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Kindle Fire — Doesn't drift like a Prius (Page 13)
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Eug
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Dec 14, 2011, 09:14 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Ignoring the part where he talks about not being able to select links on web pages because 7" is too small for a tablet?
No, because it's already been discussed ad nauseum here. Also, I did not post his inane statement, “Look at your hand. Is it thin or fat?” he asked. “If it’s fat, you just know it’s going to be bad.” WTF? Furthermore, I didn't post the part where Gene Munster, über Apple cheerleader, says "Pricing will save the Fire". Hmmm... That sounds awfully familiar, doesn't it?
     
Wiskedjak
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Dec 14, 2011, 09:16 AM
 
Also from that article:
"If Apple brought the notion of the tablet into the mainstream, Amazon is making it affordable."

"But once the device is activated in a buyer’s home, the losses stop and the consumption begins."

"The device does do one thing well, he said. Shopping on Amazon is a breeze. “If I were given to conspiracy theories, I’d say that Amazon deliberately designed a poor Web browsing user experience to keep Fire users from shopping on competing sites,” Mr. Nielsen said."


By the way, Nielsen also criticized the usability of the iPad.
http://www.useit.com/alertbox/ipad-1st-study.html
http://www.useit.com/alertbox/ipad.html
( Last edited by Wiskedjak; Dec 14, 2011 at 09:25 AM. )
     
Wiskedjak
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Dec 14, 2011, 09:36 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Anyway, this doesn't change the crappy value and questionable size of the Kindle Fire.

Now it's taking more of a beating, this time by the NYT.

As Kindle Fire Faces Critics, Remedies Are Promised - Yahoo! Finance
I don't know if an article that presents almost as many positive points as negative points counts as "a beating".
     
imitchellg5
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Dec 14, 2011, 11:07 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Ignoring the part where he talks about not being able to select links on web pages because 7" is too small for a tablet?
I don't understand this argument. I've never had issues selecting links or anything. It's much, much more comfortable to browse on than any phone, for obvious reasons, and I never hear anyone complain about that.
Originally Posted by Wiskedjak View Post
Yes, because browsing web pages is, at best, a secondary task for the Fire.
One of my main uses for the Fire is a web browser in bed or hospital and it works rather well to me. It's faster after you turn off Silk. No, it isn't the smoothest browser in the world in terms of things like pinch to zoom, but that's the fault of Android itself. Even Honeycomb's browser is nowhere near as responsive as Apple's.
     
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Dec 15, 2011, 02:43 PM
 
Amazon have sold more than 1 million Kindles every week for the past three weeks now. Pretty impressive.
     
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Dec 15, 2011, 02:53 PM
 
I opened the box to check KT out, and was surprised at how small and light it was. However I still prefer the bigger ipad screen, personally.

Under the tree it goes!
     
Eug
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Dec 16, 2011, 12:53 AM
 
Apple's iPad gets competition at last: Kindle Fire to take 20 per cent of tablets in 2012

Research company IDC reckons Amazon's Kindle Fire tablet will grab nearly 20 per cent of the tablet market in 2012, shipping more than 16 million units.

While Apple will still dominate the tablet space with more than 60 per cent of the market - and is becoming "increasingly relevant" to enterprises, IDC said - Google's Android platform will get a "significant boost" in the tablet arena thanks to the Fire which will singlehandedly own two-thirds of the Android tablet market.
     
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Dec 16, 2011, 01:12 AM
 
That says more about the dire state of the Android tablet market than the viability of the Kindle Fire.

Amazon's a big company and selling the thing for a loss will attract a lot of people, but that still doesn't mean it's a good product. However, when they do release a 10" tablet next year we'll have a better view on their ability to compete against Apple. Much of that will ride on Google being able to deliver on their ICS promises, however.
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Eug
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Dec 16, 2011, 11:38 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
That says more about the dire state of the Android tablet market than the viability of the Kindle Fire.

Amazon's a big company and selling the thing for a loss will attract a lot of people, but that still doesn't mean it's a good product.
Whether or not it's a good product is not just about absolutes. It's about feature set and functionality vs. price. ie. Price is integral to the discussion.

Your multiple references to BMWs etc. seems to indicate where you're coming from on this. You seem to think it's a superior product to many other vehicles, whereas I think they're simply not worth the money. Yeah, it may have better handling and other nice features, but quite frankly I don't care, and would rather spend less money for something else, because that lower cost product will do what I need it to do. In fact, there are some serious disadvantages to BMWs, not the least of which is price, up front and ongoing.

As for "taking a loss", Amazon's intent on this is to make a small profit on the hardware, after the initial loss. Interestingly, that's exactly the take Toyota took with my hybrid, and now it's selling extremely well and they're making a profit on it just like they predicted. Great for us consumers, instead of the huge margin Apple charges on most of its products.
     
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Dec 16, 2011, 07:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
That says more about the dire state of the Android tablet market than the viability of the Kindle Fire.
Weren't you just saying I should have purchased an Asus Android tablet?
     
Shaddim
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Dec 16, 2011, 11:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
Weren't you just saying I should have purchased an Asus Android tablet?
The Transformer was the only Android tablet that made it's manufacturer a profit this year. Think about that.
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Dec 17, 2011, 12:01 AM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
Whether or not it's a good product is not just about absolutes. It's about feature set and functionality vs. price. ie. Price is integral to the discussion.

Your multiple references to BMWs etc. seems to indicate where you're coming from on this. You seem to think it's a superior product to many other vehicles, whereas I think they're simply not worth the money. Yeah, it may have better handling and other nice features, but quite frankly I don't care, and would rather spend less money for something else, because that lower cost product will do what I need it to do. In fact, there are some serious disadvantages to BMWs, not the least of which is price, up front and ongoing.

As for "taking a loss", Amazon's intent on this is to make a small profit on the hardware, after the initial loss. Interestingly, that's exactly the take Toyota took with my hybrid, and now it's selling extremely well and they're making a profit on it just like they predicted. Great for us consumers, instead of the huge margin Apple charges on most of its products.
Well, I can't help the fact you like the Prius, talk about terrible value (and a God-awful car to drive). The only real disadvantage to BMW is buying one used that's been abused by a previous owner, otherwise they're solid driver's cars. Mine have been some of the most reliable cars I've ever had, and I've owned a very long list of vehicles from just about every manufacturer.
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Dec 17, 2011, 01:25 AM
 
Reliable ≠ easier or cheaper to maintain.
     
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Dec 17, 2011, 01:44 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Well, I can't help the fact you like the Prius, talk about terrible value (and a God-awful car to drive). The only real disadvantage to BMW is buying one used that's been abused by a previous owner, otherwise they're solid driver's cars. Mine have been some of the most reliable cars I've ever had, and I've owned a very long list of vehicles from just about every manufacturer.
Rear-wheel drive BMWs suck going uphill on ice in the winter. The only cars I will consider buying are front wheel drive or else all wheel drive. BMWs often have higher maintenance costs, at least judging by my friends who own them. They're constantly bitching about it, and given what I've seen, I'd bitch about it too. BMW dealerships around here seem to charge more just because they can get away with it. Actually, Toyota dealerships around here are guilty of the same thing, but it's even more noticeable because for the same basic maintenance work, they have different pricing scales for Lexus vs. Toyota, at the exact same dealerships.

So personally, I think they're a waste of money. I'd usually say "to each his own", but for some reason, you don't agree with that statement. Your approach to everything seems to be "everyone who Thinks Different than Shaddim is foolish".
( Last edited by Eug; Dec 17, 2011 at 02:06 AM. )
     
Shaddim
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Dec 17, 2011, 05:21 AM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
Reliable ≠ easier or cheaper to maintain.
I paid more fixing and maintaining an Accord than I did either of my M3s. Damned fine cars.
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
Rear-wheel drive BMWs suck going uphill on ice in the winter. The only cars I will consider buying are front wheel drive or else all wheel drive. BMWs often have higher maintenance costs, at least judging by my friends who own them. They're constantly bitching about it, and given what I've seen, I'd bitch about it too. BMW dealerships around here seem to charge more just because they can get away with it. Actually, Toyota dealerships around here are guilty of the same thing, but it's even more noticeable because for the same basic maintenance work, they have different pricing scales for Lexus vs. Toyota, at the exact same dealerships.

So personally, I think they're a waste of money. I'd usually say "to each his own", but for some reason, you don't agree with that statement. Your approach to everything seems to be "everyone who Thinks Different than Shaddim is foolish".
No, I just think that a person who buys a Prius probably is. All dealerships will screw you if you let them, but they're easy to deal with if you handle them right. It's like a dog, if you show that you're scared they'll eat your face. If the service manager sees that you're weak he automatically starts thinking about a vacation in Aruba, and buying lots of mai tais with the money he'll siphon from you.

FYI, you can get a host of BMWs with AWD, such as the 328xi, which will do a better job on that "icy hill" than a FWD Prius. Wanna save even more money on fuel, help save the planet? Buy a diesel. Geez.

Now, what does this thread have to do with any of this? Oh yeah, the Fire sucks, and so does the Prius.
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Dec 17, 2011, 10:25 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
FYI, you can get a host of BMWs with AWD, such as the 328xi, which will do a better job on that "icy hill" than a FWD Prius.
It's mind boggling that you don't understand anything beyond your very own limited scope. First of all the 328xi costs 50% more, but despite this, it has half the gas mileage. Uh, yeah, totally better.

Wanna save even more money on fuel, help save the planet? Buy a diesel. Geez.
As I discovered after renting a couple of diesel vehicles, diesel around here is quite the pain in the ass. Most of the central Toronto gas stations don't even carry diesel.

Now, what does this thread have to do with any of this? Oh yeah, the Fire sucks, and so does the Prius.
So again, it's clear your opinion of a product is shaped by a very focused bias, and you have a very hard time comprehending that people actually have different priorities than you do.

FYI BTW, in the US, the Prius alone outsells the entire BMW 3 series combined. Now, I don't think the Fire will outsell the iPad, but it's clear the Fire is selling well, and sales may just increase once it gets updated.
( Last edited by Eug; Dec 17, 2011 at 10:39 AM. )
     
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Dec 17, 2011, 07:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
I paid more fixing and maintaining an Accord than I did either of my M3s. Damned fine cars.
I've spent $75 fixing my Accord over the past four years. $75.
     
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Dec 17, 2011, 11:58 PM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
It's mind boggling that you don't understand anything beyond your very own limited scope. First of all the 328xi costs 50% more, but despite this, it has half the gas mileage. Uh, yeah, totally better.

As I discovered after renting a couple of diesel vehicles, diesel around here is quite the pain in the ass. Most of the central Toronto gas stations don't even carry diesel.

So again, it's clear your opinion of a product is shaped by a very focused bias, and you have a very hard time comprehending that people actually have different priorities than you do.

FYI BTW, in the US, the Prius alone outsells the entire BMW 3 series combined. Now, I don't think the Fire will outsell the iPad, but it's clear the Fire is selling well, and sales may just increase once it gets updated.
Priorities? Like actually enjoying driving? The Prius is about as much fun to drive as a 7" Android tablet is to use. Which is not much at all. My wife's a tree-hugger and even she couldn't bear to drive one more than a 15 minute test drive. You must have an ass made of steel springs, not mind it being ridiculously under powered, and enjoy the clueless handling. The thing had so much understeer I thought it was busted from the factory, then after the second one we concluded that they're made that way on purpose, for some reason.
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
I've spent $75 fixing my Accord over the past four years. $75.
I guess you didn't have the transmission go tits up on yours, or replace the front axle. Then there was the water pump, master cylinder, both front wheel bearings, and replaced the rear seal and head gasket. I felt guilty even giving the car away, but there wasn't much else that could go wrong with it.
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Dec 18, 2011, 12:35 AM
 
Fwiw, your bit about "enjoying driving" is exactly it.

For most people, priorities are precisely NOT on that.

Mine are on getting my daughter and myself from A to B safely and timely, finding parking space, fitting a minimal set of keyboards, and fitting my financial priorities. If I had $10,000 extra to spend, I'd sure as hell spend it on studio equipment and instruments, as well as a family vacation, and NOT on a more enjoyable ride.

If it gets the job done, I'm fine with that.

If it turns out that I spend an exorbitant amount of time using my car, those priorities will change, as I'm sure it might for people who find they'd like to spend more time with their tablet computers and notice where the Fire falls short. But as long as it gets the job done, $300 is a lot of money if you've got more important things on your list.
     
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Dec 18, 2011, 01:09 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
Fwiw, your bit about "enjoying driving" is exactly it.

For most people, priorities are precisely NOT on that.

Mine are on getting my daughter and myself from A to B safely and timely, finding parking space, fitting a minimal set of keyboards, and fitting my financial priorities. If I had $10,000 extra to spend, I'd sure as hell spend it on studio equipment and instruments, as well as a family vacation, and NOT on a more enjoyable ride.

If it gets the job done, I'm fine with that.

If it turns out that I spend an exorbitant amount of time using my car, those priorities will change, as I'm sure it might for people who find they'd like to spend more time with their tablet computers and notice where the Fire falls short. But as long as it gets the job done, $300 is a lot of money if you've got more important things on your list.
Oh God, so booooring. Here I am, motoring down the freeway in my little hybrid that's about as much fun to drive as a washing machine and as cool as a colonoscopy. I have this 7" tablet too, it has Android-something on it, it's admittedly sluggish and dated, allows me to strain my eyes reading books, and really isn't ideal for doing anything, except buying stuff off Amazon. Damn, my life is all about the things that "get the job done". Which is just fine, because if I actually found any joy I'd probably have a stroke. Gotta keep an even keel, no boat-rocking.

Are the fluorescent lights in here too bright? That one over there keeps flickering... where's my stapler?
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Eug
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Dec 18, 2011, 02:10 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Priorities? Like actually enjoying driving?
I don't mind driving, but I sure as hell don't enjoy it, whatever the car. To me, on a wide open road it's the ultimate bore, and in urban rush hour traffic, it's the ultimate irritant. Most of my time in the car is the latter.

So, a few of us don't want to make love to our cars like you seem to want to. Oh the humanity!

The Prius is about as much fun to drive as a 7" Android tablet is to use. Which is not much at all. My wife's a tree-hugger and even she couldn't bear to drive one more than a 15 minute test drive. You must have an ass made of steel springs,
Huh? Sporty BMWs have much harsher rides, on purpose. That's one of the reasons I don't like most sport versions.

Anyways, again you've completely missed the point. I don't find driving any car particularly fun... cuz I don't find driving fun in the first place, at least on public roads. On public roads, I drive for safety, not fun.

BTW, I'm not a tree hugger. Never have been. I just find the car quite useful for what I need it to do, it has some interesting tech features, and it has good gas mileage. However, if your wife were truly a tree hugger, she would either get no car at all, or else one with very good gas mileage and safety features. Everything else becomes less relevant.

not mind it being ridiculously under powered, and enjoy the clueless handling.
Underpowered for what? Hauling big rocks? Drag racing? Cuz for safe highway driving, it's perfectly adequate. If you need more power on public roads just for a 2 or 4 person passenger vehicle, then perhaps you should re-evaluate your driving habits.

The thing had so much understeer I thought it was busted from the factory, then after the second one we concluded that they're made that way on purpose, for some reason.
Yet, that car still outsells all 3 series BMWs combined in the US. Gee, go figure.

Like Spheric suggests, some of us have better things to do with that $10000 or whatever. Like his studio equipment, or vacation, or perhaps even his daughter's future education.

Seriously, the more you argue the Fire is like an inexpensive car, the more it makes it sound like it should do well in terms of sales, now and going forward. Inexpensive cars far outsell higher end luxury cars, and a lot of people like me have no interest in unnecessarily spending more on cars because the added features really offer little real world benefit. The added cost just becomes a waste of money.

I'll repeat my example of the idiocy you seem to be espousing:

This kinda reminds me when I went to Toyota dealership to buy a Prius. While I was waiting I decided to browse again through some of the other Toyota models and the Lexus models too. Some dude saw me looking at the Lexus and said he was picking one up. I told him it seemed decent but it just wasn't for me. This (forward) guy then tells me if I can afford the Lexus then I should get one. I said no, because I actually preferred the Prius, and even if I didn't, I didn't feel like spending twice as much on a car that isn't going to be doing anything more for me. He looked at me as if I was completely nuts and said that I should get one if I can afford one. The guy was so convinced of his own opinion's superiority, that he simply had his mind closed to anything else. Sounds familiar.
( Last edited by Eug; Dec 18, 2011 at 02:32 AM. )
     
Spheric Harlot
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Dec 18, 2011, 08:17 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Oh God, so booooring. Here I am, motoring down the freeway in my little hybrid that's about as much fun to drive as a washing machine and as cool as a colonoscopy.
But I'm doing it with my daughter riding shotgun, on the way to pony-riding, and listening to her favorite audio play on my iPhone—both things I afford precisely because the wheels cost that extra $150 a month less, on average.

So, aye, my car is about "getting the job done", because I'd much rather spend my hard-earned money on stuff that's actually important, and that I *really* enjoy.


P.S.: Drove a girlfriend's BMW regularly for a couple years. Fun ride. I can see why people buy them. It also became obvious why BMW drivers have a reputation of being reckless and total assholes—the car encourages "sporty" driving that really has no place in a city setting. And it shows in how people react to you in traffic. The 10-year-old VW van I drove after that was a vastly nicer ride.
     
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Dec 18, 2011, 09:14 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
I guess you didn't have the transmission go tits up on yours, or replace the front axle. Then there was the water pump, master cylinder, both front wheel bearings, and replaced the rear seal and head gasket. I felt guilty even giving the car away, but there wasn't much else that could go wrong with it.
The only thing I've had to replace that wasn't scheduled maintenance was the starter motor.
     
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Dec 18, 2011, 11:27 AM
 
Nice try. Blaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. Blaaaaaaaaa. Bllaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa;.....
     
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Dec 18, 2011, 10:38 PM
 
Um, I was going to post my thoughts after using a Kindle Fire for a day, but I think this thread has moved on.

Long story short: the Fire is rubbish.
     
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Dec 19, 2011, 12:43 AM
 
Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
Um, I was going to post my thoughts after using a Kindle Fire for a day, but I think this thread has moved on.

Long story short: the Fire is rubbish.
Shhh... no room for such comments in here, it's an awesome little device. Best $200 you can spend, cross my heart.
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Shaddim
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Dec 19, 2011, 01:07 AM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
I don't mind driving, but I sure as hell don't enjoy it, whatever the car. To me, on a wide open road it's the ultimate bore, and in urban rush hour traffic, it's the ultimate irritant. Most of my time in the car is the latter.

So, a few of us don't want to make love to our cars like you seem to want to. Oh the humanity!
Maybe if you drove a car with decent handling for a while you'd see the light.
Huh? Sporty BMWs have much harsher rides, on purpose. That's one of the reasons I don't like most sport versions.

Anyways, again you've completely missed the point. I don't find driving any car particularly fun... cuz I don't find driving fun in the first place, at least on public roads. On public roads, I drive for safety, not fun.
My M3 has a widely adjustable suspension, from Lincoln-like squishy to crush your spine hard, just dial in what you want. I drive for safety too, probably why I've never had a car wreck. *knocks on wood*
BTW, I'm not a tree hugger. Never have been. I just find the car quite useful for what I need it to do, it has some interesting tech features, and it has good gas mileage. However, if your wife were truly a tree hugger, she would either get no car at all, or else one with very good gas mileage and safety features. Everything else becomes less relevant.
She drives a Mini. It's actually fun, like a big `ol go cart with a back seat.

Underpowered for what? Hauling big rocks? Drag racing? Cuz for safe highway driving, it's perfectly adequate. If you need more power on public roads just for a 2 or 4 person passenger vehicle, then perhaps you should re-evaluate your driving habits.
I think my driving habits are great, since I'm the one who hasn't had a wreck before. Underpowered, as in not being able to safely pass without relying on the mercy of others in more capable vehicles.

Yet, that car still outsells all 3 series BMWs combined in the US. Gee, go figure.
and McDonald's sells more burgers than the Rosebud in Chicago.

Like Spheric suggests, some of us have better things to do with that $10000 or whatever. Like his studio equipment, or vacation, or perhaps even his daughter's future education.
For what you paid for the Prius, you could have gotten a better driving car. Doesn't have to be a Beemer, almost anything is better.

Seriously, the more you argue the Fire is like an inexpensive car, the more it makes it sound like it should do well in terms of sales, now and going forward. Inexpensive cars far outsell higher end luxury cars, and a lot of people like me have no interest in unnecessarily spending more on cars because the added features really offer little real world benefit. The added cost just becomes a waste of money.
Except there are cars that cost less than a Prius that are better. Like the Focus, or Mini, or Cruze, or GTI, or damned well just about anything else in it's size class.

This kinda reminds me when I went to Toyota dealership to buy a Prius. While I was waiting I decided to browse again through some of the other Toyota models and the Lexus models too. Some dude saw me looking at the Lexus and said he was picking one up. I told him it seemed decent but it just wasn't for me. This (forward) guy then tells me if I can afford the Lexus then I should get one. I said no, because I actually preferred the Prius, and even if I didn't, I didn't feel like spending twice as much on a car that isn't going to be doing anything more for me. He looked at me as if I was completely nuts and said that I should get one if I can afford one. The guy was so convinced of his own opinion's superiority, that he simply had his mind closed to anything else. Sounds familiar.
Nope, because you could have gotten a much better drive for your buck from a Corolla, and saved $10k. Takes a looong time to save that much on fuel, dude.
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Dec 19, 2011, 06:36 AM
 
I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
     
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Dec 19, 2011, 10:16 AM
 
Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep View Post
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ort888
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Dec 19, 2011, 12:30 PM
 
This one is slow as hell, you can't haul stuff in it and if it rains you get wet.

This one has big cushy seats, a roof, goes super fast and can hold additional people and things.

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Eug
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Dec 19, 2011, 12:52 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Maybe if you drove a car with decent handling for a while you'd see the light.
Such differences in handling's "funness" might be more of a concern if I happened to like going on long drives in the country. I personally find that an incredible bore. The purpose of a car is to get me and the stuff I'm carrying from A to B. The less I have to drive, the better.

If I have spare time, I'd rather pull out one of my bicycles. And in the winter I'd rather stay home and watch a movie or something.

I think my driving habits are great, since I'm the one who hasn't had a wreck before. Underpowered, as in not being able to safely pass without relying on the mercy of others in more capable vehicles.
Pretty much with almost any car sold in North America, if you need more power then you're not driving defensively enough. Furthermore, it's not as if people with muscle cars or beemers get into less accidents than people with conservative family cars. ie. Your contention is bull.

and McDonald's sells more burgers than the Rosebud in Chicago.
Indeed. This discussion was about the Fire, and its potential market. Many of us think its potential sales is quite large, because it satisfies a need in expensively.

BTW, I eat at places that are single digit $ for a meal and other places that are 3 digit $ for a meal per person without alcohol. Yeah, the 3 digit $ places are better but they're 3-digit $. If I was forced to choose between one or the other for the rest of my life, I'd choose the single digit $ places every time. You can get quite decent meals for under 10 bucks, and quite tasty and satisfying. No, it wouldn't be McDonald's but fortunately McDonald's isn't the only restaurant with sub $10 meals.

For what you paid for the Prius, you could have gotten a better driving car. Doesn't have to be a Beemer, almost anything is better.
Looked into a bunch of German cars (BMW 3-series - friend's car, Volkwagon Jetta - friend's car, Audi A4 - didn't test drive) and some Japanese ones (Accord & Camry). Meh. In the end none of them really fit the bill, and it's not as if I actually enjoyed driving any of them more than a Prius. (See above.) The other main option was a Subaru hatchback, but I ended up getting the Prius.

Except there are cars that cost less than a Prius that are better. Like the Focus, or Mini, or Cruze, or GTI, or damned well just about anything else in it's size class.
I like the Mini but it's way too small, and I've never liked the Focus, dunno why. Never driven a Cruze. If by GTI you mean Golf GTI, it was too small.

Nope, because you could have gotten a much better drive for your buck from a Corolla, and saved $10k. Takes a looong time to save that much on fuel, dude.
The Corolla is a compact. The main competition at the time for the Prius was the Camry. It had more power, but wasn't a hatchback, and cost more after you factored in the features and the tax rebates (several thousand dollars worth). As for Subaru, that could be still on the list for a future car since the tax rebates on the Prius are now gone.

Clearly you have strong opinions about the cars you drive. However, what you really need to learn is that a lot of people don't really give a chit that you think car A drives better than car B, and no, they are not idiots, despite the fact that you think your opinion is superior to everyone else's. There is more to a car than just handling. There are several other factors including things like comfort, flexibility, roominess, and not least, price. Similarly, with tablets, there is more to them than just the 10" size, etc. Price is an integral part of the discussion.
( Last edited by Eug; Dec 19, 2011 at 01:12 PM. )
     
Shaddim
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Dec 19, 2011, 03:18 PM
 
Price would be part of the discussion, when talking about the Fire, if a 7" tablet is a good idea, but it isn't. As I've said many, many times, with the support of the vast majority of reviewers, it's a crappy size. So, we have to look at 9"+ tablets to find the "best bang for the buck". Now, if you want to argue what that is, we'd have a whale of a discussion; android vs. iOS, flexibility vs. function, raw performance vs. apparent feel, etc. etc..

However, this whole thread has continued because of the things you dislike or have no passion for. So, we can conclude that; if you don't like to drive, want a car with some room, and can be sold on fuel economy, despite the up-front higher cost that will require many years to recoup.. buy a Prius. In a similar vein; if you don't really like tablet computing, want an LCD reader that can do a lot of tablet-like functions in a pinch, don't mind the dead-end OS, and can be sold on a form factor that's much too cramped so you can save $100... buy a Fire.

I think that about covers it, except for the McDonald's thing, because no one should ever eat there. Ever. *shudder*
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imitchellg5
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Dec 19, 2011, 03:29 PM
 
You still don't understand that most people, would, in fact, give up features to save $100. Which, again, is HALF of the Fire's MSRP.
     
Shaddim
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Dec 19, 2011, 03:56 PM
 
Giving up features is one thing, several 10" tablets do that, but giving up a usable size is another.

$200 for something that doesn't work well at all
or
$300 for something that's actually pleasant to use

That's what I'm saying, that's what reviewers are saying. It's a horrible trade-off and not worth the savings.
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Wiskedjak
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Dec 19, 2011, 03:59 PM
 
And, you still don't understand that, just as some people prefer cars like the Prius, some people actually prefer a smaller screen for better portability. It may not be a lot of people, but it might be enough for Amazon.
     
imitchellg5
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Dec 19, 2011, 04:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
Giving up features is one thing, several 10" tablets do that, but giving up a usable size is another.

$200 for something that doesn't work well at all
or
$300 for something that's actually pleasant to use

That's what I'm saying, that's what reviewers are saying. It's a horrible trade-off and not worth the savings.
Honeycomb is pleasant to use??? It's atrocious! Even Matias Duarte, Honeycomb's UI designer says it was nothing more than a list minute attempt to put Android on a tablet.
     
Shaddim
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Dec 19, 2011, 04:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
Honeycomb is pleasant to use??? It's atrocious! Even Matias Duarte, Honeycomb's UI designer says it was nothing more than a list minute attempt to put Android on a tablet.
With ICS (4.0) out, all the major makers are in the process of porting their newer products to it (except Amazon, because the Fire doesn't meet the specs required). That aside, 3.2 is decent, better than the laggy, bloated Gingerbread-based abomination on the Fire.

And yes, ICS is pleasant to use, I've used it myself. If Apple doesn't watch it, Google is going to be breathing down their neck.
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Eug
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Dec 19, 2011, 06:13 PM
 
Sometimes small is good... Heh. I wonder if this parking is legal.



P.S. The next time we go to France, there's no way we're gonna rent a mid-size. What a frickin' PITA there with a mid-size. It's gonna be either compact or subcompact, or possibly even a Smart if we can get by with less luggage.

For a computer, we took my 11" Windows laptop. iOS was problematic for compatibility with certain websites, not surprisingly (as evidenced by the problems on my iPhone).
     
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Dec 19, 2011, 09:47 PM
 
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
Sometimes small is good... Heh. I wonder if this parking is legal.
In Calgary, it isn't legal ... mostly due to the inability of the bureaucratic mind to reach beyond it's rule books.
     
glideslope
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Dec 19, 2011, 10:06 PM
 
Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
Um, I was going to post my thoughts after using a Kindle Fire for a day, but I think this thread has moved on.

Long story short: the Fire is rubbish.
Agreed. Total Rubbish.

This thread went south about 5 pages ago.
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imitchellg5
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Dec 20, 2011, 02:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by Shaddim View Post
(except Amazon, because the Fire doesn't meet the specs required).
I can see you'll never, ever, understand the point of an affordable product.
     
Shaddim
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Dec 20, 2011, 05:19 AM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
I can see you'll never, ever, understand the point of an affordable product.
Just because something is inexpensive doesn't mean it's cheap. The Fire is both, other tablets aren't.

Also, you'll never understand that affordable is a relative term. What's affordable for me would give you sticker shock. What's affordable for you would make a homeless guy shake his head and call you a spoiled rich kid.
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Dec 20, 2011, 10:23 AM
 
Thirteen pages later, do we know which is the better tablet computer?
     
ort888
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Dec 20, 2011, 11:17 AM
 
Yes. The one that costs 2.5 as much and comes from a company that is known for making computing devices and not selling books.

Shocking!

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ort888
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Dec 20, 2011, 11:18 AM
 
Speaking of, if you go to amazon.com and type "iPad" in the search bar, the first entry you find is this...

Amazon.com Message

Not a very honest chart. And I get that it's their site and whatnot, but it's also kind of shady to make the #1 hit a comparison between the iPad and your product.

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Spheric Harlot
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Dec 20, 2011, 05:14 PM
 
     
imitchellg5
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Dec 20, 2011, 06:43 PM
 
Netflix plays in HD on the Fire...
     
Lateralus
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Dec 20, 2011, 07:12 PM
 
Man. This thread ****ing sucks now.
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Paco500
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Dec 20, 2011, 09:43 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
Netflix plays in HD on the Fire...
Fire resolution is 1024 x 600. What HD format do you think the fire can play?
     
imitchellg5
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Dec 20, 2011, 09:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by Paco500 View Post
Fire resolution is 1024 x 600. What HD format do you think the fire can play?
Never mind, it says "HQ."

I don't think the iPad can play Netflix in HD either? It looks pretty much the same to me on the Fire as my iPad 1.

As a side note, the Fire seems to be faster browsing the web IMO than the original iPad, but not iPad 2.
     
 
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