[Sudogenic]

I'm moving to the big city (London) next month and I'm not going to be able to take my (PC) computer with me (the thing is too big and I won't have the space in the flat), so I've decided (although not 100% yet) to finally take the plunge and get a Powerbook.

However, I need something that's relliable and that will be easy for me to jump straight into (I've only used OSX very briefly before). I have one friend who owns a Powerbook, well, actually two in the last two years, and he's had no problems with his. But I've spoken to other people who have always had problems in one form or another with their Powerbooks, and have just accepted the fact that their laptop will have to be fixed every once in a while (perhaps once every one or two years).

If I buy a Powerbook, which I've wanted to do for three years, I simply cannot have it break down on me, as it will be my only computer and I work many hours on my computer every day - It will be turned on for anything from 12 to 16 hours a day, and I will be using it for work and play for 10 to 12 of those hours (every day). Can a Powerbook handle this?

Luckily, all of the apps that I use for work are available for Mac, so all that bothers me is whether the Powerbook can handle it without breaking down, because two-weeks without my computer could cripple me if it needed to be sent out to be fixed.

So what do you guys think? Do you simply accept that your laptops have to be 'serviced' every once in a while? Or can a Powerbook handle everything you throw at it without any problems?

I should point out that I baby every piece of electronics that I own - I will probably buy either the Brenthaven Professional Backpack, or the Booq BOA_XL[system] Backpack (I haven't decided yet - any suggestions?) to protect it.

Also, can any UKers tell me how long it took for your Powerbook to arrive once you ordered it from the UK Apple store? And if you bought it from somewhere else, did you get a good deal and could you still order Applecare at that store or afterwards?

Cheers.

[McFarmer]

Originally posted by Sudogenic:
Do you simply accept that your laptops have to be 'serviced' every once in a while?

Bollocks!

I've seen and worked with dozens of iBooks and PowerBooks over the years (my company uses Macs almost exclusively) and they do not need to be serviced every once in a while! Someone was pulling your leg.
Not unless you mishandle them. Just don't drop them, don't pour coffee or soda in it (you'd be surprised what users can do!) and don't use them in very dusty or sandy environments.
Most of the 'Books we have are in operation 10-15 hours a day for years with no service whatsoever. Hoover the keyboard once in a while, clean the screen and body with a soft cloth, that's it.

If ever there is a problem with a particular 'Book then you'll notice it straight away (within the first weeks of operation) and it'll get serviced. These things can happen. But once it works, it works. No ongoing service necessary.

Orders from the AppleStore ship depending on the specs you asked for. If you get the plain model with no additions then they ship the next day. If you order special add-ons (more memory, bigger HD etc.) things can take a bit extra, but not more than 5-10 days normally.

And yes, you can buy AppleCare later from any dealer or online. You can buy it as add-on until the normal warranty expires.

Cheers.

[Sudogenic]

lol! Thanks for the reply, McFarmer. And I'm glad that you're so avid about the relliability of Powerbooks - It restores some faith.

About shipping: What I actually meant was, once they've shipped, how long do they take to get to you? Are they shipped from the US or Asia, or directly from somewhere in the UK?

Cheers.

[McFarmer]

PowerBooks are assembled in Taiwan and ship from there if you request build-to-order additions. Plain models sometimes ship from local warehouses if they are in stock.

My BTO 12" PowerBook took 9 business days from the day I ordered it until it arrived on my doorstep in the UK, 13 calendar days in total. That includes building in and shipping from Taiwan.

[Sudogenic]

Thanks McFarmer.

I guess I'd better order soon then if I want one on time - Anyone else bought and taken one home from a store?

[McFarmer]

Sudogenic, if you want loads of RAM (and for some apps like Photoshop, Final Cut Pro or Virtual PC you do) then you can get a much better deal if you buy the PowerBook at a local dealer and they put their own RAM in, as they do not have to use expensive Apple RAM. Extra RAM is expensive if you get it build-to-order on the AppleStore.
You can save the most ��� if you order and install extra RAM yourself, but if so make extra sure that the RAM you order does in fact work with your PowerBook model - compare the exact part number!
Since there are so many models out there even dealers often get confused and sell you the wrong memory - and all you get is crashes and weird behaviour, and many hours lost searching for the 'problem' as you would suspect motherboard or software issues first.
Some manufacturers do a good job helping you along though, like Kingston.

The only reason to use Apple RAM would be to have less trouble with AppleCare support (if you intend to get it), because only Apple RAM would be covered by AppleCare too. They sometimes give users a harder time if they can blame an issue potentially on thirdparty RAM (which sometimes actually is to blame for problems like frequent crashes).

But that is no Apple-specific thing. The Windows world works just the same.

And one more thing:
AppleCare is generally a very good idea for PowerBooks. Especially if you intend to use it a lot every day. If you search for PowerBook and AppleCare in the forums you'll find many posts with pros/cons. I tend to strongly suggest it for notebooks as replacement parts are much more expensive.

[Sudogenic]

Thanks for the heads-up, McFarmer.

I do plan on getting 512MB ram, so that's a good point.

The question for me is whether I buy a ready-made Powerbook in Tottenham Court Road in London and save about �100, or buy it and everything else I'll need from the Apple store.

Still not sure... And I'm especially not sure about the backpack/case. It seems to order a Booq bag to be shipped to the UK will cost $80 for the shipping alone. Although perhaps Apple's delivery charges from the UK store will be cheaper, for the Brenthaven.

[McFarmer]

Sudogenic, don't know whether you saw my add-on re AppleCare to my last post... You're just too fast.

For bags, personally I prefer Boblbee hardshell backpacks. The smaller Peoples Delite fits the 12" and 15" PowerBooks, the bigger Megalopolis model fits all PowerBooks.

Because of their curvy shape at the bottom a lot of the weight sits on your hip, seriously taking off weight from your shoulders. A big bonus if you carry it around for a few hours or when biking.
Also the hardshell protects you and your PowerBook against all sorts of impacts.

And lastly due to their clever flexible sides they can expand to more than double their volume - for those occasions when you intend to pack a lot extra.

There are a couple of shops in London that have them in stock.

[WOPR]

I'd recommend a proper Mac dealer such as Jigsaw, or on the high street somewhere like John Lewis who offer excellent service and after sales care. I always buy my RAM from Crucial as it's the cheapest and best. My PB 12" was an Apple refurb and it's never let me down. I know 4 people with 15" Alu PBs and again no problems there. My last job was looking after a network of over 20 Macs, including 4 portables, and none of them had a hardware failure in the 4 years I was there.

I'm in the UK by the way.

[McFarmer]

Jigsaw is definitely a good dealer, I can second that.

And many swear by John Lewis (e.g. on Oxford Street) because they give a 2 year warranty (one year extra) at no extra cost. AppleCare is 3 years but would cost extra.
Even though it might seem odd to purchase your Mac at a general department store, it does make sense.

It is worth spending a few hours shopping around. Some dealers offer free or cheap extra printers if you buy a PowerBook.
Or the AppleStore offers a �130 reduction if you are a student and buy an iPod at the same time, the so-called 'Cram and Jam' special.
And if you intend to purchase a few things in one go, e.g. a PowerBook, a backpack and a printer, it never hurts to ask for discounts...

[Sudogenic]

McFarmer - You're right, I did miss that last part of your post - Thanks for letting me know about Applecare, I've always been planning to get that when I got a Powerbook.

Isn't John Lewis generally very expensive? With that 2 years though, I might consider forgetting about Applecare... Or would that be a mistake?

WOPR - Thanks for letting me know about Crucial RAM - I checked them out and they're prices are excellent! How much ram do you guys have in your 12" PBs and do you think it's enough for you?

[WOPR]

There's little discount to be found these days so John Lewis is as good a place as any to buy.

I just upped my Rev. A 12" from 384mb to 640mb and it's much quicker and more responsive. I've been playing Call of Duty all evening and it runs like a charm.

Bear in mind most of the printers, scanners and cameras they sometimes give away are very low spec models and hardly worth bothering with.

[McFarmer]

I've maxed my RAM out at 1.25GB and don't regret it. Virtual PC was dog-slow when starting up and quitting on my Titanium PowerBook (saving the RAM contents). But now on my 12" PB it is fairly responsive and a lot faster when starting up (somewhere in the range of 500% faster!). It's the RAM I was told. (The TiBook had 512MB of RAM, so it's the RAM beyond that which makes the difference.)

OS X just loves RAM. You might not need it today, but if you use certain apps like Photoshop, Final Cut Pro and Virtual PC then the more RAM the merrier.

I know RAM is expensive, especially that 1GB module, but it does seem to make life so much easier. I'd say 512MB to 640MB is the minimum for a decent OS X machine.

Both Crucial and Kingston seem to be great RAM manufacturers.

Originally posted by WOPR:
Bear in mind most of the printers, scanners and cameras they sometimes give away are very low spec models and hardly worth bothering with.

Totally agree. But if the printer was a freebie you can still just use the one cartridge it comes with and then toss the whole thing in the bin - saved you some money nevertheless. And you gain experience with this type of printer and the drivers from that manufacturer. You might then think this was a great experience or opt to buy a printer from another manufacturer, or even go with a different printer technology (e.g. laser instead of inkjet).

[McFarmer]

Regarding AppleCare:

That really is a tough one. As I said, please read the former posts in these forums, all the pros and cons before you make up your mind.

My personal experience is that if you use your PowerBook very heavily (somewhere in the range of 10+ hours a day for 365 days a year) then problems, if any, are likely to occur towards the end of the 3rd year. If you have AppleCare, then you're covered. If not then you are better off buying a new PowerBook as the parts at that point are fairly expensive.
It's things like the screen hinges that might break from constant open/closing of the screen after 3 years. With AppleCare they get replaced. Without you would likely have to replace the whole screen, which is about 1/3 to 1/2 the price of a new PowerBook. Not worth it at that point.

Personally, I'm not sure it's worth extending the warranty to 2 years as IMHO most problems will either occur in the first few weeks or the 3rd year. But it all depends how you intend to use your PowerBook. Some run web servers 24/7 on PowerBooks. In that case a 2 year warranty, as offered by John Lewis, might be a bonus. Or if you travel a lot, physical stress on the 'Book might be heavier and problems might occur during the first 2 years already.

But be reminded that the AppleCare warranty for PowerBooks is worldwide, so even if you're in the US e.g. for a quick visit and your 'Book breaks down, you're covered and can have it repaired at any Apple Store in the US.
In contrast John Lewis' extra 2 year warranty would not cover that. You'd have to bring it in to John Lewis in the UK.

A decision so depends on your intended use of the PowerBook.

Yet another one more thing (blimey, I should get that patented... ):
There is one added bonus of having AppleCare, though: sad to say, but you do get preferred treatment at the Apple repair centre. Here's a real story:
Once we got a new PowerBook which had a faulty keyboard. Broken from the day we got it. These things happen, they'll get replaced on warranty, so no big deal. We contacted a repair centre and they said 'Well, on normal warranty we'll just mail it in to Apple and they'll replace it - that'll be about 3-4 weeks'. Yikes! Quite a bummer if you need your PowerBook to do your daily work!
Then we mentioned that it is protected by AppleCare. Their attitude changed in a second: 'Oh, that's something different then. In that case we'll just order the replacement keyboard for you, call you when it's here and then just bring the PowerBook in and we'll swap the keyboard while you wait'.

Makes you wonder about the value of 'normal' warranty...

[Parky]

Originally posted by Sudogenic:
Isn't John Lewis generally very expensive? With that 2 years though, I might consider forgetting about Applecare... Or would that be a mistake?

John Lewis will price match any price you can find as long as it is available at a retail outlet (i.e. not mail order)

So if you see it cheaper in another store tell John Lewis and they will match it, they will check, but always match the price.

Ian

[WOPR]

Parky, I notice you have the same PowerBook as me. Do you suffer the problem of it not being able to find the wireless network when it wakes from sleep sometimes? Driving me nuts.

[Parky]

Originally posted by WOPR:
Parky, I notice you have the same PowerBook as me. Do you suffer the problem of it not being able to find the wireless network when it wakes from sleep sometimes? Driving me nuts.

No I don't have that problem at all, or I have not seen it so far.

I have an Airport Express network at home and I use both my iMac and PowerBook on it with no issues.

I have to say that I rarely put the PB to sleep, I usually shut it down as it is not used as much as the iMac.

Ian

[WOPR]

OK thanks anyway. I have to restart my wireless box and have always blamed that, yet others seem to have the same problem with the 12" PB.

[Parky]

I put my iMac to sleep every night and it always wakes up and immediatley picks up the Airport Network.

Sorry I can't help, I will give my PB a few tries with putting it to sleep, see what happens.

Ian

[McFarmer]

Originally posted by WOPR:
Parky, I notice you have the same PowerBook as me. Do you suffer the problem of it not being able to find the wireless network when it wakes from sleep sometimes? Driving me nuts.

Have you searched in the forums (this and others)? This issue has been beaten to death! There are so many good tips on how to solve this, I'm surprised anyone still has that problem...

For one go into System Preferences -> Network and drag 'AirPort' all the way up to be the first item in the list. That sorts it for most people. Hope it helps you too.

[milkmanchris]

Hi

Just to follow and keep the thread going really.

I ordered mine via The Apple Store online, bog standard apart from the larger HD. Ordered Friday, recieved the following Thursday, good to be able to track it all the way on TNT though.

Applecare, not sure if I will or wont take it out, the PB is covered on the house contents, so if anything major went wrong I guess I would knock it off the desk and make a claim through them for a new one (or is that naughty).

And finally, I use a belkin router and just this last week I have had the problem of the network not been found when the PB is brought back from sleep, Belkin's TS is useless so i have been using this forum as well as the support centre on Apple for help. Still trying, will post back if i get a decent result.

Welcome to the club.

C

[Parky]

Originally posted by milkmanchris:
Applecare, not sure if I will or wont take it out, the PB is covered on the house contents, so if anything major went wrong I guess I would knock it off the desk and make a claim through them for a new one (or is that naughty).

Yes it's naughty and it's why you and the rest of us have ever increasing Insurance premiums.

Why don't you do the 'honest' thing and buy AppleCare rather than rip everyone else off.

Ian

[milkmanchris]

Originally posted by Parky:
Yes it's naughty and it's why you and the rest of us have ever increasing Insurance premiums.

Why don't you do the 'honest' thing and buy AppleCare rather than rip everyone else off.

Ian

Whats insurance for if not the knocks and spills of everyday life.

I thought the liberals who took away capital punishment were the cause of ever increasing premiums.

[Parky]

Deliberate Insurance Fraud is my point, which is what you suggested.

Not the accidental knocks and spills of everyday life.

Insurance Fraud is the single biggest cause of the spiralling cost of all types of insurance (Car, House and Property)

Ian

[milkmanchris]

The amount I have paid in insurance, over the years and never had a claim, I believe I am due some.

I got friends here in york who's premiums have gone up 500% in a year.

Thats got nothing to do with fraud, its the insurance companies who hate paying out.

And where do apple get off on charging 33% of the goods value in an insurance policy, if your car insurance was worked out the same there would be outrage.

[WOPR]

Originally posted by McFarmer:
Have you searched in the forums (this and others)? This issue has been beaten to death! There are so many good tips on how to solve this, I'm surprised anyone still has that problem...

For one go into System Preferences -> Network and drag 'AirPort' all the way up to be the first item in the list. That sorts it for most people. Hope it helps you too.

I've seen and tried loads of things but not that, so I'll give it a whirl.

[Sudogenic]

Thanks for the replies everyone.

Just a couple more questions:

Can anyone recommend stores with good Apple discounts?

And also, is it worth asking Apple for discounts/deals when ordering on the phone? Has anyone ever recieved a good deal/discount via Apple?

Cheers.

[McFarmer]

It's certainly worth asking Apple on the phone when ordering stuff.
A friend of mine just out of curiosity asked to get a 5% discount when phoning the Apple store and was surprised to have the other end say 'yes' straight away. Definitely worth asking.

People in the US found another way of getting a discount: You place your big order on the AppleStore online, go to the checkout and everything, enter your data etc. but stop short of actually ordering it.
What seems to happen is that this 'almost order' gets picked up by someone and they then call the person who placed the order (in case you left your proper phone number) and ask if you're still interested or whether there was a problem during your order. If at that point you say 'well, yes, but it's a bit too expensive for me' people were offered discounts up to 10% in order to place the order.
Don't know if this works in the UK too though...

It all depends what you intend to get. iBooks have a very narrow dealer margin. Something like 5%. So do not expect a discount larger than 2-3% if that, as the dealers wants to earn something too.
PowerBooks on the other hand have a much larger margin. 5-10% is doable as a discount. But not necessarily from dealers, perhaps only from Apple.