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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Desktops > Dual Powermac 2 GHz PPC G5 vs. Core 2 Duo Mac Mini

Dual Powermac 2 GHz PPC G5 vs. Core 2 Duo Mac Mini
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Apple Pro Underwear
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Jun 14, 2010, 09:59 PM
 
Hi everybody,

So I moved into a larger apartment and want wifi for all my Apple devices and also want to finally upgrade to the new OSX from Tiger on my Dual PPC 2GHz machine. For those of you who are not on Tiger - Apple makes nothing that works on them anymore... including keyboards and mice. It Sucks.

My career and the industry has changed a bit since 2005, performance is not so much an issue (the performance of this 5 yr old machine for instance is fantastic for what I do). For my career, I spend equal if more time with text-editors more than design apps but even a slow computer can handle a text editor and Photoshop together these days.

Anyway - I don't really see why I need a PowerPC anymore. I have a 3 yr old Intel Macbook that's super fast already so I don't see the value of it these days. If I get a high-end Mac Mini, it will save space, give me comparable performance to what I have now and be much much cheaper.

So am I thinking the wrong way or is my reasoning legit? I would have never thought of myself as a mac mini person but damn if I'm going to pay 3 grand for another behemoth.

Is the performance of a 2005 dual Powermac similar to a recent Mac Mini?

P.S. Also, It should power a 30 inch Apple Cinema display screen circa 2005.
( Last edited by Apple Pro Underwear; Jun 14, 2010 at 10:04 PM. Reason: Added a Question...)
     
reader50
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Jun 14, 2010, 10:30 PM
 
If you already have a working PowerMac, you'd need a reason to buy a new computer. Like if you needed the space, or needed a faster computer.

If you upgrade the OS, one of the things you will want is a Time Machine backup volume. The PowerMac will have a spare drive bay. The mini comes with a 2.5" internal HD, which might be slower than the OEM HD in the PowerMac. So you'd need to add an external drive to the mini. Possibly two, if the boot drive needs to be fast.

Normally, comparing a new computer to a 5-yr old machine is a no brainer. But the Mini has significant limitations, and you are comparing it to a Mac with maximum internal expansion. It really depends on what you need to do with it, and how much money you want to spend.
     
Apple Pro Underwear  (op)
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Jun 14, 2010, 11:32 PM
 
Thanks for the reply, let me clarify:

1. I need to upgrade to Snow Leopard because software doesn't run on Tiger anymore. (Snow Leopard can't be installed on a PPC Mac). Airport extreme for instance doesn't install.

2. Is the hard drive as fast as a MacBook pro? If so, that works for me.

3. External hard drives don't bother me. I have never added another drive to my current powermac. I find it nice to move things off a central computer. I use a MacBook pro as well.

4. Main apps I use: Coda, Transmit, Browsers, Textmate. I use Photoshop and illustrator but only in the design phase of a web project and mostly dealing with web sized images with 10 layers or less. To say I live in Adobe apps anymore would be untrue.
     
P
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Jun 15, 2010, 05:09 AM
 
Originally Posted by Apple Pro Underwear View Post
2. Is the hard drive as fast as a MacBook pro? If so, that works for me.
It's the same speed as the default HD in the low-end MBP. Higher-end models use a faster drive. You can upgrade the HD in the mini yourself, however (e.g. with something like the Seagate Momentus XT, an SSD/HD hybrid drive which should be faster than the PM on the stuff you do).

Originally Posted by Apple Pro Underwear View Post
4. Main apps I use: Coda, Transmit, Browsers, Textmate. I use Photoshop and illustrator but only in the design phase of a web project and mostly dealing with web sized images with 10 layers or less. To say I live in Adobe apps anymore would be untrue.
Unless you have a brand new 30" display that you love, or hate all-in-ones, I would recommend a low-end iMac instead. It has a full 3.5" HD instead of the laptop 2.5", the new displays are gorgeous (it's IPS on the low-end as well now), it can take more RAM and is easier to upgrade, and that's before we even get started on the CPU.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
Apple Pro Underwear  (op)
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Jun 15, 2010, 12:38 PM
 
Originally Posted by P View Post
It's the same speed as the default HD in the low-end MBP. Higher-end models use a faster drive. You can upgrade the HD in the mini yourself, however (e.g. with something like the Seagate Momentus XT, an SSD/HD hybrid drive which should be faster than the PM on the stuff you do).
Ok, I'm starting to see where you guys are going with the HD. While a fast 3.5 HD would be nifty, I think for my playing inside Coda and TextMate and with 2 Gigs of memory, it will STILL suffice. I mean, my entire project folder will not be the side of the RAM.

NOTE: I think Apple just updated the Mac Minis btw:
Mac mini - Buy Mac mini desktop computers - Apple Store (U.S.)

Last night they had 2 options but now they have one with a higher processor than the low-end one.

Unless you have a brand new 30" display that you love, or hate all-in-ones, I would recommend a low-end iMac instead. It has a full 3.5" HD instead of the laptop 2.5", the new displays are gorgeous (it's IPS on the low-end as well now), it can take more RAM and is easier to upgrade, and that's before we even get started on the CPU.
Unfortunately... or fortunately, I have a pretty awesome 30" cinema display I bought with the Powermac in 2005. I don't want to get another monitor although the glass on the new monitors do make them very tempting.

Here is something that might convince me to go iMac - Can I add a second screen (circa 2005 30" Cinema Display) via the mini display port?

Not like I need more screen space but if it adds to the positive, I won't turn it down.


Thanks for the help!
     
Apple Pro Underwear  (op)
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Jun 15, 2010, 12:53 PM
 
I figured out that I just need to get a cable to connect the 30" display to a mini display port with this:
Mini DisplayPort to Dual-Link DVI Adapter - Apple Store (U.S.)

Here's the link to the new Mac Minis:
Apple's Unibody Mac Mini
     
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Jun 15, 2010, 01:17 PM
 
Originally Posted by Apple Pro Underwear View Post
Ok, I'm starting to see where you guys are going with the HD. While a fast 3.5 HD would be nifty, I think for my playing inside Coda and TextMate and with 2 Gigs of memory, it will STILL suffice. I mean, my entire project folder will not be the side of the RAM.
Oh, it will certainly suffice - the question is what is the best value for money. The fact that the internal drive can be so much bigger as well as faster is another bonus.

Originally Posted by Apple Pro Underwear View Post
NOTE: I think Apple just updated the Mac Minis btw:
Mac mini - Buy Mac mini desktop computers - Apple Store (U.S.)

Last night they had 2 options but now they have one with a higher processor than the low-end one.
They did, and they must have done it while I was writing my post, because I checked rpm on those HDs and after the post the specs were updated...

This does actualy complicate things in one sense, because the mini now has a better GPU (320M) than the lowest-end iMac (9400M), implying that the iMac is about due for an update as well.

Originally Posted by Apple Pro Underwear View Post
Unfortunately... or fortunately, I have a pretty awesome 30" cinema display I bought with the Powermac in 2005. I don't want to get another monitor although the glass on the new monitors do make them very tempting.

Here is something that might convince me to go iMac - Can I add a second screen (circa 2005 30" Cinema Display) via the mini display port?

Not like I need more screen space but if it adds to the positive, I won't turn it down.
Yes, you can add a second display, and when you do, you will wonder why the iMac is so much brighter than your expensive 30" display. The backlight wears, more so with CCFL, so a new display will be much brighter.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
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Jun 15, 2010, 07:55 PM
 
The only area in which a PMG5 will outperform a new Mac Mini is HDD size/speed/price, and even then it could be a marginal case.

Can you survive on Leopard for now? You might be fine just buying the OS upgrade, depending on RAM and PPC compatibility for the software you want to use. What software do you want to run?
     
Apple Pro Underwear  (op)
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Jun 15, 2010, 10:19 PM
 
Originally Posted by Tuoder View Post
The only area in which a PMG5 will outperform a new Mac Mini is HDD size/speed/price, and even then it could be a marginal case.

Can you survive on Leopard for now? You might be fine just buying the OS upgrade, depending on RAM and PPC compatibility for the software you want to use. What software do you want to run?
Snow Leopard won't run on a PPC machine. I don't even know where to get Leopard... if that will even work. (If Leopard was the bridge to getting my Powermac workable with the Airport Extreme Base Station - all of my problems would be solved).

The software I want to run that doesn't work on 10.4 Tiger is Airport Extreme, CSSEdit, Adobe C5 apps

Thanks for your input!
     
Tuoder
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Jun 15, 2010, 11:26 PM
 
Originally Posted by Apple Pro Underwear View Post
Snow Leopard won't run on a PPC machine. I don't even know where to get Leopard... if that will even work. (If Leopard was the bridge to getting my Powermac workable with the Airport Extreme Base Station - all of my problems would be solved).

The software I want to run that doesn't work on 10.4 Tiger is Airport Extreme, CSSEdit, Adobe C5 apps

Thanks for your input!
The newest AEBS requires 10.5.7. The oldest PMG5 supports up to 10.5.8. CSSEdit requires 10.4. CS5 requires an Intel machine. CS4 does not, except for an app or two.

You can legitimately purchase Leopard second-hand on eBay or Craigslist.
     
Apple Pro Underwear  (op)
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Jun 16, 2010, 12:23 AM
 
Originally Posted by Tuoder View Post
The newest AEBS requires 10.5.7. The oldest PMG5 supports up to 10.5.8. CSSEdit requires 10.4. CS5 requires an Intel machine. CS4 does not, except for an app or two.

You can legitimately purchase Leopard second-hand on eBay or Craigslist.
This might work. Do you know if Software Update will still continue to upgrade whatever old version of 10.5 I get to version 10.5.8?

     
macaddict0001
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Jun 16, 2010, 12:38 AM
 
Yeah it will.
     
reader50
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Jun 16, 2010, 01:46 AM
 
Software Update continues to work for Mac OS 9. To date, Apple has not turned off SU services for any OS version.
     
Apple Pro Underwear  (op)
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Jun 16, 2010, 01:20 PM
 
I've never ran a router/Airport base station before.

Do you need to keep your mac on at all times along with the base station or is the base station stand-alone after you configure it with the mac? Furthermore, does it need to be tethered to a computer at all times after configuring it?

Because with this logic, I can install the base station using my laptop.
     
Tuoder
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Jun 16, 2010, 05:08 PM
 
Originally Posted by Apple Pro Underwear View Post
I've never ran a router/Airport base station before.

Do you need to keep your mac on at all times along with the base station or is the base station stand-alone after you configure it with the mac? Furthermore, does it need to be tethered to a computer at all times after configuring it?

Because with this logic, I can install the base station using my laptop.
The AEBS stands alone. The software is only configures it and saves the configuration to the device. It need not be connected to any particular computer at any time.
     
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Jun 16, 2010, 05:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by Apple Pro Underwear View Post
I've never ran a router/Airport base station before.
Wow, did they finally just get broadband where you live? Heck, I was using a router before I got a high speed connection because the router provided a more consistent dial-up modem experience. That was probably more than 12 years ago.

I thought you were a techie like most of us, APU.

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
Apple Pro Underwear  (op)
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Jun 16, 2010, 06:04 PM
 
Originally Posted by Big Mac View Post
Wow, did they finally just get broadband where you live? Heck, I was using a router before I got a high speed connection because the router provided a more consistent dial-up modem experience. That was probably more than 12 years ago.

I thought you were a techie like most of us, APU.
I know, it's quite sad and I mean it but either the apartment buildings I lived in NYC already came with wireless or a room mate supplied it for me. Out here in CA, my studio apt was so small that it didn't require me to move and I just manually managed my devices because I said to myself for 3 years that I was moving "any day now",

     
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Jul 6, 2010, 03:05 PM
 
If you want a speed comparison, a 1st gen MacBook Air is notably quicker than a dual core 1.8, last-of-line G5 tower for most tasks. Current Mac Minis are of course, quicker than original MacBook Airs.
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
   
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