheaper for them than unsautering and resautering the battery ...
     
Stogieman
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Jul 9, 2007, 04:17 PM
 
Unless it's under warranty, why would you take it to the Apple store? You can probably do it yourself for 1/3 the price Apple charges. I've replaced the battery on my iPod mini thanks to places like www.ipodbattery.com_ I'm sure they will have instructions & replacement batteries for the iPhone in the near future.

Slick shoes?! Are you crazy?!
     
icruise
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Jul 9, 2007, 04:21 PM
 
I don't think there are going to be do-it-yourself kits for the iPhone, because as Wiskedjak points out, the battery is actually soldered in place. The iPod nano is the same way. I don't think there are any kits for the nano. There will almost certainly be third-party solutions where you send off your iPhone and get it replaced, however.
     
xMetal
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Jul 9, 2007, 04:51 PM
 
Is nobody at all reading what Apple actually said about the battery life? Right there, in print on the iPhone battery page, it says:

Charge Cycles - A properly maintained iPhone battery is designed to retain up to 80% of its original capacity after 400 full charge and discharge cycles. You may choose to replace your battery when it no longer holds sufficient charge to meet your needs.
The battery is not going to stop working completely at 400 cycles. It's going to charge to 80% on average. That's still a lot of battery life. Sure, not as good as brand new but 80% is not 0%.

The battery will probably work for a very long time after those 400 cycles.
     
::maroma::
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Jul 9, 2007, 04:59 PM
 
^^ Ding ding ding! We have a winner folks!

The battery "issue" isn't going to be an issue. Just like the iPod battery "issue" that everyone cried about. No one's crying anymore because its not a real issue.

Some people just have to find a way to complain about something.
     
amazing
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Jul 9, 2007, 06:03 PM
 
Down the road, when people's iPhone batteries get to be a problem, you'll find reliable companies offering replacements for far less money than Apple charges. Apple's prices are always at the upper end--which allows ample opportunities for 3rd parties to offer overnight service, etc.

And you'll also find that battery technology will have advanced, so that the replacement batteries will be longer lasting than present day batteries.

And if the iPhone non-replaceable battery was hidden from you, please tell us how this was accomplished?
     
vln2  (op)
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Jul 9, 2007, 07:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by ::maroma:: View Post
The battery "issue" isn't going to be an issue. Just like the iPod battery "issue" that everyone cried about. No one's crying anymore because its not a real issue.
Some people just have to find a way to complain about something.
I know that the battery issue will not affect me because by then I will either sell the current iPhone on ebay to get a new 3G version or give it to my wife who is not using it as much as I do.
I just hate to push this on somebody else. Some people are hoping this toy will last long time.
I would not trust the 80% statement. I have seen weak batteries in phones and laptops. They do not level at 80%, they just do not hold the charge.
     
::maroma::
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Jul 9, 2007, 07:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
I know that the battery issue will not affect me because by then I will either sell the current iPhone on ebay to get a new 3G version or give it to my wife who is not using it as much as I do.
I just hate to push this on somebody else. Some people are hoping this toy will last long time.
I would not trust the 80% statement. I have seen weak batteries in phones and laptops. They do not level at 80%, they just do not hold the charge.
Well of course there will be exceptions to that 80% rule. There will always be batteries out there that will either fail for one reason or another, or poop out earlier than they should. That's why Apple instituted the replacement program (same goes for the iPods). Its already clear to me, and many others, that the battery in the iPhone is far far better than any battery any other cell phone has, and even better than the iPod batteries. Why you wouldn't trust what Apple has stated in print, even to go as far as stating that most people will have a different experience than that, is beyond me.

Anyways, if you are wary of recommending this phone to others, then don't do it. Or recommend it with a little side note saying that they may have to pay to have the battery replaced in the future (that is, if they are out of warranty). There really is only a small number of people who will be using this battery replacement program. Those who use it a buttload (and are out of warranty), those that wind up with defective batteries (and are out of warranty), and/or those who end up using this phone for a very long time. But I really believe that vast majority of "normal" users won't ever have to deal with it.
     
vln2  (op)
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Jul 9, 2007, 10:26 PM
 
Originally Posted by ::maroma:: View Post
Why you wouldn't trust what Apple has stated in print, even to go as far as stating that most people will have a different experience than that, is beyond me.
Well, lets just say that the experience of having hundreds of computers made by Apple at work has toughed me a thing or two about Apple warranty and support.
On top of that having 2 personal video iPods which both broke (one within a week, another in 3 months) and had to be replaced by Apple which made the process very difficult and charged me for shipping on one.

Originally Posted by ::maroma:: View Post
Anyways, if you are wary of recommending this phone to others, then don't do it. Or recommend it with a little side note saying that they may have to pay to have the battery replaced in the future (that is, if they are out of warranty). There really is only a small number of people who will be using this battery replacement program. Those who use it a buttload (and are out of warranty), those that wind up with defective batteries (and are out of warranty), and/or those who end up using this phone for a very long time. But I really believe that vast majority of "normal" users won't ever have to deal with it.
You are not leaving much doubt about your allegiance while forgetting about a reasonable expectation of every (and some less) loyal Apple customer to receive a reliable product without hidden fees. For 6 months we have heard about fabulous features of iPhone, nobody has mentioned that Apple will charge $85 for replacing its battery. Warranty details were not announced. On June 28th while calling Apple to ask about sharing iTunes between iPod and iPhone I asked questions about the warranty. They refused to answer any of them, they refused to answer any of my questions period. So it is fair to say that we can be "little" surprised now.
It is hard to compare battery from iPod to iPhone battery. It is obvious that the phone will be used daily and with all the built-in features rather heavily. I can not say that about my iPod: one sits in my car and the other on my alarm radio.

I am happy with my iPhone, I recommend it to others for features it has and I am not shy about its shortcomings. I really hope that Apple is reading our posts and will make a better upgrade next year.
I do not understand for example why WiFi refuses to work with SSID broadcast turned off and will not save security settings. That is after all a very basic feature but I can live with that and rename my home Access Point to error_0x0438294 startling some teenager for at least few seconds so they would move to easier target like open Linksys or D-Link. I can find those on every street.
     
cSurfr
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Jul 9, 2007, 10:36 PM
 
Saying Apple has a hidden fee of 85.00 to replace the battery is like saying RIM or Motorola have a hidden 60.00 fee to replace the battery. It's a given that batteries will degrade over time. Why are you complaining about Apple? Is it because they are the only company to actually SAY that the battery life will shorten?

If you are so concerned about the battery life, take it back. I have had a 4th gen iPod for what. . . 2 1/2 years now? The battery still lasts a good 6 hours of constant music playback. . . . good enough for me!
-How pumped would you be driving home from work, knowing someplace in your house there's a monkey you're gonna battle?
     
icruise
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Jul 9, 2007, 10:53 PM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
You are not leaving much doubt about your allegiance while forgetting about a reasonable expectation of every (and some less) loyal Apple customer to receive a reliable product without hidden fees. For 6 months we have heard about fabulous features of iPhone, nobody has mentioned that Apple will charge $85 for replacing its battery. Warranty details were not announced.
Did you expect it to be free?

On June 28th while calling Apple to ask about sharing iTunes between iPod and iPhone I asked questions about the warranty. They refused to answer any of them, they refused to answer any of my questions period. So it is fair to say that we can be "little" surprised now.
I think it's fair to say that even Apple support people didn't know a lot of things about the iPhone before its release. But what does this have to do with anything?

I do not understand for example why WiFi refuses to work with SSID broadcast turned off and will not save security settings.
What security settings doesn't it save?
     
vln2  (op)
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Jul 9, 2007, 11:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
Did you expect it to be free?
?
I expect it to be clearly free within a period of 1 year if that is Apple warranty for a simple reason that I can not get access to that battery. It was Apple's choice to hide its access from us.
I perfectly understand that some people can use it more but that is why normally batteries are easily replaceable.


Originally Posted by icruise View Post
What security settings doesn't it save?
There seems to be an issue with saving Hex password on WEP. Also with saving SSID when it is set not to broadcast.
     
BRussell
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Jul 9, 2007, 11:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
I expect it to be clearly free within a period of 1 year if that is Apple warranty for a simple reason that I can not get access to that battery. It was Apple's choice to hide its access from us.
I perfectly understand that some people can use it more but that is why normally batteries are easily replaceable.
It's not free within the warranty period?
     
icruise
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Jul 9, 2007, 11:27 PM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
I expect it to be clearly free within a period of 1 year if that is Apple warranty for a simple reason that I can not get access to that battery. It was Apple's choice to hide its access from us.
I perfectly understand that some people can use it more but that is why normally batteries are easily replaceable.
It is free within the 1-year warranty, is it not?

There seems to be an issue with saving Hex password on WEP.
Haven't seen that myself.
     
cSurfr
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Jul 9, 2007, 11:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
It is free within the 1-year warranty, is it not?


Haven't seen that myself.

After reading the warranty on the iPhone, the battery should be covered under the first year. It's not listed as an exclusion. . . Buy the AppleCare for the phone and you'll be fine for the next 3. . .
-How pumped would you be driving home from work, knowing someplace in your house there's a monkey you're gonna battle?
     
icruise
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Jul 9, 2007, 11:56 PM
 
Applecare for iPods is only an additional year, for a total of 2. Applecare for computers is an additional 2 years, for a total of 3. I would assume the iPhone would follow the iPod model.
     
itai195
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Jul 10, 2007, 01:38 AM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
You are not leaving much doubt about your allegiance while forgetting about a reasonable expectation of every (and some less) loyal Apple customer to receive a reliable product without hidden fees. For 6 months we have heard about fabulous features of iPhone, nobody has mentioned that Apple will charge $85 for replacing its battery. Warranty details were not announced. On June 28th while calling Apple to ask about sharing iTunes between iPod and iPhone I asked questions about the warranty. They refused to answer any of them, they refused to answer any of my questions period. So it is fair to say that we can be "little" surprised now.
It is hard to compare battery from iPod to iPhone battery. It is obvious that the phone will be used daily and with all the built-in features rather heavily. I can not say that about my iPod: one sits in my car and the other on my alarm radio.
And yet some people complained about the non-user replaceable batteries in iPods while most people didn't care. A user-replaceable battery would be nice, but I'm willing to sacrifice it for a lighter/thinner design any day. I think many people would agree with that position. Obviously you don't, so don't buy an iPhone.
     
demiurgical
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Jul 10, 2007, 02:10 AM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
...I do not understand for example why WiFi refuses to work with SSID broadcast turned off and will not save security settings. That is after all a very basic feature but I can live with that and rename my home Access Point to error_0x0438294 startling some teenager for at least few seconds so they would move to easier target like open Linksys or D-Link. I can find those on every street.
I have no problems with my WiFi settings being saved. My SSID is set to non-broadcast, have WEP password on and also MAC address filtering on. I have a D-Link dgl-4300 wireless router.
     
Cadaver
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Jul 10, 2007, 09:19 AM
 
It cost me $59 to replace a battery in my wife's $29 cellphone a couple years ago. Why should battery replacements for the iPhone be any different. The only thing that has changed is that now you have to send it in, instead of doing it yourself. Big deal. Loaners are (will be) available, BTW, for the 3 days it takes.
     
amazing
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Jul 10, 2007, 10:44 AM
 
Is there some diagnostic function on the iPhone that tells you how many charge cycles it's been through, like CoconutBattery on laptops? Because normal (edit: meant to say "abnormal") wear and tear on the iPhone will undoubtedly not be covered. This means that somebody whose battery deteriorates under light usage will probably have their battery replaced for free. A very heavy user, who runs through an entire charge every day, will "age" the battery very quickly--perhaps in quite a bit under a year...

You know how car warranties state "so-and-so many years OR so-and-so many miles?" In other words, heavy usage is only covered up to a certain point.

BTW, when you do send it off for battery replacement, you don't get a loaner, you get a "rental."
( Last edited by amazing; Jul 10, 2007 at 11:28 AM. )
     
vln2  (op)
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Jul 10, 2007, 10:53 AM
 
Originally Posted by itai195 View Post
And yet some people complained about the non-user replaceable batteries in iPods while most people didn't care. A user-replaceable battery would be nice, but I'm willing to sacrifice it for a lighter/thinner design any day. I think many people would agree with that position. Obviously you don't, so don't buy an iPhone.
I absolutely do not care about replacement of batteries in my iPods because they are used occasionally. iPhone is already used heavily with WiFi and Bluetooth on and so far the battery seems to have a good capacity. I am used to charging my PDA daily and I do not expect the battery to hold the charge longer.
Time will tell how long the battery will last.
     
vln2  (op)
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Jul 10, 2007, 11:04 AM
 
Originally Posted by amazing View Post
Is there some diagnostic function on the iPhone that tells you how many charge cycles it's been through, like CoconutBattery on laptops? Because normal wear and tear on the iPhone will undoubtedly not be covered. This means that somebody whose battery deteriorates under light usage will probably have their battery replaced for free. A very heavy user, who runs through an entire charge every day, will "age" the battery very quickly--perhaps in quite a bit under a year...
I was thinking about it myself. It would be very easy for Apple Tech to look into your Usage Settings and figure out from numbers appoximately how many charges you needed on your iPhone.
Then this is just another PDA and if I would ever had to send it in I would back it up and reset it erasing everything. I am curious if it would still hold the Usage numbers.
     
vln2  (op)
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Jul 10, 2007, 11:48 AM
 
Originally Posted by demiurgical View Post
I have no problems with my WiFi settings being saved. My SSID is set to non-broadcast, have WEP password on and also MAC address filtering on. I have a D-Link dgl-4300 wireless router.
I wonder if this is related to different Access Points/Routers. I have Verizon FIOS at home and they asked me to use their big Actiontec wireless (802.11 b&g) router. I gave away my Linksys AP. On my Actiontec I have problems with iPhone any time I set SSID not to broadcast. It does not connect and will not save any settings unless I start broadcasting SSID. I looked at the logs on my Actiontec router and it shows when iPhone is trying to connect with SSID not broadcasting. Here is a typical sequence:

kern.debug Clink Device Forced reset
daemon.warn cLink: clink0: ioctl(DRV_SET_SW_CONFIG) failed, res=-1: Bad address.
daemon.warn cLink: clink0: ioctl(DRV_GET_MY_NODE_INFO) failed, res=-1: Bad address.
kern.debug Clink Reset Cause :0x1b0002 Reg:0x20000 Dbg:0xa9b
kern.debug Clink Device Forced reset

In my neighborhood I can pick up all open Access Points and connect easily. At work all buildings on campus have Cisco Access Points and iPhone works fine there. I could just get a typical Access Point (Linksys or D-Link) without a router and connect it to my Actiontec. Yet it is much simpler to just start broadcasting SSID, bummer.

Yesterday I helped my friend configure all settings on her new Linksys 802.11n router and corresponding PCMCIA card. I had the same problems with my iPhone - when I stopped broadcasting SSID iPhone could not connect to WiFi (it was in mixed b,g & n mode). As soon as I started broadcasting SSID iPhone picked it up without any problems. BTW 802.11n runs really, really fast and has a nice long range.
     
amazing
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Jul 10, 2007, 12:02 PM
 
Hiding your SSID doesn't provide any security because it is so easily picked up. OTO the Actiontec router doesn't provide much security either--you'd be better off with a 3rd party WAP. And, in the past, some WAPs didn't play well with Macs, so the same thing may occur with the iPhone.
     
chipchen
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Jul 11, 2007, 03:26 AM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
I absolutely do not care about replacement of batteries in my iPods because they are used occasionally. iPhone is already used heavily with WiFi and Bluetooth on and so far the battery seems to have a good capacity. I am used to charging my PDA daily and I do not expect the battery to hold the charge longer.
Time will tell how long the battery will last.
Why don't you just do us all a favor and return your iPhone? You bought it KNOWING what features it has and doesn't have. And if you are requiring a phone to have an EVERLASTING battery, then you shouldn't buy it if it doesn't.

You should probably return your car too, because of the hidden cost of gasoline...
     
analogika
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Jul 11, 2007, 05:29 AM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
I absolutely do not care about replacement of batteries in my iPods because they are used occasionally. iPhone is already used heavily with WiFi and Bluetooth on and so far the battery seems to have a good capacity. I am used to charging my PDA daily and I do not expect the battery to hold the charge longer.
Time will tell how long the battery will last.
Well, then, how about we let time tell whether there is a need to bitch about it, rather than pre-emptively bitching about it now?

Anybody remember those two morons who tried to create a huge internet hype about failing batteries on the first-generation iPod?

I have one of those iPods. It *still* gets six hours run-time out of a single battery charge.

It was five years old in May. Original battery.
     
scubus
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Jul 11, 2007, 09:41 AM
 
It isn't exactly "hidden." The fact that we are openly discussing it demonstrates that.

If the battery fails within a year it is covered under warranty. I can think of no possible way a person will go through more than 400 FULL charge cycles in a year of 365 days, but if a person does, then the iPhone is probably not for them as they are most likely in a business setting, and the iPhone is marketed as a consumer solution at this point. It is also very unlikely that a person who is able to go through 400 or more FULL charge cycles in year is such a noob that they would be unaware of the battery "issue."

I suspect that most iPhone users are more casual users, probably have never replaced a cell phone battery due to lost capacity and probably will never be concerned about replacing the iPhone's battery.

This is a huge non-issue for all but a few who are trying to make it more than it is.
Democracy: two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for lunch
Liberty: a well armed sheep expressing his rights.
Anarchy: a planet full of well-armed sheep who all claim to be expressing their 'rights'.
     
vln2  (op)
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Jul 11, 2007, 10:27 AM
 
Originally Posted by chipchen View Post
Why don't you just do us all a favor and return your iPhone? You bought it KNOWING what features it has and doesn't have. And if you are requiring a phone to have an EVERLASTING battery, then you shouldn't buy it if it doesn't.
I have no intention to return it and hope for a long use. I bought the iPhone knowing its general features and Not Knowing anything about its warranty. It was still under raps, remember?
As I said before my current iPhone will last until I can buy 3G model. At that point it will go on eBay or to my wife. My area will not be upgraded to 3G until 6 months from now so the timing seems perfect.
     
icruise
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Jul 11, 2007, 10:30 AM
 
I think it's questionable whether there will be a 2G iPhone in 6 months, much less 3G.
     
Zeeb
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Jul 11, 2007, 10:56 AM
 
You've spent between $500-$600 on a phone and an additional monthly fee of around $75 or more to maintain it for two years. Even if you have to replace the battery, what's another $85 to someone like you? I don't think it will be an issue anyway, you know you're going to buy the next generation of this phone when its updated in 3 months.

The iphone most definately isn't for people on a budget.
     
palane
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Jul 11, 2007, 11:18 AM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
I have no intention to return it and hope for a long use. I bought the iPhone knowing its general features and Not Knowing anything about its warranty. It was still under raps, remember?
I hope you are enjoying the iPhone and will continue to do so. I'm not up for the piling on, but it isn't entirely true that you went in blind. None of the iPods have a user replaceable battery. If you had that kind of expectation, it was unrealistic. One can reasonably anticipate the cost of a battery replacement from what Apple has charge in the past. And, I would note, third party providers have stepped in with less expensive alternatives.

True, this is going to cost more than $35 for a Treo battery, but it's relatively small for total cost of ownership. I wouldn't sweat the battery issue too much. The battery lifetime on my Gen2 iPod is down, but it's still quite usable. And that's 4 1/2 years on!

BB
     
scubus
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Jul 11, 2007, 11:43 AM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
I think it's questionable whether there will be a 2G iPhone in 6 months, much less 3G.
3G networking - not 3rd generation.
Democracy: two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for lunch
Liberty: a well armed sheep expressing his rights.
Anarchy: a planet full of well-armed sheep who all claim to be expressing their 'rights'.
     
icruise
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Jul 11, 2007, 11:46 AM
 
Ah of course. We talk about 2G and 3G iPods so often that I got confused.
     
vln2  (op)
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Jul 11, 2007, 12:10 PM
 
Originally Posted by icruise View Post
I think it's questionable whether there will be a 2G iPhone in 6 months, much less 3G.
I know you are teasing me and you know it is 3G network…
Since European version with 3G comes out in November that is roughly 4 months after its first release here. I hope it may take 4-5 months after that for a new US version with 3G. I am sure Steve Jobs will not miss the opportunity to announce it in January with a big fanfare. Postings here and opinions in many other places seem to stress the need for higher speed then Edge can offer. Obviously Edge is capable of offering speeds of 360 kbit/sec but is seems from posted test speeds that is available in one or two places in the country. My area in Florida – Sarasota seems to be the slowest – I am getting under 100 kbit/s and sometimes 20 through Edge. Not far from me is Tampa which has 3G, they just need to extend it further south. Edge is working little faster in Tampa as well so perhaps upgrading infrastructure to 3G may help increase Edge speeds when they replace olde equipment.

As we can see using WiFi on iPhone, it has great Internet browsing capabilities and 3G offers something we all have been waiting for many, many years. Edge does not seem to be able to deliver it. I think the answer is diversification of the iPhone line just like we have different models of iPods. Some consumers (many at this forum) would pay whatever price for a device which “can do it all” capable of using 3G and including GPS (or at least able to use external GPS Bluetooth antennas), I certainly would.
Then there could be existing line of Edge iPhones and the equivalent of the Nano $300 iPhone – version with the “click wheel” to dial the numbers we have heard so much about in last 2 days. I guess Apple already filed documents for that new device and AppleInsider yesterday posted its picture but it was pulled today from the website.
AppleInsider | Analyst claims iPhone nano on track for fourth quarter
I really think that a year from now we will refer to iPhone by specific model names. It is the most logical solution if Apple wants iPhone to be its vital line of products. People have different needs and even Mercedes is making tiny cars for European market:
Mercedes-Benz UK - Passenger Cars - Mercedes A-Class - Models
     
amazing
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Jul 11, 2007, 12:19 PM
 
Battery controversy turns out to be a tempest in a teapot:

Everybody's now printing qualification about their battery stories. Here's Gizmodo's:

Bad Reporter, Bad!: Actually, the iPhone Battery Will Last Longer Than 400 Charges - Gizmodo

Key phrase is that the battery will retain 80% capacity after 400 charge cycles.

Internet literacy defaults to the lowest comprehension level: nobody reads anything all the way through, or maybe the brain didn't get enough coffee that morning? Result is that everybody gets all a twitter about zilch.
     
icruise
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Jul 11, 2007, 12:26 PM
 
This kind of this happens a lot with blogs it seems. I remember a Gizmodo story about how you might be able to get a discount on the iPhone by complaining to the Apple salesman that it was too expensive. Thing is, the story that they linked to was talking about getting a discount on a large purchase of Apple hardware when you purchased it over the phone. The was no mention of the iPhone at all.
     
dan20164
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Jul 11, 2007, 02:14 PM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
Well then you know what vln stands for.
Apple is supposedly making $200-300 on the cost of each iPhone after its costs. They should set aside $75 for the cost of battery replacement. I think it sounds reasonable.
Why don't you see if you can get Ford, GM, BMW, Lexus, Honda, Toyota, and Mercedes to subscribe to your philosophy ?

It will be just like the iPod, third party service will spring up.. Like the other poster said, if some of the whiners would take the time to learn about what they are buying.. It seems like most of this noise is "You mean my cordless iPhone has a battery that needs to be replaced ?"
duh...
     
analogika
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Jul 11, 2007, 04:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by vln2 View Post
I know you are teasing me and you know it is 3G network…
Since European version with 3G comes out in November
Pure speculation.

We might have to wait until the next generation as well.

And the November release date has not been announced by any carrier nor Apple, yet, so that, too, is up in the air.
     
vln2  (op)
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Jul 11, 2007, 09:20 PM
 
Originally Posted by dan20164 View Post
...if some of the whiners would take the time to learn about what they are buying.. It seems like most of this noise is "You mean my cordless iPhone has a battery that needs to be replaced ?"
duh...
Since you are charging let’s get couple answers from you:

- Did you know details of iPhone warranty before June 29th?
- Have you heard about $85 charge for iPhone battery replacement before June 29th?
- Did you bother to read your warranty now?

I suspect your answer is going to be 3x NO but please surprise me. If you would read your warranty yourself you would not scribble those things.
You see I did take time to research the iPhone before buying it. I make large purchases of technology equipment at work and naturally check things well before making any decisions. My PocketPC screen broke and I needed new PDA quickly. iPhone seemed to be best choice at the time.
I used Apple products since Mac Plus but always kept the open mind. Apple made some great products and some duds. Actually I wish their support would be even close to the level of their engineering. I have hundreds of their products at work and even though we have extended warranties support is dismal. That is subject for another forum.

If you would take time to read this thread you would know that I called Apple and asked about their iPhone warranty before June 29th. They refused to answer any questions.
I also did what 90% of people reading this did not: I saved and printed every statement from the screen I came across during iTunes Activation.
Let’s get some facts straight:
1. There is nothing about battery warranty in any statements any of us agreed to during Activation.
2. In your iPhone box you will find iPhone Important Product Information Guide and if you flip to pages 16 and 17 you will see 1 Year Limited Warranty info. Very clearly Apple states under EXCLUSIONS AND LIMITATION - p. 17: This warranty does not apply: (f) to consumable parts such as batteries, unless damage has occurred due to a defect in materials or workmanship
3. That means that on June 29th Apple EXCLUDED battery from its 1 year warranty
4. On July 2nd (not earlier) Apple released more specific information about iPhone battery on their website Apple - Batteries - Battery Replacement by adding a statement about iPhone.
That was cited here: iPhone battery warranty, replacement information - The Unofficial Apple Weblog (TUAW) That means that by then all of us already were using our iPhones.
5. Apple Care Protection Plan which supposed to cover the battery for 2 years is still not available.
6. The wording of the statement is very interesting: first they say that the one-year warranty includes replacement coverage for a defective battery. Problem is how can we determain it has happened due to a defect in material or workmanship?
7. Then they say that “During the plan’s coverage period, Apple will replace the battery if it drops below 50% of its original capacity”. That means they will replace battery if you buy Apple Care Protection Plan and then the battery drops below 50%. Obviously none of us will be able to measure that capacity. That is left for Apple to decide and they will determine the charge in $.

None of this would be an issue if we would have access to the battery. Those of us who use it more would just keep couple spares and the life would go on.
I hear you…iPod has the same thing and it was not an issue. Yes, but none of us depend on iPod every day for communication, scheduling and many other things iPhone was designed for. That is why PDAs and cell phones have replaceable batteries. Until Apple changes the design to make battery easily replaceable this is going to be an issue.
As we can see Apple was hiding the battery issue from us and we have a right to bring it up now. I like my dissenting role, I am not “Yes, Master” man.
     
BRussell
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Jul 11, 2007, 10:04 PM
 
vln2: The exact price of the battery replacement plan wasn't known until the release of the iPhone, but we knew it wouldn't have a user-replaceable battery, and that you'd therefore have to send it in to Apple to be replaced (or use another company providing the service). To equate not knowing the exact dollar amount to "hiding the battery issue" seems to me to be dishonest. You make it sound as if there was a bait-and-switch, but there was not.
     
 
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