[fizzlemynizzle]

right after apple.

[ryju]

God?

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by ryju:
God?

I'm still waiting for someone to come out with something that costs 1/2 as much and does the same thing... they are almost there.

[mitchell_pgh]

DP

[hmurchison2001]

Puhleez. All the rabid Tivo fanatics in the world won't save tivo.

Tivo's death is imminent if they don't get an OEM deal beyond direct tv.

The choice for consumers is going to be obvious.


Pay an extra $6 a month with no initial cash outlay for HDTV PVR action or shell out a $1k for a Tivo and then $13 a month or another $350??? Ummmm we all know how consumers react to paying more money.

I like Tivo but unlike Apple they never became a stalwart big enough to face the Comcasts and Motorolas. Even if they try to litigate they don't have the funds.

Encroachment by HTPC and the major networks "rolling their own" is going to pretty much seal the deal on Tivo. I'd buy one anyways because they'll be around for a few years. Tivo, however, doesn't stand a snoballs chance of lasting longer or as long as Apple.

[fireside]

tivo only costs 370$ initially. not a thousand. and its only 300$ or 13$ a month. while the brand name "TiVo" might die, i dont think the idea that TiVo started is going anywhere but up.

[Link]

For the price of tivo you can almost put up a linux powered HTPC that does the same damn thing.

[fireside]

Originally posted by Link:
For the price of tivo you can almost put up a linux powered HTPC that does the same damn thing.

while it may sound like a sound idea on paper, its not. i have a friend that tried to make one, and it was nothing but problems. first the video card didn't work the the software, then crappy reception, etc.

[Captain Obvious]

Originally posted by Link:
For the price of tivo you can almost put up a linux powered HTPC that does the same damn thing.

Yeah, I'm sure there are about 100 dorks who would care to go to the trouble of doing that.

TiVo will change its pricing and there will be consumer non-subscription like TiVo machines out in 18 months tops. A better question is if the VCR will die.

[hmurchison2001]

Originally posted by fireside:
tivo only costs 370$ initially. not a thousand. and its only 300$ or 13$ a month. while the brand name "TiVo" might die, i dont think the idea that TiVo started is going anywhere but up.

No i'm talking HDTV PVR. Comcast, Dish Network and others will be rolling out HDTV PVR rigs for just an additional monthly fee. Tivo HDTV PVR will be $999 (you can preorder now) and that's just too much. Standard Definition Tivo will continue to sell but will diminish quickly as once you see HDTV ..you're not going back. My parents just upgraded to Comcast HD and the first thing they said was "when can we get the tivo to record" I adv them they'd have to wait until HDTV Tivo was ready. But I already know that they would balk at the price. I also know Comcast will eventually send them and advertisement letting them know they can now use a PVR with their HDTV and they will leave Tivo.

For the record I want Tivo to survive but like Apple they're stuck in a situation where market forces just don't leave much room.

[C.J. Moof]

Originally posted by Link:
For the price of tivo you can almost put up a linux powered HTPC that does the same damn thing.

Can you build one my wife wants to use, with an award winning remote and a very usable interface?

FWIW, my 80 hr Tivo/DVD Player (by Toshiba) cost me $317, and doesn't require a monthly fee. I have to program manually, but I can live with that. I don't have the free time to watch all the shows I know I would enjoy, much less the content it might go gather on my behalf.

[thunderous_funker]

Manually program your TiVo?? So, you have a $317 vcr.

Not compelling.

[Kenneth]

I don't have a TiVo..

I want something even better.

[fizzlemynizzle]

I have yet to see a non-Tivo PVR with anywhere close to the scheduling flexibility and features. Maybe Replay TV but it's priced even higher than Tivo.

[thunderous_funker]

My biggest beef with TiVo is the fact that the stand-alone TiVo unit only has one tuner while the DirecTV unit has dual-tuners. A single tuner TiVo is only marginally more useful than a VCR. Considering the substantial cost barrier, it just isn't worth it so I don't have to rewind tapes or load one before I hit the "record" button. Besides, the guide already comes for free.

If I could get DirecTV in my apartment, I'd get the TiVo decoder in second. But the stand-alone unit just plain isnt' worth the money.

[fizzlemynizzle]

I have the standalone and it hasn't been a problem. I record enough stuff to where I'm not watching live TV very much, so while it records live shows I record what I've previously saved.

[Paco500]

I think TiVo's other problem is the lousy customer service. Apple's had it's black periods in this regard, but TiVo does not have a large enough loyal base to put up w/ their nonsense.

I love my TiVo, but when the HD went loud (it sounded like a jet engine) I had to make a total of 3 toll calls, with an average with time of 40 min, to get them to repair it under warranty for $99. This was a 6 month old system that cost me ~$800 (unit, lifetime subscription and home media option.) And the kicker is, when Tivo upgrades their boxes, the subscription stays w/ the box. So if I want the latest and greatest, I have to cought up the hundreds for a new subscription.

TiVo makes a great product, but it's no Mac. As soon as something almost as good comes down the line with out all of the TiVo nonsense, I'll sign up.

[Kilbey]

Originally posted by Link:
For the price of tivo you can almost put up a linux powered HTPC that does the same damn thing.

TiVo is a Linux box. And you can set up a Linux HTPC bow with a remote for $150?!?! Do it for me and I will gladly pay it!

TiVo series 2 are $149

I love my TiVo. I actually watch less TV with it though. Instead of just flipping channels for hours looking for something good, I can go into the TiVo and watch something already recorded that I know I will like.

And I own a basic 30 hour (low quality)/9 hour (high quality) unit.

I am kicking my self for not getting a lifetime subscription. With the monthly plan, I have almost paid for two lifetime subs.

[Mediaman_12]

IF TiVo is only continuing to exist primarily because of the DirecTV/Murdoch deal. Then TiVo is in real trouble, and they need to look outside of the USA to see it.
Rupert Murdoch also owns SKY TV in the UK, who has been developing and selling there own combined Digital Satellite receiver/decoder/PVR (called SKY+), which competes directly with (hardly supported after a botched UK launch) TiVo. So what do you think is more likely. Murdoch to use 'in house' research to create a 'new' PVR for his DirecTV network (after all the bug's have been ironed out by using the Sky+ system as a giant 'beta test').
Or (as the PC mag article suggests) he buy's TiVo outright.

(The guy who wrote that article should look beyond the shores of the USA when talking about International Media Moguls like Rupert Murdoch. His article talks about his DirectTV possibly using a "lower-cost and less useful but cheaper PVR" why would he do this when one of his other TV company's already have a PVR system thats on a par with (if not better) than the TiVo.)

[hmurchison2001]

Very stiff competion coming for the large cable operators

Motorla DCT6208 HDTV with DVR

it features a 1394 port to enable external hard-drive expansion for increased storage space.

That's cool. External FW drive and Bam more recording.


HDTV with DVR service will only be $15-20 extra

Comcast Rollut compendium

My mother loves tivo but when she finds she can get a HDTV DVR box for just $13 more a month she'll jump. I'm hoping Tivo HDTV will come down in price quickly.

The days of buying a Good Better Best Tivo with rising HD space is over. Cable operaters don't care about that so it's not problem for them to slap on a Firewire port and say "hook up whatever drive you want"

Tivo's not dead but they're looking like David to Comcasts Goliath.

[romeosc]

I have DirectTV Tivo.... $49 + $5 per month...... works great!

[OwlBoy]

I currently have a ReplayTV and love it.

I would consider upgrading (and to a TiVo) when I have HDTV and HDTV TiVos are common.

For now my $149 ReplayTV + Lifetime subscription is good

-Owl

[starman]

Originally posted by Link:
For the price of tivo you can almost put up a linux powered HTPC that does the same damn thing.

Uh, not a good one.

Mike

[Shaddim]

I just got TVR with all the same features for only $9.99 /month through Comcast (includes HDTV and Dolby Digital support), and that includes the cost of the box rental. Compared to that, Tivo is just too expensive.

[Kilbey]

Originally posted by MacNStein:
I just got TVR with all the same features for only $9.99 /month through Comcast (includes HDTV and Dolby Digital support), and that includes the cost of the box rental. Compared to that, Tivo is just too expensive.

That would be awesome! But it is not offered here. We still only have HDTV available through antennas. The outrageous thing is that we have two cable companies here.

[starman]

Originally posted by MacNStein:
I just got TVR with all the same features for only $9.99 /month through Comcast (includes HDTV and Dolby Digital support), and that includes the cost of the box rental. Compared to that, Tivo is just too expensive.

Wait...

That's impossible. A PVR that has HDTV support would need a 250GB hard drive. You could NOT have gotten that for $10/month.

Mike

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by starman:
Wait...

That's impossible. A PVR that has HDTV support would need a 250GB hard drive. You could NOT have gotten that for $10/month.

Mike

I was offered the same deal. It's HD on demand in our area. Basically I program when to record and it's stored at their end. I can access it whenever.

Good idea...

[Shaddim]

Originally posted by starman:
Wait...

That's impossible. A PVR that has HDTV support would need a 250GB hard drive. You could NOT have gotten that for $10/month.

Mike

I've not tried it on HDTV (the TV it's attached to isn't HD) but it says so in the documentation. It's the model DCT6208 made by Motorola. Says it only records 7 hours of HDTV content (30-50 hours of normal programming).

I've only had it for a couple days, haven't had a chance to really check it out yet. School stuff.

[Montezuma58]

Originally posted by hmurchison2001:
Pay an extra $6 a month with no initial cash outlay for HDTV PVR action or shell out a $1k for a Tivo and then $13 a month or another $350???

With Tivo for DirecTV the PVR service is only $5/month, even for the HD version. That also covers every DirecTivo in your home so you don't get raped for having multiple PVRs. You don't even have to pay that if you subscribe to their highest level of programming. The initial price for the hardware is steep but it will drop. I'm going to wait until the geeks that have to be the first kid on the block calm down and get a woody for something else then pick up a HD Tivo for a couple of hundred less.

I have yet to see a non-Tivo PVR with anywhere close to the scheduling flexibility and features. Maybe Replay TV but it's priced even higher than Tivo.

ReplayTV and Tivo cost almost the same. With Tivo you have to shell out more money to get some of the equivalent features that are standard on ReplayTV.

That's impossible. A PVR that has HDTV support would need a 250GB hard drive. You could NOT have gotten that for $10/month.

The Scientific Atlanta HD PVR that the cable company that serves my area is testing includes a 160 GB hard drive. That should give about 15-20 hours of HD recording. I don't know how much it will cost. I doubt I'll ever get one since they've never been able to make my digital cable work reliably.

[Link]

The idea of tivo is hugely growing because well.. it's recording without a damn VCR.

[starman]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
I was offered the same deal. It's HD on demand in our area. Basically I program when to record and it's stored at their end. I can access it whenever.

Good idea...

Right..at THEIR end. Big difference.

Mike

[OwlBoy]

Originally posted by Link:
The idea of tivo is hugely growing because well.. it's recording without a damn VCR.

Yeah, my parents are loving it. It's just about set it and forget it. No tapes that wear out or look like crap.

-Owl

[dreilly1]

A real TiVo is so much better than other companies' PVR's (I personally can testify that it beats Time Warner/Scientific Atlanta's PVR hands-down). It seems like the cable companies in particular are rolling out their own cheaper PVR's instead of licensing TiVo's.

And that's a shame, because of TiVo was able to transmit its guide information over the cable directly, and if it were able to decode the digital cable signals and HDTV signals directly and thus be a full replacement for the cable company's set-top box, they'd have taken over by now.

Maybe if TiVo could have worked harder to get OEM deals with cable companies and set-top box makers instead of having them roll their own, things would have been different.

Then again, maybe if the standards for cable were a bit more open, and you could plug your own box into the cable ad get all the digital channels TiVo would be in much better shape. As it is now, they're poised to become the next Betamax. Boy, will my wife be pissed when that happens!

(I just hope someone reverse-engineers the TiVo program guide protocol so if/when the company goes out of business, I can still use it)...

[andi*pandi]

I heart my Tivo, but I wish the OPTIONS weren't so expensive. We have the dual receiver Direct TV gig, but I'd love to be able to watch TIVO recordings on other TVs/computers in the house thru home network. They have this option, but it costs A TON.

[SomeToast]

Originally posted by andi*pandi:
We have the dual receiver Direct TV gig, but I'd love to be able to watch TIVO recordings on other TVs/computers in the house thru home network. They have this option, but it costs A TON.

Home Media Option is $99, but since it doesn't work with the DirecTV units, moot point.

I just have coax running from the D-Tivo to TVs in the bedroom and next to the computer (and use an RF remote repeater), but that's easier to deal with when there's only one person in the house.

[chabig]

The home media option is now free with the TiVo service.

[ort888]

...and brand new stand alones are $129 with rebate.

TiVo won't last forever, but I think they have a few good years left. It's a damn nice product that is much better then almost all of the competition. Those free boxes you get form the cable companies suck ass. The user interface and conflict managment are no where near the level TiVo is.

[vmpaul]

Originally posted by ort888:
...and brand new stand alones are $129 with rebate.

Is that without the subscription? And where?

[DigitalEl]

I have the standalone and it hasn't been a problem. I record enough stuff to where I'm not watching live TV very much, so while it records live shows I record what I've previously saved.

This guy gets it. If you have TiVo, it's very rare that you're watching live TV, so the dual tuner issue is a non-issue. In the rare instance you need to watch live TV while TiVo is busy recording something, you just put the TiVo in Standby mode... It records while "off" (best way to describe it to Mom) and you can use your TV as you would normally.

The biggest threat to TiVo and all PVRs is the networks playing their own time-shifting games with the schedule... Especially NBC this past season. If one show goes from 6:59 to 7:46, it kind of messes up what you wanted on the other channel at 7:30. There's no way around that kind of crap... But who can blame the broadcast networks for fighting a product specifically designed to let you skip the commercials that pay for their programming.

Maybe TiVo will be around for a long time. Maybe it'll be gone soon, but the idea is here to stay. Unlike the average fanboy (for anything, including Macs), I'll use what's best and what makes the most fiscal sense at the time. If it doesn't have the TiVo logo, that's fine.

[Amorya]

Why do you guys say a TiVO with no subscription is pointless?

I know it wouldn't be as good as one with the subscription, but it's not as if programming a VCR is a huge amount of effort... just flick through the TV guide and enter the 8 digit (or so) code for everything you want to watch. Takes five minutes max.

So you guys saying it's only as good as a VCR... what about the fact that you can instantly find whatever programs you want? What about the fact that you don't have to flick through all your tapes to find one with stuff you've already watched, which is OK to tape over? What about the improved quality? When a tape's been used to record in a VCR every day for a few months, it doesn't look too healthy any more.

I'd say that, if I got a TiVO, the "you don't have to program it" feature would be the least important one to me. I don't watch a huge amount of TV; when I do, I almost always know exactly what I want to see in advance.

[velodev]

Originally posted by fireside:
while it may sound like a sound idea on paper, its not. i have a friend that tried to make one, and it was nothing but problems. first the video card didn't work the the software, then crappy reception, etc.

yep, i bought a hauppauge tv card and then started messing with windows media center... it never got off the ground. so I scrapped it.

every so often i get the idea to buy an EyeTV but I have DirecTV. Until someone gets a way to control the channel changing as well as recording without a dongle... i'll stick to my vcr. it sucks but it's been working since 1998.

[ort888]

Originally posted by vmpaul:
Is that without the subscription? And where?

TIVO.com

Without the subsription which is $12.95 a month.

The price is $199 - a 10% discount and a $50 mail in rebate. It's right on the main page.

[Sherwin]

I'm shelling out for one of these as soon as my house move is complete. No need for TiVo, no need for subscription - straight $300 one-off payment and the job's a good 'un.

[bleuvixen]

I got a TiVo Series 2 Hughes Model with built in DirecTV tuner from Circuit City (no rebates or any other crap) for $99
You can still get a standard def TiVo from DirecTV for $99

Had 40 Hours recording, I popped in 2 120GB drives and have over 210 Hours of recording. It is $4.99 a month for the service when you have DirecTV

When we move to a HDTV unit it is only $299 + $4.99/month (if you shop around you can get them for $150, in a year or 2 (when HDTV is more available they will be even cheaper)

I used to have a stand alone unit and the fact that I can now record 2 channels, watch another recorded show and still have my other TiVo recording another show is sweet, though we don't usually record all that at once. :-)

[bleuvixen]

Originally posted by DigitalEl:
The biggest threat to TiVo and all PVRs is the networks playing their own time-shifting games with the schedule... Especially NBC this past season. If one show goes from 6:59 to 7:46, it kind of messes up what you wanted on the other channel at 7:30.[/B]

Umm, this is EXACTLY where the dual tuner comes in handy, It will pick the other tuner to record the new time and if by rare chance I have 2 shows already recording at 7:30 I can tell it to cancel one or cancel the new one.

[bleuvixen]

Originally posted by Amorya:
Why do you guys say a TiVO with no subscription is pointless?

I don't think its pointless, you had some great points about how it would be useful.

I would suggest you at least get the subscription for a month or two, it is only $12 i think if you have cable, etc. And only $4.99 if you have DirecTV

The best part about the subscription for me is I like to record science show and I can set up record by title, director, etc. and sometimes I look in TiVo and find surprises (like the Boeing 777 Nova (I think) program recently)

Was a great program and had TiVo not found it at 1:30AM I probably wouldn't have watched it.

I also set actors like "Christopher Walken" and I have seen at least 4 movies I hadn't even considered watching by hearing the title alone, again these are recored from obscure channels I never watch and at times IM usually sleeping.

It just comes down to what works for you and how much you do or will watch, there is also the TiVo "need to watch anxiety" we currently have around 6 or 8 shows to watch and never seem to get caught up, so you can't watch the newest episodes until you see the older ones, gets frustrating if you can make relaxation time some days :-)

[starman]

/me can't live without dual tuners.

[Amorya]

Originally posted by bleuvixen:

I would suggest you at least get the subscription for a month or two, it is only $12 i think if you have cable, etc. And only $4.99 if you have DirecTV

Alas, I don't think I'll be getting a TiVO at all... from their site:

I can't find TiVo for sale anywhere - why is this?
Unfortunately we no longer have any stock of the Thomson Digital Video Recorder. This is because Thomson's contract to supply units for the UK market has come to an end.

Some high street and online electrical retailers may have limited stock but we cannot guarantee availability at any location.

However, the TiVo service is independent of Thomson and is provided directly by TiVo so all current subscriber and any new subscribers who are able to purchase a unit, will continue to receive and be able to activate the TiVo service as they do now.

Customer service and support of the UK base will continue to be provided by Sky

Amorya

[Sherwin]

Originally posted by Amorya:
Alas, I don't think I'll be getting a TiVO at all... from their site

If you're in a FreeView area of the UK, one of those Pace Twins is the next best thing. Dual tuners, programme guide (from which you can programme the thing to record). 200 spons from Argos.

[Amorya]

Originally posted by Sherwin:
If you're in a FreeView area of the UK, one of those Pace Twins is the next best thing. Dual tuners, programme guide (from which you can programme the thing to record). 200 spons from Argos.

Actually, I've no idea if I'm in a Freeview area... I only have the standard 4 channels (can't get channel 5) and don't have sky or digital... That's at home anyway. It might be worth it for our student house next year - and I can make other people help with the cost too

Amorya