Welcome to the MacNN Forums.

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > iPhone, iPad & iPod > Why I'm getting a Blackberry Bold over an iPhone

Why I'm getting a Blackberry Bold over an iPhone (Page 3)
Thread Tools
analogika
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: 888500128
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 19, 2008, 04:00 AM
 
strain != damage

Also, if you insist on people capitalizing your name, I suggest you start with your username.
     
- - e r i k - -
Posting Junkie
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 19, 2008, 04:18 AM
 
Funny you should mention grandma since you are the ones dishing out old wives tales.

[ fb ] [ flickr ] [] [scl] [ last ] [ plaxo ]
     
stevebez
Junior Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 20, 2008, 04:10 PM
 
Erik - The article you linked to discusses sitting too close to the screen, not starring at too small of one.

Analy - You are right on the capitalization thing. Every language I know of capitalizes proper nouns, but I can see your arguement. On the other hand I have no idea where you found the letter y in "stevebez", so I gave it back. Isn't it annoying when people mess with your name?

Do you know what happens if a professional athlete strains a joint too many times? Ta da! Damage! No, strain is not equal to damage, but it leads to it.
     
Mastrap
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Toronto
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 20, 2008, 04:19 PM
 
Page three of this thread?
     
analogika
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: 888500128
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 20, 2008, 05:04 PM
 
Originally Posted by stevebez View Post
Do you know what happens if a professional athlete strains a joint too many times? Ta da! Damage! No, strain is not equal to damage, but it leads to it.
So squinting is mechanically abrasive to your eyesocket?





Think about what exactly happens in that athlete's joint, and why it's fairly unlikely to happen in an eye.

Then:
http://www.agingeye.net/visionbasics/visionmyths.php
There really is very little you can do that will permanently damage your eyes. Similarly, reading small print or reading extensively cannot cause damage to the eyes. This is true even for people who already have poor vision. Although using computers will not damage your eyes, fatigue, eye strain or dry eye may occur with prolonged use.
     
paduck
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: May 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 21, 2008, 07:41 PM
 
Aron - this is a fascinating thread. You original list of lacking iPhone features included:

copy + paste - still no solution, even with 2.1 firmware (see below for fan boy comments)
a hardware keyboard - matter of personal choice, not a hard "requirement"
a file manager and Bluetooth file exchange - as pointed out, available via the App Store. You were initially concerned that this was an unsupported "hack" but reassured because of the officialness of the Apple App Store. You also got distracted into a debate on the merits of Wifi v. Bluetooth for file exchange.
iPhones lack of Office file format support and editing - again, available via to App Store, albeit without editing. Not a full featured addition, but a long way toward answering your list of shortcomings.

Based on the above, the list of your shortcomings should now be:

copy + paste
Bluetooth file exchange
Office file editing
Plus the personal preference of a hardware keyboard

Given this, I would say that much of what is available for the iPhone mitigates at least a fair amount of your original reservations about the platform vis-a-vis the Bold. It doesn't, however, eliminate all of them.

Interestingly, in listing the Bold's limitations, you indicate that GoogleMaps can be added as a download, thus mitigating that concern. I just find it interesting that an add-on is ok for the Bold, but gave you pause on the iPhone.

Now to the fan boys (of which I have been known to be one in the past, especially since I have owned every Apple product line dating back to the Apple ][+, including the iPhone).

They went to town on the shortcomings listed below and did not recognize that you had several legitimate reservations about the iPhone. My favorite is probably that they were unconcerned with editing files because they felt you would need a real computer for that. Although I would agree with that for extended work, I think it makes sense for minor changes and tweaks on substantially complete documents. I consider the viewing of source documents more important, but being able to make small tweaks is good as well. I really liked the Vonage .WAV file example of unique iPhone capability. If it were on your list of requirements, then that would be a high point for the iPhone!

They also went to town on the poor Bold which, be all accounts, is a worthy competitor to the iPhone, especially in the enterprise (and let's remember that the iPhone was not originally targeted at the enterprise). They were focused on defending their choice by running down the opposition. A fault that I think you fell victim to as well. The continued emphasis they placed on firmware 2.1 having copy-paste (in the absence of evidence) is amusing given that it wasn't in the final build last week.

Anyhow, like I said, I find this whole topic interesting for the social dynamic that is playing out. I wonder if you took a step back and re-evaluated the iPhone that you might find it and the Bold closer than you had originally thought. Not to say close enough for you to switch, just that the two products are pretty competitive. As you and others also pointed out, the service plan providers are also important to making the decision on what platform to go with.

If you were more interested in media features, PAYG, substitute Wifi for Bluetooth file exchange, and live without file editing, copy/paste and a hardware keyboard then I guess the iPhone would be for you!
     
paduck
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: May 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 23, 2008, 05:43 PM
 
The new Android phone has a pull-out keyboard. I was unsure on Office support and Bluetooth file exchange though. I'm sure someone can write apps for that.
     
Mastrap
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Toronto
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 23, 2008, 07:38 PM
 
No office support, unless you count support for google docs.
     
Aron Peterson  (op)
Senior User
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: South Carolina
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 25, 2008, 03:07 PM
 
I made quite a surpising choice in the end. I went for the Nokia E71 because it is very fully featured, has a solid keyboard, very slim and light form factor, Webkit browser with Flash support, 3.2 mpixel camera with LED flash, and was cheaper than the Bold or iPhone. I'm posting from it now while on the treadmill at the gym!
Web dev, Poe, faux-naïf, keyboard warrior, often found imitating online contrarians . My stuff : DELL XPS, iPhone 6
     
Aron Peterson  (op)
Senior User
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: South Carolina
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 26, 2008, 05:08 AM
 
Originally Posted by Aron Peterson View Post
I made quite a surpising choice in the end. I went for the Nokia E71 because it is very fully featured, has a solid keyboard, very slim and light form factor, Webkit browser with Flash support, 3.2 mpixel camera with LED flash, and was cheaper than the Bold or iPhone. I'm posting from it now while on the treadmill at the gym!
Oh well, after half a day with it I've discovered some annoyances and will return the phone.

-3G reception in my flat is extremely bad.
-The S60 operating system has some severe bugs. I know have folders that are acting as shortcuts to unrelated apps.
-The office suit ignores text alignment.
-The Webket browser doesn't have Javascript support.
Web dev, Poe, faux-naïf, keyboard warrior, often found imitating online contrarians . My stuff : DELL XPS, iPhone 6
     
Phileas
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Toronto, Canada
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 26, 2008, 11:28 AM
 
I was surprised when I read that you were going for the Nokia. While Nokia makes some great phones, I don't think they're as mature as the BB in the smart phone sector.
     
Aron Peterson  (op)
Senior User
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: South Carolina
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Sep 26, 2008, 02:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by Phileas View Post
I was surprised when I read that you were going for the Nokia. While Nokia makes some great phones, I don't think they're as mature as the BB in the smart phone sector.
I read some reviews which were all good and saw how fully specced it was and thought I might as well take one home and if it is no good I'd get a refund. Fortunately I had several legit reasons for a refund that I was able to show the salesman.

The E71 is supposed to be Nokia's first serious attempt at getting some of BB's market share. It does a pretty good job but it's no more a smartphone than the iPhone. The Bold simply destroys it.

The E71 had some good points, the build quality being the the best standout feature, and the GPS is very quick at getting a lock on. I was surprised to see that the 600k Google Maps download is every bit as good as the implementation on the iPhone (and on some phones, not the E71, now includes Street View). The GPS feature was able to track me in realtime as I went around looking for a sushi restaurant and never drifted by more than a few metres.

Keyboard was pretty solid, more than the Bold's, but it was also a little too narrow like the iPhone's software keyboard. The Bold is the clear winner when it comes to text input. I've never felt so natural at typing so quickly than when I used the Bold.

The BB Storm comes out within a few weeks and should be interesting.

But give the iPhone a slide out hardware keyboard, file management, and system wide copy+paste, and there won't be a phone to beat it. It would swallow the market, as long as developers don't feel oppressed or neutered in any way.

Android also looks promising but needs some interface refinement.
Web dev, Poe, faux-naïf, keyboard warrior, often found imitating online contrarians . My stuff : DELL XPS, iPhone 6
     
rslifka
Forum Regular
Join Date: Dec 2004
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Mar 9, 2009, 03:05 AM
 
I'm curious to know if the OP picked up a Bold? Aron?

I'm an iPhone 1st gen user at the moment and considering either getting the Bold or the iPhone 3G. I'm a very minimal iPhone user (no apps, no media) who's pretty much convinced that if there's no unified inbox, no copy-and-paste and no searchable email after 2 years, it's either not going to happen, or isn't going to happen for a long time to come.

Rob
     
matt_s
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Mar 9, 2009, 06:35 PM
 
If my iPhone 3G supported copy/paste, I would also leave my BBerry behind. I'm sort of in the same place you are, using the iPhone as a personal telephone + text messenger and the occasional albeit rare launch of Safari. My Blackberry does most of the day to day heavy lifting.

I could not imagine dealing with the volume of email and notes I do on the Blackberry over on the iPhone. I must copy/paste sections of quotes and specs and snippets of email into other email or texts 20 or 30 times a day. Often, it isn't appropriate to forward an entire email to an account, all you want is to lift a few sentences here or there. It's how business gets done. I mean, copy/paste is pretty much a base function from the prehistoric computer days, right?

Only rarely do I use the search function on my BlackBerry, although I must admit it works fabulously. There's got to be a 3rd party iPhone app that lets you search through email (?). Not sure, I've never been to the app store.

I don't use the UNIFIED mailbox- because of contractual obligations, I have to keep my four email very discreet and completely separate. It's easier when the messages aren't all jumbled up into one inbox. But I can see how this could be a useful feature.
     
maxintosh
Mac Elite
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: New York, NY
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Mar 11, 2009, 12:21 PM
 
I actually picked up a BB Bold when my iPhone v1 died and I wasn't convinced the iPhone 3G was big enough of a leap. I liked my BB Pearl I had before the iPhone so wanted to see what they had come up with.

The keyboard is great and much preferred to my iPhone keyboard. I also found it got better reception and the screen is really sharp and bright.

However, web browsing is still just awful and the media player is horrid. HTML e-mail support is weak. Plus the headphone jack, while 3.5mm, is on the side of the phone, making it awkward to put back in your pocket with the headphones plugged in.

I did like the push services from Facebook, etc and how customizable everything is.

Overall though, I missed the iPhone's web and media experience and ended up returning it for an iPhone 3G. I'm bummed my first iPhone didn't make it till the 3rd Gen model came out. BB still rules for e-mail and typing. For everything else, the iPhone is still king... IMHO. Really depends what your primary use is going to be... for personal use, iPhone is much stronger.

Also, AT&T's 3G NYC network is absolutely abysmal, on either BB or iPhone. WTF guys??
     
rslifka
Forum Regular
Join Date: Dec 2004
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Mar 11, 2009, 02:01 PM
 
That sounds exactly like something I could see myself writing in a month!

I've owned my iPhone since Nov '07. Daily usage is primarily SMS and phone, and I would use it more for email if I didn't find typing so frustrating. I can't think about the email I'm writing because I'm constantly correcting typos... so I stopped writing emails with it. Web and media I'm not so worried about. I rarely ever use the web and I'll hook up my iPhone to my car stereo once in a blue moon.

I'm really on the fence here. Sounds like I should just get the Bold and see if I get used it to after a few weeks - return it and pickup an iPhone 3G.
     
matt_s
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Mar 11, 2009, 02:27 PM
 
I hear ya :-) The iPhone's neonatal keyboard is a bit frustrating, especially for my ginormous, fat fingers...

I've gotten a little bit better over time but it's still not anywhere near the blazing fast typing I can do on the BlackBerry's physical keyboard. The icons are just too close to one another, it can be maddening at times.

I wish the iPhone's keyboard would turn horizontal & enlarge. That would really help matters. Doesn't the BlackBerry touch phone's keyboard rotate?
     
rslifka
Forum Regular
Join Date: Dec 2004
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Mar 11, 2009, 02:30 PM
 
Yep, the Storm supports that although the Storm was released at least 6 months too early. It's a disaster compared to the iPhone. RIM needs to invest in a design team, desperately.
     
matt_s
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 21, 2009, 03:36 PM
 
I wish Apple would allow mass-deletion of email, like the Blackberry does with it's DELETE PRIOR command. Having to individually delete, one at a time, hundreds of email is just plain stupid. Painfully stupid. I would really like to be able to pick a date & just wipe everything in my INBOX prior to that.
     
Phileas
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Toronto, Canada
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 21, 2009, 04:43 PM
 
Originally Posted by matt_s View Post
I wish Apple would allow mass-deletion of email, like the Blackberry does with it's DELETE PRIOR command. Having to individually delete, one at a time, hundreds of email is just plain stupid. Painfully stupid. I would really like to be able to pick a date & just wipe everything in my INBOX prior to that.
One of the many reasons why I use IMAP. You just don't have these problems.
     
matt_s
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 21, 2009, 10:37 PM
 
I'm not allowed to delete email off the server, it's against US corporate law. iPhone handling of IMAP is still in it's infancy, and doesn't offer the same features that Blackberry's DELETE PRIOR command offers among it's many options. Since the iPhone has limited storage capabilities, the ability to erase hundreds or thousands of unneeded email almost instantly - along with their weighty attachments - is a basic requirement. Hopefully, as the iPhone platform grows up and matures, we won't have to absurdly delete email one at a time any more.
     
Phileas
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Toronto, Canada
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 21, 2009, 10:51 PM
 
I am not sure if I am getting this.

With IMAP, mail resides on a mail server, not locally. So, if you do need to delete hundreds of mails then that's easily done from your PC or Mac. With IMAP, local storage is not an issue either, simply because of the way it works. In any case, should you still use POP mail - not a good idea if you're checking mail from multiple devices - then the iPhone's storage is large enough to store years and years of mail.

I am also not sure what you mean by saying that IMAP on the iPhone is in it's infancy, it works perfectly for me. In addition to all of this, there is no corporate law that prohibits you from deleting email, in the US or anywhere else I've ever worked.
     
matt_s
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 22, 2009, 12:56 PM
 
Sorry, not the case for us. IMAP would be wonderful if we all had constant high speed internet connections but the vast amount of work on email I can get to is either on a plane or in someone's car or truck. I've got to have the email locally. I might have a decent net connection in the evening or perhaps every other day. In some locations, nothing for several days while I'm traveling. I queue up dozens and dozens of messages and send when I can.

My iPhone cannot store even a month's worth of email and constant deletion is required. We have some single product design folders that are 850 MB up to 2.5 GB in size. If three or four of those arrive, it's painful. Three weeks ago I waited for almost 3 minutes for a move from the Home screen to the email accounts list because the iPhone was so slowed down by the darned inbox's contents. Once I deleted the file locally, the iPhone returned to it's old peppy self.

No one in our company syncs email on their handhelds with their laptops or vice versa - or the server. We handle 2-3-4 days or a week of business, delete off the handheld and move on. That's why the Blackberry's DELETE PRIOR command and all it's various submenu options is a really sweet deal and I wish Apple would emulate that.

BTW, Sarbanes-Oxley prohibits deletion of email and stipulates archival. If your corporation comes under it's guidelines & regulations, as ours does, compliance is mandatory. Apple already knows this, having been through the courts on their little stock dating scheme.
( Last edited by matt_s; Jun 22, 2009 at 06:05 PM. )
     
Phileas
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Toronto, Canada
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 24, 2009, 01:14 PM
 
You're using email in a way that it was never intended for - you should not send anything larger than a couple of MB max over a mail server. Sending GB of data over email is - forgive me - insane and will any mail program to it's knees.

Can't your company implement a file storage system, where all you send is a link rather than the file? We use dropbox at work.
     
Big Mac
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Los Angeles
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jun 24, 2009, 02:29 PM
 
Phileas is totally right. Transferring large files is not what email was designed for.

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
     
N228UA
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Japan
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jul 6, 2009, 09:14 AM
 
Originally Posted by matt_s View Post
BTW, Sarbanes-Oxley prohibits deletion of email and stipulates archival. If your corporation comes under it's guidelines & regulations, as ours does, compliance is mandatory. Apple already knows this, having been through the courts on their little stock dating scheme.
At least in my company, using an iPhone is a violation of Sarbanes-Oxley regulations due to it's poor security features when using Exchange mail. My CIO had a meltdown when I told him I was using an iPhone and I'm being asked to switch back to a BlackBerry. I'm going to get a Bold as I think it's as good as an iPhone for what I require. I will miss playing Mafia Wars though
MacBook C2D, PowerMac G4, PowerBook G4, Mini G4
     
cgc
Professional Poster
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Down by the river
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jul 6, 2009, 09:27 AM
 
Funny, when I saw this thread it reminded me of someone who told everyone they were going to commit suicide in hopes someone would care enough to stop them.

Buy your Blackberry...who gives a crap?
     
shifuimam
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Somewhere in the Pacific Northwest
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jul 6, 2009, 09:38 AM
 
Originally Posted by cgc View Post
Funny, when I saw this thread it reminded me of someone who told everyone they were going to commit suicide in hopes someone would care enough to stop them.

Buy your Blackberry...who gives a crap?
That's about what I thought when I saw the subject line.

Either that or "you're posting in a forum full of the last people on the planet who are going to care".
     
harbinger75
Mac Enthusiast
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: In a constant state of panic...
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jul 6, 2009, 10:19 AM
 
Blackberry Bold? What is that, a kind of drink or something?
the geek source
Twitter: @thegeeksource
     
turtle777
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: planning a comeback !
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jul 6, 2009, 11:07 AM
 
Originally Posted by N228UA View Post
At least in my company, using an iPhone is a violation of Sarbanes-Oxley regulations due to it's poor security features when using Exchange mail.
It's absolutely ludicrous what things get lumped in with SOX. WTF ?

The only reason why companies include all kinds of sh!t as part of SOX is because they are so afraid to be out of compliance that they'd rather include eleventy billion unnecessary things, just to be safe.

-t
     
pcryan5
Mac Enthusiast
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Vancouver, BC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jul 6, 2009, 11:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by N228UA View Post
.. iPhone is a violation of Sarbanes-Oxley regulations ..My CIO had a meltdown when I told him I was using an iPhone
Can you explain exactly why he had this melt down? Specifically what security issues were the concern?

Also - I thought the Sarbanes-Oxley issue vis-a-vis iPhones was old news. (Was it not related the arcane requirement that SOX doesn’t allow you to add features to products that you have already been paid for. (which Apple gets around by it's subscription model.))
     
::maroma::
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: PDX
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jul 6, 2009, 12:14 PM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
It's absolutely ludicrous what things get lumped in with SOX. WTF ?

The only reason why companies include all kinds of sh!t as part of SOX is because they are so afraid to be out of compliance that they'd rather include eleventy billion unnecessary things, just to be safe.

-t
Amen to that! Our IT department is full of crazies. Eventually, it becomes easier for them to tell us "no, you aren't allowed to do/use that" rather than figure out if its actually safe or in violation of SOX.
     
matt_s
Fresh-Faced Recruit
Join Date: Nov 2003
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Jul 6, 2009, 10:50 PM
 
No worries, I just work here, and have to conform. When they tell me I can't delete email off the server, I say 'fine,' because after all, it's just email, and who the hell cares?

Another thing it would be really nice to be able to do on the iPhone is get to the RECENTS screen while on a phone call. This is really annoying, and what's more annoying is because I used a Blackberry for so many years, I keep forgetting I'm barred from viewing any window while on a call. So, I ring up a customer and tell him: you really should call this guy because he wants to do business, and then I try to get to the RECENTS screen to retrieve the phone number... but I'm blocked. Why should we be barred from any window just because a call is in progress? It makes no logical sense.

PS_ I also noticed that the refresh icon on Safari 4 is now at the far right of the address window, instead of being where it used to be, over by all the other action icons on the left. Muscle memory is making me despise Safari 4. It's just inconvenient. Why would they move something that was working so well and had been placed there since 10.0? And then I noticed: it's over on the right of the address window in the Safari app on the iPhone, and man, it just made me mad that OS X on my Mac is being made more difficult, requiring additional mousing for no other reason than it's being forced to conform to what's up on the damn iPhone.
( Last edited by matt_s; Jul 6, 2009 at 11:02 PM. )
     
 
Thread Tools
 
Forum Links
Forum Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Top
Privacy Policy
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:14 PM.
All contents of these forums © 1995-2017 MacNN. All rights reserved.
Branding + Design: www.gesamtbild.com
vBulletin v.3.8.8 © 2000-2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.,