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Pol Lounge General News Thread of "This doesn't deserve it's own thread" (Page 13)
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Paco500
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May 16, 2017, 04:29 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
Part of my "overblown" argument is my instincts are telling me practically speaking this information isn't as sensitive as it's being made out to be. If it was, we would have never heard about it. The leakers aren't going to burn a genuinely valuable asset just to score points against Trump.

And as much as I bitch about the media, I don't think the Washington Post would do it either.
This guy believes that there are actual. responsible adults in the White House that were so alarmed by the president's behaviour that the story needed to get out.

Originally Posted by Conservative Pundit Erick Erickson
What sets this story apart for me, at least, is that I know one of the sources. And the source is solidly supportive of President Trump, or at least has been and was during Campaign 2016. But the President will not take any internal criticism, no matter how politely it is given. He does not want advice, cannot be corrected, and is too insecure to see any constructive feedback as anything other than an attack.

So some of the sources are left with no other option but to go to the media, leak the story, and hope that the intense blowback gives the President a swift kick in the butt. Perhaps then he will recognize he screwed up. The President cares vastly more about what the press says than what his advisers say. That is a real problem and one his advisers are having to recognize and use, even if it causes messy stories to get outside the White House perimeter.

I am told that what the President did is actually far worse than what is being reported. The President does not seem to realize or appreciate that his bragging can undermine relationships with our allies and with human intelligence sources. He also does not seem to appreciate that his loose lips can get valuable assets in the field killed.
     
Paco500
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May 16, 2017, 04:31 PM
 
Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants View Post
It's almost as if they've never read Machiavelli's The Prince, where this very strategy is outlined.
Did your book club finally finish Rules for Radicals?
     
Laminar
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May 16, 2017, 05:52 PM
 
Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants View Post
We're reaching the point where we won't know when there's an actual crisis, due to the MSM trying to bill everything Trump does as a crisis.
This has been the case since the second sentence he said in his campaign. I'm way past crisis exhaustion, and I'm sure others are too.
     
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May 16, 2017, 06:41 PM
 
No one in the LWMSM cared when intel Obama shared with the Russians resulted in attacks.
From fake news Newsbusters.
http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/nb/...a-russia-intel

The Today show.
Back in the summer of 2016, the Obama administration provided some information to the Russians about some of the things happening on the ground. Guess what happened? The Russians then attacked some of those sites of our allies, our proxies that we were working with. And that’s a problem.
Meanwhile, over on CNN’s New Day, political analyst Jeffrey Lord provided some “perspective” to anchor Chris Cuomo:

The only thing I would say here, Chris is perspective. Perspective is all. I'm holding two headlines from the Washington Post, one of May 25th, 2014, “White House mistakenly identifies CIA chief in Afghanistan.” The Obama administration put the name of the CIA on the press release, exposed him and endangered his life. The second one, June 30, 2016, “U.S. Offers to share Syrian intelligence on terrorist with Russia,” which is to say the Obama administration wanted to give their intelligence to the Russians. All I'm saying here is there’s perspective. We need to find out the facts and let’s have perspective.
     
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May 16, 2017, 07:51 PM
 
Originally Posted by Paco500 View Post
This guy believes that there are actual. responsible adults in the White House that were so alarmed by the president's behaviour that the story needed to get out.
Perhaps the source made the observation before this was the case, but I'm seeing all of the dangers he lists being reported on.

I'll also note however big of a deal it is, the source is going to want it to look like a bigger deal. They're not exactly a disinterested party.

That said, I'm in no rush to start dismissing claims, be they dire or fishy.
     
Paco500
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May 16, 2017, 07:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
That said, I'm in no rush to start dismissing claims, be they dire or fishy.
Don't you find if difficult to dismiss them given that the administration has not denied them- only justified them?
     
subego
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May 16, 2017, 08:16 PM
 
Which particular claim(s) do you have in mind?

I unfortunately didn't catch today's presser, so I could easily be out of date.
     
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May 16, 2017, 08:23 PM
 
Originally Posted by Paco500 View Post
Did your book club finally finish Rules for Radicals?
For sure, when you finish Thomas the Train you should check it out.
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May 16, 2017, 08:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
This has been the case since the second sentence he said in his campaign. I'm way past crisis exhaustion, and I'm sure others are too.
To be fair, you probably pay more attention to national news than the avg person.
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May 17, 2017, 07:50 AM
 
Listening carefully to WHAT the LWMSM talking heads are saying, it all becomes speculations, exaggerations and hyperbole.
Having no actual facts to present, MSNBC was running their banner BREAKING NEWS anyway. They have no credibility. Screaming for impeachment will backfire. Can you say President Pence?
     
The Final Dakar  (op)
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May 17, 2017, 09:46 AM
 
Originally Posted by BadKosh View Post
Listening carefully to WHAT the LWMSM talking heads are saying, it all becomes speculations, exaggerations and hyperbole.
Having no actual facts to present, MSNBC was running their banner BREAKING NEWS anyway. They have no credibility. Screaming for impeachment will backfire. Can you say President Pence?
Is your argument that impeachment is unnecessary because the VP is Mike Pence?
     
The Final Dakar  (op)
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May 17, 2017, 09:50 AM
 
Also since we're whinging about the media, Fox News' prime time lineup is pretending this isn't happening. You'd have a hard time convincing me CNN and MSNBC would do the same if the same allegations were made against a dem prez.
     
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May 17, 2017, 11:00 AM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
Is your argument that impeachment is unnecessary because the VP is Mike Pence?
Pence is to the right of Santorum.
     
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May 17, 2017, 11:05 AM
 
New Political Compass analysis:

"I have a dream, that my four little children will one day live in a
nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin,
but by the content of their character." - M.L.King Jr
     
The Final Dakar  (op)
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May 17, 2017, 11:13 AM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
Pence is to the right of Santorum.
That doesn't answer the question.
     
The Final Dakar  (op)
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May 17, 2017, 11:16 AM
 
You guys catch this? While Edrogan is in town people in the Turkish Embassy attacked protesters outside.

https://twitter.com/samira_ghaderi/s...50436095205377
     
Cap'n Tightpants
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May 17, 2017, 11:20 AM
 
Originally Posted by BadKosh View Post
Listening carefully to WHAT the LWMSM talking heads are saying, it all becomes speculations, exaggerations and hyperbole.
Having no actual facts to present, MSNBC was running their banner BREAKING NEWS anyway. They have no credibility. Screaming for impeachment will backfire. Can you say President Pence?
So few people are listening to them, except those who want to confirm their LW bias, it doesn't really matter what they say anymore. Nowadays, "anonymous source" is synonymous with made-up bullshit, and Comey is just pissed off over getting shit-canned, which we now know was because he patently refused to dedicate bureau resources to investigate the very serious problem of gov't leaks. None of this will lead to Trump's ouster, but it is good fodder for throwing the country into civil war, which is what will happen if they attempt to remove a duly elected president with such flimsy evidence.
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Laminar
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May 17, 2017, 11:41 AM
 
Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants View Post
To be fair, you probably pay more attention to national news than the avg person.
I don't think I do! I unsubscribed from most of the BS news subreddits, I've unfriended or unfollowed almost every single Facebook friend that posts political anything, most of what I get is from here or if I'm compelled to seek out research on my own.

Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants View Post
New Political Compass analysis:

Okay, fine, I snickered a bit.
     
BadKosh
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May 17, 2017, 11:54 AM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
Is your argument that impeachment is unnecessary because the VP is Mike Pence?
No....
It most likely won't happen. Republicans control both houses of Congress and trump is President. My point is the LWMSM is insane and putting out the most stupid BS with nothing in the way of actual facts being offered. Speculation isn't facts. Making incorrect comparisons isn't facts. lies and propaganda isn't facts. I suggest listening closely to the 'news' readers actual words and you'll see they are just spewing BS.
     
subego
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May 17, 2017, 11:54 AM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
Okay, fine, I snickered a bit.
Yeah...

And I can't really disagree with the claim I lie somewhere between pothead and neckbeard, nor can I deny the healthy dose of autistic screeching involved.
     
Cap'n Tightpants
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May 17, 2017, 11:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
I don't think I do! I unsubscribed from most of the BS news subreddits, I've unfriended or unfollowed almost every single Facebook friend that posts political anything, most of what I get is from here or if I'm compelled to seek out research on my own.
Those don't sound like the average person either, since most regular folks don't really know what reddit, 4chan, tumblr, etc. are. When they aren't working, they skim through their Facebook feeds looking for photos from people they care about (or cats), eat dinner, then watch whatever looks good on TV or Netflix. Apart from weather, sports, and local interest stuff, they really don't pay too much attention to the news. Most are very confused over what they're seeing about Trump; if they pull to the Left they think negative things about him, if they pull to the Right they think it's just the media trying to tear him down, and then go on about their lives. Very few give it much thought, let alone discuss it on a forum.
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The Final Dakar  (op)
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May 17, 2017, 11:57 AM
 
Originally Posted by BadKosh View Post
No....
It most likely won't happen. Republicans control both houses of Congress and trump is President. My point is the LWMSM is insane and putting out the most stupid BS with nothing in the way of actual facts being offered. Speculation isn't facts. Making incorrect comparisons isn't facts. lies and propaganda isn't facts. I suggest listening closely to the 'news' readers actual words and you'll see they are just spewing BS.
Why did you mention "President Pence "?
     
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May 17, 2017, 11:59 AM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
Yeah...

And I can't really disagree with the claim I lie somewhere between pothead and neckbeard, nor can I deny the healthy dose of autistic screeching involved.
Yeah, I'm squarely between the DTOM and neckbeard camps.
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May 17, 2017, 12:02 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
Why did you mention "President Pence "?
Likely because, even if the Left received all they wanted, the "best" they could hope for is President Pence, someone who is even more conservative and authoritarian than Trump.
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subego
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May 17, 2017, 12:04 PM
 
Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants View Post
Yeah, I'm squarely between the DTOM and neckbeard camps.
As an aside, purely for aesthetic reasons, I wish Join or Die had won out over DTOM.

Franklin was a ****ing genius.
     
subego
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May 17, 2017, 12:09 PM
 
Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants View Post
Likely because, even if the Left received all they wanted, the "best" they could hope for is President Pence, someone who is even more conservative and authoritarian than Trump.
One of my general arguments has been Trump isn't as far away from a "regular" Republican as people imagine.

Pence is Trump + Competence + Safer Rhetoric.
     
The Final Dakar  (op)
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May 17, 2017, 12:28 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
One of my general arguments has been Trump isn't as far away from a "regular" Republican as people imagine.

Pence is Trump + Competence + Safer Rhetoric.
I've been trying to figure out when the time is right to ask what are the legislative differences between Trump and republicans. Because so far, I'm not seeing any.
     
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May 17, 2017, 12:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
I've been trying to figure out when the time is right to ask what are the legislative differences between Trump and republicans. Because so far, I'm not seeing any.
Trump is more pro-gay.
     
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May 17, 2017, 01:09 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
Trump is more pro-gay.
Not according to his executive orders.
     
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May 17, 2017, 01:13 PM
 
80s democrat Trump who wanted the gays to like his swank resorts, sure he was more pro gay. This guy though?
     
subego
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May 17, 2017, 01:21 PM
 
We're comparing him to Republicans, right?

As in, home of the Constitutional Amendment Preserving the Sanctity of Marriage™.
     
The Final Dakar  (op)
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May 17, 2017, 01:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
We're comparing him to Republicans, right?

As in, home of the Constitutional Amendment Preserving the Sanctity of Marriage™.
We're in a post Oberfell world. I don't see the majority GOP congress talking about that either.
     
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May 17, 2017, 01:31 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
We're in a post Oberfell world. I don't see the majority GOP congress talking about that either.
So the Republicans have changed their opinion, or just decided to shut up about it?

How's about abortion? Gotta imagine Trump has sent his share of potential humans into the sky.
     
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May 17, 2017, 01:43 PM
 
compared to Pence, sure ThisTrump is more progay/choice/etc. What percentage? What percentage has no one paid off yet?
     
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May 17, 2017, 01:52 PM
 
Originally Posted by subego View Post
So the Republicans have changed their opinion, or just decided to shut up about it?

How's about abortion? Gotta imagine Trump has sent his share of potential humans into the sky.
Are you talking the person? I'm talking about as president here.
     
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May 17, 2017, 01:53 PM
 
Originally Posted by andi*pandi View Post
compared to Pence, sure ThisTrump is more progay/choice/etc. What percentage? What percentage has no one paid off yet?
Pence, however is not your average republican.
     
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May 17, 2017, 01:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by The Final Dakar View Post
Not according to his executive orders.
Absolutely is (Pence would have never held up a Pro-LGBTQ banner). Also, Trump's more pro-choice, Pence would have been aggressively trying to stamp it out by now. If the veep took over, the Left would be looking back on the Trump days with affection. Pence would be the most conservative, and religious, president in office in living memory. That's what has the far Right licking their chops.
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May 17, 2017, 01:55 PM
 
Originally Posted by andi*pandi View Post
compared to Pence, sure ThisTrump is more progay/choice/etc. What percentage? What percentage has no one paid off yet?
I'm pretty certain you can't buy Pence on those matters, at all.
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May 17, 2017, 02:56 PM
 
Originally Posted by Cap'n Tightpants View Post
Absolutely is (Pence would have never held up a Pro-LGBTQ banner). Also, Trump's more pro-choice, Pence would have been aggressively trying to stamp it out by now. If the veep took over, the Left would be looking back on the Trump days with affection. Pence would be the most conservative, and religious, president in office in living memory. That's what has the far Right licking their chops.
We could end up with VP Palin as well.
     
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May 17, 2017, 03:28 PM
 
That would be AWESOME i mean wait-
     
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May 17, 2017, 04:10 PM
 
In other signs of the Apocalypse news:
     
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May 17, 2017, 06:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chongo View Post
We could end up with VP Palin as well.
Or veep Cruz. (What a long strange journey that would be, if Pence is then impeached.)
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May 17, 2017, 06:06 PM
 
Impeached and convicted. Bubba and Andrew Johnson were impeached.
     
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May 17, 2017, 06:10 PM
 
I figure some Dems believe they can just impeach and convict presidents as many times as they want, until they get someone they like.
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May 17, 2017, 09:03 PM
 
Shapiro noted Trump has WH comms running to the front unarmed, with threats he'll shoot them in the back if they stop advancing.

Just like Stalingrad.
     
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May 17, 2017, 10:34 PM
 
     
subego
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May 17, 2017, 10:59 PM
 
Remarkably, an insightful commentary from r/politics.

There's clearly a "player", or a small group of them orchestrating the important leaks.

They are only leaking to the NYT and the WP.

They pre-leak a weakened form of the story to rope-a-dope the WH into making denials, and then hit them with hard evidence.

Comey may not be part of the group, but is certainly allied.
     
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May 17, 2017, 11:00 PM
 
Hiding he's richer than people expect. Or maybe that thing with his wife.
     
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May 18, 2017, 09:42 AM
 
Roger Ailes passed away. Symbolic foreshadowing, perhaps.
     
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May 18, 2017, 01:38 PM
 
Everybody pretend I started a thread called "Jive, Turkey".
     
 
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