[KeilwerthSX90R]

After previously discussing my Ti400 problems and breaking the display latch (totally my fault) I have decided to purchase another laptop. The question for me is whether a new Ti667 or hopefully a new G4 powerbook in the next couple of weeks or if should just get a PC notebook. My problems with the G4 400 are as follows:
Battery sometimes falls out
Airport reception isn't the best
Brower slowness, and freezing during heavy browsing
Spinning beachball on other occasions
Slow apple bluetooth implimentation (the USB thing is OK but I don't want to have to mess with the back, I want to use a PC card, hopefully the drivers will come for those)
I am not a poweruser anymore, I just use it for web and writing for the most part but consistent performance is a must. Freezing during writing and inability to use intensive web browsing is unacceptable.

Thanks for any input,
Josh

[PeteWK]

The current crop of G4s have the 10/100/1000 ethernet, so the speed should improve while browsing. As for the other issues, other people aren't having the same problems. It could be something to do with your software configuration. Spring cleaning may be in order. Plus it wouldn't surprise me if the next gen of Powerbooks have Bluetooth built in.

PeteWK

[seanyepez]

If you're not doing any design and clearly can't see the need for another Mac, you should get the PC notebook.

You'll get a faster, cheaper machine that will do the same things the Mac can.

Personally, I would get the Mac. The Mac is classier, more stylish, more reliable, and enjoyable to use. Windows notebooks are purely functional. I don't understand some of the things going through PC designers' heads when they decide to make some PC notebook designs; the things are covered in ports and nonsensical labelings. Macs have all of these hidden.

However, pricing on Macs is definitely unreasonable. Apple has to innovate to stay alive, and they sell to a niche market of devotees revolutioary products. Most consumers will realize that Macs are overpriced, and quite frankly, they're right.

When you buy a Mac, you buy innovation and a computer. When you buy a PC, you buy a computer and nothing more. There's something you have to need in the Mac to justify the price. If it's not 100% clear, your choice has already been made.

[seanyepez]

Originally posted by PeteWK:
<STRONG>The current crop of G4s have the 10/100/1000 ethernet, so the speed should improve while browsing.</STRONG>

It won't help at all. The bottleneck is the Internet connection (unless you have an OC-48 or something) and the CPU.

Most computers, routers, and modems don't have 100-megabit Ethernet let alone thousand-megabit networking. It will only help when connecting to a host that also has thousand-megabit networking.

[seanyepez]

The 400-megahertz PowerBook G4 isn't a terribly fast machine under X. It may be your software configuration, but then again, it's probably normal.

I upgraded my mother's laptop (500-megahertz TiBook with 512 megabytes of RAM) to X, and she has nothing but complaints about the new operating system's speed. I can't imagine what it would be like for a power user with a slower machine.

Originally posted by PeteWK:
<STRONG>Plus it wouldn't surprise me if the next gen of Powerbooks have Bluetooth built in.</STRONG>

If they have built-in Bluetooth, the machine could not use both standards at once. They both operate on the same frequency, and they would interfere with one another. PC manufacturers who offer both Bluetooth and 802.11b on their notebooks make it impossible to use both at a time. In other words, you would have to switch off AirPort to use Bluetooth.

[KeilwerthSX90R]

I originally chose the Mac based on the elegance of the design, built in 802.11b and the power vs. size ratio. Additionally, even though it has its problems, OS X is a great new OS that is fun to use most of the time. However, since then PCs now have built in 802.11b and similar power v. size and with the exception of models that are less than 1" thick, a built-in CD drive. The other thing is that I don't use the CD drive. Basically I use the computer as a portable web browser / word processor. I would even consider the ultra small Sony except I can't use small keyboards and I value screen realestate. Basically, all indication point ot switching to a PC, I just don't want to abandon the Mac platform, above all else, I like using a Mac.

I forgot to add: It is not a software problem, unless it's Office (which it could be). I did a clean install to see if it corrected the problem. No change.

[ 03-29-2002: Message edited by: KeilwerthSX90R ]

[msykes]

Well I think batteries falling out has been fixed, and from what I hear airport reception is a little improved in the latest revision. Still, it does sound like you are one of the unfortunate people who experience more random slowness in X than others... we always blame it on "software configuration" and suggest a reinstall, but who knows what is really happening.

You might however try experimenting with different browsers, various people use Explorer, Omniweb, and Mozilla and each seems to have a following right now.

I'd stay with the Mac, but I just happen to find OSX to be the exactly perfect combination of nice desktop OS and Unix for me. If I were you I would try to wait it out until the next Ti revision comes along... since I agree the current ones are a touch underfeatured at that price. If Apple takes too long to update and you need a laptop, buy a PC, and pray to God that you don't hate it as much as you know you will ;-)

[vmarks]

You could try Mariner Write- It's a light word processor that creates documents Word can handle, so it's still good for exchanging documents cross-platform.
http://www.marinersoft.com

As for the battery on your g4/400, the apple solution involved a bit of foam tape that filled the gap to keep the battery in. Another solution was to put a little bit of rubber tubing around the plastic pins on the battery.

Personally, I would be ECSTATIC to have a Titanium Powerbook, even the 400.

[Matsu]

Both 400Mhz TiBooks that I've used (one in store, and one belonged to a prof) seemed painfully slow to me. I dunno what it was, but the speed just didn't seem right for a machine that cost as much as the TiBook did/does.

However, if your TiBook is repaired and your uses are light you might as well just keep using it. Throw in a 512MB dimm, and swap out the HDD for a 5400rpm drive. I've never tried a machine in this configuration, but by many accounts it make a noticeable difference.

Then again, you might just be throwing good money after bad. Has the machine been repaired? How much could you get for it? etc etc...

I really don't see 667 as too much of a performance boost (even with the HDD and Video improvements). I'd wait for at least 800Mhz-1Ghz before considering a new machine. By year's end your options should look a lot better (if you decide to wait that long)

[KeilwerthSX90R]

I currently have already added 512MB of RAM. OS X just doesn't seem to like web browsing with any browser. I am wondering if it's worth it.

[satchmo]

If price is an issue but you want to stay with the Mac platform, you might wait until a new Powerbook is introduced and buy the current 667 model at a reduced price.

Then again, if the browsing speed is not sufficient, then either go PC or use 9.2.

[Mac Zealot]

Sean, I am forced to thinking those were the best (and most informational) posts I've ever seen come out of you, congrats

Anyhow, I have to agree, first of all you already have a ti-400, but though the 667 has a faster bus, etc, that can make at least a 30% difference.

You still have speed though, I'd really go try one out in the store (as I always say). PC laptops are VERY good at web browsing and basic tools but loosing mac os is like loosing a good friend, of course, that's not true with OS X, and os 9 looks babaric compared to OS X!

Windows XP is half decent, a midline pentium 3m laptop is probably your best bet, since you're using it for average usage, AND the p3m is much better at general operation than the screwed up P4m series.

Steer away from celeron laptops, they're normally more crash-prone for some reason and have poor engineering, a laptop with a major brand graphics card is best. May I suggest a toshiba laptop? They're very durable and cheap.

To go on, let's give this a small list of basic reviews:

Sony laptops are decent, but they overheat, and are said to fall apaart easy.

Toshiba laptops are ok, though they run warm, and can get cracks with time

IBM laptops are great, but have cheap plastics and the hinges always break after like 2 years.

You also have dell laptops, but they look more like fish than laptops (big and ugly as heck), so watch out, there have been dells that come out of the box in several pieces.

You just have to remeber that you'll be using windows, and let's get real... that's a BIG OS CHANGE....

I've been using macs full time for 6 months now and have picked up a lot of nifty knowledge, etc, but I'm not exacltly sure (nnooooo I'm not trying to offend anyone or anything) that most people can pick up things as fast as I can, or someone like sean can. [I picked up DOS and got a 286 running when I was 8 overnight, on floppies]

So to the real point, mac or pc, I find internet nice on OS X, you're going to be missing all your old programs, and TRULY!!!! If you've always used macs, it's going to cost A FOURTUNE to switch to PC.

I'm facing spending thousands on a load of programs for my g4 system now because my whole library of like 12k or so of PC programs is rendered unusable

So think it over, think it deep, what you REALLY want is what matters because you'll never enjoy anything else as much.

If you have any second thoughts, etc, I'd be honored to give you some other advice as well, details, etc, just click the reply button under my post, or reply to the thread

[KeilwerthSX90R]

One thing is that I have a PC desktop. I needed it previously for certain Apps that only ran on a PC and have since kept it. I purchased the G4 powerbook because (especially at the time) it was the best laptop available feature wise. There are no issues with switching platforms, simply the advantages / disadvantages of each. The disadvantage of windows and a PC laptop is that it can't run OS X. I know people believe there are others but for me, especially for my uses, that is the only one.

Regarding PC Laptops, I could use some advice and I'm looking for a good, similar forum with info on PC laptops. Right now I have my eye on the Toshiba Portege 2000. I like the size, and the feature set is fine for my uses. The only question is adjusting to the smaller screen. I like the screen realestate of the TiBook because it allows for true multi-tasking. Other possibilties are the S1, Sharp ultrathin and I'm also considering several Japanese models from Dynamism including a 1" thick 14.1" screen Sony Vaio and the Sharp Mebuis. Any advice on the subject would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Josh

[rampant]

The portege isn't a good choice because of the performance and short battery life. I'd say get a Compaq N140c, the Dell C400, or the IBM X22. All very good and powerful thin and lights. (the dell being the slowest, but more featured)

[Paul Huang]

I am usually not a believer in buying the top-of-the-line model, but with the 667, I don't see any reason why not. After all, I spent 4.5 years with my 1400. If I am going to use the 667 for more than four years, $150 extra per year is not that much.

The 667 is the system that made me a believer in OS X. While I was waiting for my flight at Taipei airport, I was getting four notches from AirPort, 128K/sec. download speed, and swift browsing speed. I even drew a huge crowd behind me.

I have carried this 667 through many airports. I really hate it. It takes only 0.5 seconds to wake up the system. The quick wake-up time does not mean you get through the security check quicker. Instead of walking away sooner, the security people start to chat up a storm. Some even believe that because it wakes up in 0.5 seconds, the system must be super-fast. On one flight out of LAX, the security guy talked to me for five minutes--all about the computer and nothing else.

I didn't think much of the Ti PB's design until I started to work on a Pismo this afternoon. I thought the Wall Street model looked like a pillow when the Pismo came out; now the Pismo looks like a pillow, too.

PCs? If you are willing to deal with poor battery life, clunky design, and heavy weight (Vaio is light, but by the time you add all the functions to match the Ti, it is much heavier and you have many more pieces to lose).

[spb]

X is not even laptop friendly..& 9 is past its sell by date..

Sadly , I am in the same boat and have more or less decided to go windows / pc laptop in next 6-12 months..

I'vs used macs for over 10 years and whilst apple & its os seemed to stand still the PC moved forward - 2000 & XP are more than good enough. Toshiba even make very good laptops . They may look dull & boring but what matters is the end result not the tool....

Unlike ibooks & pbg4's running X they are compatible , reliable , affordable & above all very fast.

Thank you all & good nite..

[neilnet]

Quit with all the whining about Apple laptops please...

Find a system that you like and stick with it. If it's a Mac come here and moan about all the problems you've got with it. If it's a PC, go and find a PC messaging board and do the same there.

My guess is that you wouldn't be happy with any.

The computer industry is pathetic. IMO, computers *still* aren't ready for the general public. I mean, come on - if you had to reboot your Microwave after it froze for the third time in two weeks and it took 30 seconds to startup each time, you'd be pretty aggrivated.

Computers aren't ready yet, but if you want to use one - do so at your own risk. Don't flame Apple for not being able to develop quick enough for you.

Oh, and one more thing - remember the grasss always looks greener on the other side.

&lt;End of pointless topic&gt;

N

[seanyepez]

Originally posted by neilnet:
<STRONG>&lt;End of pointless topic&gt;</STRONG>

More like end of your irrelevant rambling. Your condescending attitude and incorrect grammar are demonstrative of your wish to merely start a fight. You are a troll and nothing more.

Quite frankly, you're irrelevant in the grand scheme of the boards, and no one thinks you have the divine authority to "end" a topic.

Computers are ready for the general public. Releasing a new technology to the public allows for the technology to become more refined and applicable to daily use. If computers were still on the drawing boards, there would not be as much interest in funding computer companies. Now, computers are selling to the general public, and because of this, they're evolving. Computers are becoming more intuitive and useful to actual people and their daily needs. End users shape the direction in which the industry is going.

Cars still break down. However, as more are bought, more funding goes into the research and development of newer, faster, cheaper, and more reliable automobiles. Nothing's ever perfect.

This is turning into a philosophical debate. Let's try and answer the original poster's questions. You belong in the lounge.

[ 03-31-2002: Message edited by: seanyepez ]

[mgl]

Originally posted by KeilwerthSX90R:
<STRONG>I forgot to add: It is not a software problem, unless it's Office (which it could be). I did a clean install to see if it corrected the problem. No change.

</STRONG>

If Office seems like molasses on your G4 400, wait for the first service release before comparing to Office for Windows. Office X is the most unoptimized set of apps released for X. Launch Word, open a reasonably complex document, and then put it in the background. Open a utility to watch your CPU usage and it will hover between 30 and 40%. Word just sucks CPU cycles even when you're not doing anything. The upcoming service release should address performance.

Office X should run considerably faster on a 667 with a 133 bus, but until Microsoft does some performance tuning, Word and PowerPoint will feel very slow.

[spb]

neilnet ...

have you visited the planet earth recently?

[neilnet]

More like end of your irrelevant rambling. Your condescending attitude and incorrect grammar are demonstrative of your wish to merely start a fight. You are a troll and nothing more.

First off, I'd appreciate you not wrongly accusing me of being 'a troll and nothing more'. The term 'troll' can be offensive, and I for one don't appreciate it.

In terms of my grammar - oh please - the internet is full of poor grammar. There's no need to individually pick out my post thankyou.

Finally, I'd appreciate you not claiming fact that my intention is to start a fight.

Quite frankly, you're irrelevant in the grand scheme of the boards, and no one thinks you have the divine authority to "end" a topic.

'No-one thinks'? Yes, that's right, you have divine authority to comment on behalf of everyone - my apologies.

It was a light hearted joke man... come on.

Computers are ready for the general public. Releasing a new technology to the public allows for the technology to become more refined and applicable to daily use. If computers were still on the drawing boards, there would not be as much interest in funding computer companies. Now, computers are selling to the general public, and because of this, they're evolving. Computers are becoming more intuitive and useful to actual people and their daily needs. End users shape the direction in which the industry is going.

First, let's highlight the fact that both of our comments our subjective, OK?

Yes, allowing the public to use inventions does ultimately refine the technology, but note I did not say they should stil be on the drawing boards. My comment was that they are not ready for the public. I'm not suggesting they should be on the drawing boards - rather the contrary - they should be tested somewhat more than currently.

You think Apple didn't realise the abundance of problems they had with the TiBook before releasing it? Had it of been tested and reseacrhed more thoroughly, I'm willing to bet not so many people would have suffered.

The current systems we are using (including the Pismo 500 I'm working on) are not suitable for the public. They ought to have been tested significantly more. Look at the lists of problems on the boards - you think that a lot of these problems couldn't have been solved before Apple released the products?

The current cut-throat, market-orientated computer microeconomy has developed such that the pressure to release products prior to applicable use has become almost over-bearable. IMO, Windows is the best example available. Early versions were unquestionably unreliable, and certainly not ready for the public. Similarly, IT companies producing now cannot simply fix bugs with new releases. They must add features, that come with additional bugs.

These are the problems with this individual economy but we have invested too much to stop everything and fix the problems. We must keep developing at a poor standard because it can be done quicker, bringing the product to market quicker, bringing in cash quicker, and gaining in cash on competitors.

Cars still break down. However, as more are bought, more funding goes into the research and development of newer, faster, cheaper, and more reliable automobiles. Nothing's ever perfect.

That's true, but it's not what I'm arguing. I'm saying more research and development ought to go into products before launch. Of course the product will refine as it develops, but if more research was put in beforehand we wouldn't have as many problems to solve. At present, computers have significantly more bugs in comparison to other products, and because of this, I don't think they are suitable for public use. More resources are required to address problems, not add additional features.

I guess it depends on your standards - and perhaps mine are somewhat higher than others.

This is turning into a philosophical debate. Let's try and answer the original poster's questions. You belong in the lounge.

By all means, do answer the posters question, but philisophical?!

lol... I think not.

Oh and one more thing - stop telling me things like 'you belong on the lounge'. Who gave you the divine right to tell me where I belong?

Just curious...

My thinking won't be appreciated - many treat Apple almost like a religion here and it's like telling then they're wrong. Similarly, it's like telling everyone who works in IT (including myself) that they're wrong too, but unfortunately I think it's true...

Quick stat - over 50% of those who work in IT wish they worked in another industry.
Does that say anything?

spb: neilnet ...

have you visited the planet earth recently?

Where?

[ 03-31-2002: Message edited by: neilnet ]

[seanyepez]

Nice to know that you don't want to start a fight.

I am speaking on the behalf of no one because no one ever has or will
submit to your "authority" do close a topic.

I've done it before. Believe me, there was backlash.

I use both Apple and Wintel boxes. I'm quite impartial. Apple as a "religion" is purely idiotic. It is the result rather than the process, but the "process" done on a PC might not be as conducive to getting a better result as it done on a Mac.

[velocitychannel]

This may help sway you more toward a Mac:

Chicks dig Powerbooks!

That is all. Carry on.

[neilnet]

Nice to know that you don't want to start a fight.

I am speaking on the behalf of no one because no one ever has or will
submit to your "authority" do close a topic.

I've done it before. Believe me, there was backlash.

I thought we concluded it was a joke...

I use both Apple and Wintel boxes. I'm quite impartial. Apple as a "religion" is purely idiotic. It is the result rather than the process, but the "process" done on a PC might not be as conducive to getting a better result as it done on a Mac.

I too (unfortunately) use both Apple and Wintel, and whilst wouldn't quite go as far as saying I'm 'impartial', I would prefer to use a Mac. Nonethelss, I'll willingly use what is best for the task in hand.

However, as you highlighted, the Apple 'religion' is pure idiocy. It only exists because Apple have one of the best marketing people on the planet working with them. They have a fantastic team of designers who can produce absolutely stunning artwork and when combined with the marketing genius behind 'Jobs the superstar', people are sucked into the hype that is Apple religion.

Again, what I'm getting at is that the products being hyped aren't up to the standards we normally receive and so it is my opinion that the product's shouldn't be released in their early stages. However, when you show someone something that looks stunning, and/or has numbers that indicate powerful performance, we as the general public want it - whether it's ready or not.

It's a sad vicious circle but there's no way out so we have to make do with what we've got.

Anyway, as you correctly stressed, the this debate belongs in the lounge. Now that the original posters questions have been answered, if any mod wants to move it to the lounge it would probably be best done sooner rather than later.

Keilwerth - you seem to have recieved sufficient feedback to make an informed decision already, so buy what you feel suits you best, and try to forgot many of our subjective (and somtimes emotional) opinions.

I say go with the Mac - it's the best of a bad bunch. Either way, enjoy...

Yours,

Neil

[seanyepez]

Peace, man!

[nana2]

Originally posted by velocitychannel:
<STRONG>This may help sway you more toward a Mac:

Chicks dig Powerbooks!

That is all. Carry on.</STRONG>

They dig $3K of cash wadded in your front pocket more....

[seanyepez]

Originally posted by nana2:
<STRONG>They dig $3K of cash wadded in your front pocket more....</STRONG>

What kind of "chicks" are you trying to pick up?