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You are here: MacNN Forums > Community > MacNN Lounge > Political/War Lounge > This is what happens when the Green lobby interferes with industry

This is what happens when the Green lobby interferes with industry
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PaperNotes
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Dec 21, 2008, 12:57 PM
 
http://gizmodo.com/5115071/dell-on-a...han-making-ads

http://www.engadget.com/2008/12/21/d...-and-kettle-l/

When the Green lobby spends millions to force companies to eliminate essential materials then companies start to attack each other's "Green credentials". All without merit.

Greenpeace has spent millions forcing companies and trying to convince the public that BFRs and PVC are harmful to humans and the environment, even though both are safe. They have also spent much time and money to force a ban on chlorine, without which we would have a hard time getting clean drinking water.

This is all completely in line with the Green lobby's policy of forcing industry into bankruptcy and injuring public health at the same time. We need only look at the ban on DDT and how many millions of lives it cost and how it has kept many underdeveloped countries in poverty to see that organisations such as Greenpeace want the same thing to happen to the industrialised world too.

Read Patrick Moore's take on Greenpeace's attack on PVC and BFR.

http://www.greenspirit.com/logbook.cfm?msid=82

Most disturbing is their campaign to ban vinyl from hospitals and health care facilities. If they were successful, the result would not be positive environmental change. The result would be more expensive and less effective health care, with no positive social gain.

Wood, concrete, steel, and plastic all have an impact on the environment. Through Lifecycle Analysis, green building experts such as the Washington, DC-based US Green Building Council, have correctly determined that vinyl has no more impact on human health than any other building material. In fact, vinyl building products have benefits: consider the energy efficiency of vinyl windows or reflective vinyl roofing, or the durability of rust-proof, corrosion-proof PVC pipe which conserves water, a precious resource.

For many applications, vinyl is the best choice. The best way to deliver affordable, safe drinking water is to add chlorine and put it in a vinyl pipe. The best way to insulate electrical wiring is with a vinyl coating. In hospitals, floors and wall coverings use vinyl widely. Vinyl is a durable, cost-effective siding for buildings because of its low maintenance and long life. Building with vinyl saves on energy and material costs.

Those vinyl benefits are not what former Greenpeace staffers at HBN want you to hear.

As co-founder of Greenpeace, former Director of Greenpeace International and former President of Greenpeace Canada, I am saddened by the direction members of my former organization have taken.

In the interest of efficient, affordable healthcare, HBN should lift the curtain, declare its Greenpeace roots, and come clean on the science of healthy building.
http://greenspirit.com/logbook.cfm?msid=134


Every year, BFRs save thousands of lives worldwide. Particularly important in schools, hospitals, automobiles and airplanes, BFRs reduce both the spread of fire and the threat of ignition, and give people more time to escape injury.

Last year, Air France flight 358 skidded off the runway at Toronto's Pearson International Airport. The plane caught fire, yet all 309 passengers survived; flame retardants gave them time to escape.

BFRs are added or blended into materials in solid form, not gas form, so the opportunity for human exposure is extremely small. Following extensive risk assessments in both the European Union and the United States, the most commonly used BFR has been proven safe.

My old colleagues at Greenpeace are leading the charge against BFRs, when no alternative flame retardants demonstrate greater health, safety and environmental benefits. Greenpeace is threatening laptop manufacturers who continue to use BFRs—and congratulating others who wrongly phase them out, such as Dell.
Shame on Dell and Apple for bending over to the Green lobby.
( Last edited by PaperNotes; Jan 9, 2018 at 05:45 AM. )
     
turtle777
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Dec 21, 2008, 01:13 PM
 
And we'll see more crap come out of Detroit in that regard as well.

It's not impossible that Detroit will survive, only to continue to build Green cars that nobody wants. But because they appease the Green lobby, Detroit will be handed over money for years to come. Awesome.

-t
     
PaperNotes  (op)
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Dec 21, 2008, 01:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
And we'll see more crap come out of Detroit in that regard as well.

It's not impossible that Detroit will survive, only to continue to build Green cars that nobody wants. But because they appease the Green lobby, Detroit will be handed over money for years to come. Awesome.

-t
This whole hoopla over battery operated cars is really retarded too. As computer geeks, sorry, we all know what batteries are like after a couple thousand recharges and how difficult they are to dispose of. We have also seen laptop batteries go up in flames because of a lack of BFR in them. Without flame retardants such as BFR can you imagine the disaster we are walking into with cars suddenly catching fire in the middle of a busy highway. And imagine all the millions of tons of batteries that need to be disposed of when they can no longer hold a decent charge and need to be replaced.

We need to make a stand against lithium ion batteries being used to power cars and spread the word in favour of hydro-electric. Much better to pump a car with compressed hydrogen and let the car generate its own power instead of sucking energy off the grid.
( Last edited by PaperNotes; Jan 9, 2018 at 05:44 AM. )
     
PaperNotes  (op)
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Dec 22, 2008, 01:59 PM
 
Here was something posted by member MeAndMyMac today on the MacNN article about the Dell Vs Apple eco-mudslinging

Greenpeace will never give Apple credit until Apple gives Greenpeace credit, as in, a line of credit to Apple's huge Greenpeace dollar contribution to the organization. Dell has free worldwide recycling. I guess due to demand? Whereas Apple products actually remain with the consumer longer. "Dell achieved carbon neutrality for its operations in August", let me guess, by buying into the Al Gore's hoax... "Al Gore's Inconvenient Loot

Former Vice President Al Gore has built a Green money-making machine capable of eventually generating billions of dollars for investors, including himself, but he set it up so that the average Joe can't afford to play on Gore's terms. And the US portion is headed up by a former Gore staffer and fund raiser who previously ran afoul of both the FEC and the DOJ, before Janet Reno jumped in and shut down an investigation during the Clinton years.

As Bill Hobbs first pointed out, Gore supposedly pays for his extra-large carbon footprint through Generation Investment Management (GIM) - and if you're looking to go green, and have your wallet go along with Gore, think again - average people are too insignificant to play - verifiable from this pdf.

Generation is based in London, with its U.S. offices in Washington, DC. The firm will manage the assets of institutional investors such as pension funds, foundations and endowments, as well as those of select high net worth individuals.* Generation expects to make extensive use of long-term performance based fees. Generation will begin its investment management business in early 2005.

* like Al Gore

Gore's company, GIM was specifically established to take financial advantage of new technologies and solutions related to combating Global Warming. The Global Warming crowd has told us that just recently new science emerged confirming the alleged fact that Global Warming is man made. So, ask yourself, why is it that Gore set up his Green money machine three years ago back in 2004? Is it possible Gore knew what the science would say before it was out? And even if not, can an individual who stands to make millions from Global Warming really be trusted as an honest broker on that topic? Talk about giving the fox the keys to the hen penthouse.

Even if Global Warming did exist, in principle, what's the difference between war profiteering and this? One could justifiably argue that Gore is taking advantage of, in his opinion, a catastrophic situation to clean up - and I don't mean the environment.

Here's a list indicating what it takes to make money along with Al. Funds associated with these companies have placed millions of dollars under Al Gore's control. And, as you'll see below, Gore's selection for the US President of GIM might raise a few eyebrows as well.

AFLAC INC - AQUANTIVE INC - AUTODESK INC - BECTON DICKINSON & CO BLACKBAUD INC - GENERAL ELECTRIC CO - GREENHILL & CO INC - JOHNSON CTLS INC - LABORATORY CORP AMER HLDGS - METABOLIX INC - NORTHERN TR CORP - NUVEEN INVTS INC -STAPLES INC - SYSCO CORP - TECHNE CORP - UBS AG - VCA ANTECH INC - WATERS CORP - WHOLE FOODS MKT INC

According to their own documents, GIM intends to invest in, or buy companies poised to cash in on Global Warming concerns. If we borrow John Edward's so-called two Americas concept for a second, this all means higher prices and taxes with more regulation and an altered standard of living for people like you and me, while Al Gore sits ensconced in his other America reaping profits from each new government mandate for us, business and even government itself. It's win win, alright, but mostly for Al."...

Just Google "Al Gore Carbon Neutral Corporation" to find more interesting stories.

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carniv...es_inconv.html
And Gore also profits from all those cheap shares Apple bestowed upon him and sits on Apple's board, giving the Green lobby an inside man to force Apple to drop the use of important BFRs, PVC and who knows what else in the future.

Apple made a serious mistake associating with Gore just for some publicity in his horror-comedy-scifi that he called a scientific documentary.
( Last edited by PaperNotes; Jan 9, 2018 at 05:44 AM. )
     
el chupacabra
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Jan 17, 2009, 01:02 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
And we'll see more crap come out of Detroit in that regard as well.

It's not impossible that Detroit will survive, only to continue to build Green cars that nobody wants. But because they appease the Green lobby, Detroit will be handed over money for years to come. Awesome.

-t
Nobody wants them? Or you dont want them?
looks to me like "green cars" are the only ones selling out...and the only ones generating a profit.
the largest problem for Americans today is they eat too much food and dont have enough work to do to keep their heart healthy
     
Shaddim
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Jan 17, 2009, 01:30 AM
 
They're trendy, like SUVs were a few years ago. Soon people will realize that their performance is crap (like SUVs).

I love the marketing, lets you forget that hybrids really aren't better for the environment and won't save you any money at all.
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom must, like men, undergo the fatigue of supporting it."
- Thomas Paine
     
turtle777
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Jan 17, 2009, 07:24 AM
 
Originally Posted by el chupacabra View Post
Nobody wants them? Or you dont want them?
looks to me like "green cars" are the only ones selling out...and the only ones generating a profit.
But not all green cars are equal.

And you bet that if the government runs it, those green cars will have a hard time to compete.
I mean, after the Bad 3 for years mismanaged their companies, who do we think that the government can add anything to make them "even more successful" ?

-t
     
ebuddy
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Jan 18, 2009, 10:19 AM
 
Originally Posted by el chupacabra View Post
Nobody wants them? Or you dont want them?
looks to me like "green cars" are the only ones selling out...and the only ones generating a profit.
Do you have a link to support this?
ebuddy
     
ebuddy
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Jan 18, 2009, 10:22 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
But not all green cars are equal.

And you bet that if the government runs it, those green cars will have a hard time to compete.
I mean, after the Bad 3 for years mismanaged their companies, who do we think that the government can add anything to make them "even more successful" ?

-t
I hear the "mismanaged" word mentioned frequently with regard to the Big three automakers, but what exactly was mismanaged? It seemed to me this whole thing fell apart @ $4.00/gallon gasoline. Even Porsche jumped on the SUV bandwagon for crying out loud. It was a huge market segment.
ebuddy
     
subego
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Jan 18, 2009, 01:56 PM
 
Originally Posted by PaperNotes View Post
And Gore also profits...

The link you provided comes up with a blank page.
     
   
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