[pkatt]

I'm an eighth grader and right now I'm planning my freshman year. I know about everything I'm gonna take (Geometry, English, History, Choir, Biology, and a Business class) but I'm still not sure what foreign language to take. The High School offers Japanese, French, Spanish, Latin, and German. My mom wants me to take Latin to help improve my English. My dad wants me to take Japanese because I'm going to go into a business/tech relatesd field and he thinks it would help. My question to you is what have you taken or are taking now? Do you like it? And, which do you think would be best for an honor student like myself who plans to go into business? Thanks.

[tobster]

Shame they don't offer Icelandic. A very useful language for you Americans

I'd go for either French or Latin. Latin for the reason you mentioned above and French for European interaction.

- tobs

[Captain Obvious]

I am not going to discourage you but the odds are that in-between 8th grade and sophomore year in college you will change your mind about what you want to do for a living. I took Latin in HS, but I am also in Law School now so that paid off. I already had taken 3 years of Spanish in Jr High so I had that covered.

I say take Spanish. German and French are good languages but not very useful later in life since such a small percentage of people speak it, esp in the business world. Japanese can be taken in college once you know you want to major in some tech field, I was a Biz major and I can tell you it wasn't that popular to take that as a second language. And Latin is great if you want to be an English major, doctor, or attorney. But the hot girls are always in the Spanish or French classes.

[argod]

Take French to impress girls.
Take Spanish because the hispanics will be majority in 30 years in the US.
Take Chinese because they are going to take over the world.

I took 2 years of Latin. It didn't help in improving my english.

[btober]

Take it from me - Latin will not help improve your English. English is a mainly Germanic language, following the structure of other similar languages. Many English words, however, do have a Latin root.

I'd recommend French or Spanish, in that order. I'm taking both right now. However, I wish I was able to take a course in Irish Gaelic. I'm currently studying it on the side right now, but I'd love to get more in touch with my origins.

Saol fada chugat.

[ 02-20-2002: Message edited by: btober ]

[daimoni]

.

[lenkman]

I took Latin from 7th grade (really) through my senior year. While no one speaks it anymore (unless you aspire to become the Pope), it really is quite a good language to take, as you will drastically improve your vocabulary and english in general.

For a functional language, if I wanted to take one, I would take either Chinese or Spanish. Chinese because they are going to be the second biggest economy in the world soon, and Spanish because Latin America and South America is rapidly gaining importance.
Also, if you know Spanish and English you can have a rudimentary conversation with almost everybody in the world (excluding China and India).

So I guess, if I were you, I would take either Latin or Spanish, since your school doesn't offer chinese. Taking Latin is the safe bet, because you make it easier to learn any other romance language (spanish, italian, french, etc.) Ultimately, though, you need to decide what you are really interested in. Don't let others pressure you to take the course if you don't want to.

Good luck! High school really sucks.
(not to get you down or anything)
- a disgruntled college junior facing too many midterms and papers in the next week

[ 02-20-2002: Message edited by: lenkman ]

[aleph_null]

i took Latin in high school. it's not terribly exciting, nor is it terribly useful. it would give you some insight into english, romance languages, and language structure in general. which is good. but it's not as if you could converse with anyone.

i took Spanish and Mandarin Chinese in college. both were pretty cool. Chinese is hard for a speaker of a non-tonal language. Spanish is comparatively straightforward, fairly English-like. and probably useful, depending on where you live or will live.

i'm currently taking Japanese. so far i like it quite a bit. no pesky tones to remember, a lovely phonetic alphabet you can pick up pretty easily (Hiragana and Katakana)... i'd recommend it. yeah, would be useful, depending on the kind of business you're in, where you live, etc...

[Captain Obvious]

Originally posted by btober:
<STRONG>Take it from me - Latin will not help improve your English.
</STRONG>

Reading more will help improve your English. Latin will help you understand what the big words mean. And apparently don't go to school in Washington State as their education system doesn't seem to produce very well rounded individuals.

[fulmer]

Spanish if you want to have a language you can use in the US; German if you're planning European-related business and travel. Sure most Europeans speak English, but if they don't then it's probably German (sorry, but only folks in France and Algeria speak French any more).

when you get to college pick a cool language. I've studied Arabic, (Biblical) Hebrew, and Russian, and consider myself cool.

but do what you want--most likely it'll change radically by the time you're a college-aged guy.

[skipjack]

I vote for Spanish from a practical point of view. Here in California, in some places, it seems to be the language of choice. Then again, it depends on your area. I would take a language you can practice outside of the classroom.

I took Latin in grammar school and high school and while it will give you some insight into English, I believe the benefit to that goal is not as much as claimed, given the present high school curricula. If you choose the traditional Latin route, I would think that a couple of years of Latin and a couple of years of Greek would be better than four years of Latin.

Pick a language you can use and become fluent. Then, especially if you have a talent in languages, you will probably find it easy to pick up another. I found Russian to be especially interesting after an exposure to Romance languages.

From another point of view, I've done a bit of traveling while in the Navy, and it seems, especially in the resort areas, that English is a dominant language of commerce, besides the native language. This is probably due to British influence rather than catering to rich Americans. Anyway, this was mostly in Europe, the Middle East, and South America. For that reason, as others have said, you might try to find a Chinese class.

[cheerios]

if you live in Ca, the southern border of the country, then Spanish. If you live next door to Quebec, then French. Those are the one's that're gonna be used, sorry to say. If you don't intend to use it practically, whatever you're damn well interested in. Japanese is major cool, but apparently quite difficult, so careful you don't get into something you can't get out of. Good luck in HS, it's not as bad as they make it out to be, although teen years in general suck. You'll get through it, and college rocks much more, even though it's more work.

[rjenkinson]

-r.

[neill anblome]

Take Spanish! It is going to become the most important language in the world (definetly on the American continent) fairly soon.

Later in college, if you've got the time and the money, take Chinese, it will open up new business opportunities in life.

I took 6 years of Latin in highschool and it helped me a lot to understnd "technical" terms in the realm of medicine and law...so if you are really smart take both latin and spanish in highschool (BTW you will notice a lot of similarities )

Hope that helps a bit....

[ 02-21-2002: Message edited by: neill anblome ]

[simonjames]

Languages are a hobby of mine. I've done courses in Russian, Japanese, French, Danish, Swedish and German.

You don't show where you live but if it is the States then Spanish is the way to go. Latin is a waste of time and unless you are thinking of major Euro travels or living there then French and German are almost as useless as Latin. Same could be said for Japanese - you will waste your time unless you feel a real afinity for the country and its people and have a desire to live there.

Out of all the languages I've learnt Swedish would be the hardest followed by Danish then Japanese (never learnt to read it unfortunately). Russian is fairly easy once you learn their alphabet. French and German are easy.

[seb2]

Originally posted by Captain Obvious:
<STRONG>...
I say take Spanish. German and French are good languages but not very useful later in life since such a small percentage of people speak it, esp in the business world.
...</STRONG>

that depends on what business world you are talking about. you're talking about the "u.s. business world". in europe, it's the other way round. spanish is quite unimportant here. french and german are useful in central europe, i found that quite a lot of people in eastern europe speak german, so think about where you want to do business later.

i personally lernead english, french and russian plus some other languages which i'm not fluent in, so they don't really deserve to be listed.

[Judge_Fire]

Finnish. 5 million speakers worldwide, you can almost understand the Estonians and will have an ancient bond with the Japanese and Koreans. Besides, it's seems to be the Jedi language. (PS Game Masters of Teras Kasi, LOL). It won't help you with any other Europeans, tho.

The younger you are, the easier it might be to embrace totally different languages - you can learn related languages later.

I'd say Chinese, perhaps Arabic or Japanese.

J

[theolein]

For Americans I ould immediately say Spanish since you're sitting next door to a continent full of Spanish speakers and there are so many in the US. For Europe German is probably the best as it's well understood in quite a few East European countries like the Czech Republic and Slovakia and Poland and even in a lot of places where there are a lot of German tourists like the Spanish holiday resorts and Greece and Turkey apart from Switzerland and Austria.

French is useful in Switzerland and Belgium where it's an official language and almost a neccesity in France due to the fact that the French have an aversion to English. It's also good in North and West Africa but not so many people go there.

Apart from that who knows, Arabic is probably good if you want to go there and Mandarin is good in China and Cantonese for other places but who knows, maybe you'll like Zulu

[Millennium]

Man, I wish I went to your school when I was in eighth grade. All my school offered was Spanish and French.

That said, I can say a few things:
Latin - Depending on what state you live in, there's likely to be a very strong community of Latin students, if you choose to really get into the language. Some of the biggest of these are in Massachusetts, Virginia, Texas, Florida, and Ohio. (no, I didn't take Latin myself, but my girlfriend was big in the community; you learn these things )

Spanish - Arguably the most "useful" of the language choices offered, meaning the one you're most likely to use in practice. This is the language I chose to go with, and I've stuck with it.

Japanese - Your dad does have a point about the tech thing. But more importantly, if you ever want to get into anime, knowing Japanese will really help I'm trying to learn it now (despite being loaded down with projects; I've picked up some of the very basics, but not much beyond that). The language itself is quite cool.

My girlfriend would probably argue for French over Spanish, being a major lover of the language and the country (though the same could be said for both japanese and Latin), but I won't go into that here

[NeoMac]

DO NOT TAKE FRENCH. The day the U.S. dropped the atomic bomb was the day French became obsolete - just don't tell the French that, they still think they run the world.

Study Spanish. It is easy, fun and can be found in the U.S. culture. It is very important that you learn a language that is in your environment. It makes the language more relevant which helps improve the chances that you will retain it.

[malvolio]

I vote for Spanish or Japanese, out of the choices offered in your school.
I can speak some very rusty French, which is handy because I live pretty close to Quebec. But from a world-wide perspective, it ain't that useful.
If Chinese was offered, I'd vote for that. Took two years of it in college, and got to where I could actually pronounce the tones pretty well. The writing is a bear, but the grammatical structure is surprisingly very similar to English.

[seb2]

pkat, now that you've heard so many different opinions and basically know that every language is useful , don't forget to tell us what you decided to take.

[JUnderwood]

Take Japanese. It is a great country. try and go to there (maybe even macworld). And the movies and anime are somewhat good.

Plus from a tech business stand point it is a good idea.

or take chinese so you don't need subtitles for crouching tiger hidden dragon.

[chris v]

Where do you live? As I'm in Texas, 4 hours from the Mexico border, I encourage folks around here to be at least conversant in Spanish. If I lived in upstate New York, I'd say the same thing about French.

The world travellers that I know all say that if you can speak English, Spanish and french, you can get by anywhere in the world, since those were the big colonial languages. Anyone who knows two or more languages is going to know one of them, except possibly in parts of Red China, and Russia, though French is not too uncommon in European Russia, either.

Japanese is supposed to be really tough for English speakers to learn, just because it's so different. French and Spanish only have minor syntax variations, and pleny of common vocabulary.

CV

[xyber233]

I'm taking my 3rd year of Latin right now. It can't be spoken but it sure helps a lot on English tests.

[JUnderwood]

it is easier to learn japanese than it is for japanese folks to learn english.

I am from texas and tried taken french and spanish but I was always trying to get them plus english mixed up because they all sound the same.

In my opinion it is easier to learn a radical language than it is to learn a lang that is a big variation of the lang you know and trust. that way they never sound alike or you get them mixed together.

And if you are a honor student, then you might like the challenge (if you think i would be one).

[sek929]

I took French frosh, soph, and half of junior year in HS, the for senior year I didn't take jack squat.

I wish I took Spanish instead since French is the most useless language to know. I may sound like a typical American but I have no real interest in learning another language here in college....just doesn't peticularly interest me. And being an art student its not like I have free time to fit in a class I'm not totally in to.

[pmoc]

Seems pretty much obvious to me: French. Why asking?

[philzilla]

most of you can't even speak English properly!

i'd say, forget French. totally. learn Spanish. it's related to more languages and spoken by more people around the world.

[talisker]

Another vote for Spanish. Useful in so many countries and a pretty straightforward language to learn. I know some Italian and French and really enjoy the languages, but if I was starting again it would be Spanish. I took Latin as well many years ago and would question how useful it really is. Sure, it improves your knowledge of grammar, but learning most foreign languages will do that. I don't think the fact that it can help you work out what difficult English words mean makes it worthwhile. You can't use it anywhere!

[seb2]

Originally posted by chris v:
<STRONG>...
though French is not too uncommon in European Russia, either.
...</STRONG>

huh? what russia are you talking about? believe me, i've been to many places in russia and the former soviet union, i haven't met a single russian who knew more than two words of french.

many of them spoke german, though, if i may repeat myself.

[fulmer]

Originally posted by seb2:
<STRONG>

huh? what russia are you talking about? believe me, i've been to many places in russia and the former soviet union, i haven't met a single russian who knew more than two words of french.

many of them spoke german, though, if i may repeat myself.</STRONG>

I've only met one French-speaking Russian, and that was on the plane from Zurich to Leningrad/Petersburg--she was coming from France where she'd just gotten married to a Frenchman (and this is one lucky Frenchie...this girl is *hot*). She didn't speak any English, and we spoke in Russian. But that's been the exception--most Russians I've met speak English (more common among younger Russians) or German (among those 35+yrs). I'd go places and folks in cafes/restaurants would greet me in English. I'd respond in Russian and they'd get the idea.

[Timo]

Originally posted by Judge_Fire:
Finnish. 5 million speakers worldwide, you can almost understand the Estonians and will have an ancient bond with the Japanese and Koreans. Besides, it's seems to be the Jedi language. (PS Game Masters of Teras Kasi, LOL). It won't help you with any other Europeans, tho.

Yep. Join the tribe.

[GK]

Don't take Latin, it sucks. I studies Latin for 8 years, total waste of time. Most of the time you are memorizing new words, and translating old works (De bello gallico, Cesar). Learn a language that you will be able to use in the real world. Try German, French , or Japanese. Think of the future, don't waste time learning a dead language (unless you want to go into academics teaching Latin and old Greek).

The reason I took Latin was that I wanted to go to Med School. Well , I did, was very successfull, and graduated, like all other people in my class, who did not take Latin. I did not see any advantage that I might have had, esp. considering the time and effort I invested in learning Latin.

[mrtaber]

Well, I won't disagree with the many suggestions here, but I object to the 'dissing' that learning Latin is taking. I would say that if the only reason you would take Latin is 'to help with English or grammar,' etc., etc., then forget it. It'll help, but not as much as you'd like.

However, if you would like to actually read things (like the randy poet Catullus) in the hard (pun intended) Latin, and be exposed to the Roman and Medieval cultures and their thinking (their errors and excesses are a nice antidote to our own), then do. Not everything we do has to be 'saleable' on the job. Preferably, take enough Latin and Greek to be able to read both (with a dictionary, of course). I like Sanskrit, too

However, I would also learn a living language. As to what one depends on your career goals. I live in California, so Spanish is a no-brainer (and it helps that Borges is one of my favorite authors). I'd love to do Italian (Calvino, another favorite author), Chinese and Japanese. Alas, so much to learn, so little time, and I have only average talents for learning languages.

MarkT

[pkatt]

Never expected this many responses. I live in northern Indiana, for those who asked. Near Chicago. I WON"T take German or French (sorry). My dad took German and says he never used any of it, and French seems to be a class that only girls take, at least here. (I'm not gay. I just don't really want to be the only guy in my class.) I probably would choose Japanese if I chose, but unfortunatels, everyone I've talked to (about 100 people) are taking it, making it full, and I think Latin would be easier, since it isn't spoken. And If I take it 4 years, the fourth year is AP. I'm not at all concerned with "using" a language. I am however very concerned in having good English skills and a good vocab, so I think I will go with latin. Also, the teacher for latin (Jeremy Walker) is great, and our latin club has competed and done very well. Don't think I've made my decision. Please continue to provide input.

[Justin Belisle]

It depends what you wanna do. Remember that the two official world languages are English and French. Learn Spanish if you live in the southern U.S. If you plan to work internationally or live in the northern U.S. learn French. Both are very closely related to each other and are equally related to other languages but French is more widely spoken around the world.

I learned French in school (grade 1 to present). It's hard to learn but it's worth it and i'm now fully bilingual. I could now easely learn any other romance language and it also helps me improve my understanding of English grammar (English borrows heavaly from French).

[Timo]

Originally posted by pkatt:
...I just don't really want to be the only guy in my class.

This may change...
...I remember Latin in school being a really big, fun club. That's a plush.

But I don't think you should discount the very real benefits of being able to read and speak a foreign language. It gives you access and insight into another culture, which in turn gives you insight into your own culture.

You "use" a foreign language in more ways than simply reading a timetable or asking for directions.

Whatever you decide, being serious about the study will pay off.

[skipjack]

Originally posted by pkatt:
<STRONG> Also, the teacher for latin (Jeremy Walker) is great, and our latin club has competed and done very well. </STRONG>

While I strongly agree with your sentiments as posted in AI, that won't deter those who prefer to use a language other than English. The use of Spanish isn't limited to areas near the southern border. Ten years ago I was a Navy recruiter giving high school presentations on the use of nuclear power, and I was surprised to hear Spanish spoken almost exclusively in the parking lot of a Lake Tahoe public school (Northern California, near Nevada). If Spanish is going to become a dominant language, I'd like to know what was going on around me whether or not I let those around me know that I understood what they were talking about.

But you bring up a good point about having a great teacher and having active participation at your school. If the Latin program has a good reputation and the other language programs have nothing in particular to recommend them, then your choice sounds especially solid.

[wataru]

I have to recommend Japanese because it's a beautiful language both spoken and written. Pronunciation is not hard at all, and learning to read and write it is not too hard if you're really interested. (By this I mean reading and writing "fluently"--about 2000 kanji + 100 kana. Just learning the kana and a few kanji is pretty easy.)

I've been studying Japanese for about 5.5 years now. I took the official Japanese Language Proficiency Test, level 1 (highest) in December. They should give me my score within the next few weeks. So soon I'll know if I'm fluent or not. I can't wait

But, to be honest, the most useful language you could learn is Spanish. Or, if you want a challenge, Chinese. I considered studying Chinese next, since I know about 2000 kanji from Japanese, but the pronunciation put me off. It just seems way too hard.

[ 02-21-2002: Message edited by: wataru ]

[SillyMonk]

I've studied Arabic, English, French, German, Spanish, and C/C++.

Spanish is the most fun, with a very interesting group of countries. French is an old aristocratic language, often studied by the elites in ex-French colonies, and great to be somewhat conversant in. Arabic is probably passe right now due to Osama, but a wonderful culture. Forget German, they mostly like to practise their english anyway.

Whatever (spanish) language you (spanish) choose, try to learn conversationally and not (spanish) just reading and vocab (spanish.)

[BTP]

I have to second Tobster on Icelandic. Too bad. Have you seen Icelandic women!?!?

[phantomdragonz]

dude, you are getting a head start on life i'm a sophmore in spanish 1 and it sux! spanish is good and all but spanish 1! I HATED my teacher last year all she would give us was packets and packets of paper spanish stuff and not speak a word of spanish in the classroom. i am pissed at that teacher, i have to take spanish for the rest of highschool!

my school only offers spanish/german/french. if i coulda taken japanese i would have loved it!

i wish i had the same head start your getting. just get your work done thats all i have to say. High school years are the best, it's true. real girlfriends, license, actually learning stuff!

P.D.

[Judge_Fire]

Originally posted by pkatt:
<STRONG>I'm not at all concerned with "using" a language.</STRONG>

Still, I'd like to argue that learning about languages is a great way to learn about other cultures - always a great asset, especially in a country where the mainstream media is very self- centric (no offense).

Also, knowing more languages well might just benefit your brain - languages are different, so thinking, speaking or writing in different languages may well give you different views. Rewiring your brain, for better or for worse.

J

[VRL]

Originally posted by Captain Obvious:
<STRONG>
I say take Spanish. German and French are good languages but not very useful later in life since such a small percentage of people speak it, esp in the business world. </STRONG>

Huh??? Quite the narrow view of things. I use all three all the time

Seriously, once you learn the first, the second and third are easier. I think Chinese would be a great one to learn. Yes, challenging.

[roger_ramjet]

Originally posted by argod:
<STRONG>
Take Chinese because they are going to take over the world.
</STRONG>

That's what everyone was saying about the Japanese 15 years ago. Didn't happen. Chinese (Mandarin) would be cool to take if it was one of the choices he listed, but it wasn't. I have a friend who is fluent in Mandarin Chinese. (Mandarin is spoken in Bejing and Taiwan.) She's so good that when she would speak on a phone people didn't realize she wasn't a native. She's says that the difference between Mandarin and Cantonese (the Chinese spoken in Hong Kong) is like the difference between English and German.

Pkatt, I say take either Latin or Japanese. I took French and a little Italian. Liked them both but I'm not fluent in either. But if I had to do it over, I would chose Latin (my HS didn't offer Japanese) because French courses are easy to find. Latin isn't.

Originally posted by sek929:
<STRONG>I wish I took Spanish instead since French is the most useless language to know.</STRONG>

Now, now.

[modusmorons]

Biggest regret is not taking Latin in highscool.

As per several above statements, take Latin not because it will "help with your English" but because it is interesting in itself and in many ways quite different from English. Needless to say, the literature it opens up is amazing. Plus, with it out of the way) you can move on to the real fun Greek stuff in University (if you think Catullus is randy.....

Of course, from as a Linguistics student everyone seems to be either doing northern germanic (faroese... anyone, anyone?) or some bantu dialect.