[SuperGroove]

I hate my computer as is now. I've had to replace the motherboard multiple times, as well as replace the processor. I hate how every little bump be it from my knee, or just someone stomping around like an idiot, freezes it immediately(Slot-A seated firmly, but perhaps the alpha is too heavy for it). I hate WinXP, and how it's not compatible with my hardware that is only a year or two old. I hate the fact that I can't lug it around where I want to. I hate how, even though it plays all the games, it crashes to desktop after only one session. I hate having to reformat my computer everytime there might be a slight chance of there being some bugs that can be sorted out if I do reformat. I just hate spending my time with this POS. The only redeeming thing about it, is having a 19". Even then, being in College, my desk is too small and I can't study in my own darn room! Nothing's on my desk but my monitor and mouse!

That said. I can't see myself plunking down $3500+ for a brand new PBG4Ti, no matter how much I demand the speed. I can't see myself spending any money at all for my PC. I hate PCs. Perhaps Linux will do the trick, but I don't want to spend any money with this PC, be it any OS other than MAC OSX.1.

That said, I am a college student who is majoring in Economics, and minoring in 3D Art(CAD, 3DStudioMax, Maya...yada yada). My computer(AMD 850 T-bird Slot-A, 128MB, ATA66, Radeon VIVO) is pretty dog on slow now that 160MB doesn't work (bad mobo + bad memory = disaster). Do you think buying a iBook would be sufficient for a couple years. I really am hoping that I will never ever have to use a desktop platform other than a DP 800 w/ 22" Cinema ADC. I'm a brat, just with no cash flow!

Any advice would be appreciated! Thanks

[Phoible]

An iBook should be fine as a desktop replacement, although the screen is kind of small if you have any desire to watch DVD movies. If you need video out at a higher resolution than 1024x768, you might want the TiBook. In fact, the $2200 Tibook ($2067, I believe, for educational customers) is a pretty good buy. If it had been that cheap in May when I got my iBook, I might have that instead. However, the iBook is quite a bit smaller than the TiBook (I often can't remember whether or not it is in my backpack). Although my desktop (PIII/733 w/768MB) is a bit faster than the iBook, it also has twice the RAM and a faster CPU. For what it is, the iBook isn't bad at all (faster and more responsive than a lot of relatively recent Wintel laptops that I've used, and definitely smaller).

if you're doing 3D then there is little hope the iBook will suit your needs

[Teo]

Hi,

I must say that I agree too, if you plan on doing some 3D, an iBook won't be fast enough and the screen to small ...

-teo.

Why do you people think that the iBook can't hand 3d design work?

Okay, maybe it will take long as hell to render scenes, but it runs Maya and Lightwave perfectly!

FYI - I replaced my G4/350 sawtooth with the iBook and feel I have not really sacrificed anything. I do pro audio work (Logic) and I am still able to compose the complex dsp intensive songs I did before with the G4 without sweating.

Also, the main thing with 3D is it may just not be as accelerated, it just depends on how intense your settings are for viewing your models - But for the most part it will be totally fine!

The screen, while small is as good as you are going to get - And you can make do with 1024x768 - Also, keep in mind the "small" size people often refer to is really the fact that the DPI is so high (squeezing 1024x768 onto a smaller area) - But you can rest assured that the next rev of the TiBook will incorporate the SAME DPI screen, thus making the text just as "small" on that screen anyway.

In short, YES the iBook is a fine desktop replacement - also, its small size lends itself to being a nice in-car mp3 player for me, I can take it anywhere and the construction feels so much less brittle than the G4..

BTW - You can always transfer your scene to a dual G4 for rendering anyway - but for modeling in general it will kick ass.

[Eug]

I know nothing about 3D design, but I would imagine it would be EXTREMELY painful running any hard core graphics program at 1024x768 on a 12" screen. I love my iBook, but lets be realistic here. After getting used to my 1600x1200 desktop monitor, it's kind of limiting even using Photoshop on my iBook. Anyways, didn't you say 3D Studio Max? PC only right?


What PC hardware do you have now? Crappy motherboard equals bugs up the yingyang. Even the better, more expensive boards like Asus, etc. can be buggy, if you pick the wrong chipset and hardware combinations.

Plus you say you have an Alpha. Does this mean you've speedbumped the chip and perhaps done the pencil trick on your AMD? For hard core work/school related software, this is a bad idea, especially if you haven't properly tested the chip at those speeds, and if you're using cheapo heatsink goop. Overclocking and stability are hard to balance.

As for your Radeon VIVO, are you running beta drivers or are you running the certified drivers? The beta drivers may be faster but usually the certified drivers are more stable. But I've heard that vid card setup is buggy to begin with.

128 MB? WAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYY too little. Pay for good crucial RAM and get CAS 2 PC-133 stuff. A 256 MB DIMM is cheap as borscht these days.

Windows XP? It came out essentially 2 minutes ago. You should be running Windows 2000 SP3 or something if you want compatibility.

Anyways, if you don't like fiddling with your Windows PC, you'll hate Linux even more. Linux is the geek fiddler's dream - because you have to. Avoid it unless you want to learn how to be a network admin or something.

Maybe what you can do is get an OS X.1 iBook for usual stuff and run 3D Studio Max and Maya on your PC, assuming your hardware is good quality stuff, and not the low end Abit overclocker motherboard kind of stuff.

[ 11-02-2001: Message edited by: Eug ]

[dawaves]

man...you said you have a 19" monitor? Just output your iBook to that...that'll solve you " small screen" issue. I think iBook for CAD is a little too much though...doesnt your "higher institute of education" have computer labs for that stuff? Use those, your tuition begs you to do so... the iBook should be for everyday issues (email, M$ Word, porn, etc)...not intensive "PRO" level uses...thats what the Ti is supposed to do. Man...just wait till Jan SF MAcworld, your Ti will be CHEAP. 'nuff said.

[OreoCookie]

First of all, a portable computer -- be it an iBook or not -- is a really cool thing as a student. For most stuff, they are fast enough.

1. How much can you actually spend? No matter if you buy a new PC or a Mac, the budget pretty much limits your choices. Maybe your budget is not sufficient to buy a computer that suits your (3D-)needs. (A PC *workstation* costs about as much as a G4 tower.)

2. After you have limited your choices, think about what you want to do with it. You have mentioned Maya -- as far as I know, it just runs reasonably on a G4. So you might have to buy a TiBook (maybe used) or a G4 tower. There are other 3d apps out there (Cinema4d, etc.), but if you really want to use Maya, you should consider to wait. I have not tried it, I rely on information on the AliasWavefront site.

MacOS X - Hardware

3. Update your existing machine and save for a brand-new one. You have little RAM which is dirt cheap. Get at least another 256 Megs (512 are better). If you use Windows 95/98/ME, *do not* plug in more than 512 Megs of RAM. In January, there will be an update to at least some machines, prices drop, etc.

I've seen Maya running quickly on a 600mhz ibook.

If you can live with the 1024x768 limitation - you will be fine.

The way I look at it, is that I can do all my 'creative' work on my iBook for my audio stuff (logic) - and if and when I need to "master" the stuff, I'd just go find what ever the hell the most powerful machine happens to be at the time.

That is the beauty of a laptop - the portability is a timeless asset - if you want to be in the computer speed race you need a desktop anyway.

[whodisbe]

I dunno if the ibook would suit your needs, but as far as the PC goes... sounds like u didn't build it right. my pc has parts that are about 5 yrs old, and winxp runs like a charm on it.

[Frumpy]

Well, i'm just going to state my case. I've had my iBook for a little over a year, and believe me, it's no desktop replacement. Yes, it's a great computer, and the best mac i've owned yet, but it won't compare to a tower. If you're just going to be leaving it in one place all the time (or at least most of the time), then definately get the Powerbook with the Radeon (seeing as how you'll be very disappointed with the graphics performance on the iBook in 3D work). Don't get me wrong, having a graphics chip in a high tech mac that came from a time when there wasn't such thing as an iBook.........uummmm.......you get my point. Apple hasn't gotten it together with the graphics on the iBook or iMacs yet because it's their consumer lines, and frankly, we don't matter as much to Apple as we once did. (otherwise we would have at least a GeForce2 in the highest iMac by now). Soooo, Powerbook or G4 tower, and don't be cheap!! Save the bucks, and get the best bang you can get with an Apple on it!

[n1ce]

My iBook has been perfectly satisfactory as a desktop replacement, doing light web/graphic/3d design. Just this past couple of days (after having my iBook for 3 months) i decided to hook it up to my 17" monitor to get some real work done and it works like a charm.

I have ahem seen a copy of maya runnung on cough a friends ibook and it runs fine as long as you don't plan to do complex renders.

My advice would be to get an ibook, and hook it up to your 19" monitor when you need to. Do your 3d design on the ibook, and you could stick linux or whatever on your peecee box and use it as a rendering machine (or use your college labs)

[ 11-03-2001: Message edited by: n1ce ]

[SuperGroove]

Originally posted by whodisbe:
<STRONG>I dunno if the ibook would suit your needs, but as far as the PC goes... sounds like u didn't build it right. my pc has parts that are about 5 yrs old, and winxp runs like a charm on it.</STRONG>

I built it correctly. I just bought the wrong mobo(MSI K7PRO)

Anyways, it sounds like the iBook is good for basic computing, and not really up to task for what I need.

Also, there's no way I'm going to keep my 19" monitor here. It's just too much for my desk.

Sigh, I still wait.

Paul

[ 11-03-2001: Message edited by: SuperGroove ]

[SuperGroove]

I know nothing about 3D design, but I would imagine it would be EXTREMELY painful running any hard core graphics program at 1024x768 on a 12" screen. I love my iBook, but lets be realistic here. After getting used to my 1600x1200 desktop monitor, it's kind of limiting even using Photoshop on my iBook. Anyways, didn't you say 3D Studio Max? PC only right?


What PC hardware do you have now? Crappy motherboard equals bugs up the yingyang. Even the better, more expensive boards like Asus, etc. can be buggy, if you pick the wrong chipset and hardware combinations.

AMD751/756 Chipset on a MSi K7Pro S6, -110CG.

Plus you say you have an Alpha. Does this mean you've speedbumped the chip and perhaps done the pencil trick on your AMD? For hard core work/school related software, this is a bad idea, especially if you haven't properly tested the chip at those speeds, and if you're using cheapo heatsink goop. Overclocking and stability are hard to balance.

No overclocking. I used to overclock, and didn't feel like buying a new heatsink. Current processor stock and never has been overclocked

As for your Radeon VIVO, are you running beta drivers or are you running the certified drivers? The beta drivers may be faster but usually the certified drivers are more stable. But I've heard that vid card setup is buggy to begin with.

Drivers off of ATi, certified for XP

128 MB? WAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYY too little. Pay for good crucial RAM and get CAS 2 PC-133 stuff. A 256 MB DIMM is cheap as borscht these days.

160MB died. Didn't feel like upgrading. Guess I should?

Windows XP? It came out essentially 2 minutes ago. You should be running Windows 2000 SP3 or something if you want compatibility.

Anyways, if you don't like fiddling with your Windows PC, you'll hate Linux even more. Linux is the geek fiddler's dream - because you have to. Avoid it unless you want to learn how to be a network admin or something.

Maybe what you can do is get an OS X.1 iBook for usual stuff and run 3D Studio Max and Maya on your PC, assuming your hardware is good quality stuff, and not the low end Abit overclocker motherboard kind of stuff.

I should upgrade to Dual XPs

System Specs:
Windows XP Professional
AMD 850 Slot-A T-bird @850MHZ
128MB CAS2 (2-2-2) Samsung RAM
MSI K7PRO S6 -110CG
ATi Radeon VIVO 64MB
IBM Deskstar 60GXP 40GB 7200RPM ATA66
SB LIVE! Value
CL PC-DVD 24x/2x
Phillips CD-RW
Enlight 7237
Enermax EG-451P-VE(431W powersupply)
Alpha P7125
DLink NIC

mlah I've had this comp for a while.

[ 11-03-2001: Message edited by: SuperGroove ]

[Eug]

160MB died. Didn't feel like upgrading. Guess I should?

Definitely. You should get good stuff, and get at least another 256 MB. Even on Windows 2000, 128 is too little. Memory is cheap these days.

I dunno anything about that mobo though. Can't comment. MSI usually is OK though, but every brand has its bad apples. Otherwise most of your stuff seems like pretty good equipment. (Except the VIVO. Nice card, but reportedly buggy drivers.)

Apparently you can get 512 MB of ram for $128 from west coast memory. (there's another thread, check it) if so, get the 512 for your iBook and I'd say that a 640MB iBook makes a pretty good desktop replacement for a student. Should be enough for OSX and some fairly heavy photoshop work too. There may or may not be a hack to the resolution on an external monitor. Anyone know anything about this, I read somewhere, I wish I could remember where, that the feat may be accomplished in software, thus no potentially scary firmware hack. Someone chime in on this if you know, or have the technical knowledge to say whether tis possible or not.

Scratch the above. If you hanker over real pro level stuff why not wait for MWSF. You've gotten through this much of the term on your current machine, you may as well wait another two months. Apollo is coming, and sahara too. That means all macs will probably get appreciable speed bumps in 2002. We're talking about 1-1.2Ghz initially, and remember a version of Apollo is supposed to be cool and efficient enough for laptop use, as is Sahara, so either the iBook or TiBook may become a real desktop replacement in Q1 2002.

[Eug]

Also, there's no way I'm going to keep my 19" monitor here. It's just too much for my desk.

Well, an iBook with 19" wouldn't have solved your problem anyway. The desktop space would still be limited to 1024x768.

[funkboy]

I use Carrara on my iBook and it's great - I went from a beige G3 (and a 19" monitor that used to run at 1280x1024) to my iBook 500 with no problems at all. Had to rearrange the palletes to work at 1024, but it actually helped my workflow a bit as I tightened everything up (in Carrara, FireWorks, Dreamweaver, every program!) .

Of course, I thought the G3 333 w/ Rage Pro (yes, the 64-bit version) was quick enough for my 3D work... it was slow, of course, but it was at least usably. The iBook lets me do a bunch more stuff... add a nice external mouse and you're set!

[Eug]

and a 19" monitor that used to run at 1280x1024

I would suggest not using that resolution on a standard 4:3 19" monitor. 1280x1024 is a 5:4 aspect ratio, so you're always looking at a distorted image on a 4:3 monitor.