[rozwado1]

My girlfriend's apartment at school had recently been infested with mites (really tiny bugs that bite). Some of these mites were on her desk and I noticed a few on the computer screen. They very well may be in the iBook itself (searching for warmth possibly). The entomologist at school told me the only way to kill the bugs off would be to put the computer in the freezer (25 deg F) for 48 hours. Can anyone comment on the dangers of condensation on the motherboard/components. Anyone else had an experience like this before? Any other ways to clean it (without complete disassembly - not fun/did it before)?
Nick

[radarbob]

I'm no expert per se....

I wouldn't be worried about condensation as long as you were certain it was all dried out before you apply current to the circuits. I'd pull the battery before cooling it off. You might wrap the computer in something to protect it from direct ice, water, etc.

let us know how it turns out!!

[scottiB]

A few winters ago, I accidentally left my PowerBook G3 in my car at the airport long-term parking for four days during a spell of sub-zero temps (-15 degrees F).

I allowed the Pismo to warm to room temperature (a couple hours or so) and had no problems.

[rozwado1]

Thanks for the input. I'll try it this week and post results.
Nick

[irus]

I totally agree with both responses. Notebook components generally aren't as delicate as other household electronics. These machines get subjected to rougher conditions when they are transported.

As mentioned, there's no need to freeze the battery and the power supply, as both are sealed units. However, you'd be more comfortable letting it warm up overnight at room temperature.

Rus

[velocitychannel]

Now that is what I call an iceBook!

[pat++]

Originally posted by velocitychannel:
Now that is what I call an iceBook!

Good one.

[rjenkinson]

wouldn't the bugs die anyway since they have nothing to eat? either that, or they'd leave to find food.

-r.

[Nile]

If buggy live in MY ibOok he might have something to eat anyway. Sometime I eat chips or crackers at my desk, and the crumbs that are little but that falls into the keyboard would likely sustain a small family of bugs, perhaps for a month or more. Where they would find some water to drink though is mysterious to me.

[villalobos]

Originally posted by rjenkinson:
wouldn't the bugs die anyway since they have nothing to eat? either that, or they'd leave to find food.

-r.

Would the heat inside the Ibook not kill them anyway? Just run a DVD for 5 or 6 hours and I think the mites will just fry to death.

Villa

[-Q-]

Wouldn't the freezer adversely affect the LCD? I suppose you could always return the iBook to Apple under AppleCare and say your LCD has gone bad. No one would believe you willingly put your iBook in the freezer!

[rozwado1]

It's actually a TFT in the iBook (correct me if wrong) and I don't believe that they contain a liquid. I'll look into it.

[irus]

Some displays, such as ones found on inexpensive wrist watches, pagers, and older cell phones, will temporarily lose contrast due to low temperature exposure. Usually that goes away after 20-30 min.

As far as I know modern TFT LCDs would not be affected.

[rozwado1]

Since TFT is a form of liquid crystal, it does contain a liquid. Well, kind of. I emailed a few professors around campus to see about freezing and expansion that will cause cracking of the screen. I read that in older laptops they used to add a saline solution to the LCD that would expand and cause screens to crack in subzero temps. Still working...

[OldManMac]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
It's actually a TFT in the iBook (correct me if wrong) and I don't believe that they contain a liquid. I'll look into it.

A TFT (thin film transistor) screen is still an LCD (liquid crystal display). Put it in your freezer, and let us know later how much it cost to replace the screen.

[Cipher13]

Uh, what the hell?

Don't put it in a bloody freezer. Even if the iBooks internals are dry, that means jack when it comes to condensation. You'd have to seal it in a vacuum-bag or something first, and even then, it's not something I'd do.

You're much better off taking it apart - it isn't hard, and is MUCH less dangerous than putting your computer in a freezer.

Sorry, but if you're dumb enough to risk a $2000 piece of equipment by putting it in a freezer, you deserve to break it.

[rozwado1]

She paid $675 and I paid $625 for mine. Hers is the same model, but with a 15GB. I got it 6 months after it's release. You'd have to be an idiot to pay $2000 for an iBook.

[dettociao]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
She paid $675 and I paid $625 for mine. Hers is the same model, but with a 15GB. I got it 6 months after it's release. You'd have to be an idiot to pay $2000 for an iBook.

Well played.

[molala]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
She paid $675 and I paid $625 for mine. Hers is the same model, but with a 15GB. I got it 6 months after it's release. You'd have to be an idiot to pay $2000 for an iBook.

i'm guessing cipher meant aussie dollars. anyway, it might help to put it in a sealed container first with a couple of silica gel packs to absorb the moisture... then stick it in the freezer. i think it should be alright, if you want to be sure look up the minimum storage temp. the iBook. freezer temps are usually -20C.

[Colonel Panic]

from Apple specs:

Storage temperature: -13� to 140� F (-25� to 60� C)

Relative humidity: 20% to 80% noncondensing

[turtle777]

Originally posted by Colonel Panic:
from Apple specs:

Storage temperature: -13� to 140� F (-25� to 60� C)

Relative humidity: 20% to 80% noncondensing

Now THAT'S a useful answer.

So seal it in some freezer bags and go ahead.

-t

[turtle777]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
My girlfriend's apartment at school had recently been infested with mites (really tiny bugs that bite). ... The entomologist at school told me the only way to kill the bugs off would be to put the computer in the freezer (25 deg F) for 48 hours.

Hey, you might wanna put your girl-friend in the freezer as well. Who know's how many of these bugs are......

*SCNR*

-t

[turtle777]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
My girlfriend's apartment at school had recently been infested with mites...

Now that I think about it:
PUT THE WHOLE APARTMENT IN THE FREEZER !

That should take care of everything.
Let us know how it worked...

-t

[rozwado1]

Just put iBook in freezer, sealed - will post results later.

[sniffer]

Why not just sell the damn thing so you don't risk destroying it?

[Simon]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
Just put iBook in freezer, sealed - will post results later.

RIP iBook.


Just to recapitulate, because of some tiny bugs which maybe aren't even in your iBook and which haven't done any damage and probably never will, you are risking a perfectly working iBook?


ROTFLMAO. Dude, you must be insane.

[rozwado1]

Originally posted by sniffer:
Why not just sell the damn thing so you don't risk destroying it?

Because we're in college and don't have money to spend on a new iBook.

[-Q-]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
Because we're in college and don't have money to spend on a new iBook.

So you're risking damaging it for an unconfirmed threat? Interesting. Let me know how this works out...

[icruise]

So who wants to bet that this lady was trying to rid her powerbook of bugs when she baked it in the oven? Seriously, seems like a similarly stupid thing to me. I'd love to see the repair guy's face.

"Well, we thought there was a possibility that mites had infested it, so naturally we stuck it in the freezer for 48 hours..."

[Nile]

So, how it has turned out? This was on yesterday he said "I have put it in the freezer" -- and now it is today and we have no update.

[cc_foo]

Originally posted by Nile:
So, how it has turned out? This was on yesterday he said "I have put it in the freezer" -- and now it is today and we have no update.

Probably looking for a new computer to send in a post...

I thought the microwave might be a better option. jk!

[Cipher13]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
She paid $675 and I paid $625 for mine. Hers is the same model, but with a 15GB. I got it 6 months after it's release. You'd have to be an idiot to pay $2000 for an iBook.

I did indeed. I'm glad some people have the sense to figure that out.

Again, I stress... if you put your iBook in the freezer to "kill bugs", you're a ****ing moron and shouldn't be allowed near electronic items at all.

[dettociao]

Update?

[billybob128]

agreed it has been at least 48hrs by now
but then with no iBook he may have a slight problem in posting
and if i had just trashed mine like that this place and post would be the last thing on my mind

[Gametes]

Keep a cool head Cypher, please. His asking about it shows that he's not stupidly going around throwing electronics into uncertain situations.

I'd agree that the mites will cause the same amount of damage (probably 0) whether they die a natural death in there, are burned to death, or freeze. So why bother with the risk?

Verdict: n:

[rozwado1]

iBook is good as new and get this - all the mites crawled out of the iBook and were in the bottom of the plastic bag. I took off the top cover of the iBook to check it out. I put it in there for 48 hours and then let it completely "thaw" for another 24 - the TFT does not freeze like everyone thought. It's a solution to bug problems if you don't want to risk taking your iBook apart and breaking it.

Almost forgot - Cipher, quit being such a douche. Nick

[dettociao]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
iBook is good as new and get this - all the mites crawled out of the iBook and were in the bottom of the plastic bag. I took off the top cover of the iBook to check it out. I put it in there for 48 hours and then let it completely "thaw" for another 24 - the TFT does not freeze like everyone thought. It's a solution to bug problems if you don't want to risk taking your iBook apart and breaking it.

Almost forgot - Cipher, quit being such a douche. Nick

Glad to hear it didn't get fried.

[mishap]

hurrah!

[Cipher13]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
iBook is good as new and get this - all the mites crawled out of the iBook and were in the bottom of the plastic bag. I took off the top cover of the iBook to check it out. I put it in there for 48 hours and then let it completely "thaw" for another 24 - the TFT does not freeze like everyone thought. It's a solution to bug problems if you don't want to risk taking your iBook apart and breaking it.

Almost forgot - Cipher, quit being such a douche. Nick

I feel sorry for any electronic goods in your house. I really do.

The risk of damage by condensation far outweighs any risk of "breaking" anything by taking the shell off. I've done it a hundred times, it's almost impossible to **** up taking an iBook apart.

But whatever. Glad it worked out in the end.

[hedgem]

Tune in next week.. when I shall be placing my iBook under a steamroller to rid it of unsightly scratches on the lid!

(what about the poor mites - who cries for them??? an i-cey death in the iGrave)

[Mastrap]

Did anyone read what Apple has to say about this? You may safely store an iBook in temperatures up to -25Celsius. You'd be hard-pressed to find a domestic freezer exceeding that temperature. So, all is well.

Some people should try this with their PBs. Should solve any heat issues they've got...

[dannyillusion]

hmmm...
selling any consumer electronics that couldn't handle sub zero temperatures would be suicide for any company since it would exclude a lot of people. This goes for mp-3 players, PDAs, laptops etc etc

In Sweden we we can get down to -20 celsius during winter so a laptop would be completely useless if it couldn't handle this...

[Simon]

Guys, it's not about absolute temperature. Of course you can use your iBook in the most northern part of Norway and so you can also put it into a deepfreeze.

The actual issue is the condensation which happens due to the high temperature gradient when you take it out of the freezer and the different atmospheric humidity in the freeze and in a normal room. These gradients are potential problems.

If the higher humidity of the room air leeds to condensation on parts of the motherboard that conduct heat badly (and thus are still very cold after you take it out of the freeze) and this condensation drops onto conducting parts (and there are a lot of those on a motherboard) your board will most likely turn into garbage.

The point here is that you are risking failure of a part that will require about 800$ to replace because of a threat that will likely cause 0 damage. That is - quite frankly - insane.

The fact that this clown here has obviously been lucky doesn't change anything about the disproportion between the possible benefit and the large risk.

[rozwado1]

I'm a clown.

[Simon]

Originally posted by Nick Rozwadowski:
I'm a clown.

And a very lucky one I might add.

[Stratus Fear]

AFAIK, the water that condenses doesn't contain any minerals or anything, thus isn't the direct cause of the problem. It's whatever dust or dirt etc. might exist on the components that would then turn the water into a conductor. Water on it's own doesn't conduct electricity very well.

[Cipher13]

Originally posted by Stratus Fear:
AFAIK, the water that condenses doesn't contain any minerals or anything, thus isn't the direct cause of the problem. It's whatever dust or dirt etc. might exist on the components that would then turn the water into a conductor. Water on it's own doesn't conduct electricity very well.

Shorting isn't really my concern.

What if it got on the processor? New mobo. Ethernet controller? New mobo. Video card? New mobo. Integrated RAM? New mobo. VRAM? New mobo. I wonder if that's really worth it. That'll kill those things pretty easily, given time, without electricity.

Either way, those components are fragile and sensitive - especially to electrical shocks, which the water could well provide, even if minutely.

[Simon]

Originally posted by Stratus Fear:
AFAIK, the water that condenses doesn't contain any minerals or anything, thus isn't the direct cause of the problem. It's whatever dust or dirt etc. might exist on the components that would then turn the water into a conductor. Water on it's own doesn't conduct electricity very well.

Of course chemically pure H2O isn't the problem.

But, you don't really think that the condensate will be chemically 100% pure, do you?

There is all kind of crap in there.

Water will kill the board. It's just a matter of how much is needed to do it.

For the rest, read Cipher's above post.

Sorry, but arguing that it's safe to water your board is just plain stupid. As a physicist in research I work with electronics a lot and I do know what these boards like and what not.

[Stratus Fear]

Originally posted by Simon:
Sorry, but arguing that it's safe to water your board is just plain stupid. As a physicist in research I work with electronics a lot and I do know what these boards like and what not.

I don't think that's what I was doing.

[billybob128]

ok lets leave this alone now we have found out that he is stupid/brave enough to do this

there is no point argueing about what levels of water will wreck them i no from xperiance that water + electronics DONT mix at all no matter what ammount i think everyone realises this

there is no such thing as "pure" water stratus fear and even pure water if you managed to get some would conduct a small ammount of current as there would still just be enough free electrons to carry the electric

so my point is this he did it and it worked for him and to that i say congrats but lets not argue about meaningless things like water will damage an iBook