[wilburguy]

Hi,

I replaced my PowerBook 550 with a new 1Ghz with 1 gig ram and a combo drive. The fan noise is unbearable, much louder than my 550 and coming on more frequently. The fan that comes on is located on the right side by the power switch, and comes on more ofter with the power adapter plugged in than when running on battery power alone.

Anyone else have this problem? it is loud enough to disturb conversation in the room. If i was doing remote recording (the reason I bought this) the noise would ruin an acoustic or orchestral recording.

[mbperk]

You may want to call Apple. I have no problem with mine running all that much, and when it does it is not that loud at all. And I agree that it does run more often when it is plugged in rather than when I am running battery power.

[issa]

wilburguy,
I think mbperk makes a good suggestion about checking with Apple. The fan on the right by the power switch shouldn't run anywhere near as loud as the fan on the 550/667 generation. The one on my 1GHz machine does run a good deal of the time, more than I would like; but it is not loud at all. That's even when working late at night in a quiet room.

Just curious...are you running OS X or OS 9.2.2? I ask because I find that the fan does run a lot more when in 9.2.2 and it also runs harder thus louder in system 9.2.2. In contrast, it is quieter and much better behaved in OS X 10.2.2.

[cambro]

I agree, something must be up with your machine. The first-cycle fan on my Ghz combo is very, very quiet. In fact, the hard drive on my old Ti400 is almost as loud as the first fan! When I'm cranking photos around between iPhoto and Photoshop Elements, the second cycle fan occassionally (though not always) comes on and it is definitely a notch up on the annoying scale. However, even this is much, much quieter than the high speed fans on the 667 VGAs that I've heard.

Good luck.

[El Pre$idente]

Hey, man. If you're doing graphics, video or games on any TiBook, any laptop even, then that CPU is going to call for the fan to start pumping out the hot air. Any laptop!

[wilburguy]

I did a test between my 550 and 1Ghz. Both plugged in. Ran MPG video of same Star trek on both machines. I started them at the same time. At 20min, the 1Ghz side fan kicks in full bore, measuring 57dB A weighted, 4 fingers from the fan. At 30 min, the back(only) fan on th 550 kicks in, measuring below scale at the same distance from the fan. The 550 is definately quieter than the 1Ghz.

BTW I'm running 10.2.2

[claughery]

yeah... I think that the fan does run a bit much, But... You have 1ghz under there.
It is not that disturbing unless you need to record music...
Just thank god that it isn't as loud as the new Powermacs!

[wilburguy]

Unfortunately, recording music is what i do....

[claughery]

well, if it really is that unbearable, I don't think you would have any better luck with a PC.
An ibook WOULD be quieter, BUT you would not have the power.
Is it really that bad? Or can you deal with it?

Other than that, do you like your ti?

[wilburguy]

FWIW_ My 550 was not this loud. I'm torn. I could sell the old 550 today, but i just don't know about the noise.

Otherwise, the machine freakin rocks!

[mrmister]

Charlton, is that you?

I think you may have some kind of defect with your TiBook...mine doesn�t run quite that hot at all, and the fan doesn�t kick on very often at all. When it does it takes a lot for it to go loud.

Maybe you should try the same experiment with processor cycling on, just for completeness?

[claughery]

how do you deal with processor cycling, and what exactly does it do?

[mrmister]

You reduce the processor speed, in the Energy Settings preference panel. Less performance, but you get less fan too.

[claughery]

do you know what that bumps the processor down to?

[Stelliform]

I would still check with Apple if I were you. I had to put my head next to my 1Ghz to confirm that the fan was running when I first got it. (Granted I am deaf from all the noisy PC's in my office) Even at my house after the kids went to bed the fan noise was barely noticable.

(My Dell sounds like a low flying plane.)

[wilburguy]

I did call tech support at both Apple and TekServe in NYC. Both techs confirm that the new fan in the 1 ghz PowerBooks comes on more often and can be "quite audible" Apple suggested that i run it through tech support to see if it is within spec. I'll be sending it to TekServe this week to see what's up. If this amount of noise specs out as OK, I'll be putting my 1 Ghz on Ebay and keeping my old 550.

I'm soo bummed.....

[cambro]

Originally posted by claughery:
do you know what that bumps the processor down to?

This is an excellent question...I haven't exactly dug around everywhere but I haven't been able to find anything on this. Anyone know what the deal is with processor cycling on the PBs in X?

[cruise]

Originally posted by cambro:

This is an excellent question...I haven't exactly dug around everywhere but I haven't been able to find anything on this. Anyone know what the deal is with processor cycling on the PBs in X?

I believe that the 1 GHz is bumped down to 666 MHz when processor cycling is enabled.

[seanyepez]

Originally posted by cruise:


I believe that the 1 GHz is bumped down to 666 MHz when processor cycling is enabled.

Both machines are bumped down to 667 megahertz.

[riverfreak]

I cannot believe that people can "barely hear" the fan or that they have to "lean into" the machine to hear it. It is freaking loud. If you are using the standard "power adaptor" settings, try doing anything, like copying a gig of files over the network or something. The fan will come on in about five minutes.

I'm not saying that this is bad, it's just that the powerbook requires that cooling. Coming from the absolutely silent iBook, I was a little suprised, but am used to it now. And in climate controlled conditions like most workspaces, it isn't even an issue since the ambient noise masks it anyways.

But at home, I definitely hear it.

Still, even if you are recording music, I don't think it's loud enough to be prohibitive. You aren't, after all, relying on the built in microphone, are you?

[azark]

I have the 1Ghz, had the 550 and I am a sound engineer..so here's my 2 euro-cents

Maybe you'd better check with Apple cause my 550 was way more noisy than the 1Gzh!!

The quiet fan run more often, but is OK.
The higher fan is really quieter than the 550's high fan.
+ there was a ground noise with the 550 (when you didn't touch it) and that's fixed!

So this + the extra power make the 1Ghz a better audio solution for me.

I guess that, as for me, reducing the processor speed is not a solution!

But you can't have a totally quiet computer. The Ti is really more quiet than a tower anyway.

If you record accoustic stuff in the same room than musicians, which I don't, you probably need a totally silent solution, if that exists.

[wilburguy]

Azark, you said that "The quiet fan run more often, but is OK."

Which fan do you mean, the back center or top right corner fan?

Then you said "The higher fan is really quieter than the 550's high fan."

You mean, the side one? I rarely hear the back fan. I hear the drive in the back, but not the fan. It's the fan by the power switch that just come on full speed with medium cpu useage (like downloading or recording 2 tracks) that's killing me. Does your side fan have a low and high speed? maybe that's my problem. Hmmm

[StiZeven]

Since it is a 1GHz chip - I don't think the issue is that the fans are on often, the real issue here is why are they loud? I literally can NOT hear the fan in my Dell notebook, and the fan in my 3GHz desktop is VERY quiet (way more quiet than my PowerBook). So the question is, why the hell is Apple using loud fans when quiet ones are out there? Certainly they wouldn't be penny pinching in their PowerBook line for professionals? Isn't horrendous fan noise a problem in their pro desktop line as well?

In a nutshell, I don't care if the fans come on to cool the system - I just don't want to hear them (nor should I have to). Since there ARE quiet notebook and desktop fans out there, I think Apple should be using them (I mean they ARE charging a premium for the pro line).

Things like this just PISS me off!

[jmp998]

Originally posted by StiZeven:
Since it is a 1GHz chip - I don't think the issue is that the fans are on often, the real issue here is why are they loud? I literally can NOT hear the fan in my Dell notebook...

How thick is your Dell laptop?
In general, one of the best ways to make a fan quieter (without sacrificing air flow) is to make it larger and lower RPM, and give it plenty of surrounding air space. The ultra-thin design of the powerbook G4 forces Apple to use very small and high RPM fans. I suspect part of the fan-noise problem is a design compromise imposed by the 1" thick profile. Note that I'm not saying this was the ideal choice-personally I'd rather have a 1.25" thick powerbook with no fan noise, if this is the problem.

[StiZeven]

Actually, my Dell notebook is .8" thin (thinner than the TiBook). The fan comes on often, but you simply don't hear it unless you put your ear to it or feel the air push out of the side vents. Quiet fans in the TiBook would make it near perfect.

[StiZeven]

Well now isn't this funny. As I was posting that message my TiBook fan came on. All I've been doing for the past 25min (since I turned it on) is reading posts on this site. So no hard activity and using the low power option STILL kicks the fan on. Great.

[jmp998]

Originally posted by StiZeven:
Actually, my Dell notebook is .8" thin (thinner than the TiBook). The fan comes on often, but you simply don't hear it unless you put your ear to it or feel the air push out of the side vents. Quiet fans in the TiBook would make it near perfect.

I don't know much about Dell's, but if it's 0.8" I'm guessing it must be one of those Latitudes with a 800MHz P3 (that's all I could find at the Dell store that's even close). Seems like in some ways this is more comparable to an iBook (focus on smaller size/portability with a previous generation and very low wattage CPU to extend battery life and reduce heat). Not so surprising that it's quiet with that low power CPU-so are the iBooks.

Are there any P4 laptops 1" thick with nearly silent fans? That would seem to be a more appropriate comparison.

[StiZeven]

Yes it's the small Latitude. However, it runs at the full 800MHz with wireless constantly on and I have a 5400rpm hard drive in there. The TiBook cuts down to 667MHz when in reduced power mode and less activity and there is little to no change.

That's all irrelevant though, it's about the noise of the fan. We have the 1.5" 2.2GHz Inspiron 4150's at work and they too have quiet fans. Also, as I mentioned earlier my new 3GHz PC Desktop has a nice and quiet fan where the PowerMac run at half the speed and are twice as loud.

Regardless of the size of the computer, Apple is simply not using quiet fans in their hardware. Why, I don't know. I can only assume that the ones they are currently using are more cost efficient for them.

[seanyepez]

Admittedly, Intel's 3-gigahertz Pentium 4 does have nice cooling options for silent operation, but the Power Mac features dual processors cooled by a single heat sink. The G4 is also not manufactured on the same, 0.13-micron process that allows P4's to run so cool. Times will change...

[Charles Bouldin]

Originally posted by StiZeven:
Yes it's the small Latitude. However, it runs at the full 800MHz with wireless constantly on and I have a 5400rpm hard drive in there. The TiBook cuts down to 667MHz when in reduced power mode and less activity and there is little to no change.

That's all irrelevant though, it's about the noise of the fan. We have the 1.5" 2.2GHz Inspiron 4150's at work and they too have quiet fans. Also, as I mentioned earlier my new 3GHz PC Desktop has a nice and quiet fan where the PowerMac run at half the speed and are twice as loud.

Regardless of the size of the computer, Apple is simply not using quiet fans in their hardware. Why, I don't know. I can only assume that the ones they are currently using are more cost efficient for them.

Here's my $0.02 (US ). The noise from Apple's latest computers is appalling. Dell laptops and towers are MUCH quieter. I have an 867 Quicksilver and 1 ghz tibook, as well as a 2 ghz Dell Precision laptop and a 2.4 ghz Dell tower. The Dell's are much, much quieter than the Macs, despite using P4's that practically warm the room. Apple should put some engineering effort into this, as it is really an embarassing departure from their emphasis on good human engineering.

I upgraded from a tibook/400 to the 1ghz book, and I am disappointed in the noise from the fan. The 400 almost never turned on the fan, although the bottom case would get very hot. OTOH, the 1ghz doesn't get nearly so warm on the case, but the fan(s) run much more. I would prefer a hotter case and a quiter computer! To be fair, when the ti/400 fan came on, it was much louder than the 1 ghz fan, but the fan almost never came on.

I can contribute one possibly practical suggestion for cooling a powerbook without the fan coming on. See
http://lonestar.texas.net/~jsavidge/passivecooling/
I can verify that this works, since my tibooks both run cooler on the granite counter tops in the kitchen. I am seriously thinking of going back to the shop that cuts granite and getting a small scrap piece for my desk. This isn't quite a "portable" solution, but might work for a fixed location like your office.

[cambro]

Yup, I agree...I too upgraded from a Ti400 to a Ti1000. The fan noise is much more annoying on the Ghz (obviously), but pesonally I find the first-cycle fan very quiet and perfectly acceptable with this level of portable performance. Fortunately (or unfortunately?) I don't have any Dell's with to compare the fan noise.

The passive cooling solution that Charles Bouldin pointed out is clever, but as discussed above, it's too bad that Apple couldn't find an innovative solution that doesn't require 12 pounds of rock.

[cambro]

Originally posted by cambro:
Yup, I agree...I too upgraded from a Ti400 to a Ti1000. The fan noise is much more annoying on the Ghz (obviously), but pesonally I find the first-cycle fan very quiet and perfectly acceptable with this level of portable performance. Fortunately (or unfortunately?) I don't have any Dell's with which to compare the fan noise.

The passive cooling solution that Charles Bouldin pointed out is clever but, as discussed above, it's too bad that Apple couldn't find an innovative solution that doesn't require 12 pounds of rock.

EDIT:: Sean and cruise...thanks for the info on processor speed in "reduced performance" mode.

[caseygittings]

I dont know what you guys are blabbing about send your books back if they are loud. I have to put my ear up to mine to even tell if its on or not. I sit up late at night in my office and I cant hear a thing. When it kicks on the only way to hear it is by putting your ear on top of the power button. Guys, I hate to say it but, send'em back.. They should be silent like mine and the other posting messages.

[craigthomas]

My 500 fan is very loud and kicks in often. My 800 fan rarely comes on and is much quieter. Here's hoping that my soon to come 1Ghz SD will be a quiet as my 800.

[wilburguy]

Some testing and conclusions:

Those of you who do not have a problem with fan noise apparently do not do any sort of audio or video work with your machines. If you want to hear the fan noise in question, try watching a DVD with the power plugged in or watch a 30 min MPG movie and you'll hear what I mean.

I did a test regarding fan noise onset while recording audio.
I used an OSX version of Bias Peak, recording with the built in mic. With the energy saver set for highest performance, the back fan kicked into high speed at 3:09 and the blow dryer on the right side kicked in at 8:39.

I let the machine cool down in sleep mode for 20 minutes.

I then did the same test with the CPU speed kicked down in the energy saver and 18 min the back fan just turned on low speed. I have to put my ear to the keyboard to hear it. The side fan has not turned on.

20:26 the back fan kicks into high, but then again i now have a web browser and my mail app open.

Conclusions? If I want to use this for quiet audio recording I need to throttle down the CPU speed to keep this beast quiet.

[craigthomas]

Do you have a Podium CoolPad? It maintains nice space below the computer keeping it running cooler. I also like the ergonomics of the keyboard angle and the swivel it provides. I'm sure it will help you.

[Troll]

I have an iMac DV 400. It doesn't have a fan, but it's still noisier than my 867MHz PowerBook (mostly hard drive noise)! I WAS surprised at how often the fan comes on on the PowerBook. Even just downloading off the net sets it off but almost all computers are noisy. They're not made to go IN the recording studio itself if you're recording triangles!

Once you get a guitar or a set of drums going, the noise your PowerBook makes is going to be drowned out. Besides which, the fact that it's a pure tone, means it's easy to edit/filter out. Still, in a professional environment, wouldn't you leave it in the control room?

If we're talking home recording in your lounge, I've always hit record and then crossed the room to a Mic and recorded my acoustic guitar from there. Had more problems with dogs barking and cars passing than I ever had with the noise from my iMac. It helps to make sure the computer is on a solid surface so that you reduce the sound board surface.

What precisely are you trying to record?

[wilburguy]

This time I tested both the 1ghz and my old 550. Recorded with Peak on both machines, but with the 1Ghz machine throttled down in the energy saver.
At 17:15 both back fans kick on at ther same time. At 25 min the 1Ghz goes hoover...

Called tech support again, talked to another "product specialist" who sounded a bit annoyed to talk to me. He was very clear that the back fan was multi speed and that the side fan is single speed and "comes on loud".

Conclusion?
1. my powerbook is not defective
2. Apple has resolved the hot power switch issue by installing a miniature blow dryer fan in the same corner. They traded heat for noise.

Frankly, the heat never bothered me. The side fan however, is a BIG DRAG.

So, all in all, the screen is brighter, the resolution better, graphics better, the speed is awesome, and the price is noise.

If the side fan noise is a problem for anyone but me, you really should take the time to call tech support and complain. Otherwise, they won't know how much it sucks and won't do anything about it.

Over and out.

[gg1234]

You may want to find out first hand if your Ti is defective rather than letting some guy on phone telling you it "comes on loud". If you don't want to send it in for a check out you might want to check out another unit at Comp USA or the like.

I am not even going to tell you how loud is loud to you but in my case the machine is fairly quiet (to me). Yes, it is easy to hear the fan but it is in no way distracting enough to interfere with normal conversation, even in a small room. Yes, the noise does pick up when the second fan kicks in and the most annoying thing about that (to me) is the beat pattern. So far I haven't heard my 1Ghz be as noisy as my old 667 VGA...

Oh, and about that beat pattern....it's fairly slow so the difference in frequency between the two fans is not alot....meaning they are running close to the same speed.

[wilburguy]

It's off to TekServe in NYC to be checked out. BTW- If you are not hip to TekServe, they are AWESOME!

[DVD Plaza]

On my PowerBook 800 DVI the fan is incredibly quite when it kicks in, I have to put my ear right up to the keyboard and have often difficulty determining if I am just hearing the hard disk spinning or if it is the fan.

BUT, if I do a lot of work in PhotoShop or have a CD/DVD spinnning then the fan kicks in at high speed and boy - does it sound like a mini-dustbuster/hairdryer!!! Quite annoying when that comes on, but luckily it's not often and usually turns off pretty quickly.

Although I'm still waiting on my new 1GHz SD, from the posts here it sounds like the blowdry fan kicks in a lot more often now - DAMN, that noise is outright loud!

[wilburguy]

The new models have a new fan up by the power switch as well as the one in the back. I think the 800 only has one.

[photoeditor]

So far I have only heard one speed on the processor fan. For me, coming from a tower, it is a huge improvement, but it is irritating, especially when I remember the silence of my PB 190 years ago, but then again it is nice that the handrest on this new one doesn't overheat my wrists . . . of course, given the choice between this fan with the silent 60GB hard drive and my professor's HP laptop with a quiet and rarely active fan but a hard drive that sounds like a dentist's drill . . . I guess I'll take the fan over the noisy hard drive. (And I'll always take the Mac over the PC!!)

The power switch fan on the right hand side comes on if you're doing a fair bit with the processor set to "Highest Speed" and/or if you're drawing a lot of juice through the power adapter.

What I'm a little concerned about is that once the processor fan comes on, it doesn't seem to want to go off unless you let the system go to sleep. Not sure I understand this, because the computer isn't exactly overheating.

[sloosley]

Has anyone tired the Podium Cooling Pad? Does it *really* keep the unit cool so that the fan doesn't run as much?

Thanks,
-steve

[RMXO]

Originally posted by sloosley:
Has anyone tired the Podium Cooling Pad? Does it *really* keep the unit cool so that the fan doesn't run as much?

Thanks,
-steve

i use the podium with my 800DVI. my fan never comes on. even with touching the bottom of the laptop. it seems cooler than w/o using the podium...

[craigthomas]

Originally posted by sloosley:
Has anyone tired the Podium Cooling Pad? Does it *really* keep the unit cool so that the fan doesn't run as much?

Thanks,
-steve

Mine most definately helps. I just about always use the coolpad. Occasionally I don't and notice that the louder fan comes one more often. If you use the computer on your lap, it's a blessing. Keeps your legs from the heat and keeps the computer cooler. Think about it: the hottest part of the Ti is the bottom. Add a coolpad and now you've opened up an inch of free circulation space where there was none. Me thinks that's got to help.

[sloosley]

Agreed. Conceptually it has to help. Thanks.
-s

[mrtew]

My Ti1gig's fans are MUCH quieter than my Ti400 or Ti667Rev2 were.

[workerbee]

You don't necessarily have to use a commercial coolpad or whatnot device. At home my T800 rests on a spare part of a metal table I have, with some styropor underneath. The fan only comes on when playing CPU-intensive games (JK II or WC III).
At work the T800 is on a massive wooden table, and the fan comes on much more easily (Dreamweaver ftp, Fireworks, watching DVD, stuff like that).
So I guess having metal underneath the TiBook really helps spreading the heat quite a lot.

[riverfreak]

Originally posted by caseygittings:
I dont know what you guys are blabbing about send your books back if they are loud. I have to put my ear up to mine to even tell if its on or not. I sit up late at night in my office and I cant hear a thing. When it kicks on the only way to hear it is by putting your ear on top of the power button. Guys, I hate to say it but, send'em back.. They should be silent like mine and the other posting messages.

Ya wanna hear the fan?

Try taking your powerbook out of your office where the ambient noise of the dueling heat and air conditioning that passes as energy efficiency in most work spaces is so deafeningly loud that you've probably lost half of your hearing already.

Go home. Sit in a room with no fans, ac, or heat on. Open the powerbook. Install X-Windows through fink or whatever (it will take a long long while).

That is the fan noise that people are talking about.