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jrome · Jul 20, 2002, 08:48 PM

Apple never promised free iTools for life. In the original license agreement, Apple clearly states they may discontinue these services at any time. See the <a href="http://216.239.51.100/search?q=cache:sjR7ZiIrIoUC:itools.mac.com/1/membership_terms.html&hl=en&lr=lang_en&ie=UTF-8" target="_blank">License Agreement</a> . Do a search on Google for "itools 'free for life.'" How many matches do you get that are mor than a week old? I got four when I tried, in none of which was Apple implied to have promised that iTools would be free for life. Further, was there so much anger when Apple discontinued KidSafe? Probably because they retained the right to discontinue it. Check to see what Apple originally promised <a href="http://www.apple.com/pr/library/2000/jan/05netstrategy.html" target="_blank">here</a> .

I know all the clever folks like to make up facts to suit their arguments. But Apple never promised this. Please, get your class-action lawyer and sue Apple, then pat yourself on the back and go back to cursing "evil, greedy" lawyers.

Here's what I did. I wrote Apple that I'd be happy to pay $20/ year for the type of service we have with iTools now, but that I could not justify paying $100/year for the new service Apple will offer. Apple might ignore it, in which case they'd leave $20 on the table. That's up to them. Presented with the current choices, I'll choose to not pay.

But really, all this crying about broken promises, and the fantasies of class-action lawsuits, will not move Apple to change. Pledges to give up on Apple forever are both short-sighted and transparent. If you want Apple to offer you a service better suited to you, tell them what it is and what you would pay. This is the type of market research that Apple would love to have. By crying and lieing, you are doind Apple no good, you are doing other users no good and you are doing yourself no good.

So please stop the self-gratifying posts assailing Apple for breaking their promise, and do something that will have a more positive effect. I'm trying to save iTools for $20/ year.

msuper69 · Jul 20, 2002, 09:58 PM

I was wondering if someone would post the original iTools user agreement.

Anyone who has ever bothered reading these license agreements would know that no company would ever promise anything free forever. There is always an escape clause that allows the company to eliminate, change or do whatever they want, including the right to impose a fee. Whether these types of documents are fair or not is another subject but for now we as consumers seem to accept them.

While everyone has a right to disagree with the change to a fee-based service, using lame excuses like "they promised it would be free for life" just doesn't cut it. Apple never said that and even if Steve Jobs himself did say it, the agreement everyone agreed to by clicking on "agree" is what counts in a court of law.

Either you are willing to subscribe to .mac or you're not. If not, you're voting with your $ and that will have the most effect on the success of .mac.

IronPen · Jul 20, 2002, 11:10 PM

I wrote to Apple, and I encourage anyone else who is upset with their decision to charge $99 a year or whatever it is for .Mac to do the same. Here's what I wrote...

Charging for .Mac when we've spent so much money on a 'premium' computer is ridiculous. Apple has, what?, a 25% profit margin? Don't tell me that they can't spare to let those who have spent money on their products (more money than we could spend on a comperable PC. be honest) to have at least a free-for-life email account. Charge for this stuff if you want, but I'll take my accounts somewhere else. I don't use anything but the email account, and I sure as hell won't pay $99 a year for it. It's M$ tactics like this that will be the doom of Apple Computer...just like suddenly raising prices on iMacs b/c LCD and RAM prices were on the rise. I could understand that one, but where's the price drop now that prices on RAM are down? Guess LCDs are still too pricey, huh?

Oh, and what about that little update we call Jaguar? Charging $129 for it? Full price!!!! Yeah, that's gonna sit well with my parents that just bought an iBook four months ago. Keep this up and even the faithful will move on to something else. Bring on Linux! That will run on Intel hardware...it isn't as pretty, but at least we don't get screwed by the big two. How would that make you feel? Not only will people migrate away from buying your software, but they will run different hardware too. I'm sure you and Steve think different, but I'm a former PC user, and I see my Apple-loving attitude shifting again. I think it's really ironic that you start the Switch campaign just in time to start this stuff. Oh, well. You've had a good thing, switching things on your own loyal customers won't get you where you want to be...you may find Mac users making the switch.

----

I think they should at the very least, offer Mac users the free email account, with a limited quota, and the options of increasing it for a price, like Yahoo! and Hotmail do. Just my opinion.

Rolling Musubi · Jul 20, 2002, 11:35 PM

Just out of curiosity, I watched the MWSF 2000 keynote to see if Steve mentioned anything. Relevant iTools/"beyond the box" overview begins at 42 minutes and he briefly discusses mac.com email at 47 minutes. He makes no mention of free for life, permanent, etc. Watched until the end to see if he said anything in his wrapup but nada. It was sort of boring watching all this old stuff but also interesting looking back (initial demo of Aqua, the Quake demo on OS X that failed to work, dropping the "i" in iCEO).

[ 07-20-2002, 11:38 PM: Message edited by: Rolling Musubi ]

mrtew · Jul 21, 2002, 12:45 AM

Let me guess. iTools was never advertized as "Yours to Keep" either???
Everyone is just making this up now, right?

BTP · Jul 21, 2002, 12:56 AM

Yep. There is a lot of fabrication of 'fact' going on recently. Suddenly everyone knows how much Apple is going to make in revenue from .mac (other thread) and what profit margin Apple makes. 25%!! HS! Do you really believe that! 25% LOL!!

Apple had about $6,000,000,000 in revenue in the latest 4 quarters. They made about $240M profit(e) in that period. With a "25%" profit margin, why do they make so little? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> $1.5B shaved down to $240M!? There must be a LOT of wasteful spending going on in Cupertino!

hmurchison2001 · Jul 21, 2002, 04:48 AM

Ok you need to start paying attention more.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> Charge for this stuff if you want, but I'll take my accounts somewhere else. I don't use anything but the email account, and I sure as hell won't pay $99 a year for it. It's M$ tactics like this that will be the doom of Apple Computer<hr /></blockquote>You don't honestly believe this do you? Apple in order to finance the continual improvement of their products charges for .mac and somehow this becomes the beginning of the end? No what this does is unloads a non revenue producing service that adversely affects Apple bottom line hence their profits and stock price. Not good. As for MS tactics...look at MS's balance sheet..99% of companies would trade with MS in a heartbeat.

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Oh, and what about that little update we call Jaguar? Charging $129 for it? Full price!!!! Yeah, that's gonna sit well with my parents that just bought an iBook four months ago. Keep this up and even the faithful will move on to something else. Bring on Linux! <hr /></blockquote>The avg informed Mac user would realize that Jaguar is NOT "little". Apple charges a Full OS price one a year and no more. You DO have the choice as to when you upgrade. Apple "faithful" understand the economics involved and realize that Apple has expenses as well. Linux? Puhleeze OSX give you 90% of that Linux offers and then obliterates Linux with the "Mac Touch". At this point your email probably lost any shred of credibility.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I'm a former PC user, and I see my Apple-loving attitude shifting again. I think it's really ironic that you start the Switch campaign just in time to start this stuff. Oh, well. You've had a good thing, switching things on your own loyal customers won't get you where you want to be...you may find Mac users making the switch.
<hr /></blockquote>Apple is a company ...NOT your girlfriend. Your love seems to only extend to what you get for free or low cost. Switchers won't mind because they've seen the Hotmail adds asking them to purchase and expanded Hotmail service for twenty dollars a year. Smart ones know that .net is going to roll out with plenty of services with associated costs. Loyal customers, I would hope, use a little more rationale about their platform choice. .mac is a choice...free email is not your birthright.

nickm · Jul 21, 2002, 05:05 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> You don't honestly believe this do you? Apple in order to finance the continual improvement of their products charges for .mac and somehow this becomes the beginning of the end? <hr /></blockquote>You're missing the point. I don't know about the rest of the people on the net, but I am not annoyed with the fact that Apple is charging for iTools; I'm annoyed that they are bundling it all together, trying force people to pay for things they don't want or need.

(Arguably, this is the what Mac hardware is all about, but I still think it is wrong for them to do this with iTools).

workerbee · Jul 21, 2002, 05:36 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by nickm:
You're missing the point. I don't know about the rest of the people on the net, but I am not annoyed with the fact that Apple is charging for iTools; I'm annoyed that they are bundling it all together, trying force people to pay for things they don't want or need.<hr /></blockquote>But then you have to agree that it is very clever of Apple to display "iDisk" so prominently in the "go" menu (it even has its own keyboard shortcut).
That way everyone who does not subscribe to .Mac will feel something is missing from his/her experience.

Well done Apple, billg would be proud of this sneaky way of getting your customers to pony up even more, and more, and more $$$:
first step: build it into the OS,
next step: turn it into an additional, paying service (one could argue that the cost of Jagwire is, in reality, $129 + $49 +$29 +maybe $19).
Next step: software rental -- you want internet access: we have a nifty super-cool plugin to the OS, for only $49/year. You got used to your iCal, didn't you? Well, we can't provide it for free anymore, things have changed, $99/year.

JLL · Jul 21, 2002, 06:15 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by IronPen:
I wrote to Apple, and I encourage anyone else who is upset with their decision to charge $99 a year or whatever it is for .Mac to do the same. Here's what I wrote...

Charging for .Mac when we've spent so much money on a 'premium' computer is ridiculous. Apple has, what?, a 25% profit margin? Don't tell me that they can't spare to let those who have spent money on their products (more money than we could spend on a comperable PC. be honest) to have at least a free-for-life email account. Charge for this stuff if you want, but I'll take my accounts somewhere else. I don't use anything but the email account, and I sure as hell won't pay $99 a year for it. It's M$ tactics like this that will be the doom of Apple Computer...just like suddenly raising prices on iMacs b/c LCD and RAM prices were on the rise. I could understand that one, but where's the price drop now that prices on RAM are down? Guess LCDs are still too pricey, huh?

Oh, and what about that little update we call Jaguar? Charging $129 for it? Full price!!!! Yeah, that's gonna sit well with my parents that just bought an iBook four months ago. Keep this up and even the faithful will move on to something else. Bring on Linux! That will run on Intel hardware...it isn't as pretty, but at least we don't get screwed by the big two. How would that make you feel? Not only will people migrate away from buying your software, but they will run different hardware too. I'm sure you and Steve think different, but I'm a former PC user, and I see my Apple-loving attitude shifting again. I think it's really ironic that you start the Switch campaign just in time to start this stuff. Oh, well. You've had a good thing, switching things on your own loyal customers won't get you where you want to be...you may find Mac users making the switch.

----

I think they should at the very least, offer Mac users the free email account, with a limited quota, and the options of increasing it for a price, like Yahoo! and Hotmail do. Just my opinion.<hr /></blockquote>Constructive feedback - really constructive

sambeau · Jul 21, 2002, 06:39 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by jrome:
Apple never promised free iTools for life. <hr /></blockquote>They did say "yours to keep" though. And "yours for life". If someone gave you a car and said "its yours to keep for life" then came back a year or two later and demanded rent or repossesion - you'd be rightly pissed off. "But I never said free!" just wouln't cut it, would it.

This whole argument is *not* about the legal stuff - it is about the spin. And spin coun ts in this day and age. A promise may not be a promise legally, but as long as it is spun as a promise it *is* a promise. Apple were making out at the time that they were the only ones brave enough to promise an email address for life.

I'm sure the legal stuff says that Apple can change the functionality of any of their software at the drop of a hat. If OSX updated itself tomorrow to just become a useless black screen - you wouldn't go "oh, well - the small print said they could do it".. you'd be mad. And somewhat dissapointed.

I'm somewhat dissapointed .

If they had told us the the pay service was going to include loads of extra features and that anyone who didn't use ther .mac address for a few months would lose it but the rest could keep it - then I would have understood. Yes I will cough up eventually. But not because I'm seriously excited by what is on offer - just because I don't want to lose my email address. The one I thought I had for life.

They have me over a barrel. And I'm not very happy about it.

JLL · Jul 21, 2002, 07:10 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by sambeau:
They did say "yours to keep" though.<hr /></blockquote>Please read the text where it says Yours to keep. You're taking it out of context.

Robo-X · Jul 21, 2002, 07:34 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Rolling Musubi:
Just out of curiosity, I watched the MWSF 2000 keynote to see if Steve mentioned anything. Relevant iTools/"beyond the box" overview begins at 42 minutes and he briefly discusses mac.com email at 47 minutes. He makes no mention of free for life, permanent, etc. Watched until the end to see if he said anything in his wrapup but nada. It was sort of boring watching all this old stuff but also interesting looking back (initial demo of Aqua, the Quake demo on OS X that failed to work, dropping the "i" in iCEO).<hr /></blockquote>Wher did you watch the keynote? I would really like to see it as well. Do you have it online somewhere?

//Rob

CarpetFluff · Jul 21, 2002, 08:14 AM

It's all very well that Apple has small print to 'prove' that it never said iTools was free forever but consumers very rarely read the small print, there is a very strong argument to suggest that Apple 'did' imply this and this is highly questionable both morally and legally.

"These services are open to everyone, although the very coolest features only work when you�re running Mac OS 9"

This is a quote taken from Apples own <a href="http://www.apple.com/hotnews/articles/2000/01/mwsf/keynote.html" target="_blank">Macworld SF 2000</a> page.

While I will agree that this doesn't say anything from a legal point of view, it implies that with a purchase of OS 9 you get access to the free services we knew as iTools. I realise that it could be argued that OS 9 'still' gives access to these services (they are just no longer free) and in effect that is all we were paying for but I for one didn't see it that way and obviously a large proportion of other Mac users didn't see it that way either.

I don't want something for nothing but I felt that I 'bought' these services.

�And iDisk is your 20 megabytes of personal Internet storage hosted securely on Apple�s Internet servers. We�re going to give everybody 20 megabytes of storage hosted on our servers"

"Give"? or lend?

Misleading consumers can be challenged legally especially if there is a large enough body of people who complain. I'm not saying that I think there's a winable case here but for me it shows up Apple (who until recently I thought was a company I respected somewhat) as just another greedy corporation because Apple didn't look at their books and 'suddenly' think "oops we'd better start charging for this stuff" they manouvered people into it as part of a strategy.

[ 07-21-2002, 08:16 AM: Message edited by: CarpetFluff ]

jrome · Jul 21, 2002, 11:38 AM

I never came to rely on my .Mac address, I just used it as an occasional POP-mail server when i needed it. So, I don't have the same anger with Apple about having been "tricked" into using their email account. What I'll miss about iTools is the 1-step publishing of iPhoto albums. Alas.

As for all of who misunderstood Apple and thought it would be "free for life," GET OVER YOURSELVES! They said you needed OS9 to use the features, they said they were free for now and that's about it. The simple fact that Apple never promised that iTools would be "free for life" should have been a fairly strong clue.

Yeah, it sucks. But you're stuck paying Apple now because you made some bad assumptions. Did any of the people here complaining about being blackmailed ever think to ASK Apple if iTools would be free for life? I mean, if I was going to switch all my email to iTools based upon that assumption, I'd want to check it out first.

Listen, I feel for everyone who feels they were misled; it's frustrating, and it feels like you're powerless. But believe me, Apple completely anticipated this backlash, from people wanting it to be free forever. But complaining to Apple along those lines will have no effect, because Apple anticipated it and discounted it.

I propose a couple of possible solutions. First, my ideas to save iTools for $20/ year. Write to Apple and tell them that you will give them money to provide the current iTools; Apple may not have anticipated this, and if the reaction is strong enough, they may offer that option.

Number 2: Find a friend who is ordering iTools, and piggyback onto their account to get email for $10/year. I mean, seems to me Apple left it wide open for people to do just that. Quit complaining, and pony up the $10.

Finanlly, find 10 friends, purchase an iTools account and 10 extra mailboxes. $210/year divided by 10 is less than $10 a month.

These options are a lot more proactive than just crying to Apple about broken promises. Apple knew they'd take a PR hit; but asking them to subsidize your internet usage is not really an appeal to reason, it's more like aasking for a handout.

Save iTools for $20/year.

jrome · Jul 21, 2002, 11:49 AM

BTW, I searched Google for the "Yours to keep" reference. Check it out <a href="http://www.apple.com/enews/2000/12/07enews2.html" target="_blank">here</a> . No reference is made to it being free, just that you can keep it if you change ISPs. Which is still true. I can't find the "yours for life" reference.

BTW, it's not hard to verify these wild claims made on the internet; we have the internet to do that. Just go to Google and run your search. Don't forget the quotes when necessary (itools "free for life", for example).

ls -al · Jul 21, 2002, 01:34 PM

<a href="http://www.msnbc.com/news/783374.asp" target="_blank">Jobs on itools</a>

�We were the last people providing that for free,� says Jobs, �and it�s growing so fast that we can�t continue to do it [without charging].�

Levy's commentary: Apple is following the industry trend of converting buyers into subscribers.

Some other choice quotes:

�I�d rather be us than some of the other guys out there,� he says. �It�s only us and Dell making money [among computermakers]. They�re making money because they�re Wal-Mart, we�re making it because we�re innovating.�

Almost lost in the blizzard of announcements was the introduction of Rendezvous, software that instantly links people in wireless networks. For instance, when several people who have laptops equipped with iTunes music software gather together, a superlibrary instantly forms, combining all the songs on everybody�s computer. Normally, such an advance would be news in itself, but in Apple�s high-powered innovation factory, it�s just one more spoke in the �digital hub� that supposedly makes Macintosh a platform that will lure �switchers� from the dominant Windows system.

genevish · Jul 21, 2002, 01:55 PM

The biggest concern in all of this is the general customer service aspect. Apple has always struggled with providing excellent customer service, or just doing the same thig everyone else in the industry is doing. I like Apple because I feel they care about my computer experience, whether it's the care that goes into crafting the OS, or the free iTools account.

I think it would be easier to get and maintain loyal customers if they would always think of the customer first when making decisions. Show that you care and customers will respond.

CarpetFluff · Jul 21, 2002, 02:03 PM

The issue for me is that 'I' (whether i'm right or wrong) believe that Apple deliberately misled people and have integrated into their operating system something which at the end of the day they knew I'd have to pay for.

I agree hosting and email costs money, what I object to is that .mac was a planned strategy by Apple that they (in my opinion) snuck in under the noses of generally unsuspecting mac users.

It's already assumed that consumers are generally stupid, and they are not expected to read the small print or look at the big picture. Apple used free services to sell macs and then took them away, many people felt that they had 'bought' these services because that is what Apple wanted them to believe. I for one never expected that sort of behaviour from Apple and I should have done, I realise that now.

As for 'ponying up' I already did, the service has been crap so far and all things considered I won't be doing it again.

sambeau · Jul 21, 2002, 02:29 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by CarpetFluff:
 'I' (whether i'm right or wrong) believe that Apple deliberately misled people and have integrated into their operating system something which at the end of the day they knew I'd have to pay for.<hr /></blockquote>ooh. I don't think its anything that sinister.

A lot of water has passed under the bridge since the free iTools were introduced and the many shrivled bodies of dead dot coms floated on top of it.

The dot com bubble burst. The world is a different place.

I don't blame Apple for dropping the free service per se. I just wish they had handled it all a bit better. Been a bit more careful with those of us who have been relying on our mac.com email addresses. Offered a few really innovative things to make us jump at .mac.

Plus, they just haven't got it right - the site is an unsightly mess and as far as I can see, the new tools just don't work right. Taking the iCards off the main pages too seems very sad...

I can think of numerous more innovative and useful ideas for an iDisk iApp combination.. I'm just not sure we're going to see it.

ls -al · Jul 21, 2002, 02:51 PM

More .Mac news

Even if they don't pay, however, current address holders will be able to take at least minor advantage of the names they've reserved under the old iTools scheme. Thomas said that even if they don't subscribe to .Mac, these users will be able to keep their names for use with Apple's iChat instant messaging as well as AOL Instant Messenger.

In addition, users who don't sign up for .Mac by Sept. 30 will be able to reinstate their accounts, at least within the first year.

Thomas said Apple had rejected the idea of offering a second, free track for e-mail akin to offerings from MSN or Yahoo!; both of those companies' free, entry-level offerings rely heavily on advertising revenues in place of subscriptions. "It's not Apple's business model to throw advertisements in users' faces," Thomas said.

GeneShifter · Jul 21, 2002, 03:02 PM

You know, this "mac faithful" stuff is kind of scary.

It makes you guys sound like a bunch of pot-smoking religious zealots that would pay even if Apple was charging $2000 for Jaguar. I'm not saying $130 is too much, it's fine, but shut up about being "faithful" to mac! I'm not faithful to any company, dude. Best hardware/software for best price, period. Companies are about one thing only...the bottom line, and this includes Apple I hate to tell you. You are the same people buying clothes, cars, etc., at a higher price because you want to feel special, even if you can get the same stuff for 75% off somewhere else. Stupid.

STOP BEING MINDLESS SHEEP FELLAS. APPLE IS A COMPANY AND WANTS YOUR MONEY. THAT'S IT. IT'S NOT ABOUT INNOVATION ANYMORE.

[ 07-21-2002, 03:02 PM: Message edited by: GeneShifter ]

CarpetFluff · Jul 21, 2002, 03:03 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> ooh. I don't think its anything that sinister. <hr /></blockquote>And really as a guy who's loved Apple products for six years I'd like to believe this is the case, perhaps if they were offering more options I'd agree.

I totally agree with you that things we considered free before we are going to have to get used to paying for, which is why I 'did' subscribe to .mac, it's not paying in principle that I object to, just the way this has happened. I may be wrong (I frequently am!) but I like to think of myself as a fairly reasonable guy who until recently thought the sun shone out of Apple's a*se and if I feel this bad about it I'm assuming that a whole lot of people feel a lot worse and that's not good news for Apple.

But more than likely this will all blow over and really the public uptake of this service will ultimately decide the future of .mac. I think it's partly because there is very little choice in operating systems so I either have to put up with crap from Apple or a lot more crap from Microsoft as in order to earn a living I have to use one or the other, this gives them an unfair advantage in the 'take it or leave it' stakes and I feel that I should vehemently stand up for the OS that I want and help shape it.

Mac007 · Jul 21, 2002, 04:25 PM

THE ORIGINAL iTOOLS AGREEMENT!

iTOOLS MEMBERSHIP AGREEMENT
AND
ACCEPTABLE USE POLICY

This iTools membership agreement and acceptable use policy (the �agreement� or the �AUP�) provides important information about your iTools membership, so you should take the time to read and understand it. You may review, save or print any part of this agreement. We encourage you to print out a copy of this entire document and refer to it as you use iTools.

IMPORTANT: IF YOU CHOOSE TO ACCEPT THIS AGREEMENT, YOU MUST DO SO AS IT IS PRESENTED TO YOU -- NO CHANGES (ADDITIONS OR DELETIONS) WILL BE ACCEPTED BY APPLE.

Apple may change, add or remove any part of this agreement at any time. If it does so, Apple will post such changes on the iTools site. IF ANY FUTURE CHANGES ARE UNACCEPTABLE TO YOU, YOU SHOULD DISCONTINUE USING YOUR iTOOLS ACCOUNT. YOUR CONTINUED USE OF iTOOLS NOW, OR FOLLOWING THE POSTING OF NOTICE OF ANY SUCH CHANGES, WILL INDICATE YOUR ACCEPTANCE OF THIS AGREEMENT, AND ANY SUCH CHANGES.

� BECOMING AN iTOOLS MEMBER

To become an iTools member, you must be at least 13 years old. If you are not yet 13 years old, you may still use iTools, but only if the account you are using was created and registered by your parent or legal guardian.

This agreement is a legal document that sets forth your rights and obligations as an iTools member. You cannot become an iTools member until you have accepted the terms of this agreement. You, as an iTools member, must abide by the terms of this agreement. Your iTools membership is also subject to Apple�s corporate Privacy Policy. This applies to this agreement and the Privacy Policy as they currently exist and as they may be revised from time to time by Apple.

When you accept this agreement and complete the iTools registration process, you become the account holder. As an iTools member, Apple provides you with a limited, non-exclusive license for no more than the term of your membership to use the member name and password provided to you for your account. Your member name is your on-line identity. Do not reveal your password to other users. Your account is at risk if you let someone use it inappropriately.

� AVAILABILITY OF THE SERVICE

While Apple will make all reasonable efforts to ensure that iTools is available at all times, Apple does not guarantee, represent or warrant that iTools services will be uninterrupted or error-free, and Apple does not guarantee that members will be able to access or use all the iTools features at all times.

Apple may change, suspend or discontinue any (or all) aspects of iTools at any time, including the availability of any iTools feature or content. Apple may also impose limits on the use of or access to certain features or portions of iTools, including a charge for or imposition of a subscription or other fee for use of iTools or any part or feature of iTools, or restrict your access to any part or all of iTools, in all cases without notice or liability.

Apple also does not guarantee or warrant that any content or data you may have in your account at iTools will not be subject to inadvertent damage, corruption or destruction. You are responsible for backing up, on your own computer, any important documents, images or other content -- Apple will not be responsible for any archiving or back-up of any such information. If any data, messages, images or other content in your account and stored on the iTools system is damaged, lost or corrupted in any way, Apple will have no obligation or liability to you.

� ACCEPTABLE USE POLICY GUIDELINES

Apple encourages iTools members to participate in the on-line world to express their views and benefit from the interactive experience. However, it is important to remember that there are rules and standards that you must abide by as an iTools member. These rules and standards are described in this agreement. As an iTools member, you agree to comply with this agreement, and you acknowledge that Apple has the right to enforce this agreement in its sole discretion. This means that if you, or anyone using your member privileges, violate the terms of this agreement, Apple may take any and all appropriate actions -- this can range from the issuance of a warning about a violation to the termination of your membership privileges in iTools -- as Apple deems necessary or appropriate. Apple is not required to provide notice prior to terminating your iTools membership for violating these rules and standards, but it may choose to do so.

You are solely responsible for your conduct while using iTools, including the content of all email messages you generate or forward, and all content in any folders, home pages or other transmissions, information, images or other interactions you generate, transmit or maintain on or through iTools. Apple takes no responsibility for any such on-line distribution or publication by you. Apple cannot and will not review every message or other content you may generate or post, and Apple is not responsible for the content of those messages or content.

Apple reserves the right to delete, move or edit any such item that Apple, in its sole discretion, deems abusive, defamatory, obscene, in violation of copyright or trademark laws, or otherwise illegal, inappropriate or unacceptable, including any material Apple believes may cause any liability for it or which may cause Apple to lose the services of any supplier, including but not limited to any Internet Service Providers (ISPs) which may provide services to iTools members.

A user�s conduct in the iTools space should conform to the requirements of the law, respect for the rights of other users of iTools, and current standards for communicating on-line. By your use of iTools, you agree to use appropriate conduct and language when you are on line -- this includes following the rules of any ISP, any other on-line services, this agreement and all applicable state, local and federal laws (including foreign or international law where appropriate).

Apple reserves the right to terminate your account or suspend iTools services to you at any time, with cause or without cause, in the event of any breach of this agreement, your infringement of Apple�s or iTools� or others� content, or any other circumstances which, in Apple�s sole discretion, merit termination or suspension.

Inappropriate conduct falls into a number of categories. The more commonly understood categories are discussed below, although this list is not exclusive.

� Illegal Conduct.

iTools may be used only for lawful purposes. The laws that apply in the off-line world must be obeyed on-line as well. Posting, transmitting, promoting, using, distributing or storing Content in violation of any applicable law or regulation is prohibited. �Content� means the text, software, communications, images, sounds, and all other information and materials you encounter or generate on-line on the Internet, including material protected by copyright, trademark, trade secret or other intellectual property rights, and material that is obscene, defamatory, constitutes an illegal threat, or violates export control laws.

Examples of prohibited illegal conduct are:

� Posting obscene content (including child pornography)

� Planning illegal activity, such as building a bomb or counterfeiting money

� Advertising a lottery, ammunition, firearms, tobacco, alcohol, illegal drugs and drug-related paraphernalia

� Pretending to be anyone you are not -- you may not impersonate another person (including celebrities), another iTools Member, an Apple employee, or a civic or government leader

� Using false statements to get, or to attempt to get, account information or other private information from other iTools members or Internet users

� Engaging in copyright infringement or other intellectual property infringement

If you believe that illegal Content is being transmitted through any iTools service, you may report it by filling out the abuse reporting form located in the �ContactUs� section of the iTools Help system.

Apple reserves the right to cooperate with law enforcement authorities, including complying with warrants, court orders and subpoenas. If Apple decides to investigate or resolve possible misuse involving you or anything you do on iTools, Apple is entitled to disclose any information about you and anything you do with iTools to law enforcement or other government officials, as Apple, in its sole discretion, believes to be necessary or appropriate. By your use of iTools, you authorize Apple to take any such actions.

� Objectionable Conduct and Content

It is essential that all Content on iTools reflect the provisions of this agreement. Apple reserves the right to remove Content if we become aware of any content in any iTools area which, in our judgment, does not conform to this agreement. You may receive a warning about the violation of this agreement if your iTools account was responsible for putting objectionable Content on-line. At all times, Apple reserves the right to terminate the accounts of iTools members who violate this AUP.

Examples of objectionable conduct and Content that violate the iTools acceptable use policy are:

� Harassing, threatening, or embarrassing another iTools or Internet user

� Stalking another iTools or Internet user (�cyberstalking�)

� Transmitting or facilitating distribution of Content that is harmful, abusive, violent, racially or ethnically offensive, lewd, vulgar or (in a reasonable person�s view) objectionable

� If you are an adult, requesting personal or other information from a minor (any person under the age of 18) who is not personally known to you, including but not limited to any of the following: full name or last name, home address, zip code, telephone number, picture, or the names of the minor�s school, church, athletic team or friends

� Posting Content that defames, abuses or threatens physical harm to others or yourself

Please remember that these are only guidelines; there are always �gray areas.� Ask yourself if your communication is something that you would say in a room full of people you never met, or in the workplace. However, Apple reserves the right to make the final determination about whether Content is objectionable or not.

If you encounter something you find inappropriate, you may report it by filling out the abuse reporting form located in the �ContactUs� section of the iTools Help system.

� Copyright and Intellectual Property Infringement

Much of the Content available through iTools is owned by others, and is protected by copyrights, trademarks, rights of publicity and other intellectual property rights. Before you upload or download any Content while using iTools, make sure you have been given the legal right to do so by the owner of the content. The Mac OS X Software folder on iDisk contains third-party software, which has been licensed by the developers thereof to Apple. You may download and use this software for your own personal use, subject to any rights retained by the developers.

� You must not copy, transmit, modify, distribute, show in public or in private or create any derivative works from any of the Content you find through iTools, unless you have the legal right to do so; and

� You must not make available serial numbers for software for the purpose of illegally validating or registering software.

Making unauthorized copies of any Content can lead to the termination of your access to iTools and may even subject you to legal action. In addition, the owner of the Content may take criminal or civil action against you. If a Content owner takes legal action against Apple because of your unauthorized use of Content, you agree to hold harmless and indemnify Apple, its subsidiaries, affiliates, related companies, employees, officers, directors, agents and suppliers against any liability, claims, or demands, including the costs of Apple hiring attorneys to defend against the action.

By submitting or posting Content on areas of iTools accessible by the public, you are representing that you are the owner of such material or have authorization to distribute it. You hereby grant Apple a worldwide, royalty-free, non-exclusive license to reproduce, modify, adapt and publish any such public area Content solely for the purpose of displaying, distributing and promoting the area on which such content is posted. Said license will be in effect only as long as you are an iTools member, and will terminate upon removal of such Content from the public area or when you are no longer an iTools member, whichever happens first.

If you believe that any Content in which you claim copyright has been infringed by anyone using iTools, please contact Apple�s agent (see below), and provide the following information, as required by the Online Copyright Infringement Liability Limitation Act of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (17 U.S.C. 512):

� A physical or electronic signature of a person authorized to act on behalf of the owner of an exclusive right that is allegedly infringed;

� Identification of the copyright work claimed to have been infringed, or (if multiple copyrighted works at a single on-line site are covered by a single notification) a representative list of such works at that site;

� Identification of the material that is claimed to be infringing or to be the subject of infringing activity and that is to be removed or access to which is to be disabled, and information reasonably sufficient to permit Apple to locate the material;

� Information reasonably sufficient to permit Apple to contact the complaining party;

� A statement that the complaining party has a good faith belief that use of the material in the manner complained of is not authorized by the copyright owner, its agent, or the law; and

� A statement that the information in the notice is accurate and, under penalty of perjury, that the complaining party is authorized to act on behalf of the owner of an exclusive right that is allegedly infringed.

Apple�s copyright agent for notice of claims of copyright infringement on or regarding iTools can be reached as follows:

Anthony V. Lupo
Arent Fox Kintner Plotkin & Kahn, PLLC
1050 Connecticut Avenue, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20036-5339
Phone: (202) 857-6353
Fax: (202) 857-6395
Email: [email protected]

� Violations of System and Network Security

Violations of system and network security are prohibited, and may result in criminal and civil liability. Apple will investigate incidents involving such violations and may involve and will report any suspected criminal activity to and cooperate with law enforcement. Examples of system and network security violations include the following:

� Unauthorized access to or use of data, systems or networks, including any attempt to probe, scan or test the vulnerability of a system or network or to breach security or authentication measures without the express authorization of the owner of the system or network

� Unauthorized monitoring of data or traffic on any network or system without the express authorization of the owner of the system or network

� Interference with service to any user, host or network including, without limitation, mailbombing, flooding, deliberate attempts to overload a system and broadcast attacks

� Falsifying your user identity or providing other false information to Apple or to other users of iTools in connection with your use of iTools or any feature of iTools

� Posting viruses or software designed to create a virus or to do harm to iTools, any iTools Members or users of iTools, or any network

� Taking any other action to disrupt the normal use of iTools or the Internet by other users

� Use of software that allows your account to stay logged on while you are not actively using the account.

� Unsolicited E-Mail (�Spamming� and �Mailbombing�)

This agreement prohibits abuse of iTools� e-mail and related functionalities. Some specific examples of prohibited actions are as follows:

� Sending unsolicited bulk email messages including, without limitation, bulk commercial advertising and informational announcements (�bulk� is defined as sending the same or substantially similar messages to more than 400 e-mail users in a single day, sending more than 200 individual pieces of email in a day, or sending one email to more than 50 recipients at once)

� Using information collected from any iTools user or iTools Member directory or any other area of iTools for the purpose of sending unsolicited bulk e-mail

� Posting the same or similar messages to one or more Usenet or other news groups, forums, or e-mail mailing lists (excessive cross-posting or multiple-posting) (�excessive� includes posting the same or substantially similar messages to ten (10) or more groups in a single day)

� Forging of any TCP-IP packet header or any part of the header information in an e-mail or a news group posting, or otherwise putting information in the header designed to mislead recipients as to the origin of the message

� Using another site�s mail server to relay mail without the express permission of the other site

� Engaging in any of the foregoing activities by using the services of another provider, but channeling such activities through an iTools account, remailer, or otherwise through any feature of iTools, or using an iTools account as a mail drop for responses, or otherwise using the services of another provider for the purpose of facilitating the foregoing activities

� Exceeding Account Limitations

iTools has been designed primarily for personal use. We do not intend that iTools will be used to host e-commerce businesses in their marketing, promotions and sales over the Internet. We also do not intend that iTools accounts will be used for FTP access and downloading. iTools accounts are limited in terms of the bandwidth for network traffic and disk utilization for storage allocated to them. Your iDisk account usage is limited to 20 MB and your email account may not exceed 5 MB. Exceeding the applicable limitations is prohibited.

In addition to the iTools account limitations on bandwidth and disk utilization, certain commercial or business uses are prohibited, including the following:

� Soliciting for advertisers or sponsors

� Posting sponsorships and third-party advertisements and banners

� Sending unsolicited advertising, promotional materials or commercial solicitations to third parties

� Reselling, renting or subleasing iTools space under any circumstance

� Using or providing to any third person or entity, whether or not for a fee, any directory of iTools Members other than for personal, non-commercial purposes

� Disseminating multi-level marketing schemes, pyramid schemes, or commercial chain letters

� INVESTIGATIONS

Apple reserves the right to investigate suspected violations of this iTools agreement. When Apple becomes aware of possible violations, Apple may initiate an investigation, which may include gathering information from any iTools member involved and the complaining party, if any, and the examination of Content stored on the iTools system.

During the investigation, Apple may suspend or terminate any or all iTools member accounts involved and/or remove the Content involved from its computers. If Apple believes, in its sole discretion, that a violation of this agreement has occurred, it may take responsive action, including but not limited to permanent removal of illegal or inappropriate Content from the iTools system, warnings to the iTools member(s), and the suspension or termination of the account or accounts responsible.

If, as a result of any such investigation, Apple believes that any criminal activity has occurred, Apple reserves the right to refer the matter to, and to cooperate with, any and all appropriate law enforcement authorities.

BY BECOMING AN iTOOLS MEMBER, YOU AGREE TO WAIVE ANY CLAIMS YOU MAY HAVE AGAINST APPLE, AND TO HOLD APPLE HARMLESS AND INDEMNIFY APPLE WITH RESPECT TO ANY CLAIMS, RELATING TO ANY ACTION TAKEN BY APPLE AS PART OF ITS INVESTIGATION OF A SUSPECTED VIOLATION OF THIS AGREMENT OR AS A RESULT OF ITS FINDING OR DECISION THAT A VIOLATION OF THIS AGREEMENT HAS OCCURRED. THIS MEANS THAT YOU CANNOT SUE APPLE OR RECOVER ANY DAMAGES WHATSOEVER FROM APPLE AS A RESULT OF ITS DECISION TO REMOVE MATERIAL FROM THE iTOOLS SYSTEM, TO WARN YOU, TO SUSPEND OR TERMINATE YOUR iTOOLS ACCOUNT, OR TO TAKE ANY OTHER ACTION DURING THE INVESTIGATION OF A SUSPECTED VIOLATION OR AS A RESULT OF APPLE�S CONCLUSION THAT A VIOLATION OF THIS AGREEMENT HAS OCCURRED. THIS WAIVER AND INDEMNITY PROVISION APPLIES TO ALL VIOLATIONS DESCRIBED IN OR CONTEMPLATED BY THIS AGREEMENT.

� SOFTWARE LICENSES

If you access iTools through downloaded software or a CD-ROM, then these provisions relating to software licenses apply to you. Nothing in these provisions, however, supersedes any terms of any end-user license for software provided with your computer.

Apple provides you with a limited license to use the software providing access to iTools, which you agree to use in accordance with these rules. You may not sublicense, or charge others to use or access, this software. Apple will occasionally provide automatic upgrades to improve your on-line experience.

Apple grants to you a non-exclusive, limited license to use the software designed to provide access to iTools for the sole purpose of connecting you to iTools. This license is subject to the restriction that, except where expressly permitted by law, you may not translate, reverse-engineer or reverse-compile or decompile, disassemble or make derivative works from the software. You may not modify the software or use it in any way not expressly authorized by this agreement. You understand that Apple�s introduction of various technologies may not be consistent across all platforms and that the performance and some iTools features may vary depending on your computer and systems and other equipment.

� DISCLAIMER OF WARRANTIES; LIABILITY LIMITATIONS

YOU EXPRESSLY AGREE THAT YOUR USE OF, OR INABILITY TO USE, THE iTOOLS SERVICES ARE AT YOUR SOLE RISK. iTOOLS SERVICES ARE PROVIDED �AS IS� AND �AS AVAILABLE� FOR YOUR USE, WITHOUT WARRANTIES OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING ALL IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, TITLE AND NON-INFRINGEMENT. BECAUSE SOME JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OF IMPLIED WARRANTIES, THE ABOVE EXCLUSION OF IMPLIED WARRANTIES MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.

APPLE DOES NOT GUARANTEE THAT ANY CONTENT, INFORMATION, SOFTWARE OR OTHER MATERIAL ACCESSIBLE THROUGH iTOOLS WILL BE FREE OF VIRUSES, �WORMS�, �TROJAN HORSES�, OR OTHER HARMFUL COMPONENTS. APPLE�S ENTIRE LIABILITY AND YOUR SOLE AND EXCLUSIVE REMEDY WITH RESPECT TO THE USE OF ANY SERVICES PROVIDED BY iTOOLS SHALL BE CANCELLATION OF YOUR ACCOUNT.

IN NO CASE SHALL APPLE, ITS DIRECTORS, OFFICERS, EMPLOYEES, AFFILIATES, AGENTS OR CONTRACTORS BE LIABLE FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING FROM YOUR USE OF iTOOLS OR FOR ANY OTHER CLAIM RELATED IN ANY WAY TO YOUR iTOOLS MEMBERSHIP. BECAUSE SOME STATES OR JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OR THE LIMITATION OF LIABILITY FOR CONSEQUENTIAL OR INCIDENTAL DAMAGES, IN SUCH STATES OR JURISDICTIONS, APPLE�S LIABILITY SHALL BE LIMITED TO THE EXTENT PERMITTED BY LAW.

EXCEPT AS EXPRESSLY SET FORTH IN iTOOLS, APPLE DOES NOT ENDORSE, WARRANT OR GUARANTEE ANY THIRD-PARTY PRODUCT OR SERVICE OFFERED THROUGH iTOOLS AND WILL NOT BE A PARTY TO OR IN ANY WAY BE RESPONSIBLE FOR MONITORING ANY TRANSACTION BETWEEN YOU AND ANY THIRD PARTIES THROUGH iTOOLS. YOU HEREBY RELEASE APPLE FROM ANY AND ALL OBLIGATIONS, LIABILITY AND CLAIMS IN EXCESS OF THESE LIABILITY LIMITATIONS.

� NOTICES

Apple may give notice to any iTools member by sending an e-mail message to the member�s mailbox or by sending a letter via postal mail to the contact address listed in the member�s iTools registration. iTools members may contact Apple by filling out the �Comments and Ideas� form in the �ContactUs� section of the iTools Help system.

� EXPORT CONTROLS

You agree to abide by U.S. and other applicable export control laws and not to transfer, by electronic transmission or otherwise, any Content or software subject to restrictions under such laws to a destination prohibited under such laws, without first obtaining, and then complying with, any requisite government authorization. You further agree not to upload to your iTools account any data or software that cannot be exported without prior written government authorization, including, but not limited to, certain types of encryption software. This assurance and commitment shall survive termination of this agreement.

� LEGAL PRINCIPLES

With respect to iTools, this agreement represents your entire agreement with Apple. You agree that this agreement is not intended to confer and does not confer any rights or remedies upon any person other than you, as an iTools member, and Apple.

If any part of this agreement is held invalid or unenforceable, that portion shall be construed in a manner consistent with applicable law to reflect, as nearly as possible, the original intentions of the parties, and the remaining portions shall remain in full force and effect. The laws of the State of California, excluding its conflicts of law rules, govern this agreement and your iTools membership. Member conduct may be subject to other local, state, national, and international laws. You expressly agree that exclusive jurisdiction for any claim or dispute with Apple regarding iTools or relating in any way to your membership or your use of iTools resides in the courts of the State of California. You further agree and expressly consent to the exercise of personal jurisdiction in the California courts in connection with any such dispute, including any claim involving Apple or its affiliates, subsidiaries, employees, contractors, officers, directors, telecommunication providers and content providers with respect to iTools.

Under California Civil Code Section 1789.3, California iTools members receive the following specific consumer rights notice: The Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the California Department of Consumer Affairs may be contacted in writing at 1020 N Street, #501, Sacramento, California 95814, or by telephone at 1-916-445-1254.

Revised 4.23.01

� Copyright 2002 Apple Computer, Inc. All rights reserved.

IronPen · Jul 21, 2002, 04:26 PM

I'm just stressing my disappointment at Apple, that's all. I firmly believe that they reserve the right to charge for these services if they decide they want to, but that doesn't make me any happier about their decision. It's just big business doing its business. But all of this .Net and .Mac talk is making me .Sick. As a Mac user I feel like I've had the rug pulled out from under me though, as I'm sure my parents (recent PC to Mac converts) do as well. I spent time telling them how good the Mac is (which it is) and all of these great free services...Mail automatically sets you up for a Mac email account, etc, and now look. Well, Mom and Dad, you will have to pay for that now even though you just bought your iBook a few months ago for the low, low price of $1500+ Oh, and don't forget to upgrade to OS X for $129. Well, you can get .Mac for $49 now if you're an existing iTools member, and $10 for each additional email account...MAYBE that's reasonable....Maybe. For a lot of the general computer users, not the hardcore Mac lovers and graphics designers and technical support folks, people want simplicity. They want to browse the web, check email, and chat. I just simply think it is reasonable that if you pay for a new Apple computer, you should get a free email account...will they do this for even the first year? Offer a discount? .Mac, I'm not .Buying (.)period

But I think we all need to start realizing that a lot of these freebies we're used to on the web aren't going to be free for long. Won't be long until you have to subscribe to a website to get the info therein. Some sites are already doing this..and not just the porn sites. You have to wonder what the future of the Net is going to be.

CarpetFluff · Jul 21, 2002, 04:52 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Mac007:
THE ORIGINAL iTOOLS AGREEMENT!

iTOOLS MEMBERSHIP AGREEMENT
AND
ACCEPTABLE USE POLICY

This iTools membership agreement and acceptable use policy (the �agreement� or the �AUP�) provides important information about your iTools membership, so you should take the time to read and understand it. You may review, save or print any part of this agreement. We encourage you to print out a copy of this entire document and refer to it as you use iTools.

IMPORTANT: IF YOU CHOOSE TO ACCEPT THIS AGREEMENT, YOU MUST DO SO AS IT IS PRESENTED TO YOU -- NO CHANGES (ADDITIONS OR DELETIONS) WILL BE ACCEPTED BY APPLE.

Apple may change, add or remove any part of this agreement at any time. If it does so, Apple will post such changes on the iTools site. IF ANY FUTURE CHANGES ARE UNACCEPTABLE TO YOU, YOU SHOULD DISCONTINUE USING YOUR iTOOLS ACCOUNT. YOUR CONTINUED USE OF iTOOLS NOW, OR FOLLOWING THE POSTING OF NOTICE OF ANY SUCH CHANGES, WILL INDICATE YOUR ACCEPTANCE OF THIS AGREEMENT, AND ANY SUCH CHANGES.

� BECOMING AN iTOOLS MEMBER

To become an iTools member, you must be at least 13 years old. If you are not yet 13 years old, you may still use iTools, but only if the account you are using was created and registered by your parent or legal guardian.

This agreement is a legal document that sets forth your rights and obligations as an iTools member. You cannot become an iTools member until you have accepted the terms of this agreement. You, as an iTools member, must abide by the terms of this agreement. Your iTools membership is also subject to Apple�s corporate Privacy Policy. This applies to this agreement and the Privacy Policy as they currently exist and as they may be revised from time to time by Apple.

When you accept this agreement and complete the iTools registration process, you become the account holder. As an iTools member, Apple provides you with a limited, non-exclusive license for no more than the term of your membership to use the member name and password provided to you for your account. Your member name is your on-line identity. Do not reveal your password to other users. Your account is at risk if you let someone use it inappropriately.

� AVAILABILITY OF THE SERVICE

While Apple will make all reasonable efforts to ensure that iTools is available at all times, Apple does not guarantee, represent or warrant that iTools services will be uninterrupted or error-free, and Apple does not guarantee that members will be able to access or use all the iTools features at all times.

Apple may change, suspend or discontinue any (or all) aspects of iTools at any time, including the availability of any iTools feature or content. Apple may also impose limits on the use of or access to certain features or portions of iTools, including a charge for or imposition of a subscription or other fee for use of iTools or any part or feature of iTools, or restrict your access to any part or all of iTools, in all cases without notice or liability.

Apple also does not guarantee or warrant that any content or data you may have in your account at iTools will not be subject to inadvertent damage, corruption or destruction. You are responsible for backing up, on your own computer, any important documents, images or other content -- Apple will not be responsible for any archiving or back-up of any such information. If any data, messages, images or other content in your account and stored on the iTools system is damaged, lost or corrupted in any way, Apple will have no obligation or liability to you.

� ACCEPTABLE USE POLICY GUIDELINES

Apple encourages iTools members to participate in the on-line world to express their views and benefit from the interactive experience. However, it is important to remember that there are rules and standards that you must abide by as an iTools member. These rules and standards are described in this agreement. As an iTools member, you agree to comply with this agreement, and you acknowledge that Apple has the right to enforce this agreement in its sole discretion. This means that if you, or anyone using your member privileges, violate the terms of this agreement, Apple may take any and all appropriate actions -- this can range from the issuance of a warning about a violation to the termination of your membership privileges in iTools -- as Apple deems necessary or appropriate. Apple is not required to provide notice prior to terminating your iTools membership for violating these rules and standards, but it may choose to do so.

You are solely responsible for your conduct while using iTools, including the content of all email messages you generate or forward, and all content in any folders, home pages or other transmissions, information, images or other interactions you generate, transmit or maintain on or through iTools. Apple takes no responsibility for any such on-line distribution or publication by you. Apple cannot and will not review every message or other content you may generate or post, and Apple is not responsible for the content of those messages or content.

Apple reserves the right to delete, move or edit any such item that Apple, in its sole discretion, deems abusive, defamatory, obscene, in violation of copyright or trademark laws, or otherwise illegal, inappropriate or unacceptable, including any material Apple believes may cause any liability for it or which may cause Apple to lose the services of any supplier, including but not limited to any Internet Service Providers (ISPs) which may provide services to iTools members.

A user�s conduct in the iTools space should conform to the requirements of the law, respect for the rights of other users of iTools, and current standards for communicating on-line. By your use of iTools, you agree to use appropriate conduct and language when you are on line -- this includes following the rules of any ISP, any other on-line services, this agreement and all applicable state, local and federal laws (including foreign or international law where appropriate).

Apple reserves the right to terminate your account or suspend iTools services to you at any time, with cause or without cause, in the event of any breach of this agreement, your infringement of Apple�s or iTools� or others� content, or any other circumstances which, in Apple�s sole discretion, merit termination or suspension.

Inappropriate conduct falls into a number of categories. The more commonly understood categories are discussed below, although this list is not exclusive.

� Illegal Conduct.

iTools may be used only for lawful purposes. The laws that apply in the off-line world must be obeyed on-line as well. Posting, transmitting, promoting, using, distributing or storing Content in violation of any applicable law or regulation is prohibited. �Content� means the text, software, communications, images, sounds, and all other information and materials you encounter or generate on-line on the Internet, including material protected by copyright, trademark, trade secret or other intellectual property rights, and material that is obscene, defamatory, constitutes an illegal threat, or violates export control laws.

Examples of prohibited illegal conduct are:

� Posting obscene content (including child pornography)

� Planning illegal activity, such as building a bomb or counterfeiting money

� Advertising a lottery, ammunition, firearms, tobacco, alcohol, illegal drugs and drug-related paraphernalia

� Pretending to be anyone you are not -- you may not impersonate another person (including celebrities), another iTools Member, an Apple employee, or a civic or government leader

� Using false statements to get, or to attempt to get, account information or other private information from other iTools members or Internet users

� Engaging in copyright infringement or other intellectual property infringement

If you believe that illegal Content is being transmitted through any iTools service, you may report it by filling out the abuse reporting form located in the �ContactUs� section of the iTools Help system.

Apple reserves the right to cooperate with law enforcement authorities, including complying with warrants, court orders and subpoenas. If Apple decides to investigate or resolve possible misuse involving you or anything you do on iTools, Apple is entitled to disclose any information about you and anything you do with iTools to law enforcement or other government officials, as Apple, in its sole discretion, believes to be necessary or appropriate. By your use of iTools, you authorize Apple to take any such actions.

� Objectionable Conduct and Content

It is essential that all Content on iTools reflect the provisions of this agreement. Apple reserves the right to remove Content if we become aware of any content in any iTools area which, in our judgment, does not conform to this agreement. You may receive a warning about the violation of this agreement if your iTools account was responsible for putting objectionable Content on-line. At all times, Apple reserves the right to terminate the accounts of iTools members who violate this AUP.

Examples of objectionable conduct and Content that violate the iTools acceptable use policy are:

� Harassing, threatening, or embarrassing another iTools or Internet user

� Stalking another iTools or Internet user (�cyberstalking�)

� Transmitting or facilitating distribution of Content that is harmful, abusive, violent, racially or ethnically offensive, lewd, vulgar or (in a reasonable person�s view) objectionable

� If you are an adult, requesting personal or other information from a minor (any person under the age of 18) who is not personally known to you, including but not limited to any of the following: full name or last name, home address, zip code, telephone number, picture, or the names of the minor�s school, church, athletic team or friends

� Posting Content that defames, abuses or threatens physical harm to others or yourself

Please remember that these are only guidelines; there are always �gray areas.� Ask yourself if your communication is something that you would say in a room full of people you never met, or in the workplace. However, Apple reserves the right to make the final determination about whether Content is objectionable or not.

If you encounter something you find inappropriate, you may report it by filling out the abuse reporting form located in the �ContactUs� section of the iTools Help system.

� Copyright and Intellectual Property Infringement

Much of the Content available through iTools is owned by others, and is protected by copyrights, trademarks, rights of publicity and other intellectual property rights. Before you upload or download any Content while using iTools, make sure you have been given the legal right to do so by the owner of the content. The Mac OS X Software folder on iDisk contains third-party software, which has been licensed by the developers thereof to Apple. You may download and use this software for your own personal use, subject to any rights retained by the developers.

� You must not copy, transmit, modify, distribute, show in public or in private or create any derivative works from any of the Content you find through iTools, unless you have the legal right to do so; and

� You must not make available serial numbers for software for the purpose of illegally validating or registering software.

Making unauthorized copies of any Content can lead to the termination of your access to iTools and may even subject you to legal action. In addition, the owner of the Content may take criminal or civil action against you. If a Content owner takes legal action against Apple because of your unauthorized use of Content, you agree to hold harmless and indemnify Apple, its subsidiaries, affiliates, related companies, employees, officers, directors, agents and suppliers against any liability, claims, or demands, including the costs of Apple hiring attorneys to defend against the action.

By submitting or posting Content on areas of iTools accessible by the public, you are representing that you are the owner of such material or have authorization to distribute it. You hereby grant Apple a worldwide, royalty-free, non-exclusive license to reproduce, modify, adapt and publish any such public area Content solely for the purpose of displaying, distributing and promoting the area on which such content is posted. Said license will be in effect only as long as you are an iTools member, and will terminate upon removal of such Content from the public area or when you are no longer an iTools member, whichever happens first.

If you believe that any Content in which you claim copyright has been infringed by anyone using iTools, please contact Apple�s agent (see below), and provide the following information, as required by the Online Copyright Infringement Liability Limitation Act of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (17 U.S.C. 512):

� A physical or electronic signature of a person authorized to act on behalf of the owner of an exclusive right that is allegedly infringed;

� Identification of the copyright work claimed to have been infringed, or (if multiple copyrighted works at a single on-line site are covered by a single notification) a representative list of such works at that site;

� Identification of the material that is claimed to be infringing or to be the subject of infringing activity and that is to be removed or access to which is to be disabled, and information reasonably sufficient to permit Apple to locate the material;

� Information reasonably sufficient to permit Apple to contact the complaining party;

� A statement that the complaining party has a good faith belief that use of the material in the manner complained of is not authorized by the copyright owner, its agent, or the law; and

� A statement that the information in the notice is accurate and, under penalty of perjury, that the complaining party is authorized to act on behalf of the owner of an exclusive right that is allegedly infringed.

Apple�s copyright agent for notice of claims of copyright infringement on or regarding iTools can be reached as follows:

Anthony V. Lupo
Arent Fox Kintner Plotkin & Kahn, PLLC
1050 Connecticut Avenue, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20036-5339
Phone: (202) 857-6353
Fax: (202) 857-6395
Email: [email protected]

� Violations of System and Network Security

Violations of system and network security are prohibited, and may result in criminal and civil liability. Apple will investigate incidents involving such violations and may involve and will report any suspected criminal activity to and cooperate with law enforcement. Examples of system and network security violations include the following:

� Unauthorized access to or use of data, systems or networks, including any attempt to probe, scan or test the vulnerability of a system or network or to breach security or authentication measures without the express authorization of the owner of the system or network

� Unauthorized monitoring of data or traffic on any network or system without the express authorization of the owner of the system or network

� Interference with service to any user, host or network including, without limitation, mailbombing, flooding, deliberate attempts to overload a system and broadcast attacks

� Falsifying your user identity or providing other false information to Apple or to other users of iTools in connection with your use of iTools or any feature of iTools

� Posting viruses or software designed to create a virus or to do harm to iTools, any iTools Members or users of iTools, or any network

� Taking any other action to disrupt the normal use of iTools or the Internet by other users

� Use of software that allows your account to stay logged on while you are not actively using the account.

� Unsolicited E-Mail (�Spamming� and �Mailbombing�)

This agreement prohibits abuse of iTools� e-mail and related functionalities. Some specific examples of prohibited actions are as follows:

� Sending unsolicited bulk email messages including, without limitation, bulk commercial advertising and informational announcements (�bulk� is defined as sending the same or substantially similar messages to more than 400 e-mail users in a single day, sending more than 200 individual pieces of email in a day, or sending one email to more than 50 recipients at once)

� Using information collected from any iTools user or iTools Member directory or any other area of iTools for the purpose of sending unsolicited bulk e-mail

� Posting the same or similar messages to one or more Usenet or other news groups, forums, or e-mail mailing lists (excessive cross-posting or multiple-posting) (�excessive� includes posting the same or substantially similar messages to ten (10) or more groups in a single day)

� Forging of any TCP-IP packet header or any part of the header information in an e-mail or a news group posting, or otherwise putting information in the header designed to mislead recipients as to the origin of the message

� Using another site�s mail server to relay mail without the express permission of the other site

� Engaging in any of the foregoing activities by using the services of another provider, but channeling such activities through an iTools account, remailer, or otherwise through any feature of iTools, or using an iTools account as a mail drop for responses, or otherwise using the services of another provider for the purpose of facilitating the foregoing activities

� Exceeding Account Limitations

iTools has been designed primarily for personal use. We do not intend that iTools will be used to host e-commerce businesses in their marketing, promotions and sales over the Internet. We also do not intend that iTools accounts will be used for FTP access and downloading. iTools accounts are limited in terms of the bandwidth for network traffic and disk utilization for storage allocated to them. Your iDisk account usage is limited to 20 MB and your email account may not exceed 5 MB. Exceeding the applicable limitations is prohibited.

In addition to the iTools account limitations on bandwidth and disk utilization, certain commercial or business uses are prohibited, including the following:

� Soliciting for advertisers or sponsors

� Posting sponsorships and third-party advertisements and banners

� Sending unsolicited advertising, promotional materials or commercial solicitations to third parties

� Reselling, renting or subleasing iTools space under any circumstance

� Using or providing to any third person or entity, whether or not for a fee, any directory of iTools Members other than for personal, non-commercial purposes

� Disseminating multi-level marketing schemes, pyramid schemes, or commercial chain letters

� INVESTIGATIONS

Apple reserves the right to investigate suspected violations of this iTools agreement. When Apple becomes aware of possible violations, Apple may initiate an investigation, which may include gathering information from any iTools member involved and the complaining party, if any, and the examination of Content stored on the iTools system.

During the investigation, Apple may suspend or terminate any or all iTools member accounts involved and/or remove the Content involved from its computers. If Apple believes, in its sole discretion, that a violation of this agreement has occurred, it may take responsive action, including but not limited to permanent removal of illegal or inappropriate Content from the iTools system, warnings to the iTools member(s), and the suspension or termination of the account or accounts responsible.

If, as a result of any such investigation, Apple believes that any criminal activity has occurred, Apple reserves the right to refer the matter to, and to cooperate with, any and all appropriate law enforcement authorities.

BY BECOMING AN iTOOLS MEMBER, YOU AGREE TO WAIVE ANY CLAIMS YOU MAY HAVE AGAINST APPLE, AND TO HOLD APPLE HARMLESS AND INDEMNIFY APPLE WITH RESPECT TO ANY CLAIMS, RELATING TO ANY ACTION TAKEN BY APPLE AS PART OF ITS INVESTIGATION OF A SUSPECTED VIOLATION OF THIS AGREMENT OR AS A RESULT OF ITS FINDING OR DECISION THAT A VIOLATION OF THIS AGREEMENT HAS OCCURRED. THIS MEANS THAT YOU CANNOT SUE APPLE OR RECOVER ANY DAMAGES WHATSOEVER FROM APPLE AS A RESULT OF ITS DECISION TO REMOVE MATERIAL FROM THE iTOOLS SYSTEM, TO WARN YOU, TO SUSPEND OR TERMINATE YOUR iTOOLS ACCOUNT, OR TO TAKE ANY OTHER ACTION DURING THE INVESTIGATION OF A SUSPECTED VIOLATION OR AS A RESULT OF APPLE�S CONCLUSION THAT A VIOLATION OF THIS AGREEMENT HAS OCCURRED. THIS WAIVER AND INDEMNITY PROVISION APPLIES TO ALL VIOLATIONS DESCRIBED IN OR CONTEMPLATED BY THIS AGREEMENT.

� SOFTWARE LICENSES

If you access iTools through downloaded software or a CD-ROM, then these provisions relating to software licenses apply to you. Nothing in these provisions, however, supersedes any terms of any end-user license for software provided with your computer.

Apple provides you with a limited license to use the software providing access to iTools, which you agree to use in accordance with these rules. You may not sublicense, or charge others to use or access, this software. Apple will occasionally provide automatic upgrades to improve your on-line experience.

Apple grants to you a non-exclusive, limited license to use the software designed to provide access to iTools for the sole purpose of connecting you to iTools. This license is subject to the restriction that, except where expressly permitted by law, you may not translate, reverse-engineer or reverse-compile or decompile, disassemble or make derivative works from the software. You may not modify the software or use it in any way not expressly authorized by this agreement. You understand that Apple�s introduction of various technologies may not be consistent across all platforms and that the performance and some iTools features may vary depending on your computer and systems and other equipment.

� DISCLAIMER OF WARRANTIES; LIABILITY LIMITATIONS

YOU EXPRESSLY AGREE THAT YOUR USE OF, OR INABILITY TO USE, THE iTOOLS SERVICES ARE AT YOUR SOLE RISK. iTOOLS SERVICES ARE PROVIDED �AS IS� AND �AS AVAILABLE� FOR YOUR USE, WITHOUT WARRANTIES OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING ALL IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, TITLE AND NON-INFRINGEMENT. BECAUSE SOME JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OF IMPLIED WARRANTIES, THE ABOVE EXCLUSION OF IMPLIED WARRANTIES MAY NOT APPLY TO YOU.

APPLE DOES NOT GUARANTEE THAT ANY CONTENT, INFORMATION, SOFTWARE OR OTHER MATERIAL ACCESSIBLE THROUGH iTOOLS WILL BE FREE OF VIRUSES, �WORMS�, �TROJAN HORSES�, OR OTHER HARMFUL COMPONENTS. APPLE�S ENTIRE LIABILITY AND YOUR SOLE AND EXCLUSIVE REMEDY WITH RESPECT TO THE USE OF ANY SERVICES PROVIDED BY iTOOLS SHALL BE CANCELLATION OF YOUR ACCOUNT.

IN NO CASE SHALL APPLE, ITS DIRECTORS, OFFICERS, EMPLOYEES, AFFILIATES, AGENTS OR CONTRACTORS BE LIABLE FOR ANY DIRECT, INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES ARISING FROM YOUR USE OF iTOOLS OR FOR ANY OTHER CLAIM RELATED IN ANY WAY TO YOUR iTOOLS MEMBERSHIP. BECAUSE SOME STATES OR JURISDICTIONS DO NOT ALLOW THE EXCLUSION OR THE LIMITATION OF LIABILITY FOR CONSEQUENTIAL OR INCIDENTAL DAMAGES, IN SUCH STATES OR JURISDICTIONS, APPLE�S LIABILITY SHALL BE LIMITED TO THE EXTENT PERMITTED BY LAW.

EXCEPT AS EXPRESSLY SET FORTH IN iTOOLS, APPLE DOES NOT ENDORSE, WARRANT OR GUARANTEE ANY THIRD-PARTY PRODUCT OR SERVICE OFFERED THROUGH iTOOLS AND WILL NOT BE A PARTY TO OR IN ANY WAY BE RESPONSIBLE FOR MONITORING ANY TRANSACTION BETWEEN YOU AND ANY THIRD PARTIES THROUGH iTOOLS. YOU HEREBY RELEASE APPLE FROM ANY AND ALL OBLIGATIONS, LIABILITY AND CLAIMS IN EXCESS OF THESE LIABILITY LIMITATIONS.

� NOTICES

Apple may give notice to any iTools member by sending an e-mail message to the member�s mailbox or by sending a letter via postal mail to the contact address listed in the member�s iTools registration. iTools members may contact Apple by filling out the �Comments and Ideas� form in the �ContactUs� section of the iTools Help system.

� EXPORT CONTROLS

You agree to abide by U.S. and other applicable export control laws and not to transfer, by electronic transmission or otherwise, any Content or software subject to restrictions under such laws to a destination prohibited under such laws, without first obtaining, and then complying with, any requisite government authorization. You further agree not to upload to your iTools account any data or software that cannot be exported without prior written government authorization, including, but not limited to, certain types of encryption software. This assurance and commitment shall survive termination of this agreement.

� LEGAL PRINCIPLES

With respect to iTools, this agreement represents your entire agreement with Apple. You agree that this agreement is not intended to confer and does not confer any rights or remedies upon any person other than you, as an iTools member, and Apple.

If any part of this agreement is held invalid or unenforceable, that portion shall be construed in a manner consistent with applicable law to reflect, as nearly as possible, the original intentions of the parties, and the remaining portions shall remain in full force and effect. The laws of the State of California, excluding its conflicts of law rules, govern this agreement and your iTools membership. Member conduct may be subject to other local, state, national, and international laws. You expressly agree that exclusive jurisdiction for any claim or dispute with Apple regarding iTools or relating in any way to your membership or your use of iTools resides in the courts of the State of California. You further agree and expressly consent to the exercise of personal jurisdiction in the California courts in connection with any such dispute, including any claim involving Apple or its affiliates, subsidiaries, employees, contractors, officers, directors, telecommunication providers and content providers with respect to iTools.

Under California Civil Code Section 1789.3, California iTools members receive the following specific consumer rights notice: The Complaint Assistance Unit of the Division of Consumer Services of the California Department of Consumer Affairs may be contacted in writing at 1020 N Street, #501, Sacramento, California 95814, or by telephone at 1-916-445-1254.

Revised 4.23.01

� Copyright 2002 Apple Computer, Inc. All rights reserved.<hr /></blockquote>

If I had to read an EULA like that for everything I purchase I would spend my life reading the damn things. Because a big company has a legal team to back up their dodgy deals does not suddenly make them right as countless legal claims have shown in the past.

ReggieX · Jul 21, 2002, 06:47 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by BTP:
There must be a LOT of wasteful spending going on in Cupertino!<hr /></blockquote>Hardly. You forget that they're the only desktop computer company that writes their own applications and operating system(s).

exca1ibur · Jul 21, 2002, 07:06 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by ReggieX:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by BTP:
There must be a LOT of wasteful spending going on in Cupertino!<hr /></blockquote>Hardly. You forget that they're the only desktop computer company that writes their own applications and operating system(s).<hr /></blockquote>They aren't the only. You forget about Microsoft, Sun, and SGI?

jrome · Jul 21, 2002, 08:22 PM

Carpetfluff, a couple points:

1) It's kind not to quote obsenely long legal agreeements when posting to the forum, as most of us have the ability to deduce, from the context of your post, the identity of the post to which you are referring.

2) Forget about the legal agreement. Why is everyone so convinced that Apple said iTools would be free for life? I never even saw anyone else claim this before Macworld-- not Apple, not users, no one. Maybe the box was misleading in referring to iTools-- what was the language & context? Please show me any sign that Apple promised or implied that iTools would be free forever. So far what I see is some people who should be angry at themselves for not understanding what was being offered. Yes, these angry customers are bad for Apple. But no, Apple cannot base their product offerings on perceived slights from a minority, albeit a large one, of their users.

I am now SOO far away from my original point. I am acting out of pure selfishness. I like the 1-touch step of publishing iPhoto album web pages, and I would like to continue to be able to do so. I proposed that Apple should offer the current level of services for $20/ year. I will gladly pay that. I told Apple as much. I encouraged others to do the same, hoping a groundswell of support (and potential revenue) may sway Apple.

All this hope for free email forever will not make it happen. Apple has provided alternatives (at $10-20/year, in effect) that, while not ideal, are workable. And so many users just bitch about it, but, like wolf howling on the moon, no one will hear your cries.

PLEASE tell Apple you will pay them $20/ year for the current level of iTools. Then maybe I can keep publishing 1-step iPhoto albums. If not, it'll be three step process. Oh well, but at least I tried something at least a little proactive instead of something completely reactive.

undotwa · Jul 21, 2002, 09:20 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by exca1ibur:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by ReggieX:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by BTP:
There must be a LOT of wasteful spending going on in Cupertino!<hr /></blockquote>Hardly. You forget that they're the only desktop computer company that writes their own applications and operating system(s).<hr /></blockquote>They aren't the only. You forget about Microsoft, Sun, and SGI?<hr /></blockquote>Ummm.... Microsoft does not make computers, they make software. Sun and SGI make workstations and servers - NOT DESKTOPs.

exca1ibur · Jul 21, 2002, 11:07 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by undotwa:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by exca1ibur:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by ReggieX:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by BTP:
There must be a LOT of wasteful spending going on in Cupertino!<hr /></blockquote>Hardly. You forget that they're the only desktop computer company that writes their own applications and operating system(s).<hr /></blockquote>They aren't the only. You forget about Microsoft, Sun, and SGI?<hr /></blockquote>Ummm.... Microsoft does not make computers, they make software. Sun and SGI make workstations and servers - NOT DESKTOPs.<hr /></blockquote>I was refering to the same company writing the OS and also writing applications. Guess I should have cleared that up. Oops.

absmiths · Jul 21, 2002, 11:15 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by GeneShifter:
You know, this "mac faithful" stuff is kind of scary.

It makes you guys sound like a bunch of pot-smoking religious zealots that would pay even if Apple was charging $2000 for Jaguar. I'm not saying $130 is too much, it's fine, but shut up about being "faithful" to mac! I'm not faithful to any company, dude. Best hardware/software for best price, period. Companies are about one thing only...the bottom line, and this includes Apple I hate to tell you. You are the same people buying clothes, cars, etc., at a higher price because you want to feel special, even if you can get the same stuff for 75% off somewhere else. Stupid.

STOP BEING MINDLESS SHEEP FELLAS. APPLE IS A COMPANY AND WANTS YOUR MONEY. THAT'S IT. IT'S NOT ABOUT INNOVATION ANYMORE.<hr /></blockquote>And it's people like you who have caused our economy to deteriorate into the Wal-Mart, impersonal, cookie-cutter market that it is. Sure, buy the cheapest hardware, but if you don't consider intangibles like user experience and general satisfaction then you haven't spent your money well.

BTW, it could just as easily be argued that a consumer who is only guided by the bottom line is as mindless or more than one who is loyal to a brand.

absmiths · Jul 21, 2002, 11:23 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by jrome:
I never came to rely on my .Mac address, I just used it as an occasional POP-mail server when i needed it. So, I don't have the same anger with Apple about having been "tricked" into using their email account. What I'll miss about iTools is the 1-step publishing of iPhoto albums. Alas.

As for all of who misunderstood Apple and thought it would be "free for life," GET OVER YOURSELVES! They said you needed OS9 to use the features, they said they were free for now and that's about it. The simple fact that Apple never promised that iTools would be "free for life" should have been a fairly strong clue.

Yeah, it sucks. But you're stuck paying Apple now because you made some bad assumptions. Did any of the people here complaining about being blackmailed ever think to ASK Apple if iTools would be free for life? I mean, if I was going to switch all my email to iTools based upon that assumption, I'd want to check it out first.

Listen, I feel for everyone who feels they were misled; it's frustrating, and it feels like you're powerless. But believe me, Apple completely anticipated this backlash, from people wanting it to be free forever. But complaining to Apple along those lines will have no effect, because Apple anticipated it and discounted it.

I propose a couple of possible solutions. First, my ideas to save iTools for $20/ year. Write to Apple and tell them that you will give them money to provide the current iTools; Apple may not have anticipated this, and if the reaction is strong enough, they may offer that option.

Number 2: Find a friend who is ordering iTools, and piggyback onto their account to get email for $10/year. I mean, seems to me Apple left it wide open for people to do just that. Quit complaining, and pony up the $10.

Finanlly, find 10 friends, purchase an iTools account and 10 extra mailboxes. $210/year divided by 10 is less than $10 a month.

These options are a lot more proactive than just crying to Apple about broken promises. Apple knew they'd take a PR hit; but asking them to subsidize your internet usage is not really an appeal to reason, it's more like aasking for a handout.

Save iTools for $20/year.<hr /></blockquote>Whoa - what's with that math. If I understand #2 rightly, the cost for one user and ten extra mailboxes is $200. Divide that by 11 and the cost is $18.18 per YEAR per person, and divide by twelve and the cost is $1.51 per month, per person.

jrome · Jul 21, 2002, 11:42 PM

You're right, my math was off. Actually, I think it was a typo and not a math error. Or maybe it was dyslexia. More like a lapse in concentration.

But yeah, less than $20/ year for an email-only .Mac account.

jrome · Jul 21, 2002, 11:49 PM

Actually, it definitely wasn't a math error. .Mac email option will be less than $10/month.

Kinda wrecks my credibility, huh?

CarpetFluff · Jul 22, 2002, 01:07 AM

Firstly you'll have to forgive me for posting the EULA as a quote, it was to illustrate the point that it's HUGE and that some people seem to be suggesting that everyone should have read this. What a company 'suggests' through marketing is what people are sold on and courts take this into consideration when they make a decision in something like a class action suit.

Secondly I haven't once said that I thought iTools was free for life, and It really wasn't ever free because I bought OS 9 to access it and I will be buying Jaguar to access the extended features of it. My point is that I think Apple 'deliberately' misled people and that the iTools/.mac fiasco didn't happen accidentally. I'm not looking for a hand out or a free ride I'm happy to pay for stuff I just don't like hidden costs being snuck in under my nose.

If the only reason Apple are doing this is because 'they have to' for economic reasons then why don't they simply offer the service at cost? I mean does anyone seriously believe that Apple aren't going to be making a profit out of .mac? they manouvered the services into the operating system and related applications because they knew they were going to do just this.

As for your suggestion that I should lobby them to reduce the cost, why exactly is that going to be successful? surely any negative comments from mac users are going to have the same effect and I have already emailed them twice to tell them what I think and I subscribed to .mac already so it would be a moot point.

absmiths · Jul 22, 2002, 11:12 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by sambeau:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by jrome:
Apple never promised free iTools for life. <hr /></blockquote>They did say "yours to keep" though. And "yours for life". If someone gave you a car and said "its yours to keep for life" then came back a year or two later and demanded rent or repossesion - you'd be rightly pissed off. "But I never said free!" just wouln't cut it, would it.

This whole argument is *not* about the legal stuff - it is about the spin. And spin coun ts in this day and age. A promise may not be a promise legally, but as long as it is spun as a promise it *is* a promise. Apple were making out at the time that they were the only ones brave enough to promise an email address for life.

I'm sure the legal stuff says that Apple can change the functionality of any of their software at the drop of a hat. If OSX updated itself tomorrow to just become a useless black screen - you wouldn't go "oh, well - the small print said they could do it".. you'd be mad. And somewhat dissapointed.

I'm somewhat dissapointed .

If they had told us the the pay service was going to include loads of extra features and that anyone who didn't use ther .mac address for a few months would lose it but the rest could keep it - then I would have understood. Yes I will cough up eventually. But not because I'm seriously excited by what is on offer - just because I don't want to lose my email address. The one I thought I had for life.

They have me over a barrel. And I'm not very happy about it.<hr /></blockquote>When did they say "Yours for life?" They did say "Yours to Keep," referring specifically to what happens when you switch ISP's. ANd here is the kicker:

"What�s more, you can keep it as long as you like and use it with any ISP you sign up with"

As long as you like, not as free as you like.

Brazuca · Jul 22, 2002, 11:42 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />When did they say "Yours for life?" They did say "Yours to Keep," referring specifically to what happens when you switch ISP's. ANd here is the kicker:

"What�s more, you can keep it as long as you like and use it with any ISP you sign up with"

As long as you like, not as free as you like.<hr /></blockquote>Subtle trickery. At least Apple is following the trend of sleazy corporate policies....

Brazuca · Jul 22, 2002, 11:54 PM

Damm, I don't mean to revive this debate, but I just came across an article <a href="http://graphicpower.com/opinion/2002/july/applebite.stm" target="_blank">here</a> that talks about someone with Actual Physical Evidence on Paper� that Apple promised, get this:

FREE LIFETIME EMAIL ADDRESS

yes, you read it right, Free for Life�.

I haven't actually read the mentioned thread since I'm not in the mood to go hunting on their mailing list, but could this be true?

This is what the "user" supposedly said:

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I was gathering all my iMac stuff, the box, papers, disks, etc, when I found the little paper insert that came with my iMac.

Sign up for iTools today and get a FREE LIFETIME EMAIL ADDRESS.

Free for a life time eh? False advertising strikes again. Just like the free lifetime tech support issue. Anybody remember Apple SOS line?

What I want to know is, where is the free lifetime email address I was promised with my iMac?
<hr /></blockquote>Anyone else have this??

jrome · Jul 22, 2002, 11:56 PM

Final thoughts:

People bought into iTools because they trusted Apple. Apple violated that trust with this new policy.

Email addresses change; when @home shut down, all the email addresses changed. Lots of free providers went belly-up and dropped email. So did Altavista. I doubt the outcry was anything like now, because people expected more out of Apple.

In retrospect, it seems fairly clear that Apple carefully avioided making any Paypal-like "free for life" claims, precisely because they knew it MIGHT come to this.

If you really think Apple did you wrong, you can probably sue to get your money back.

It seems obvious left an opening for people to keep their email addresses for $10-20/ year. But Apple has downnplayed this option, which in retrospect may not have been the best move. Apple probably should have provided free forwarding for an extra year or so that people don't rush into dumping their Mac.com addresses.

Betcha Apple pushes real hard to make this a gift-giving thing; discounted membership w/ new CPU purchase; education bulk-puchasing and other promos.

So Apple, how about this:

1) Free email forwarding for 1-year after expiration of iTools/ .Mac account. This would be a class move unmatched by any other provider, a committment to not hold their customers blackmail.

2) Sell me .Mac classic (old iTools) for $20/year. I'll buy it.

AliP · Jul 23, 2002, 02:37 AM

I've just had an e-mither off Apple offering me .mac for $49.95 for the first year if i sign up within the next 70 days.
Excuse my ignorance but i make that about �35 is this then good value as Virex would probrably cost me that much and i do like the mac.com e-mither.
Maybe Apple are listening to the discontent about paying for services and i don't like lots of stuff being bundled together most of which i'll never use but i'm gonna try it for a year anyway.
KRO
Ali P

CarpetFluff · Jul 23, 2002, 03:25 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I've just had an e-mither off Apple offering me .mac for $49.95 for the first year if i sign up within the next 70 days.
Excuse my ignorance but i make that about �35 is this then good value as Virex would probrably cost me that much and i do like the mac.com e-mither.
Maybe Apple are listening to the discontent about paying for services and i don't like lots of stuff being bundled together most of which i'll never use but i'm gonna try it for a year anyway.
KRO
Ali P <hr /></blockquote>Hi Ali, I guess to my mind you have to consider the on going cost, don't forget this is only $49 (�32) for the first year, after which it will be twice that or Apple could change the cost at any time. I'm not sure if as UK customers we have to pay VAT on this amount either.

If it's the Virex software you're mainly interested in then Apple say this on their Virex page:

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> Regular updates to Virex anti-virus software are just one of many benefits .Mac membership provides. Make sure your membership stays current to keep Virex as potent as possible. <hr /></blockquote>Which to my mind implies that the Virex software would only be useful for the length of your subscription. I have already signed up to .mac and I have to say I've been very dissapointed with what's on offer for my money but this is just a matter of opinion. I would urge you to 'wait and see' though, as a mac owner Virus software is unlikely to be something you 'desperately' need and you have plenty of time to think about it and see if Apple comes up with something else to make it worth your while.

LightWaver-67 · Jul 23, 2002, 03:36 AM

DISCLAIMER - I have not ready *every word* of this thread, but I have scanned every post & reply... I hope I am not re-hashing what has been said. ---

Man!

If you don't like it... DON'T GET IT!!! Plain & simple...

So... for $100... you get 100MB of iDisk space, 50MB "Web"mail space, Anti-Virus protection with a few options, back-up solutions and a simple User Interface for novices to create web content... and that's not enough? Less than $9 per month...?

What about everything else that feeds INTO it... opening a .mac can provide you with 1-click shopping... it allows you to order numerous output options from iPhoto, it allows you to PUBLISH web content right from iPhoto, or to post movies from iMovie. Just the idea of iDisk itself is a step forward... web-based sharing from your desktop... access your files from anywhere without having to be an FTP-type person... How many people here have benefitted from having their public iDisk folder...? How easy was (is) it to use...?

Let's not forget the FUTURE stuff... iCal... how about iSync...? the ability to synch multiple computers using .mac...?

I don't know about you... but I feel that this .mac is going to be utilized more & more and grow into something that becomes a core PART of the OS. It's a SERVICE that is optional... no one is FORCING you to join... but I think there is a huge potential to tie-into the REAL potential of the internet. Some of you seem to view it just as a simple email address and disk space allocation... where on the other hand, I see it as an integrated means of utilizing your internet connection in your daily life in an intuitive fashion. It is interwoven into the OS and some of the current apps... and definitely in some upcoming apps.

It makes the internet an extension of your Mac environment... not just a disk you mount on your desktop... but even if it WAS just that... THAT'S pretty darned cool in-and-of-itself...!!! The ease of drag-n-drop to a disk on your desktop that you can access from any other computer with an internet connection. That's not cool enough for less than $9 a month ( nevermind the REST of .mac )...?

Maybe it's just me... but I see big things happening with .mac in the future and in order to keep innovating.. they need to see a revenue stream and interest from users to keep pushing it forward.

just my $.02

CarpetFluff · Jul 23, 2002, 03:53 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I don't know about you... but I feel that this .mac is going to be utilized more & more and grow into something that becomes a core PART of the OS. It's a SERVICE that is optional <hr /></blockquote>A core part of the OS something that's optional? hmmm!

I agree with you though, if you don't think it's value for money don't buy it, the same as if you don't like people complaining about it don't read this forum thread.

LightWaver-67 · Jul 23, 2002, 04:27 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by CarpetFluff:
A core part of the OS something that's optional? hmmm!

I agree with you though, if you don't think it's value for money don't buy it, the same as if you don't like people complaining about it don't read this forum thread.<hr /></blockquote>Well... what I meant by that is the ability to access iDisk and to control iTools (.mac) is built-in to the OS. The OS is "aware" of an entity outside of the machine that allows it to do other things. Now... YES it's an option. You do not NEED to have an iDisk to run OSX by ANY means... but it's in the menu for you to access if you do.

You don't NEED an iTools account to use iPhoto... but if you DO have one... you can order prints easilly with 1-click or you can publish a web-page. Again... OPTIONAL.. not necessary. In my opinion, the extra ease and functionality I get from HAVING that account is WELL worth the $8.25 a month.

LightWaver-67 · Jul 23, 2002, 04:33 AM

Perfect example:

I just got back from the NAMM show in Nashville Sunday night. On Monday morning, I sat my Kodak DX3500 in it's cradle... the images imported into iPhoto... I arranged them easilly... I hit the "Share" button and told it to make a web page.

Within 10-minutes I had all 4 web pages uploaded and ready for the world to view all because of the ease of OSX, iPhoto and iDisk.

(FYI - Here are the photos

<a href="http://homepage.mac.com/sfinlayson" target="_blank">NAMM Images</a>

On the second (2nd) gallery... the first 8-10 images are of the stage we played last Thursday down in Nashville. (I'm also a musician)

- Scott

JLL · Jul 23, 2002, 04:38 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by jrome:
If you really think Apple did you wrong, you can probably sue to get your money back.<hr /></blockquote><img border="0" alt="[Skeptical]" title="" src="graemlins/bugeye.gif" />

mmurray · Jul 23, 2002, 05:07 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by LightWaver-67:
DISCLAIMER - I have not ready *every word* of this thread, but I have scanned every post & reply... I hope I am not re-hashing what has been said. ---

Man!

If you don't like it... DON'T GET IT!!! Plain & simple...

<hr /></blockquote>No its not simple if you have made extensive use of your .mac.com
email address or the homepage web address. If these are posted
around the place you have a problem. Its a problem you are going to have
to live with but its not `pure and simple'.

Michael

PS I haven't used my .mac.com address much or my homepage web site.
Its a not a big deal for me - but it is for some.

CarpetFluff · Jul 23, 2002, 05:11 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by LightWaver-67:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by CarpetFluff:
A core part of the OS something that's optional? hmmm!

I agree with you though, if you don't think it's value for money don't buy it, the same as if you don't like people complaining about it don't read this forum thread.<hr /></blockquote>Well... what I meant by that is the ability to access iDisk and to control iTools (.mac) is built-in to the OS. The OS is "aware" of an entity outside of the machine that allows it to do other things. Now... YES it's an option. You do not NEED to have an iDisk to run OSX by ANY means... but it's in the menu for you to access if you do.

You don't NEED an iTools account to use iPhoto... but if you DO have one... you can order prints easilly with 1-click or you can publish a web-page. Again... OPTIONAL.. not necessary. In my opinion, the extra ease and functionality I get from HAVING that account is WELL worth the $8.25 a month.<hr /></blockquote>I personally don't like 'commercial' things being built into the operating system, I'd rather Apple focused on making the OS as good as possible 'as it is!'. For instance I waited ages for them to fix the modem bug in 10.1 and presumably they could have diverted more resources to fixing that problem if they hadn't been developing .mac. OS 10.1 is a product which I bought from Apple and I own, in my opinion .mac is a service designed for the most part to create extra revenue for Apple and I don't feel it offers me great value I feel it has taken value away from a product already purchased.

I want to pay for my operating system outright, with .mac I feel like they have been building in a suprise hidden subscription for later on. Yes of course I can opt out of it but supposing the operating system becomes filled with little extras that I can sign up for? Is that good for me as a consumer who wants a reliable operating system and wants to know 'upfront' what he's paying for? I see very little reason for iDisk to be integrated into the finder except that people will see it there and wonder why they haven't got it, real choice for me would be if I could 'add' iDisk to my operating system, no reason Apple couldn't do this except that it would be harder for them to sell.

Really this is the kind of thing Microsoft do all the time and with very little choice in operating systems I would urge people to look at the bigger picture and where this might possibly lead.

If you think it's good value, great

I'm not saying you shouldn't.

jrome · Jul 23, 2002, 07:45 PM

Apple exista as a business to make money, like any other. That's not the only point. My guess is that if Apple perfected things (bug-free) before selling them, they'd have 1 release every five years.

I guess that's why some like Linux-- no great profit motive, so the maintainers of Linux may be more included to fix bugs than add features. Is Linux as good a desktop OS as OS X? I don't think it's close. Some people think it is, some use it as a hobby, and some like being able to hack their own code. Apple is doing things which appeal to their users-- and these users like new features such as iPhoto, iTunes, spring-loaded folders, etc.

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by CarpetFluff:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by LightWaver-67:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by CarpetFluff:
A core part of the OS something that's optional? hmmm!

I agree with you though, if you don't think it's value for money don't buy it, the same as if you don't like people complaining about it don't read this forum thread.<hr /></blockquote>Well... what I meant by that is the ability to access iDisk and to control iTools (.mac) is built-in to the OS. The OS is "aware" of an entity outside of the machine that allows it to do other things. Now... YES it's an option. You do not NEED to have an iDisk to run OSX by ANY means... but it's in the menu for you to access if you do.

You don't NEED an iTools account to use iPhoto... but if you DO have one... you can order prints easilly with 1-click or you can publish a web-page. Again... OPTIONAL.. not necessary. In my opinion, the extra ease and functionality I get from HAVING that account is WELL worth the $8.25 a month.<hr /></blockquote>I personally don't like 'commercial' things being built into the operating system, I'd rather Apple focused on making the OS as good as possible 'as it is!'. For instance I waited ages for them to fix the modem bug in 10.1 and presumably they could have diverted more resources to fixing that problem if they hadn't been developing .mac. OS 10.1 is a product which I bought from Apple and I own, in my opinion .mac is a service designed for the most part to create extra revenue for Apple and I don't feel it offers me great value I feel it has taken value away from a product already purchased.

I want to pay for my operating system outright, with .mac I feel like they have been building in a suprise hidden subscription for later on. Yes of course I can opt out of it but supposing the operating system becomes filled with little extras that I can sign up for? Is that good for me as a consumer who wants a reliable operating system and wants to know 'upfront' what he's paying for? I see very little reason for iDisk to be integrated into the finder except that people will see it there and wonder why they haven't got it, real choice for me would be if I could 'add' iDisk to my operating system, no reason Apple couldn't do this except that it would be harder for them to sell.

Really this is the kind of thing Microsoft do all the time and with very little choice in operating systems I would urge people to look at the bigger picture and where this might possibly lead.

If you think it's good value, great

I'm not saying you shouldn't.<hr /></blockquote>