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Objective C
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Peldone
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Jun 23, 2000, 04:25 PM
 
I have been trying to work with Interface Builder and Project Builder to create some basic programs in OS X and I am finding that I need to learn more about Objective C. I know C++ and so I can sort of read Objective C and my program can execute tasks when I click on buttons. I am now am trying to create more complicated and useful functionality. I have read the documentation I could find on Apple's web site about Objective C and found it lacking in substance (disclaimer: or myself lacking in brains.) Does anyone know of any good books or better yet know of some good places to find sample code? I have looked at the sample code that is included on the OS X DP4 install and it doesn't cover samples of what I am trying to figure out. For example I am trying to create a list view that shows the file names that I have searched for and I was not able to make sense of Apple's documentation about datasources. It just felt like they assumed some information that wasn't transparent to me. Any helpful programmer links or books etc... for Objective C and OS X would be greatly appreciated. Deep peace to you.

-Brian
     
ralph_on_dp4
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Jun 23, 2000, 06:55 PM
 
try http://www.stepwise.com

They have some sample code and further infos, most of it is still related to MacOS X Server + Openstep, but that's where Objective C comes from.

You might also try to get some old OpenStep manuals...

PS: Apple recommends programming the Cocoa APIs in Java...

Hope that helps.

Ralph
     
Michaeld
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Jun 24, 2000, 03:31 AM
 
Sorry...but they don't,

At the Cocoa seminars at WWDC, they were recommending using Objective C, and saying that Java is there...but not completely. IE Java will work, but still has some developement to do.

Cocoa is made of Obj C, and this OC will, for the time being, work the best in it.

Mike


PS: Apple recommends programming the Cocoa APIs in Java...
Ralph
     
ralph_sch
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Jun 24, 2000, 07:01 AM
 
Hi Mike,

I really haven't been to WWDC myself, but after reading Jobs' JavaONE statements and the announcement of a Java version of WO I really thought Apple might prefer Java for Cocoa, too. I have just played around a bit with DP4 but I'm really closer to WO than to what Cocoa is going to be on MacOS X. I haven't spent a lot of time with DP4 because I heard that WO 4.5 apps are not going to be supported on this platform. However, I do not know too much about what Cocoa is going to be, but I really think if Apple is going to carry on with their Objective C support, Java will be supported at least equally because there are a * lot * more people dealing with it and Apple really needs support for the platform.
Currently, WO and the Yellow Box (whatever it may be called next week) are one, but I have absolutely no clue where EOF is going... I really don't want to be some sort of smartass here, so if you have more info on this topic, I should be grateful if you could enlighten me further...

Ralph
     
bentwookie
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Jun 24, 2000, 06:22 PM
 
When I first started Cocoa programming a year ago, I thought, "I really don't want to learn a new language, much less one used by only one company." Well it's a year later, and I can't describe how much I love ObjectiveC.

If all you've ever known is C/C++, you owe it to yourself to see how nice OO can be. Beyond being OO, it is EXTREMELY dynamic.

For example, "pointers" to functions (although I hesitate calling them pointers) can be described and stored easily using the @selector command. When you make connections in InterfaceBuilder, it's just storing these selectors to use later at runtime. You simply cannot do this with a static language like C++.

Look at MFC. Applications created with it are a mess of macros and VisC++ generated code. We've all had this system come crashing down at one time or another because somebody checked in a bogus .h file or incorrectly tweaked a //AFX<messofcraphere> insertion. It doesn't work! IB and ObjectiveC do!

The AppKit and Foundation frameworks were built in ObjectiveC. As such, you'll have a better time using them in ObjectiveC.

Short of learning a new language (and it's sooo simple to pick up), what's the point of using Java? You're linking against the AppKit anyway, so your end result isn't 100% Java. It's just slow.
     
Scott_H
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Jun 24, 2000, 09:41 PM
 
I know C and used C++ enough to know I never want to touch it again. Objective-C looked very cool. I read though the stuff at Apple developer site and felt I could pick it up rather quickly. It's worth reading the intro over there. I think there's sample code too?
     
macinteo
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Jun 25, 2000, 12:06 PM
 
Here's a little documentation on OC. U could start from it.

Apple TechPubs: http://developer.apple.com/techpubs/...tiveC/ObjC.pdf http://developer.apple.com/techpubs/...niquesBook.pdf

MacTech magazine (the article should be on line too. search http://www.mactech.com/) :
Vol 13 No. 3 - 'C++ versus Objective-C' - by Michael Rutman - pagg 58..61

... or just use your mac knowledge by programming with Carbon under PB/IB.
The support is still under construction, but will come in the NeXT future...

     
Michaeld
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Jun 29, 2000, 07:07 AM
 

Hi Ralph

You are absolutely right about Apples total commitment to Java. They want OS X to be the premier Java developement and deployment machine.
Its just at the moment Apple is working on bringing full Java support to Cocoa. They are close to it, but not quite there yet. Thus there comments at WWDC to also check out Obj C.

Also...remember the audiances they were preaching to. At the seminar at the WWDC they were mainly NeXt Developers there, while at the Java conference...well, you guess who was there ;-).

As far as I am aware...Apple will keep up Obj C for the Next ppl, and Java for Sun and everyone else.

I think Apple's long term path is pretty clear. Classic will die soon (or be put to the back of the priority queue), they will encourage developers to phase out of Carbon and into Cocoa with either Java or Obj C, and Java and Obj C will be the languages of the future.

Mike


Originally posted by ralph_sch:
Hi Mike,

I really haven't been to WWDC myself, but after reading Jobs' JavaONE statements and the announcement of a Java version of WO I really thought Apple might prefer Java for Cocoa, too. I have just played around a bit with DP4 but I'm really closer to WO than to what Cocoa is going to be on MacOS X. I haven't spent a lot of time with DP4 because I heard that WO 4.5 apps are not going to be supported on this platform. However, I do not know too much about what Cocoa is going to be, but I really think if Apple is going to carry on with their Objective C support, Java will be supported at least equally because there are a * lot * more people dealing with it and Apple really needs support for the platform.
Currently, WO and the Yellow Box (whatever it may be called next week) are one, but I have absolutely no clue where EOF is going... I really don't want to be some sort of smartass here, so if you have more info on this topic, I should be grateful if you could enlighten me further...

Ralph
     
nibs
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Jul 3, 2000, 04:29 PM
 
     
   
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