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The behavior of the police in NYC with all the back turning, slander, etc.
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besson3c
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Jan 9, 2015, 02:05 PM
 
You're welcome...
     
The Final Dakar
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Jan 9, 2015, 02:52 PM
 
You have too much time on your hands.

Also stop being lazy and at least quote the relevant post.
     
OAW
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Jan 9, 2015, 04:05 PM
 
Let's be clear about what this is all about ....

1. Mike Brown is killed in Ferguson and Eric Garner is killed in NYC. Both were unarmed.

2. A STL County grand jury fails to indict Officer Darren Wilson. This decision was controversial and there was a predictable split along racial lines.

3. A Staten Island grand jury fails to indict Officer Daniel Pantaleo. This decision was was also controversial because it was met with a collective WTF? given the video evidence. No significant split along racial lines.

4. Protests erupt across the nation. "Black Lives Matter" and "I Can't Breath" and "Hands Up! Don't Shoot!" are the themes.

5. In response to the Eric Garner decision and the protests in NYC Mayor De Blasio makes these statements.

Originally Posted by Mayor Bill de Blasio
This is profoundly personal to me. I was at the White House the other day, and the president of the United States turned to me, and he met Dante a few months ago, and he said that Dante reminded him of what he looked like as a teenager. And he said I know you see this crisis through a very personal lens. And I said to him, I did.

Because Chirlane and I have had to talk to Dante for years about the dangers that he may face. A good young man, law-abiding young man who would never think to do anything wrong. And yet, because of a history that still hangs over us, the dangers he may face, we've had to literally train him—as families have all over this city for decades—in how to take special care in any encounter he has with the police officers who are there to protect him.

And that painful sense of contradiction that our young people see first, that our police are here to protect us, and we honor that, and at the same time, there's a history we have to overcome, because for so many of our young people, there's a fear. And for so many of our families, there's a fear.


So I've had to worry over the years. Chirlane's had to worry. Is Dante safe each night? There are so many families in this city who feel that each and every night. Is my child safe? And not just from some of the painful realities—crime and violence in some of our neighborhoods—but is safe from the very people they want to have faith in as their protectors.

That's the reality.
Originally Posted by Mayor Bill de Blasio
It conforms to something bigger that you've heard come out in the protests in Ferguson and all over the country. This is now a national moment of grief, a national moment of pain and searching for a solution. And you've heard in so many places, people of all backgrounds utter the same basic phrase. They've said "Black lives matter." And they said it because it had to be said. It's a phrase that should never have to be said. It should be self-evident. But our history, sadly, requires us to say that black lives matter.
6. Ismaaiyl Abdullah Brinsley, a mentally ill man with NO ties to the protestors and estranged from family and friends, shoots and seriously wounds his ex-girlfriend Shaneka Nicole Thompson in Baltimore, MD. Ironically, she had talked him out of previous suicide attempts. He leaves social media posts threatening to kill police officers. He then boards a bus and heads to NYC where he is from. On the way he calls the mother of his ex-girlfriend to apologize for shooting her and inquire about her condition. The mother alerts the authorities. He then arrives in NYC and proceeds to murder Officers Rafael Ramos and Wenjian Liu in cold blood. He flees onto the subway with other officers in pursuit where he then committed suicide.

7. Mayor De Blasio goes to the hospital where the officers were taken in the aftermath of the shooting and several NYPD officers turn their backs on him.

8. The president of the NY Patrolman's Benevolent Association then had this to say in response to Mayor De Blasio's earlier comments ...

Originally Posted by Patrick J. Lynch
There's blood on many hands tonight. Those that incited violence on the street in the guise of protest, that tried to tear down what New York City police officers did every day. We tried to warn it must not go on, it shouldn't be tolerated. That blood on the hands starts at the steps of City Hall in the office of the mayor.
Originally Posted by Patrick J. Lynch
What police officers felt yesterday after that press conference is that they were thrown under the bus. That they were out there doing a difficult job in the middle of the night, protecting the rights of those to protest, protecting our sons and daughters and the mayor was behind microphones like this throwing them under the bus.”
Originally Posted by Patrick J. Lynch
He spoke about, ‘we have to teach our children that their interaction with the police and that they should be afraid of New York City police officers.’ That’s not true. We have to teach our children, our sons and our daughters, no matter what they look like, to respect New York City police officers, teach them to comply with New York City police officers even if they think it’s unjust.
Regarding that last statement, that's NOT what Mayor De Blasio said. And it's notable that he had nothing whatsoever to say about the shooting of Ms. Thompson.

9. Mayor de Blasio defends his earlier comments during an ABC News interview with George Stephanopoulos with this ...

PATRICK LYNCH, PRESIDENT, PATROLMEN'S BENEVOLENT ASSOCIATION: What we need is a mayor to stand up with and for us, as well. What police officers felt yesterday after that press conference is that they were thrown under the bus.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STEPHANOPOULOS: Throw the police under the bus?

DE BLASIO: No, of course not. I have immense respect for the men and women who protect us. In fact, what we're trying to do is make everyone safer in this equation. We're trying to protect all of our communities and protect the people who do this important work.

To do that, we have to draw on police and community together. And you can't achieve that if you're not having a real conversation about what's happening.

Of course people respond when they see a tragedy like this. They see it through their own eyes, through their own prism of their family. And we can't deny that and act out that isn't the reality and we're seeing it...

STEPHANOPOULOS: (INAUDIBLE) your son is at risk from your own police department?

DE BLASIO: Look, I want to say it the right way, because I think there was so much misunderstanding here. What parents have done for decades who have children of color, especially young men of color, is train them to be very careful when they have a connection with a police officer, when they have an encounter with a police officer.

It's different for a white child. That's just the reality in this country. And with Dante, very early on with my son, we said, look, if a police officer stops you, do everything he tells you to do, don't move suddenly, don't reach for your cell phone, because we knew, sadly, there's a greater chance it might be misinterpreted if it was a young man of color.


What we're striving for is a day when every child can be told equally, not only are the police there to protect you, but they're going to assume that the young person is an innocent, law-abiding young person. That just is not always the reality today. And it's something we have to overcome so we can actually draw police and community closer together.

But, look, I -- in terms of response, I'm just saying what people are actually experiencing and have been for decades. I've talked to a lot of families of color, well before this time, because I've said things like this before. And they've said to me over and over and over again that they appreciate someone finally acknowledging that they have that conversation with their sons. It's a painful conversation. You can sense there's a contradiction in that conversation.

We all want to look up to figures of authority. And everyone knows the police protect us.

But there's that fear that there could be that one moment of misunderstanding with a young man of color and that young man may never come back.


STEPHANOPOULOS: But how do you...

DE BLASIO: And that's what parents are so worried about.
10. Members of the NYPD then turned their backs on Mayor De Blasio at the funerals of both the slain officers and have been engaging in an unofficial "work slow down". All in the back drop of police union contract negotiations with the city.

OAW
( Last edited by OAW; Jan 9, 2015 at 09:50 PM. )
     
OAW
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Jan 9, 2015, 04:21 PM
 
^^^^

With that being said, my view is that the "Everyone must support the police ... right or wrong" attitude exhibited by Mr. Lynch is a fundamental part of the problem that has led to the ongoing tensions between the NYPD and the black and Latino communities in NYC.

OAW
     
lpkmckenna
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Jan 9, 2015, 09:17 PM
 
A blatant display of disrespect to your boss is a firing offence in every workforce. Except policing, apparently.

(I'm in the army. If I did this, I'd be in jail.)
     
reader50
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Jan 9, 2015, 09:39 PM
 
Congrats to OAW for providing the info the OP didn't. Made things much clearer.

Pulling this nonsense during contract negotiations may have the opposite effect. They may not get the contract they're looking for.
     
OreoCookie
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Jan 10, 2015, 12:31 AM
 
Originally Posted by lpkmckenna View Post
(I'm in the army. If I did this, I'd be in jail.)
Who's gonna arrest them?
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The Final Dakar
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Jan 12, 2015, 10:25 AM
 
Well, the commish is telling them to start actually working again. I'm sure they will find a way to make him regret it.
     
osiris
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Jan 12, 2015, 10:26 AM
 
crap, I was enjoying a level of freedom not seen in years.
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OAW
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Jan 12, 2015, 02:27 PM
 
Originally Posted by osiris View Post
crap, I was enjoying a level of freedom not seen in years.
It would appear that NYC is feeling a bit of a revenue squeeze ....

It’s a slowdown showdown.

At precincts across the city, top brass are cracking the whip on summons activity and even barring many cops from taking vacation and sick days, The Post has learned.

Throughout the city, precincts are being ordered to hand up to borough commanders “activity sheets” indicating the number of arrests and summonses per shift, sources told The Post.

“Police officers around the city are now threatened with transfers, no vacation time and sick time unless they write summonses,” one union source said.

“This is the same practice that caused officers to be labeled racist and abusers of power.”


In at least one precinct, the brass backlash — which comes in the wake of Police Commissioner Bill Bratton ordering cops back on the job after The Post reported a 90 percent drop in ticket writing — is downright ­draconian.

“Everyone here is under orders — no time off” during the summons catch-up blitz, said one cop at the 105th Precinct in Queens.

“And the majority of [new] summonses written aren’t protecting the public in any way.

“But now they’re realizing how much revenue the city is losing and they’re enforcing their will upon us,” he said.
Bratton’s back-to-work edict was still ringing in commanding officers’ ears when the crackdown hit cops on the Thursday/Friday overnight shift at the 105th bordering Nassau County, the officer said.


The lieutenant ordered sector cars from throughout the precinct to converge at Springfield Boulevard and Jamaica Avenue for a driver checkpoint, the officer said.

No one was to return to the precinct or even take a meal break until two summonses were logged, the officer said.

“To have all the manpower utilized for the sole purpose of writing summonses is a very dangerous way to utilize manpower,” he said. “This is not what we’re out here for.”


Back at the station house, memos (above) were posted alerting cops that no new days off would be approved beyond already approved vacation days. And there were to be no sick days without a doctor’s note.
NYPD cops told no vacations until work slowdown ends | New York Post

OAW
     
The Final Dakar
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Jan 12, 2015, 02:31 PM
 
Probably. It's arguable the way they're calling for the stoppage to end is equally bullshit. It's pretty much quotas.

That said, one must consider who the source is here: Union officials and officers – likely the same people who turned their back on De Blasio and slag on Bratton. I do wonder how much they've distorted the truth here.
     
osiris
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Jan 12, 2015, 02:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
Probably. It's arguable the way they're calling for the stoppage to end is equally bullshit. It's pretty much quotas.

That said, one must consider who the source is here: Union officials and officers – likely the same people who turned their back on De Blasio and slag on Bratton. I do wonder how much they've distorted the truth here.
The Police Union is a curious animal - policed and staffed by their own to protect the rights of police. I'm sure they take a few liberties with reality every now and then, but because 9/11 happened, we can't question them.
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The Final Dakar
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Jan 12, 2015, 02:53 PM
 
The most galling impression I get from them is they think they should be entrusted to police themselves. I'd laugh if it weren't so sad.
     
osiris
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Jan 12, 2015, 02:58 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
The most galling impression I get from them is they think they should be entrusted to police themselves. I'd laugh if it weren't so sad.
Yep, that's something they don't understand - sure, there are a lot of great cops out there (I know many), but they have little to no oversight internally, and once something bad goes public they don't know how to handle it. Thus the stupid offended thug mentality. It's weird...
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OAW
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Jan 15, 2015, 04:26 PM
 
Seventy-seven percent of voters said Lynch's assertion that the mayor's office had "blood on its hands" after the execution of two police officers in Brooklyn last month was "too extreme."

In addition, 69 percent of those questioned disapproved of police turning their backs on the mayor at the officers' funerals, part of an anti-de Blasio police movement spearheaded by Lynch.


Only 18 percent of New Yorkers have a "favorable" impression of Lynch, the poll found, and 43 percent of voters think he's a "mostly negative" force in New York City.
Poll: Sharpton and Lynch equally unpopular | Capital New York

OAW
     
The Final Dakar
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Jan 15, 2015, 04:28 PM
 
I don't think I've heard anyone here support the back turning, but good know NYC is fairly united on this issue.
     
The Final Dakar
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Jan 15, 2015, 04:31 PM
 
Hmm.. they hand out the blame on racial lines...
Relations between Mayor de Blasio and the police are "generally bad," voters say 77 - 15 percent. Of those who say "bad," 45 percent of voters say de Blasio is to blame, while 43 percent blame police. White voters blame de Blasio 61 - 30 percent and black voters blame police 69 - 16 percent. Hispanic voters are divided with 45 percent blaming the mayor and 42 percent blaming police.
     
OAW
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Jan 15, 2015, 04:33 PM
 
^^^

Not surprising.

OAW
     
The Final Dakar
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Feb 6, 2015, 02:18 PM
 
Well, Bratton lost my respect.
Bratton: Raising Resisting Arrest to a Felony Would Be ‘Very Helpful’ | Observer
NYPD Commissioner Bill Bratton today called for the state to change resisting arrest to a felony charge.
“We need to get around this idea that you can resist arrest. You can’t. You just can’t do it. It results in potential injuries to the officer, to the suspect. And we need to change that, and the way to change that is to start penalties for it,” he said.

He acknowledged that many cases may not be legitimate—advocates complain that resisting arrest is often the only charge against someone who was not resisting arrest for something else and that it’s often tossed out. Mr. Bratton said the department would expand its CompStat tracking program to monitor how many such charges are vacated.
Tell you what Bill, you stamp out those illegitimate cases and then we'll consider your suggestion.
     
reader50
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Feb 6, 2015, 02:29 PM
 
I can't see using Resisting Arrest by itself. You have to have done something else to warrant an arrest, which you then resist. Being arrested for resisting arrest is circular logic, an ex post facto punishment, and lowers respect for law enforcement.
     
The Final Dakar
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Feb 6, 2015, 02:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by reader50 View Post
Being arrested for resisting arrest is circular logic, an ex post facto punishment, and lowers respect for law enforcement.
That's how bad law enforcement has gotten. It's not a stretch to think they're tacking it on inappropriately. I think in a another thread a lawyer commented that often times they'll add the charge to back-justify any physical force they inflicted on the person arrested.

Edit: Here's a thought – what would happen if you could only be charged with resisting arrest based on body-cam evidence. Shit'd get real interesting, right? (I realize its an untenable position)
     
BadKosh
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Feb 6, 2015, 02:44 PM
 
Knee jerk procedures and "No tolerance" policies in gov't are getting out of hand. The schools suspending kids for "gun shaped" cookies etc, to the police shooting first and thinking after are both part of why our political/governments are broken. Where is accountability and responsibility with those who come up with these idiotic policies in the first place? Perhaps WE ALL need to be a lot more heavy handed towards our idiot politicians and public officials? We only get the government we deserve.
     
Snow-i
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Feb 6, 2015, 02:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
Well, Bratton lost my respect.
Bratton: Raising Resisting Arrest to a Felony Would Be ‘Very Helpful’ | Observer



Tell you what Bill, you stamp out those illegitimate cases and then we'll consider your suggestion.

The attitude shift among police to me is appalling.

They are supposed to take every imaginable effort to ensure that innocent people don't go to jail/become harmed by the police, and somewhere along the way we've moved from that.

Instead, their attitude seems to be "throw em all in jail and let the courts sort it out". As such, you have police that are unwilling to compromise or relate to life as an ordinary citizen. They believe that in order to enforce the law you must be above it, which I find to be utterly dystopian.

IA needs to be expanded to include plainclothes officers with jurisdiction ONLY over the police they are policing, and IA needs to be separated from the police chain of command.

I advocate using the Sheriff position as the "police of the police" as the sheriff is an elected position and has a chain of command out of the reach of the local PD.
     
The Final Dakar
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Feb 6, 2015, 02:46 PM
 
It occurs to me he may be trying to pander to his officers with this suggestion (After the funeral fallout), but either way, scumbag move
     
The Final Dakar
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Feb 6, 2015, 02:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by BadKosh View Post
Knee jerk procedures and "No tolerance" policies in gov't are getting out of hand. The schools suspending kids for "gun shaped" cookies etc,
Some kid in Texas got suspended for threatening to use the "One Ring to Rule Them All" on his classmate. No joke.

Originally Posted by Snow-i View Post
I advocate using the Sheriff position as the "police of the police" as the sheriff is an elected position and has a chain of command out of the reach of the local PD.
Sounds promising
     
OreoCookie
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Feb 6, 2015, 05:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by Snow-i View Post

The attitude shift among police to me is appalling.
Agreed, especially since this is a charge which can be easily construed even if the other person was not resisting arrest. You could kill the lives and careers of many regular, innocent people this way by giving them a felony conviction for being suspected of a crime and then »resisting« arrest.
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OAW
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Feb 6, 2015, 06:32 PM
 
Absolutely, 110% agreed! "Resisting Arrest" as a felony?

OAW
     
   
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