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The official Leopard thread (Page 44)
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besson3c
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Oct 17, 2007, 01:48 PM
 
Sorry, I'm a computer guy that does a lot of Unix stuff, so I'm kind of a stickler for accuracy. I'm confused by the conversation here...

If there are UI inconsistencies, please provide us with examples. So far, all people are talking about here are user experience examples, which is not the same thing. Am I being nit picky? Maybe, but why not say exactly what it is that you mean so that we can all understand each other and not talk past each other?

Designing GUIs is not the same as providing the artistic graphical content of GUIs. Please do not confuse the two, because you are confusing me in the process (and hopefully I speak for others too)
     
mdc
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Oct 17, 2007, 01:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by Sean Nichol View Post
Mac OS X is Aqua, period. With Leopard we are seeing an evolution in a cleaner, neater, tighter Aqua-- but still Aqua, in all of its lickable, glossy wonder.

The iLife GUI is slightly different in the fact that it is seeming to achieve a slightly more "professional" feel while at the same time allowing the user to still feel connected to OS X as a whole. Basically, Aqua with most of the gloss toned down to a more transparent matte finish.

Then there are the Pro Apps, which are intended to be used by professionals, for professionals. These apps are most likely to be used in an atmosphere with less lighting, such as a sound stage, recording studio, digital darkroom, etc. Knowing this, Apple eased our aching eyes and made the entire GUI grey. Even so, the grey GUI of the Pro apps they still retain elements of Aqua to allow the user to feel connected to the overall Mac OS X experience.

So basically, I see Apple as trying to create 3 separate user experiences, unified by one operating system... Mac OS. Personally, I see "Aqua" as more of a digital brand than a GUI.
I think you have something there, but I have to disagree in the sense of 3 user experiences. The Pro apps definitely have their own, and those work very well for the reasons you mentioned. Those deserve their place in Mac OS.
Taking Aqua and making it look the same and yet different, at the same time, to iLife doesn't make sense to me.
     
Spirit_VW
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Oct 17, 2007, 01:56 PM
 
Originally Posted by mdc View Post
@Spirit_VW, Unless I'm misreading Kevin, I think he means Frankensteinesque in the same way that currently 10.4 is very Frankensteinsque because it has two different scrollbars.

(snip)

There should be one type of scrollbar, Aqua or iTunes. I don't care which it is. If Apple doesn't change one to the other, I hope someone else will.
I understand exactly what he's saying. I'm just questioning whether it's this HORRIBLE EMBARASSING DISASTER OMG OMG OMG EVERYBODY WILL LAUGH AT APPLE WTF ANYBODY WHO HAS TASTE AGREES WITH ME AAAAAAAAAAHHH WE'RE ALL GONNA DIE FROM THIS FRANKENSTEIN GUI DISASTER! thing that he seems to make it out to be, that has consumed what seems like 97% of the posts in this thread. I'm willing to bet that the vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaast majority of OS X users simply *do not care* if a couple of apps have scrollbars that don't match, and that the throngs of users with pitchforks and torches that he seems to think will be breaking down Apple's door simply do not exist.

I understand that when you're a guy who spends his time hacking OS X's interface, you'll notice and care about stuff like that. I'm just saying this barrage of posts about how disasterous this is for Apple, well, it's an overreaction, frankly.
Kevin Buchanan
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TETENAL
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Oct 17, 2007, 02:18 PM
 
The vast majority of users doesn't care that they are using Windows. That doesn't mean that Windows is good enough.

I agree that the vast majority doesn't care about the scrollbars in OS X. Neither will I to the point that I will hack it or something to make them look good. That doesn't mean that Leopards UI is as good as it could be. Whoever decided that the new folder icons are making it in, but the new scrollbars won't – even though both were clearly designed to go with each other – has no clue about design. Tragic? No. Unfortunate? Definitely.
It's kind of disappointing since with getting rid off brushed metal Apple had the chance of creating a consistent, attractive and fresh new UI.
     
0157988944
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Oct 17, 2007, 03:05 PM
 
I think to sum it up, we all agree that It would match a bit better if iTunes scroll-bars were integrated into the iTunes-like "Unified" theme. If not, having the Aqua elements won't kill anyone, but they do stand out in the toned down, non-glossy (except the dock) Leopard. And finally, regardless of which scroll-bars they are, we need one set, and they should all look the same.

Also, thanks for the info on Time Machine. I'll use it now
     
imitchellg5
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Oct 17, 2007, 03:09 PM
 
Well, you can preorder it now. I ordered it, split the cost with a friend. I'm pretty excited, even though my G4 won't run it.
     
Kerrigan
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Oct 17, 2007, 03:30 PM
 
Does anyone know if I can create new calendar events with OS X?
     
0157988944
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Oct 17, 2007, 03:31 PM
 
Of course... just like Tiger...
     
analogika
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Oct 17, 2007, 03:42 PM
 
Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
Does anyone know if I can create new calendar events with OS X?
What?
     
Dakarʒ
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Oct 17, 2007, 03:51 PM
 
I think that's an iPod Touch joke.
     
0157988944
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Oct 17, 2007, 03:53 PM
 
I thought so, but couldn't quite tell... it wasn't very good.
     
Dakarʒ
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Oct 17, 2007, 04:00 PM
 
I'd take it over most of the posts past 5 pages.
     
0157988944
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Oct 17, 2007, 04:02 PM
 
Haha.. yes, true.
     
0157988944
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Oct 17, 2007, 06:02 PM
 
Ok, on the Leopard tech specs page, Apple - Mac OS X Leopard - Technical Specs , there is a small diamond next to the "867 MHz or higher" in the Processor Requirements image. I'm assuming that is supposed to reference some small print, but I don't see said small print anywhere.

EDIT: Ah, wait... it seems to be a tiny plus sign. Never mind.
     
Staren
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Oct 17, 2007, 07:41 PM
 
I was kind of surprised when I saw that. Apple is being real generous with the PowerPC support. I figured they where going to use Leopard as stepping stone to start phasing them out., even if it was an artificial restriction. Glad they didn't.
     
imitchellg5
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Oct 17, 2007, 07:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by Staren View Post
I was kind of surprised when I saw that. Apple is being real generous with the PowerPC support. I figured they where going to use Leopard as stepping stone to start phasing them out., even if it was an artificial restriction. Glad they didn't.
It's not that generous of them at all, there are still a ton of people out there who use PowerPC Macs. It would go over real well if your G5 Quad couldn't run the newest OS or Final Cut Pro.
     
MindFad
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Oct 17, 2007, 09:58 PM
 
Anyone who's "tested" the newest "867+ MHz" version know if the installer tells us dual 800 G4s owners to piss off and die? Or can we actually put that extra 800 MHz to use?
     
Kevin
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Oct 18, 2007, 06:12 AM
 
Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
However, since you brought it up... Jobs never said they were keeping secrets to the last minute for Leopard. He only said at WWDC06 that they have some top secret stuff that they won't show during WWDC06. Check the keynote yourself at 29:20 from Apple - QuickTime - WWDC 2006
He said there was top secret stuff that wouldn't be shown. He never said what those top secret things where. Still has not. People have made guesses but the fact remains. That doesn't mean that they haven't already shown them. It just means no one really knows. People that say they do are being dishonest.
We all knew what it looked like before they released it since it was demoed at MacWorld 2007 over six months before it was for sale.
Um, looks have changed since then. Hell the GUI changed from build to build since then.

Originally Posted by analogika View Post
That's even more wrong and useless than claiming that the changes from DP3 to 10.0 were "last-minute" "surprises". EVERYBODY know what the iPhone and its GUI looked like MORE THAN SIX MONTHS BEFORE IT WAS RELEASED. Hardly anything at all changed between the January presentation and actual release.
Whoah woah woah. No one knew what exactly it would look like. Nor the GUI until JOBS REVEALED IT. I wasn't talking about AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC. I am saying at the LAST MINUTE until it was SHOWN, no one knew what it looked like. And they didn't. And the first wasn't useless either. Stop bringing up beaten down horses. They are already dead.
Originally Posted by Spirit_VW View Post
Good grief. Overdramatic much?
I guess all the people that agrees with me in this forum, counting Swiz, is over dramatic too? No, I am just not an Apple apologist. 10.5's GUI, as we see it now is a MESS.
Personally, I think Leopard looks great. Seems way more consistant than most every other version of OS X, frankly.
Well it might seem that way to you, but it's more inconsistent than before. Now all the windows have the same window type, but all the GUI wigets come from 5 different GUIs that Apple has used over the years. And then some added new ones. So you may THINK or believe it is, but it's not. This isn't being a drama queen. This is just being honest.
Would it look better with the iTunes scrollbars? Maybe,
More people in here said they would look better than the Aqua ones. And more in place with the rest of the OS. I guess they are drama queens too.
yeah, though I think the Aqua ones look just fine.
As I, and many other people that have been following the internals of Apple's GUI since day one have said, they are out of place. You might not be able to tell. And that is fine. Some people can't. Just like I can't code worth crap.
To go around screaming at people on forums about how "HORRIBLE" and "Frankenstein" and "embarassing" Leopard's interface skin is because of the Aqua scrollbars, well, that just strikes me as more than a touch over-the-top.
Apple must be doing pretty well if you're blowing gaskets over the stinking *scrollbars.*
Screaming? I wasn't screaming. Talk about drama. And if you have been paying ANY attention to what I've said, it's just not the scrollbars. So in other words, you really didn't read anything I've really said in here, and juts knee-jerked to take up for Apple. Great.
     
Kevin
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Oct 18, 2007, 06:14 AM
 
Originally Posted by Sean Nichol View Post
M
So basically, I see Apple as trying to create 3 separate user experiences, unified by one operating system... Mac OS. Personally, I see "Aqua" as more of a digital brand than a GUI.
That's a spin if I ever saw one. You should work with Apple.

"3 different GUIs unified as one!" LOL! Thats a contradiction.

Just like I said stripes and such would be removed from Aqua in the future versions when 10.0 came out, and I was told I was nuts. That they were a permeant part of Apple's new GUI. Aqua's days are numbered. If not within the next few months, soon after.
Originally Posted by mdc View Post
@Spirit_VW, Unless I'm misreading Kevin, I think he means Frankensteinesque in the same way that currently 10.4 is very Frankensteinsque because it has two different scrollbars.

iTunes comes out with a new dark unified look and along with the new windows it brings new scrollbars. The rest of 10.4 stays regular Aqua.

10.5 comes along and it's all dark unified, everything matches iTunes/iLife, and yet non-iTunes/iLife applications still have Aqua scrollbars?
That just doesn't make sense to me.


iTunes has the new scrollbars and other applications have the Aqua scrollbars; and yet they all have the same Unified look.

There should be one type of scrollbar, Aqua or iTunes. I don't care which it is. If Apple doesn't change one to the other, I hope someone else will.
Yes, you get what I was saying. And you understand the importance. Some here don't. And that is fine. And Believe me, if Leopard ships with this broken mangled GUI I will fix it myself. Just like I've had to do since it's inception.
     
Kevin
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Oct 18, 2007, 06:20 AM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Sorry, I'm a computer guy that does a lot of Unix stuff, so I'm kind of a stickler for accuracy. I'm confused by the conversation here...
Sorry, I'm a GUI designer guy that has does a lot of GUI designing over the decade, so I'm kind of a stickler for accuracy.

Even though no .nix's GUIs I have seen have ever been consistent. Menu cmds in different places from apps to apps. Different GUIs for different Apps... it's a mess. Though I will say they are TRYING to be more consistent. The reason why a lot of .nix people bought OS X was because Apple was known to be a maker of great consistent GUIs. They have the power of .nix, and a great GUI, and major app support. These are the reasons I was given by .nix users as to why they bought a Mac. And 10.0.0's GUI, while ugly, was more consistent than 10.5s.
If there are UI inconsistencies, please provide us with examples. So far, all people are talking about here are user experience examples, which is not the same thing
Having 5 different GUI ideas into ONE gui is inconsistent with the way Apple does things. Or used to brag about doing things. This might not be (it's not) the status quo for .NIX type windows managers. So I can understand why you don't "get it" Have you ever designed a GUI for an OS besson? From scratch?
Designing GUIs is not the same as providing the artistic graphical content of GUIs. Please do not confuse the two,
Um, designing a GUI has to do with it's graphical content, and over all placement design besson. The whole shabang. Not just the layout. But what goes into the layout as well.
Originally Posted by Spirit_VW View Post
I understand that when you're a guy who spends his time hacking OS X's interface, you'll notice and care about stuff like that. I'm just saying this barrage of posts about how disasterous this is for Apple, well, it's an overreaction, frankly.
I've shown were people that use the GUI everyday and doesn't theme that are upset abotu this. I've shown dozens of links.
I am not the only person in this thread that has complained. Swiz, the official GUI punk of the forum even agrees with me. NO one jumped his ass. Why oh why is that? (I know, don't bother answering)
( Last edited by Kevin; Oct 18, 2007 at 12:22 PM. )
     
Kevin
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Oct 18, 2007, 06:26 AM
 
Originally Posted by adamfishercox View Post
I think to sum it up, we all agree that It would match a bit better if iTunes scroll-bars were integrated into the iTunes-like "Unified" theme.
Not everyone is agreeing to this. Some are calling us drama queens.
If not, having the Aqua elements won't kill anyone, but they do stand out in the toned down, non-glossy (except the dock) Leopard.
And standing out, = not fitting with the whole graphical idea. Standing out = distracting from the content. Distracting from the content = Bad GUI.
And finally, regardless of which scroll-bars they are, we need one set, and they should all look the same.
Agreed. And you saying that, does not make you a drama queen in any way.

But It's just more than scrollbars that is inconsistent. It's just the scroll-bars that are the most NOTICABLY out of place with the rest of the OS design.

I realize not everyone has a eye for such things. And they wont "see" it. And they will be just fine with the OS. But most Apple users are picky about such things. And they do have an eye for design.

I can understand how someone that came from the Windows or .nix world wouldn't get it, or understand the importance. Or how someone that didn't have a eye for such a thing wouldn't get it.

I can't see anyone saying that this



Looks better and more in place than this



That isn't the only thing I would change either.

The scrollbars and new non-aqua folders simply clash too



*sigh*

To quote swiz again, since no one is doubting his GUI knowledge in here.

Originally Posted by swiz View Post
Wow.
I haven't used any pre-releases of Leopard or even seen screens of it other than in this thread and on Apples website but they really do seem to be furthering the gap of GUI consistency as opposed to unifying it IMO.

The screens in this thread with the subtle gradient scroll bars, are far more of a unified look than Aqua scroll bars. Its almost as if Apple (:Steve) wants to move away from Aqua but cant completely for whatever reason so he insists on leaving pieces lying around in the GUI.

Those new window widgets look so "Windowsy" its ridiculous. They really look like an M$ attempted copy of Aqua, maybe this is intentional to draw more PC users LOL.

Im not totally sure if I am just really over Aqua or if its the mismatch of elements in the Leopard sreenshots but I think the new look, minus all the Aqua elements, is a more appealing GUI- less confusing too. If they modeled their widgets after those light gradient blue scroll bars and buttons too it would look much nicer... but wait a minute, I do believe a themes already exists for Tiger in this manner. Can anyone pinpoint the theme Im referring to? Can't remember its name, I havent been around for a while.
If swiz doesn't decide to make a theme that doesn't require SS to use to fix 10.5s GUI as to the way it looks now. I surely will.

SO anyone wanting a REAL unified 10.5 GUI, don't fret. It will be there soon after 10.5s release.
( Last edited by Kevin; Oct 18, 2007 at 06:43 AM. )
     
TETENAL
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Oct 18, 2007, 06:41 AM
 
Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
Screaming? I wasn't screaming.
Really?
Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
Whoah woah woah. No one knew what exactly it would look like. Nor the GUI until JOBS REVEALED IT. I wasn't talking about AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC. I am saying at the LAST MINUTE until it was SHOWN, no one knew what it looked like. […] 10.5's GUI, as we see it now is a MESS. […] So you may THINK or believe it is, but it's not. This isn't being a drama queen. […] And if you have been paying ANY attention to what I've said, it's just not the scrollbars.
     
JLL
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Oct 18, 2007, 07:31 AM
 
Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
JLL I am not talking about just OS secrets. I am talking about SECRETS IN GENERAL. For example. No one knew what the iPhone, nor it's GUI looked like before Apple released it. There was GUESSES, but no one knew till the last day.
No one knew what it looked like before the announced it - big difference. Leopard has been annonced and shown.

Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
Wow, you are getting hostile for no reason.
No reason? You hijack every single Leopard thread with this crap.

Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
AS far as you know. At least I am being honest when I say "I don't know, I am just guessing" anyone making definite statements about such a thing is simply being dishonest. Now by saying that, I too am losing doubt that Apple will fix this mess before the release. But I would never attempt to state it factual when I didn't know. That would be obnoxious.
Lloyd: What are the chances of a guy like you and a girl like me... ending up together?
Mary: Well, that's pretty difficult to say.
Lloyd: Hit me with it! I've come a long way to see you, Mary. The least you can do is level with me. What are my chances?
Mary: Not good.
Lloyd: You mean, not good like one out of a hundred?
Mary: I'd say more like one out of a million.
[pause]
Lloyd: So you're telling me there's a chance.

Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
If 10.5's GUI doesn't get updated, expect it to by 10.5.2. Enough people will complain. Apple will eventually do something about it.

Just like they did when people complained about the stripes, and brushed metal.
OK, I didn't know that BM was removed in 10.0.2
( Last edited by JLL; Oct 18, 2007 at 07:53 AM. )
JLL

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Kevin
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Oct 18, 2007, 08:21 AM
 
Originally Posted by TETENAL View Post
Really?
Screaming involves actually yelling out loud. A sound. When I use capitols it is to HIGHLIGHT a word, or make it stand out. I assure you, when I was WRITING those things down, I did no SCREAMING.

MacNN code in the lounge DOESN'T ALLOW YOU TO YELL. BECAUSE IT REMOVES ALL THE CAPS. SEE THIS IS YELLING!!

But it does allow you to EMPHASIZE a word.

There is a difference.
( Last edited by Kevin; Oct 18, 2007 at 08:30 AM. )
     
Kevin
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Oct 18, 2007, 08:28 AM
 
Originally Posted by JLL View Post
No one knew what it looked like before the announced it - big difference. Leopard has been annonced and shown.
That is irrelevant of my point that Apple does indeed keep secrets. I can't even believe that people in here are arguing with me that Apple keeps secrets. Or hasn't kept cats in bags till the end. I've guess we've been watching different keynotes.
No reason? You hijack every single Leopard thread with this crap.
I can't be hijacking a thread when what I am talking about is the topic of said thread. Just because you aren't interested in the same things I am, doesn't mean I am hijacking things. Skip my posts. When I see posts by certain people I sometimes skip them too because I usually realize they aren't interested in the same things as I was. I surely just because I didn't want to hear about what they were talking about anymore, accuse them of hijacking threads.
trolling deleted
Me stating that no one knows what secrets Steve was talking about is just that. Speaking the truth. Anyone that says they do know is lying. It's that simple. I am not saying that the secret is a new GUI. I've already said I've pretty much lost hope in 10.5. I am just being HONEST.
OK, I didn't know that BM was removed in 10.0.2
I don't think I said it was. I said it was removed because enough people complained about it. So were the stripes.

Of course I was told back in the day that BM and stripes were what Aqua was, and that I better just get used to it. Because Apple wasn't going to redesign the GUI blah blah. Well they were wrong.

I know if Apple ships 10.5 how it looks now, I will be busting out my GUI chops again. What would be cool is, if Max R would make a TRUE Unified theme in the similar fashion he did with Smooth Stripes.

Smooth Stripes is just a better, more eloquent version of Aqua. Max made all the elements more consistent throughout the OS, and removed the stripes from it. It looks 10x better than Apple's version of Aqua.

I am hoping he does the same for Unified as he did Aqua. And release it in a installer format like he does Smooth Stripes.

He'd have a huge winner on his hands. There are tons of people requesting this theme already and 10.5 isn't even out.
( Last edited by Kevin; Oct 18, 2007 at 12:25 PM. )
     
Mrjinglesusa
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Oct 18, 2007, 08:45 AM
 
Horse. Dead. Beating.

Pointless, banal drivel...
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Kevin
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Oct 18, 2007, 09:05 AM
 
Originally Posted by Mrjinglesusa View Post
Horse. Dead. Beating.

Pointless, banal drivel...
I put this into my trollise to English translator and it says

"I don't care about this stuff, so I am going to complain until they talk about stuff I do care about"

Do what I do when people go on endlessly about the terminal. Just skip those posts. This thread is for everyone. Different conversations can go on at the same time. And do.

I don't think this is required reading.
     
JLL
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Oct 18, 2007, 10:29 AM
 
Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
That is irrelevant of my point that Apple does indeed keep secrets. I can't even believe that people in here are arguing with me that Apple keeps secrets. Or hasn't kept cats in bags till the end. I've guess we've been watching different keynotes.
No one is arguing that Apple doesn't keep secrets, but you are using it to argue that there is a chance that Apple is keeping parts of the Leopard GUI a secret.

It's one thing to keep the iPhone a secret until it's ready to be announced (not launched) and it's a totalt different thing to keep a scroll bar and buttons a secret until the day of the launch even though you have previewed the damn thing a thousand times.

Get your priorities straight, please.

Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
#1 I can't be hijacking a thread when what I am talking about is the topic of said thread.
This isn't the only Leopard thread you post your "concerns" in! By posting it in several Leopard related threads it's hijacking.

Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
I don't think I said it was. I said it was removed because enough people complained about it. So were the stripes.
And you said that the scroll bar will be fixed by 10.5.2.

How many complained about BM? A helluva lot more than I've seen complaining about the Leopard scroll bar!

How long did it take to remove BM? 7+ years. Perhaps the scroll bar will be fixed in 10.10

You have a strange way of defining time. You call changes in six months "last minute changes" and now you're expecting things to change in a few months because they removed BM after 7+ years?

Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
I know if Apple ships 10.5 how it looks now...
That's why I quoted Dumb & Dumber. Even the tiniest percentage of hope is still something you mention in every post.

Try to use some logic and try to see what Apple has done in the last 10 years. Not one time have they changed something like that in the last minute (hereby actually meaning in the last few days).
JLL

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Mrjinglesusa
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Oct 18, 2007, 10:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
I put this into my trollise to English translator and it says

"I don't care about this stuff, so I am going to complain until they talk about stuff I do care about"

Do what I do when people go on endlessly about the terminal. Just skip those posts. This thread is for everyone. Different conversations can go on at the same time. And do.

I don't think this is required reading.
The difference here is that you are going on and on and on and on and on about the SAME thing. Nothing new has been added in over 5 pages of this dribble. And that's just what it is: dribble. You keep ranting about how you are just being "honest" and everyone else is being intellectually dishonest.

The fact is, Steve said there were secret features that he couldn't talk about. He then talked about them several months later. The idea that the secret, unannounced feature is some UI tweak is simply absurd. Like many have said, the UI for Leopard will be exactly what it looks like in the current screenshots and in the last build developers received. Period. You can carry on about how we can't know this for sure, but the fact remains that there is less than a 0.0001% chance Apple will change the UI now.
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OreoCookie  (op)
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Oct 18, 2007, 10:42 AM
 
Guys, keep things professional and on topic, this isn't one of the Lounges or the Feedback forum. I'd hate to spend 30 minutes cleaning up the mess here.
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analogika
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Oct 18, 2007, 10:44 AM
 
Just lock it. There'll be plenty of Leopard discussion, and this thread was already set to "liquefy" five pages ago when Kevin and a couple of us stopped ignoring people and started turning it into slush.
     
Kevin
Baninated
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In yer threads
Status: Offline
Oct 18, 2007, 12:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by JLL View Post
No one is arguing that Apple doesn't keep secrets,
If you really believe this, you haven't been reading the posts.
but you are using it to argue that there is a chance that Apple is keeping parts of the Leopard GUI a secret.
I WAS using it as an argument (and validly) Again as I have stated many times in here, I have since pretty much given up all hope Apple will fix 10.5s GUI by the time it ships.
It's one thing to keep the iPhone a secret until it's ready to be announced (not launched) and it's a totalt different thing to keep a scroll bar and buttons a secret until the day of the launch even though you have previewed the damn thing a thousand times.
Again still not really relevant to what I said, nor does it in any way disprove anything I said.
This isn't the only Leopard thread you post your "concerns" in! By posting it in several Leopard related threads it's hijacking.
No, no it's not. Hijacking a thread is taking a thread, and moving it off topic to another topic. I am talking about Leopard. It doesn't matter if their are 10 zillion Leopard topics, and I mention I don't like the GUI in all of them, it wouldn't be me hijacking threads. People making personal complaints and character assassinations however is a hijack...
And you said that the scroll bar will be fixed by 10.5.2.
Please quote were I said that. I did not. I said expect a 10.5.1 10.5.2 updates soon. I never said what they would contain.
How many complained about BM? A helluva lot more than I've seen complaining about the Leopard scroll bar!
Then you haven't been paying attention. I posted over a dozen sites complaining about not just the scroll bar, but the over all inconsistencies with 10.5s "Unified" GUI. Not only that, more than a dozen or so people in this very forum have complained.
How long did it take to remove BM? 7+ years. Perhaps the scroll bar will be fixed in 10.10
Actually they started removing them before that when the Unified windows came to place.
That's why I quoted Dumb & Dumber. Even the tiniest percentage of hope is still something you mention in every post.
But it had nothing to do with the point you were quoting. I was just saying that no one knows what Steve meant. And you put the dumb and dumber quote. Which made no sense. Me stating to someone that Steve never mentioned such a thing isn't me saying anything about that specific thing being the GUI. So my assessment was correct.
Try to use some logic and try to see what Apple has done in the last 10 years. Not one time have they changed something like that in the last minute (hereby actually meaning in the last few days).
I told you I have all but lost hope that Apple is going to fix it's GUI problems by the time it ships. How many times do I have to say this for you to drop it?
     
Kevin
Baninated
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In yer threads
Status: Offline
Oct 18, 2007, 12:39 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
Guys, keep things professional and on topic, this isn't one of the Lounges or the Feedback forum. I'd hate to spend 30 minutes cleaning up the mess here.
Yeah it would suck. It's too bad people can't make valid complaints about an OS without people getting so defensive.

Any more character assassinations sent my way, I will just report them. I am not replying to anymore of them. It's getting asinine.
     
OreoCookie  (op)
Moderator
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Hilbert space
Status: Offline
Oct 18, 2007, 01:04 PM
 
It was fun while it lasted ...
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
 
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