[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

Now who's sounding like Baghdad Bob.

How many Muslims have been beheaded or crucufied in the last month?

No, you're missing my point. The mid-east is a shit place to be. Wasn't it the past month or so that ISIS wiped out a town that was the wrong sect?

[Cap'n Tightpants]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Are Muslims in the M.E. the world's most persecuted majority?

Not unless you count what they do to each other.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants 

Not unless you count what they do to each other.

Yes, that's exactly my point.

[Chongo]

That's when they are taking a break from cutting the heads off Chaldeans and burning down their Churches.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

That's when they are taking a break from cutting the heads off Chaldeans and burning down their Churches.

…and that means what, exactly?

[subego]

Ask ISIS. I hear it's a fair amount.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

Ask ISIS. I hear it's a fair amount.

Huh?

[subego]

My understanding is they'll behead Muslims in areas they control if they aren't towing the line hard enough.

[The Final Dakar]

I don't think you understood the question.

What am I supposed to garner from Chongo's assertion that Muslims are killing Muslim's during their Christian killing downtime?

[subego]

I don't know what you can garner from Chongo's point, I'm just saying some Muslims have no trouble with chopping off the heads of other Muslims.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by subego 

I don't know what you can garner from Chongo's point

That's why I was asking him.

Originally Posted by subego 

I'm just saying some Muslims have no trouble with chopping off the heads of other Muslims.

I'm saying they have no problem chopping the heads off anybody.

[subego]

I would agree with that.

[Waragainstsleep]

The unfortunate truth is that their collective morality has failed to sufficiently evolve for the last millennium or so. Not very politically correct to say it of course as Maher and Harris found the other week, but its true that even with the Muslims who don't like chopping the heads off infidels it often doesn't take much to inspire them to commit murder or at least support it.

[Chongo]

And now for something completely different. Another Jesuit in the news.
Brother Guy Consolmagno, S.J., has won the Carl Sagan Medal - The Vatican Observatory

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

And now for something completely different

Oh. We're done with the Christian and Muslim persecution tangent?

[Cap'n Tightpants]

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep 

The unfortunate truth is that their collective morality has failed to sufficiently evolve for the last millennium or so. Not very politically correct to say it of course as Maher and Harris found the other week, but its true that even with the Muslims who don't like chopping the heads off infidels it often doesn't take much to inspire them to commit murder or at least support it.

One of the few times I've ever completely agreed with you.

[subego]

My dad is fond of saying:

Make fun of Buddha, you might get someone trying to explain why they'd take offense.
Make fun of Jesus, you might get someone trying to throw a rock through your window.
Make fun of Mohammed, you might get someone trying to kill you.

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

Oh. We're done with the Christian and Muslim persecution tangent?

Not if you don't want it to.

LAHORE, Pakistan — A young, married Pakistani Christian couple, including the pregnant mother of three children, were “brutally tortured and burned alive” at a brick kiln Nov. 4 in the Punjab province following “a false accusation of blasphemy,” according to the brother of the slain husband.
The deaths of Shahzad Masih, 28, and his pregnant wife Shama Bibi, 24, were vociferously decried by Christians in the predominantly Muslim country.
“They were brutally tortured and burnt alive,” Shabhaz Masih, elder brother of Shahzad, told the Register from the village of Chak 59, located near Kot Radha Kishan in the Kasur district in Pakistan’s Punjab province.
Six brothers of the Masih family, of whom Shahzad was the youngest, had been working in a brick kiln in the village as bonded laborers for 17 years. Trouble started on the evening of Nov. 2, Shabhaz said, when Shama was burning the waste after cleaning up the house following the death of their father Nazar Masih on Oct. 30.
The manager of the brick kiln where the bonded laborer brothers worked spotted pages that allegedly contained Quranic verses from Islam’s holy book in the rubbish being burned by Shama, who Shabhaz said couldn’t read, and alerted local Muslims.
After the announcement of the alleged desecration of the Quran was made over loudspeakers in neighboring villages, the couple feared for their lives and wanted to flee. But Mouhammad Youaf Gujjar, the owner of the brick kiln, instead confined them in a room in the brick kiln.
Early on the morning of Nov. 4, hundreds of Muslims came to the village in tractor trolleys and motor bikes.


Read more: Pakistani Christians Tortured and Killed on ‘False Accusation of Blasphemy’ | Daily News | NCRegister.com

[Chongo]

And in Iraq
Minority communities wonder why Iraqi government fails to protect them

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

Not if you don't want it to.

You seem to be avoiding the question.

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

What am I supposed to garner from the assertion that Muslims are killing Muslim's during their Christian killing downtime?

[Chongo]

Infidels first, then apostates.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

Infidels first, then apostates.

So? What has this lesson been about? What is the overall point I'm supposed to be taking home from all this stuff you've been posting?

[Waragainstsleep]

Nevermind.

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

Coming soon
Humanum-home

The Holy Father at Humanum
Pope: Children deserve to be raised by a mother and father - YouTube
Pope: Children deserve to be raised by a mother and father

Pope Francis kicked off an inter-religious conference to highlight that marriage is based on the complimentary roles of a man and a woman. He stressed that a decline in marriage, inevitably leads to a decline in society.

POPE FRANCIS
"This revolution in thought and morals has often flown the flag of freedom, but in fact it has brought spiritual and material devastation to countless human beings, especially the poorest and most vulnerable.”

The conference, titled 'Humanum' brings together more than 350 people, from 23 countries and 14 religions, to the Vatican. One of the underlying themes, is the right children have to grow up in a stable home, with a mother and father.

POPE FRANCIS
"Family is an anthropological fact - a socially and culturally related fact. We cannot qualify it based on ideological notions or concepts that only survive during a certain point in time, but eventually they crumble. We can't think of conservative or progressive notions. Family is a family. It can't be qualified by ideological notions. Family is per se. It is a strength per se.”

[Cap'n Tightpants]

He never said "mother and father", he said they deserve to be raised by a family.

"We can't think of conservative or progressive notions. Family is a family. It can't be qualified by ideological notions. Family is per se. It is a strength per se.”

In fact, he's saying that what a family is can't be qualified by conservative or progressive notions, a family is a family, no matter its composition. Impressive stance by His Holiness.

[Chongo]

Pope Francis did say "Mother and Father"
http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/ne...-father-56123/

“The family is the foundation of co-existence and a remedy against social fragmentation,” the Holy Father continued, stressing the importance of marriage in the raising of children.

“Children have a right to grow up in a family with a father and a mother capable of creating a suitable environment for the child's development and emotional maturity,” he said.

[Cap'n Tightpants]

Not in the video that was linked he didn't.

[Chongo]

You can read the complete text for yourself from news.va
Pope Francis: Marriage and the family are in crisis

The relevant section.

It is necessary first to promote the fundamental pillars that govern a nation: its non-material goods. The family is the foundation of co-existence and a guarantee against social fragmentation. Children have a right to grow up in a family with a father and a mother capable of creating a suitable environment for the child's development and emotional maturity. That is why I stressed in the Apostolic Exhortation Evangelii gaudium that the contribution of marriage to society is "indispensable"; that it "transcends the feelings and momentary needs of the couple" (n. 66). And that is why I am grateful to you for your Colloquium's emphasis on the benefits that marriage can provide to children, the spouses themselves, and to society.

[Cap'n Tightpants]

If they're going to lead in with the title "Children deserve to be raised by a mother and father", they need to actually show that part of the video, otherwise I'm calling shenanigans. The claim that he said "mother and father" actually runs counter to everything else he's saying in the clip.

[Chongo]

NEWS.VA is an official news site of the Vatican. The video is from Rome Reports.

[Chongo]

Here you go... You can hear The Holy Father say it himself. It's at the 6:27 mark

Pope Francis Opening Address Humanum Conference - YouTube

[Cap'n Tightpants]

That's taken entirely out of context, that was a passage about financial support (during a different speech) and not about the subject matter (composition of a family) in the other clip. I knew I was on to something here.

[Laminar]

ITT:

Everyone: This pope dude's pretty alright. I think he's great.
Chongo: QUIT IT! QUIT LIKING HIM!!

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants 

That's taken entirely out of context, that was a passage about financial support (during a different speech) and not about the subject matter (composition of a family) in the other clip. I knew I was on to something here.

The second video is the entire address at the opening of Humanaum Humanum Home | Humanum | Videos

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by Laminar 

ITT:

Everyone: This pope dude's pretty alright. I think he's great.
Chongo: QUIT IT! QUIT LIKING HIM!!

I just prefer that you not get over excited by what appears in the secular press.

From Time online:

Pope Francis: Media Gets It Wrong on Evolution and Creationism

Sorry, But Media Coverage of Pope Francis is Papal Bull
Elizabeth Dias @elizabethjdias Oct. 29, 2014
It is official: the media has gone bananas in its coverage of Pope Francis.

The OMG-Pope-Francis-Supports-Evolution story of the past two days is just the latest example. Almost every news outlet, major and minor, has plastered Pope Francis’ name across the interwebs and proclaimed he has finally planted the Catholic Church in the evolution camp of the creation-evolution debate. The only problem? Almost every outlet has got the story wrong, proving once again that the mainstream media has nearly no understanding of the Church. And that madness shows no signs of stopping.

Pope Francis’ real role in this evolution hubbub was small. He spoke, as Popes do, to the Pontifical Academy of Sciences on Monday, which had gathered to discuss “Evolving Topics of Nature,” and he affirmed what Catholic teaching has been for decades. “God is not a divine being or a magician, but the Creator who brought everything to life,” he said. “Evolution in nature is not inconsistent with the notion of creation, because evolution requires the creation of beings that evolve.”

Anyone who knows anything about Catholic history knows that a statement like this is nothing new. Pope Pius XII wrote an encyclical “Humani Generis” in 1950 affirming that there was no conflict between evolution and Catholic faith. Pope John Paul II reaffirmed that, stressing that evolution was more than a hypothesis, in 1996. Pope Benedict XVI hosted a conference on the nuances of creation and evolution in 2006. There’s an official book on the event for anyone who wants to know more. Pope Francis’ comments Monday even came as he was unveiling a new statue of Pope Benedict XVI, honoring him for his leadership.

If you want to know what the Pope really said about this or that, there is the Pope app from news.va News.va - The Pope App There is also NEWS.VA and The National Catholic Register

[Cap'n Tightpants]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

The second video is the entire address at the opening of Humanaum Humanum Home | Humanum | Videos

and they're still separate "sermons" with entirely different context. Nice try, though.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

secular press

Somehow everything is a problem

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants 

and they're still separate "sermons" with entirely different context. Nice try, though.

Even nicer try.
Go and read the entire text on the Vatican news website.

[Cap'n Tightpants]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

Even nicer try.
Go and read the entire text on the Vatican news website.

I did, your position is just spin and damage control. I get it, you spiritual leader is espousing ideas that make you uncomfortable, but instead of trying to change the message why not try to look at this from his perspective? That is, if you truly believe the man is ordained by God.

[Chongo]

First it was: "he never said mother and father" I provided the text. Then it was "it's not in the video" I provided the video of the entire address, not sermon(s), to the colloquium the theme being “The Complementarity of Man and Woman in Marriage.”

This is the entire paragraph

In these days, as you embark on a reflection on the beauty of complementarity between man and woman in marriage, I urge you to lift up yet another truth about marriage: that permanent commitment to solidarity, fidelity, and fruitful love responds to the deepest longings of the human heart. Let us bear in mind especially the young people, who represent our future. It is important that they do not give themselves over to the poisonous mentality of the temporary, but rather be revolutionaries with the courage to seek true and lasting love, going against the common pattern: this must be done. With regard to this I want to say one thing: Let us not fall into the trap of being qualified by ideological concepts. Family is an anthropological fact - a socially and culturally related fact. We cannot qualify it with concepts of an ideological nature, that are relevant only in a single moment of history, and then pass by. We can't speak today of a conservative notion of family or a progressive notion of family: Family is family! It can't be qualified by ideological notions. Family has a strength of its own [per se]

Pope Francis does not say "no matter its composition."

Pope Francis states in the previous paragraph what an anthological family is.

It is necessary first to promote the fundamental pillars that govern a nation: its non-material goods. The family is the foundation of co-existence and a guarantee against social fragmentation. Children have a right to grow up in a family with a father and a mother capable of creating a suitable environment for the child's development and emotional maturity. That is why I stressed in the Apostolic Exhortation Evangelii gaudium that the contribution of marriage to society is "indispensable"; that it "transcends the feelings and momentary needs of the couple" (n. 66). And that is why I am grateful to you for your Colloquium's emphasis on the benefits that marriage can provide to children, the spouses themselves, and to society.

[Cap'n Tightpants]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

First it was: "he never said mother and father" I provided the text. Then it was "it's not in the video" I provided the video of the entire address, not sermon(s), to the colloquium the theme being “The Complementarity of Man and Woman in Marriage.”

I said he didn't make the comment in the video you linked, and he didn't. The "theme" is someone else's spin, again, it wasn't in the video you linked, the true theme of the sermon being the importance of family.

Pope Francis does not say "no matter its composition."

Pope Francis states in the previous paragraph what an anthological family is.

I've already explained this, and no, I don't believe it's within the context you (and many within the RCC) want it to be, so they're trying to revise it to fit with their agenda. Yeah, I can tell that his position on certain things pisses you off, and frankly you deserve to be, because you're a very bigoted individual WRT homosexuals, the pope however appears not to be burdened with that problem.

[The Final Dakar]

I just figured out what WRT means

[Chongo]

The first video is the highlights. The second is the entire address. Both are from the Humanum seminar. The theme is not someone else's spin. It is the theme of the seminar. BTW Rick Warren of Saddleback is a particapnt of Humanum. He's hardly a Catholic.

BTW The New Civil Right Movement website calls Humanum "anti-gay" Their take is polar opposite to yours.
At Marriage Meeting With US Anti-Gay Leaders, Pope Decries 'Spiritual Devastation' Of New Morality - The New Civil Rights Movement

The Pope's speech, full video below, included many veiled attacks on same-sex marriage. Although he did not mention same-sex marriage specifically, his remarks were enough for Christian publications to run headlines like, "Pope Francis stands firm on marriage at Humanum Colloquium."

"We know that today marriage and the family are in crisis," the Pope told his very-willing audience. "This revolution in manners and morals has often flown the flag of freedom, but in fact it has brought spiritual and material devastation to countless human beings, especially the poorest and most vulnerable."

"We now live in a culture of the temporary, in which more and more people are simply giving up on marriage as a public commitment."

"Do not fall into the trap of being swayed by political notion. Family is an anthropological fact – a socially and culturally related fact."

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants 

..... because you're a very bigoted individual WRT homosexuals, the pope however appears not to be burdened with that problem.

I'll have to tell that to my cousin, her two nephews, and my neighbor across the street, whom I have known since I was a child. BTW she is living a chaste life and is a member of Our Lady of the Assumption Sodality and an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion.

[Cap'n Tightpants]

Family IS an anthropological fact:

".. we can not qualify it based on ideological notions, or concepts that survive during a certain point in time, but eventually they crumble. We can't think of progressive or conservative notions, family is family, it can't be qualified by ideological notions. Family is per se, it is a strength per se." - Pope Francis

Do you understand what was being said there? It seems you're having issues with the words coming out of the pontiff's mouth.

[Cap'n Tightpants]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

I'll have to tell that to my cousin, her two nephews, and my neighbor across the street, whom I have known since I was a child. BTW she is living a chaste life and is a member of Our Lady of the Assumption Sodality and an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion.

She's probably already aware that you are. Knowing gay people doesn't mean you accept them, it's like some guy from Alabama saying he doesn't have a problem with Chinese people, because he goes to their restaurants all the time.

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants 

Family IS an anthropological fact:

".. we can not qualify it based on ideological notions, or concepts that survive during a certain point in time, but eventually they crumble. We can't think of progressive or conservative notions, family is family, it can't be qualified by ideological notions. Family is per se, it is a strength per se." - Pope Francis

Do you understand what was being said there? It seems you're having issues with the words coming out of the pontiff's mouth.

[Chongo]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

I'll have to tell that to my cousin, her two nephews, and my neighbor across the street, whom I have known since I was a child. BTW she is living a chaste life and is a member of Our Lady of the Assumption Sodality and an Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion.

Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants 

She's probably already aware that you are. Knowing gay people doesn't mean you accept them, it's like some guy from Alabama saying he doesn't have a problem with Chinese people, because he goes to their restaurants all the time.

I love my cousins with all my heart and include them in my prayers and when I pray my Roasry each day. I will include you as well, as I do the other members of the MACNN community.

[Chongo]

You can add these sites as not agreeing with you.
Vatican Humanum Conference Erases LGBT People With Trite Gender Norms | ThinkProgress
#Humanum Day Two: How many ways can you dismiss gay lives? | GLAAD

[Cap'n Tightpants]

Originally Posted by Chongo 

I love my cousins with all my heart and include them in my prayers and when I pray my Roasry each day. I will include you as well, as I do the other members of the MACNN community.

You can even love someone and not accept them or who they are, many people in my family are like that. They pray for me and my marriage (which they refuse to call a marriage) instead of just accepting the choice I've made and being happy for me. It's still bigotry, no matter how they paint it.